5 Steps To Becoming A Rockstar Freshman (Undergrad Advice)
I've seen a lot of freshman and HS grads wondering how to land internships or gain relevant experience early on in their undergrad careers. Every year the job market becomes so much more competitive for those of us wanting to break into finance. I'd like to share what I believe to be the keys to success as a freshman trying to break in - for those who want to start as soon as they touch down in college. It's what I did and found to be successful!
5 Steps To Becoming A Rockstar Freshman
1. Extracurriculars
As a fresh high school grad, there is only a finite amount of things you can do to demonstrate your interest. As soon as I got to CC I joined the stock market club and realized there wasn't even a finance club. This was a great opportunity to take initiative and demonstrate leadership capability; I founded a finance club. This was a great discussion point in my interviews. Most schools will already have something like this, join ASAP and be as involved as possible! The more you learn the more you can talk about in your interviews.
2. Technical Knowledge (Or not.)
You're really not expected to know much. Unless you went to one of those elite prep schools that makes you select a major in high school, and you've already taken intermediate corporate finance because your dad is a hedge fund manager - you will not be grilled on technicals. I believe most useful thing would be to subscribe to WSJ and check it on a daily basis. After even a month, you will have a good idea of what is going on in the markets, politics, and business world. I also recommend subscribing to WSO's daily "Morning Brew," and The Economist as they are always fun and relevant reads. Your interviews will be all about fit, your experiences, and whatever is listed on your resume. So I wouldn't put things like "excel," "powerpoint," & "word" under the skills section on your CV, unless you really are an expert - you can be called out for this. Know yourself, know what's going on in the world, and stick to what you know - don't make a fool out of yourself trying to flex knowledge you do not have and you're on the right wave!
3. Networking
I know you guys have heard of this a million times on WSO, but I cannot emphasize it enough. If you are interested in an internship or opportunity to work part-time, do your research. Find employees on LinkedIn and reach out to them; don't be too forward, just tell them who you are and where/what you study. You're interested in learning about them and what they do at their job. You'd like to learn about the culture at XYZ firm because you are interested in their business operations. Keep it short and and if they bite, get them on the phone. You can also do some more due diligence and find the firm's email format; shoot an email directly to an employee instead of using LinkedIn, this is more respected IMO because it shows you will do the extra work necessary. Make connections and truly get to know people; keep in touch.
4. Persistence
You must be persistent. I applied to over 50 different internships and didn't hear back from a single opening. As a matter of fact, my freshman internship was earned via point number 3 above. Maintain a positive attitude, be confident, and do not give up. Keep your eyes open and do not be picky! As long as you are enthusiastic and willing to learn, interviewers will like you and will consider you more favorably. There are tons of jobs out there, so dedicate a few hours each weekend to scouring LinkedIn, Indeed, & your school's career portal for anything finance related.
5. Be realistic, it's only the beginning.
So many people can get hung up on a BB PWM or AM internship. That's not all that exists and it's not the only way you can gain some relevant experience. Apply to accounting clerk openings, business analyst internships, finance intern openings, or even operations at a financial services firm! There are so many options out there. If you have the opportunity to, I highly recommend studying abroad. You can learn a lot living in a foreign environment and will come back with hours of stories to tell. I studied abroad my freshman year/summer and it truly was one of the greatest learning experiences of my life.
I'm a high school senior that's been lurking for a while and made an account because I wanted to thank you for this post! I'll be going to BYU this fall and definitely needed this. I'm interested in Equity Research but don't know much about it yet, but i'm sure following these steps will help me as well!
Glad I could help :~)
As someone who recently was thinking about equity research then made the transition into M&A banking, really consider that equity research is a dying field
this is helps a lot thanks!
How were you able to convert your networking into actual interviews or offers? I honestly have no clue what to talk about or how to approach getting someone to push my resume and could definitely use some pointers.
I think a lot of people set themselves up for failure by trying to pitch themselves too early on. Be casual and don't try too hard. You just want to let someone know who you are, where you're from, and that you are interested in the work that they do. These guys know that you want an internship, but they don't want to hear it - if they're giving you time of the day they're willing to get to know you, so make a real connection and then you can follow up when it's application time asking for a referral. Always keep in touch!
I totally agree with this. There is nothing worse than an applicant who tries too hard during an interview. When I interview Analysts and Associates who do that, it puts me off because I assume they will be like this on the job and during meetings, and that’s the last thing that I want.
This is great job search advice for any person looking for an entry level job after college. Well done.
Bruh, you're a sophomore with a F500 internship but your TL;DR sounds like you're an MD/Partner at a megafund
Congrats on already having two PE internships as a sophomore! Very impressive
Unless we break in, it doesn't really mean anything. It just seems a little weird posting on how to be "successful" if you haven't really achieved anything yet.
What’s a good area/country to study abroad for the first time? I’m kinda nervous to cause I’d probably be going alone (all my friends are taking summer classes)
I studied abroad in London - and would highly recommend! There are some VERY prestigious and well regarded schools that do summer programs (LSE, UCL, King's College). Don't worry about being alone. You will have classmates and more than likely flatmates as well, no matter where you study abroad. Outside of London, i'd probably recommend Germany, Italy, or Paris - have fun with it.
