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Wall Street Oasis » Blogs » Ed Conway's blog

Dear Apple, I’m leaving you
 

Ed Conway's picture
Ed Conway
     
 
(Senior Chimp, 24
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 11:00pm
dear apple.jpg

Mod Note (Andy): this is a syndication from edmundconway.com

There follows a letter to Tim Cook, chief executive of Apple:

Dear Tim,

There’s no easy way to put this so I’ll just come right out with it. I’m leaving you. It’s been great (mostly) but it’s over.

I figured the least I could do is to explain my decision in full – I like to think it might help protect you from nasty break-ups like this in the future.

I’ve been with you, with Apple I mean, for 13 years now – ever since 1999. Perhaps you’ve forgotten: I was a spotty teenager; I bought one of your cute little translucent iBooks. Slowly but surely I painted most parts of my technological life a bright shade of Apple. Let’s see: I’ve owned two iMacs, a number of iBooks, countless Macbooks (I’ve currently got two on the go, for some unknown reason), an iPhone for almost five years, an iPad since the very beginning; iPods, iPod touches, iPod nanos – I’ve had ‘em all. I even invested in an Apple TV and, wait for it, a G4 Power Mac Cube (yes, that was me!).

I’ll admit I became dependent on you – clingy, even. When I went to the States a couple of years back I shelled out hundreds of dollars to ensure I wouldn’t be without an iPhone – even though I was back at college and wasn’t exactly rolling in it. And like so many of those who fall in love with you, soon enough I found myself working part-time as your best PR spokesman: I spent hours persuading all my friends to buy your stuff. I even wrote a blog about what made Apple such a dynamic, innovative and successful company.

Like millions of others, I really believed the hype.

I never thought I would utter these words, but here goes: I’m leaving you. I have already traded in my iPhone for a Samsung.

Now, this is the point where I know I’m expected to say: “it’s not you, it’s me,” but I can’t, because the truth is: “it’s not me, it’s you”. Now, I know you don’t like lists (at least I presume that’s why you avoided including a task application in Mac OS and iOS for so many years) but it’s only right that I run through the issues:

1. iOS 6

Yes, I know I’m hardly the first to mention this – but that doesn’t make it any less valid as a complaint. It is truly, truly awful. I’m usually ready to forgive one or two niggles in a new iteration of operating system. After all, they’re usually outweighed by the improvements. In this case, I honestly can’t think of a single new feature that in any way enhances the phone. Every change you’ve made is negative.

The maps application is utterly horrendous; you must have known this is among the most commonly-used of all functional parts of a smartphone and that to change it quite so substantially would be seriously disruptive. Yes, I know you’ve magnanimously urged users to use alternatives, but the problem is that even if I try to use Google maps on your safari browser (it hardly ever works on Safari but let’s leave that for the time being), I can’t avoid the fact that crappy iOS maps are integrated into every other geographically-reliant app I have.*

I know you’re a pragmatic fellow: I suspect you might even give future users the option to change this. But the fact is that’s not the only disconcertingly disastrous issue with iOS. Take iTunes Match. In the previous iOS I could download any individual song in my iTunes Match library, so I could listen to it overseas without data or when in the Tube. Now your dreadful new operating system will only let me download whole albums and then won’t let me delete them afterwards, so my iPhone gets clogged up with stuff before arbitrarily deleting precious chunks of data when it reaches capacity.

It’s as if you think I should never have had the right to have chosen what songs to have, and to delete, on my own iPhone in the first place. Which I find a little controlling, to tell you the truth. As do I find the fact that you now seem to have decided to allow the iOS to decide unilaterally to use the telephone network rather than wifi when it so chooses. Given how badly you screwed up with the whole secret GPS-tracking of iPhone users, I’d have thought you realised we don’t like it when you behave creepily like this. It’s seriously not cool, but then more on that later.

All the new, exciting apps you’ve brought in are, I’m afraid to say, rubbish. Podcasts: dismal and buggy. Facebook integration: should have been there years ago. Passbook: erm – seriously? Siri’s improvements are lost on me because, like most users, the only time I’ve engaged with Siri is to see how many swear words he/she/it understands (answer: a surprising number).

Finally, for some reason iOS also seems to have broken the tilt-scrolling in Instapaper, which I resent because, well, I just use that app a lot.

2. You’ve lost it

Yes, I realise that’s going to sound harsh. But there’s no point in sugaring the pill.

I’ll be specific: for most of our relationship, there were two things I could rely on from Apple. The first was that your products would work far better than PCs. Windows PCs would get viruses, they would be difficult to fix, they would break down and leave you tearing your hair out. The second thing is that although you weren’t necessarily the most innovative company out there, you would just do it right. You weren’t the first company to make a smartphone (Nokia Communicator, anyone?) but you were the first to do it well. The same goes for mp3 players, for tablet computers, for family photo software, for media management (for the first half of iTunes’s life). You were never about innovation, but you were damn good at execution and flair.

Not any more. This is going to sound awful, but I can’t think of any big product you’ve re-imagined well since the iPad, and that was almost three years ago. iCloud? Not as good as dropbox, and actually more confusing. FaceTime? Slick, but still pales in comparison with Skype. iMessages? Mostly annoying, particularly when it sends messages twice. Siri? See the previous point. Safari? Not as good as Chrome or Firefox. Safari’s Reader function? Not as good as Instapaper. I could go on, but I think you get the idea.

Plus, my Mac simply doesn’t work that well any more. The contacts on my iPhone don’t seem to sync very well with my laptop. Aperture is extraordinarily slow and buggy, Pages and Numbers are a bit of a nonsense. It just feels like you don’t make the best software anymore. And it doesn’t fit together as seamlessly as in the past.

3. You’re not cool anymore

Again, this is probably a body blow, but it’s also true. It’s not merely that I now have to put up with your products being used by my mother. The fact is that Apple used to be edgy; it used to be associated with the counterculture; it used to be rebellious. I liked that. I liked the fact that you were uncompromising. When you introduced the iMac you ditched the serial ports and insisted everyone had to make do with USB ports, despite the fact there was approximately one printer in the world which worked with USB. You were the first to ditch disc drives and DVD drives. I’m not alone but I liked the way you refused to put Flash on your devices. Plus I liked the fact that unlike Google and pretty much every other big company you and your fellow execs would never go to navel-gazing networking conferences like the World Economic Forum in Davos. There was something cool about that attitude.

These days, you’re all too ready to compromise. Do you want to know the beginning of the end of our relationship? It was when you decided to include an SD slot in your MacBooks. Why? I can’t imagine the Apple of old ever doing this; there is no inherent reason why you need one in your laptop, save to compromise. And in compromising, you’ve become too complex. I remember the first iMac: it was the first computer you didn’t really need an instruction manual for. When iOS came out I found myself having to download the manual and wade through its 156 pages (156, FFS Tim!) to find out what you’d done with the settings I used to use. That’s the first time I’ve ever had to use an Apple instruction manual.

Apple used to be about purity, which in turn made its products simpler and more reliable; somewhere along the way, this got lost. Or rather, Apple under Steve Jobs used to be about purity: when he wasn’t at the helm in the 90s, it also made the kind of compromises I’m talking about here.

And then there’s your advertising. You were the company which came up with the best advert in history.

These days your ads are not merely awful and patronising – they are palpably worse than the competition.

Finally, there’s that legal letter you sent to Samsung when you failed, churlishly, to get their tablets banned. I challenge anyone to read that and not conclude you’re bitter, chippy and, frankly, a little unpleasant.

In short, you are so not cool.

4. You’re screwing us

You might be surprised to learn that the final straw for me wasn