I went to Spain and China. I'd recommend Spain. It was a blast.
My interest was learning languages as well though, so I'm not sure of your goals in that area.
If you want to be a rockstar freshman, fuck a lot of girls, make cool/motivated friends, and get A's. Not much more to it for the first year.
Freshman (Sort of) - Investment Banking Advice (Originally Posted: 01/28/2016)
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beat me to it
McGill student here as well. In your U1 year, assuming you're coming out of CEGEP, your internship opportunities are definitely limited but your thinking is on the right track. You should be casting your net as wide as possible but honestly don't be too disappointed if you don't land something in your U1 year. Local boutiques are going to be the most inclined to hire non-juniors. Also, don't rule out unpaid internships - I know of a family office in Montreal called Palomino Capital that hires almost year round but doesn't pay any of their interns.
As for your connections, if they're at BBs they can't really help you that much. These firms are bureaucratic machines that won't bend for a U1 student because the hiring decisions don't come from one person.
In any case, if you are sure that finance is for you, you should look into the Honours in Investment Management program at McGill. It offers 10-12 students the chance to run a $4m fixed income and equity fund in a real investment management firm with all the "real stuff" (compliance, board of directors, idea generation and due diligence, annual reports, etc.) They also place extremely well into banking/consulting/PE in both Canada and the States.
PM me if you have any questions about the above.
Yeah I'm aware of the HIM Program. That has actually been my objective since last year (While I was still in CEGEP). I've done some networking with a few HIMers, but not nearly enough. I've also been trying to work my way around the Investment Club crew as well.
I don't know If I'll be able to get a HIM interview with my 3.6 GPA, but I'm crossing my fingers. If i were to get in HIM, that is when I could see the possible connections coming into play. A few of these HIM guys get NYC SA positions, so It's definitely not out of question... But that is provided that I get in HIM..
Bump. More advice on first summer for Quebecers would be appreciated.
Gave you a SB purely for being a new poster and making an intelligent post. That's a rarity around here. Almost "put on your resume" worthy.
Haha thank you. Didn't think it was anything special!
Advice for Incoming Freshman (Originally Posted: 07/30/2017)
Hello All,
This fall, I will be a freshman at the University of Chicago, where I currently plan to double major in Economics and East Asian Languages and Civilizations. This is my first time starting a thread on this site (and my second posting anything at all). However, in the spirit of "lurk moar," I've been lurking here for a bit over a year now and I read pretty much everything I can find that's interesting each week, so I'm relatively well versed in the vernacular of the site and the general process for recruitment, etc. With that being said, it seems most of the advice on this site is directed at rising sophomores, at earliest, so I was hoping for any advice anyone has as to what I can do as a freshman to best position myself for success.
I've often heard on this site that it is a bad idea to get set on your career goals too early, as they will almost certainly change in the long run. Even keeping that in mind, I figured I may as well say what I think I'm interested in right now, in case anyone has more specific knowledge in those areas. At the moment, I'm most interested in global macro, specifically in emerging markets. I like EMs because the idea of more abundant inefficiencies in immature capital markets appeals to me. Global macro is interesting because I'm fascinated by the influence of political factors, economic history, govt. policy, etc. on rates, FX, and what have you. In general, I'm most interested in ultimately working at a hedge fund, ideally in global macro. Given what I've read on this site, the most likely path there would be an S&T desk, like EM or rates. So again, if anyone has specific insight into any one of these subjects, I'd be happy to hear it.
I also have a more couple specific questions:
Is it worth looking for a freshman summer internship - does it give a meaningful leg up in recruitment and experience?
If so, is it realistic to look outside the classic freshman summer domain of PWM? Obviously not in BB, but maybe in MM S&T or smaller AUM hedge funds?
What steps can I take to better position myself for a freshman summer internship, given that I most likely won't be taking many classes for my major or be in any significant extracurricular positions?
What do WSBers wish they had known freshman year and how can I avoid hidden pitfalls?
Are there any UChicago alums here, who might have advice specific to the school or insights about its career advising/recruitment quirks?
Lastly, any other suggestions you all think might be helpful to an incoming freshman would also be greatly appreciated.
I apologize in advance if this is too long, or if anything I've said is incorrect or comes off as presumptuous.
Are you really making a post like this at this stage in your educational/career progression? I'm becoming an associate this year and still feel like I have to make VP before I can even think about making an arrogant post like this.
Lmao arrogant? Get out of here. I'm a student sharing my success so far. There is absolutely nothing wrong with my post. I'm not shoving this thread down people's throats telling them this is what they have to do. I'm sharing what works. Seriously, wtf? Just because i'm not in banking yet doesn't mean i'm not allowed to post advice/help for my peers. It's not IB or BUST for everyone on this planet and one doesn't have to be at full-time to be proud and to share what they've already been through.
What "kind" of post is this? What's so arrogant about it? There are literally hundreds of freshman asking the same question on this forum everyday "how do I/what do I do as a freshman to get a good start?" I shared what I consider to be the five most important things. It's literally a personal feel-good post, not a textbook guide to what you have to do..
Yeah a "feel-good post," as in an exercise in self-aggrandizement? "Look at me, I've done so well, listen to what I have to say about life and making important choices about your career and future!" Cool bro, have fun at your corpfin internship.
If you do genuinely want to help others, you should realize that you haven't had enough success or experiences to give solid advice or know shit. Valuable insights are generated by people with many, many experiences, a real sample size that creates a general understanding of how things work in the real world. You don't have those, I don't even have those. Calm down and focus on achieving real success before you go out seeking personal and professional vindication on the internet.
It's always worth to look for a freshman summer internship, although the consensus here on WSO is that it won't "make or break" you in any sense, although it's a good thing to have on your CV anyway.
Buddy, unless you're goddamn Blankfein's son there is probably no way that BBs would take freshmen, you don't bring enough value to them (yet). Stick to PWM, CPA firms, anything finance related.
Networking is probably the best way to position yourself. Utilize and exhaust all (I mean ALL) connections that your family and friends have. Talk to people!
Good luck mate.
Thank you very much, your post is just the sort of thing I'm looking for.
Yes, I don't think I worded my post clearly enough, but I'm well aware that a freshman BB internship is impossible. I will edit my post to reflect that.
Bump!
I'd say just try to enjoy your first year of college, get adjusted, make new friends, explore and research different career paths, rush, etc this is a big stepping stone in your life. Don't worry about the details too much yet. But for what it's worth I recommend studying abroad freshman summer.
Cast your net as wide as possible, I have a friend at a top LAC who managed to land an IB boutique internship his freshman summer and it has given him a lot more options for the next summer
For your freshman year, I would recommend getting a good feel for your college. Join some finance related clubs, have a good time without letting your grades slip up and you should be fine.
One of the best tips I've ever heard is you should start networking the minute you decide you want to be in a finance role. If that is when you get to campus, I would start then. The earlier you can reach out to those PWM outlets, the better you should be come application time.
I would really stress the grade thing, the earlier you secure your GPA the better and it really will be a huge benefit come recruiting time. That said, I agree that you should aim for just joining different things on campus, HOWEVER, make sure to be genuine. Do things genuinely, not just for the leg-up, but a mix of the two.
Take some time to really delve into the different areas of the campus and take classes/participate in events that the school is known for. Although your dream position requires some pretty good work ethic, take some time to just take in the school and the people around you, because the first year goes by extremely fast.
Best of luck, don't let your grades drop, and be genuine!
Or you could just enjoy your freshman year... it's also your last "summer". I worked as a cashier my freshman summer, I'd like to think I turned out alright
Advice for Freshman at Non-Target School (Originally Posted: 02/07/2017)
I currently attend a Non-Target. However, some of the 3d and 4th year students have been able to land positions in IB and Sales/Trading for their Co-op positions. However, these students are part of a Student Investment Fund. It accepts 10 second year finance/accounting students.
The program was designed to help our students stand out from the students at target schools. But I am not sure if its enough.
What should I do, - Transfer to a target school after second year - Stay and hopefully get accepted into the program
Yeah for sure.. but there are freshman who want to do more or as much as possible from the get-go. That's who this was intended to help
i mean. both would be best i guess? apply for transfers for targets after freshman year (all other things equal, that will be better for recruiting than the investment fund at a non target 99% of the time)
if that doesn't work out you can do your best to apply to the student fund
Pound out as much sweet tail as u can and brag about it during your interviews.
Incoming UGrad Freshman Indiana University -- Any Tips/Advice (Originally Posted: 07/13/2017)
I am an incoming freshman at Indiana University (Kelley). I am pretty set on pursuing a career on Wall Street, but am just not completely sure exactly what I want to do yet (IB, IM etc.) Anyway, I am just looking for any advice those who have made it can offer (preferably Kelley grads). Things like networking, clubs, internships etc.
Would love to hear about your guys's experiences. Appreciate anything you have to offer.
keep your grades up obviously, check out both the investment management workshop and investment banking workshop as those would be your best gateways to wall street, there's a couple of club fairs you should definitely go to never any harm in signing up for multiple clubs just to see what you end up sticking with in the end
Finance Advice for Freshman (Originally Posted: 10/03/2017)
Hey, I'm a freshman at Fordham University and am interested in Investment Banking. I know it's only been one month since classes began, but I just wanted to get ahead of the game (since I usually never am). I also hear that things in this field begin REALLY early. Since I'm not from a target school, it's even harder. I'm a Finance major. I want tips on how to get an internship for this summer (the summer between freshman and sophomore year). It doesn't have to be investment banking related, but anything will do. Also, advice, tips, resources for the field is appreciated. Especially advice of what steps I should take/do in the future. Thanks in advance!
WTF is that tl;dr
Edit: Lmao OP deleted it - here was the original "TL;DR: Be humble, driven, involved, and realistic. Shoot for the stars but don't get lost in space. Aggressively push any opportunity there is out there. It's all about your determination and attitude, you will find something. You have nothing to lose. If someone like me, from a no-name town was able to do it; you surely can too. I truly hope this helps at least one person out there that is in the same shoes I was!"
I PM'd you.
Hey, thanks! But because it's a new account, I have to wait two days before I could reply. So I'll contact you then. But thanks!
Advice for an incoming freshman (Originally Posted: 01/31/2017)
Hey guys I'm an incoming freshman at nyu cas and am interested in investment banking. I am looking for any advice so that I can start on the right foot in freshmen year. Is nyu cas a semi target or is it a complete non target?
I would love to get some advice on which books to read, networking, finding internships in the city and joining clubs, or any other details.
Thanks for all the help guys!
Let's hope we don't have: "5 Steps To Becoming A Rockstar Freshman (High School Advice)"
My advice for you is to transfer to Stern
Hey there, thanks for the quick response. I understand that Stern has the best placement opportunities at NYU but what I was wondering was that if i stayed in CAS, would it tremendously hinder me in the job search or can i make up for it by networking harder, especially since apparently all of nyu gets the same OCR
Some advice for incoming college freshman? (Originally Posted: 05/06/2012)
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This may be a generational thing (no not bashing millenials). As a 54 yr old with 29 yrs of war stories in the sales trenches that ultimately led to owning / operating a successful business, I run in to this a lot. Just had dinner with a friend's family the other night. Their college senior son was spouting off on various subjects (politics, sports) as if he were an expert. Was a real turnoff. Nice enough kid. Just thought to myself, two ears, one mouth, more listening, less talking. The general consensus afterwords was "he'll learn, less is more, etc." Need to stay in the learning stage for awhile before you enter the advising stage.
Good luck to you as you move along your career path.
Just pursue finance now. The earliest you're gonna finish an MBA is 27-28, which is a long ass time to wait for something you've wanted "ever since I was a young child". GPA is obviously very important regardless of what you choose to do
Bust ass and transfer. Knock out your general eds, get a 3.8+, and you have a very strong shot at a semi-target/target.
I would look away from CS if you go this route. If you pull a major GPA of 3.8+ in CS, congratulations, you are a born engineer. But now is not the time to try that out.
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Cali? Dude, Community College -> Berkeley Haas or UCLA. You get preferred admission, cheap tuition...it is a great deal. Both are easy to get into if you do well (and not getting As is a struggle at a CC). Why not do it and save some money- worst case you get into UCSB/UCI, but you will have save 2 years tuition.
^Pretty much that. It's a bitch transferring into Haas (like 7% acceptance), but into Berkeley L&S/UCLA it's pretty straightforward.
Community colleges in my area are extremely overcrowded. It takes on average 3-4 years to transfer now and because of the increase in sheer volume even cc transfers to ucla and ucb is extremely difficult. a lot of top notch students end up at uci ucsb and ucsd. on top of that ucb and ucla and the UCs in general are extremely overcrowded making classes difficult to get. California education system is pretty fed up right now. I don't know the reputation of Fordham business I'm assuming it's not the greatest though
bump. list of targets/semi targets please.
List of "top" schools that are not terribly difficult to be admitted to as a transfer
UNC-Chapel Hill, University of Virginia, UMich, Boston College, NYU, USC
Umm... Haas transfers have a 31% acceptance rate. Not 7%. The 7% figure comes from the fact that most Haas transfer applicants are "ineligible" because they forgot to take a class required for the transfer. If you take all the required classes, you have a 31% acceptance rate.
http://haas.berkeley.edu/Undergrad/class_profile.html
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bump. sorry for annoyance
Where you go to college, geographically, doesn't really matter when companies recruit you as long as it's a good college and you keep your gpa up.
"I am very determined to fix my mistakes of High School and accomplish my dreams" Then go to Fordam if you think it's the best program and work your ass off. Don't blame the professors. Study on your own if you have to.
3.If you're going to transfer to another school in west coast. You should try your hardest to get into Berkeley.
This is my opinion.
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Seeking Advice - Freshman in undergrad (Originally Posted: 05/09/2009)
I am currently a freshman in undergrad and thinking of majoring in hotel management. My concentration is probably going to be more on the finance side than operations. I love the hotel industry, but recently I have been thinking of consulting/banking/etc. Do you think it will still be possible for me to get a job in the more finance heavy fields even when I am majoring in hotel management? I've heard of people becoming bankers with an art history/anthropology/philosophy/etc major but does that only happen for Ivy grads? Would my B.S. in hotel set me apart from the other applicants in a good way? Thanks for all your help. I look forward to reading your responses.
Sorry, I can't offer you advice, but I'd love to know why you like hotel management. Any specific reasons?
http://catalog.ferris.edu/programsheets/Business/hotelmgmt_b.pdf
I never knew there is BS in Hotel Management...
Flat out. I love real estate especially luxury real estate. I don't want to give a cliche story but it's the only way to explain my desire to major in hotel management. I wanted to be an architect when I was younger-- I went to a couple of seminars. Turns out I had no artistic talent whatsoever. However, I was always pretty good at math. I decided to combine my two passions (if you count math as one) into one major: hotel management. And a reason everyone has--the hospitality industry fits its name. It's very hospitable.
Doesn't Cornell have a whole school dedicated to Hotel Management?
As for why someone would be interested, I hear the major involves nothing but learning how to drink.
Cornell does have a great school for hotel. And yes, they have wine tasting classes but I hear only students who wish to concentrate in operations/food and beverage take that class.
Your GPA will be fantastic. Easy major from what I've witnessed from friends. Can't answer about banking (unless you double major w/ fin or econ). Might be okay for consulting.
Don't banks usually have a training period/program before you start? I have heard of people majoring in art history and are now investment bankers.
9 Tips For All Incoming Freshmen Entering College (Originally Posted: 09/02/2013)
In order to maximize your resume when marketing yourself to potential employers, the hard-work begins during your first day of college. Aside from getting acclimated, which varies between commuters and residents, your first few days, semester, and year will begin establishing a framework for your expectations once graduation approaches. No, this is not a writing piece attempting to deter young 18 year old teens to enjoy the college atmosphere and party scene. In all actuality this is a motivational and informative article meant to touch the soul of all my readers.
So what exactly does this guy have to say that my parents have not told me before?
For starters, your parents graduated college about 20 years ago on average. In fact, there is a growing trend of adults in the upper forties (40’s) having children between 17-18 years old in college. As a senior in college I may have the experience that many readers may be able to relate too. Trust me when I say that these nuggets I will drop are invaluable. The following tips should assist all freshmen: • Get involved by taking on responsibility (e.g. leadership role) • Obtain at least one or several internships • Remain active socially by playing sports or joining Greek life • Maintain a competitive GPA, ideally above 3.5 • Consider pursuing a dual degree, certifications, or several minors • Join organizations to receive notifications for upcoming events • Network and keep in touch with recruiters or guest speakers • Keep in touch with career and academic advisors • Take part in Co-op opportunities
These are very important steps that any student needs to take in order to maximize their brand, while attempting to sell themselves to employers. As of 2012, about 53% of graduates where unemployed. Clearly, indicating a weakened labor market and shift of trend that were previously enjoyed by our predecessors are nonexistent or more unattainable. There’s nothing to fear if one continuously applies his or herself, the sooner one put’s his or her name out there, the easier it will be for him/her to find opportunities. So remain assertive, persistent, and optimistic as your character will also play a factor in you being hired or not.
By following this blueprint YOU WILL SET YOURSELF UP FOR SUCCESS!
I'm not a fan of dual degrees and minors - I would suggest getting your one degree, and if you have time outside of class, work, and your internship, take a class that builds a skill (programming, databases, golf). Good stuff otherwise. Nothing groundbreaking - it's just a matter of beating the importance of these things into the heads of kids who are on their own for the first time.
If it is a good internship, number 2 is definitely the most important. GPA is probably the second most important, but I think that it would be hard to fall much below a 3.5 GPA.
Its not hard at all to fall below 3.5. You don't even have to do anything to get there!
It's an art form
Good advice. Too bad I'm almost a decade late saying that. ha
An internship gained is another positive step towards a more lucrative offer, these corporations want their employees groomed to handle the daily grind and workload. My goal is to motivate someone into a six figure position right after college.
Tracked
Would it still be worth it in your opinion to try and accomplish these in the latter parts of your college tenure? (GPA, networking, etc). It seems that by that time, your employer(s) would be pretty much set.
Or do it early so you have a good chance of getting a better employer
^ Refering to the post above me
Jesus. Incoming college students: don't listen to any of this shit. Please spend the next four years getting drunk and laid. Work on developing people skills, not your CV.
It's not as if the two are mutually exclusive.
I've often thought back to what I would do differently if I had to attend college again. The results of that thinking yield a slightly different list of recommendations than those of the OP. Here's what I would humbly suggest to all you new college students.
First, forget the notion that the college in and of itself (i.e. the classes / curriculum) is designed to teach you things of value. It isn't. It's a credentialing / signaling mechanism. Class time = a waste of time in most cases. Thus your goal should be to position yourself to send the strongest signal with the least amount of effort, so you can devote your energy to other, more rewarding pursuits. With this in mind, here are some specific recommendations:
(1) Major in something "technical." STEM majors are the best, economics, accounting, etc. are second best. People with technical majors can get technical or non-technical jobs after college. People with non-technical majors can only get non-technical jobs. Preserve your optionality. Forget minors. Nobody cares about minors. Take the bare minimum necessary to get the technical major on your degree and nothing else.
(2) Protect your GPA. Find out who the easiest professors are, which courses are the easiest, etc., and take them. Taking unnecessarily hard courses is an exercise in futility. Most of what you learn will be useless and you can't put an asterisk next to your GPA on your resume and say "only a 3.1 but included super hard quantum physics classes with ridiculously anal professor." Now, if you major in STEM your courses will naturally be harder than say an econ or history major's. Mitigate this by finding easy professors and balancing your technical courses with ridiculously easy "fluff" courses (don’t take all your meaty core classes in the same semester). If you get anything less than an "A" on an exam that is not multiple choice, visit the professor / TA during office hours and go over every question missed in painstaking detail. Serves three purposes. Gives you a feel for the individual's grading style, shows you care, and makes him think longer about marking things wrong because if he does he'll have to sit through another question session. If things in a course don’t make sense get help immediately – don’t spin your wheels. If you’re in a course where there’s even a remote chance that you could get C or lower, drop the course immediately. You can always make up credits later.
(3) Get your work done early. Your work load is astonishingly light in college (you won't appreciate this until you start working). If you cut out the agonizing / procrastinating, you will have more free time than you know what to do with. There’s nothing like knocking out a big paper / project three weeks in advance and chilling. If you can, schedule your classes in the afternoons and use the mornings (9 a.m. - 12 p.m.) to bang out your work. No one will be up to bother you so you can focus and this frees up your evenings to hang out.
(4) Devote time every day to honing real skills. Read stuff worthwhile, maybe pick up a programming language or two, write, work on your quant skills, figure out internship opportunities, start working through the various finance guides if you want to pursue a finance career. Do this during your morning routine along with the other necessary studying.
(5) Network right. Think someone on WSO has already said this, but it’s worth repeating. Find alums from various fields and actually try to build relationships with them. Go to lunch once a month, meet up to play squash (or whatever you and that alum happen to be into). Pick their brains so you can have as wide a perspective on post-college life as possible, and a friend waiting on the other side when you get there.
(6) Quality over quantity when it comes to extra-curriculars and internships. One solid internship is all you need. One or two extra-curriculars / hobbies that you're actually into is all you need. Don't join a thousand different clubs or fret about bullshit internships the summer after your freshman year. No one cares except for people at the university and you're already there so don't worry about it.
(7) Enjoy your freedom. If you do everything else right, you should have a ton of time to socialize, have fun, and enjoy a unique period of your life where you have tons of freedom without the usual accompanying responsibility. Take advantage of it. Go to crazy festivals (Burning Man, Carnival, Mardi Gras, whatever), take trips, hang out with your buddies, hook-up, etc.
That’s my list. If you do the above, you should get the credentials you came to college for, a stellar GPA, and you should have a great time in the process. Best of luck.
advice for freshman (Originally Posted: 12/29/2012)
Hi, I just completed my first semester at stern and I have a few questions. I am majoring in finance, and will most likely do a minor in math.
Thanks so much for any help.
Can't really help you, but I'm pretty intrigued by these questions as well. Hopefully someone with experience can provide insights.
Advice for a struggling freshman (Originally Posted: 01/08/2013)
I am currently a freshman at a semi-target looking for finance internships in NYC this summer. I have emailed about 30 AM, PWM, and boutique IB firms and have only gotten 3 responses with no luck.
I am going to keep sending out emails but was hoping someone would have some advice for another route to go. I was thinking I would start broadening my search to all types of corporations and try to intern in their finance department. Anyone have any success with that and any suggestions on how to approach these firms?
LOL When I was a sophomore a year ago, I emailed about 500 firms and got about 30 responses and 2 interviews. I screwed up my first one and got the second one by pure luck because it was all fit. Keep going man, you're not even at the tip of the iceburg.
Thank you for your response. I suppose I was just feeling discouraged because 90% of these firms haven't even been sending me an email saying "sorry, no positions available." But like I said, I will keep going and hopefully someone takes a chance and asks me for an interview.
Although I got my internship through cold emailing my sophomore summer, I would highly recommend a much more targeted approach. If you are at a semi-target you should have a strong network of alumni in financial services. Find an alumni directory, search for "investment banking" and you should find a ton of alumni to email. My response rate emailing alumni is pretty close to 100%. Plus even if they don't have an opening they might know someone who will. You still have time to focus on relationship building. Cold emailing is only good as a last resort. Also keep in mind a lot of smaller firms don't even know their headcounts for the summer and thus can't even offer you an internship opportunity until the spring.
tl;dr-build relationships with alumni and then discuss your interest in investment banking. No reason you can't work at a boutique/MM with this approach.
My school's alumni network is much stronger in other regions of the US but rather weak in NYC. I checked my school's alumni database and couldn't find much in the area. Thank you for your response, though.
Why would a boutique bank even look at a freshman? This is not surprising.
Try cold calling local PWM branches of Merrill Lynch / UBS Wealth Mgmt / etc... these guys often take interns as long as you show some interest and dedication. It will probably be unpaid but the name will help you down the road
Why would anybody look at a freshman?
Sure, it's an uphill battle as a freshman, but it's not impossible - I applied for a bunch of stuff as a freshman, and got lucky with a paid SA stint at a boutique IB. The UCS listing had said sophomores/juniors, but it didn't restrict me from applying and I figured it couldn't hurt.
It's definitely worth trying as a freshman. You shouldn't expect much, but you shouldn't entirely give up on it either. At the end of the day, if you can impress them and convince them that you're smart/capable/professional, that's all that matters.
Dude do not worry so much you are only a freshmen. That aside keep up the hard work and something will pay off. Maybe you can offer to work for free, I bet firms will look at your more that way
Why are you shooting for NYC as a freshman? You should be looking locally with alumni at small/tiny firms. Start small young one
I'd say up the number of calls. My list is hitting triple digits. Also try to call specific alumni of your school that you find through your uni's alumni list, or through LinkedIn
If you email a financial advisor at a small Merrill Lynch branch, follow up with a call if they don't respond after an email or two. It's also kind of early. When I started to enter panic mode I emailed a bunch in March and by the end of the month could have had my pick of 4 different places. Granted you'll have to work unpaid most likely, but as a freshman it's a solid gig.
Try looking for other areas, like Stamford, CT. Much easier to score an internship.
Advice for Freshmen? (Originally Posted: 12/16/2014)
Hey! I'm a first year at a non/semi target school - UNC Chapel Hill looking for an internship for the summer. I know these are extremely hard to come by but I want to at least try before giving up. I've worked really hard the fall semester and have managed to get a 4.0. I've also tried to do semi-finance related things such as joining clubs and working as an account executive for my school newspaper next semester. My knowledge pertaining to business is limited to an AP economics class I took during high school and microeconomics and accounting classes I will be taking next semester. I've also applied to JP Morgan's freshman internship program but I can only imagine how low my chances are in getting accepted to that.
I was just wondering how to approach this situation and end up with something to do in the summer that will help my chances with getting into IBanking. Preferably I will have an internship at an investment bank, but given the very rare chance of that happening and the limited official opportunities related to that, I am unsure of what else to pursue and the time-frame in which to pursue it. I have considered cold-emailing boutique investment banks but I am unsure of what to say and how they will respond. Should I mention the potential for an internship right away? Should I send them my resume right away? Finally, if I am unable to land an internship at an investment bank, what other opportunities are available in the summer that could help me learn more about finance and increase my chances for getting an internship sophomore year?
Thanks for reading this! Any advice would be really helpful.
I am not an expert on these matters, but I have a few things to mention/ask.
First off, do you care if your internship is in NYC? You have a decent chance of breaking into an NYC bank, but your odds are much greater with Charlotte & ATL banks.
I would recommend you look into PWM if you can't get IB interships. It's provides an excellent platform from which you can build off of. Don't be disheartened if you don't score that JP Morgan's/any other bank you apply to internship, there are many opportunities out there.
Also, "learning more about finance" doesn't necessarily increase your chances of getting somewhere. Just keep studying hard in your core classes and start reading up on financial news. Think of this as helping you in your career later on, not in helping you get a job/internship.
Cold e-mailing and resume sending has a minute chance of working, beacuse odds are, your advances will be ignored. Nevertheless, it's worth a shot, if you are willing to put the time into it. Just inquire first; don't throw your resume around.
Again, I'm not the most knowledge person on this, but it's just my two cents.
Do PWM internship and learn financial modeling. That's what I would do during summer break.
I would prefer it to be in NYC but it is possible for me to intern in Charlotte provided I can't get anything else.
Just a question about PWM internships: how would I go about looking for/asking for them and which firms would I look towards? Should I start asking for them now?
Honestly, working at an investment bank this summer is pretty unrealistic. At the moment, you probably have an extremely limited amount of knowledge about the industry as well as basic accounting/finance principles. The good news is that you don't need a banking internship this early on to get one after your junior year. To get a PWM "internship" ask family and close friends if they know anyone in PWM and once you find someone, have that family member or friend ask of you can come to the office a few times to learn about what they do.
Ok thanks so much for all the advice! In terms of emailing the regional managers, should I start emailing them now or waiting a little bit?
Yes, you should start as soon as possible.
5 Things Freshmen Should Be Beware of Before Starting College (Originally Posted: 11/11/2017)
Hello WSO Community,
I am a penultimate year student studying at The University of Melbourne, majoring in Economics and Finance. Due to the short length of the course structure in Melbourne, double majors in the commerce area are usually completed in 3 years, unlike the ones in US which normally takes 5. In Australia, students often find themselves hard to balance their university life (parties and drinking) and academics, often realising they are not in a good position for jobs when everyone is expected to find an internship in the end of penultimate year of university. The realisation is often distressing as there is only a year of university left for the course, due to this, students often find themselves both confused and frustrated. Including myself, with a very very average GPA, of 2.8 GPA. I have experienced great difficulties in securing an internship throughout the year, I have done numerous online interviews and none of them came back for me. Fortunately, after a vast amount of cold emails, in depth searches, quick coffees with current employees of big 4 firms. I have eventually secured two internships for my upcoming summer, doing cash equities trading at a small firm and wealth management at a BB in Hong Kong.
Through this article, I just want to inform those who have an average GPA, or high school graduates who are about to enter college/university things you should beware of to maximise your opportunities to obtain a career in the field. Don't be afraid to ask, every failure is a step closer to success and most importantly, stay motivated!!
GPA matters, in Australia, no one really tells you the significance of GPA or how it can contributes towards your future as everyone is too busy partying in their first year of university. A good GPA opens a lot of doors, IB, BB, Big 4s, they all look at your GPA in order to do screening. Even if you are not the best at studying, trying the hardest would give you an edge over smart kids who are too busy partying. Investing a half decent effort into studies also open up a lot of doors, including going on exchange etc.
Take Initiative Within the College Community Everyone tends to cruise around university/college complaining not securing a half decent internship or complaining why companies wouldn't take them as they claim ''they are the better candidates''. Firms look for specific qualities and one of the biggest ones is leadership/ initiative, join a club, gain experience, meet different people, network, participate in competitions. These activities will make you stand out with you are compared to other candidates.
Get Out Of Your Comfort Zone. Opportunities Are Just Around The Corner Take your chances to socialise in classes, form a study group, this would assist you into achieving good grades and to have a solid support group when you encounter difficulties in your university life. Break ups, bad hook ups, a group to share all your happiness and sorrow. Remember that everyone is as nervous as you so there is nothing wrong to be the first one to be friendly and say hi.
Make use of Consultation Sessions with Professors University is often hard to juggle at times and it has a lot to do with self-independence and being competent in allocating your own time. Subject material often gets hard progressively throughout the semester and your friends might not be able to answer/clarify your unknowns. You have paid your school fees so you might as well just maximise the resources you are given; get help from the professors, clarify your unknowns as soon as possible before workload starts stacking up.
Balanced Lifestyle Students often get carried away because they believe they have to attend every party. Do not get FOMO and peer pressured at times. This is the biggest soft spot of myself. You can be yourself, you do not have to try to be someone else, know what your goals are and make sure you stay on track towards your goals. Students often find themselves giving into parties and a lack of studying will result in severe casualties; a low GPA. You might think GPA can be pulled back up in the upcoming semesters but first year subjects tend to be easier. Hence if you are able to maximise your grades in your first year, it would do you a massive favour even if you do not perform as well as you wanted in your rest of your college life.
WORK HARD PLAY HARD!
Hi Anonymous Monkey, any of these topics helpful:
More suggestions...
Fingers crossed that one of those helps you.
Strategy for First Year of College (Originally Posted: 07/18/2017)
I'm an incoming first year at UVA and am interested in working in investment banking. I know that most internships don't take place until after my third year, I was wondering if there is anything I can do to get ahead of the curve?
I don't have much experience with Finance, in fact my only real accomplishments are CS related (I interned managing websites for local businesses and made a couple apps on the App Store). I plan on joining investment clubs and maintaining a high GPA but do you guys have any suggestions on activities or programs that will give me an edge going into the coveted ib interview in a couple years?
PM me
I just made this account a couple of hours ago and apparently you're barred from sending PM's until 2 days after registration
Get box or die trying
1) Get a 4.0
2) Join Clubs
3) Build your LinkedIn
4) Reach out to UVA fkers and talk about your passion for deals and ask for advice
5) Join OCR
Except the last one isn't possible unless you get into McIntire so make that you fucking priority.
Good luck and PM if you have ANY questions.
I was a part of our bank's OCR for UVA... I would recommend somehow getting a finance internship your sophomore summer (work at a small PE firm, investment bank, etc.) - a majority of competitive people will have a decent GPA and some finance experience their sophomore summer.
I also forget the name, but there is an investing group/affiliation that looks great on the resume (not a must, but more a feather in the cap).
What did you Monkeys do in undergraduate to get where you are today? (Originally Posted: 08/15/2017)
Monkeys,
Think back to your undergrad days, unless you are currently in undergrad! Aside from partying and hooking up with girls, were you active in clubs on campus? Were you a leader of a club? Or did you opt to focus on academics and partying? I'm not sure if there is any need to focus on leading a club.
Would love to hear y'all on this one.
I think the only really positive things I did in college were participating in clubs (fraternity chair, finance club president) and remaining conscientious of things (when applications for stuff are due, do I need an internship this summer, etc). Otherwise I was a slacker like all the rest. I think the key is to not miss the important "checkboxes" on your resume, since if you generally fit the profile of a successful candidate (and you act like and believe that you are), then you'll be a successful candidate.
I didn't know what people meant when they said "fake it 'till you make it," but as an adult I see it: you don't need to be the rockstar because if you're 50% rockstar, you're still in the band, and 20% rockstar means you're still on tour. Most people never even learn to "play."
Greek Life, On Campus Job, Relevant Club, Partying, didn't do too much with academics til junior year.
Jimmy is that you? Get back to work on those TPS reports!
Put that coffee down. Coffee is for closers.
I partied hard, got with a bunch of chics, barely got above a 3.0, and landed in retail out of college. Inspiring, I know.
drink before, during, and after class; hit on any female with legs; ruin social gatherings; briefly get expelled; write a blog and watch youtube through three internships; smoke weed on the roof; talk conspiracy theories with econ professors; get asked to leave parties; get asked to leave bars; get asked to leave concerts; get in fights with arabs; get shit stolen; steal shit; argue with professors for fun; xanax; vyvanse; cigarettes; drunk drive motorcycles
dude college was gay real life is way better im like 22% less retarded
I sure as hell didn't join Toastmasters, lol
Ran student government, my fraternity, sat on various university boards, etc. I also got a sub 3.0 GPA.
Leadership is important, don't get me wrong, but don't let it get in the way of your grades.
I did your MOM.
Advice for an Incoming College Freshmen (Originally Posted: 04/11/2018)
Hey yall. I'm an incoming University of Michigan LSA Honors freshmen and I wanted to seek some advice.
Having acquired about 50 credit hours in high school, I'm on track to graduate in three years with at least two degrees. As of now, my plan is to finish up these three years and then apply to masters in finance program.
My question is, which concentrations should I major in to maximize my chances of getting into a top tier mfin program and eventually land a position as an IB?
I'm thinking something like economics/psychology or economics/political science, but if I do econ/political science, I feel like I might as well pursue a third degree in philosophy or history because of the overlap (and to maximize my college tuition).
Any advice would be appreciated.
Bump
bump
Don't do MFin; try to get into Ross instead if you want to land in IB. Also the number of degrees/majors don't really matter if you want to get into IB.
Why would Ross be advantageous to a mfin program?
advice 1. get into ross 2. dont pair econ with a soft subject. do math cs physics stat etc. 3. get into ross
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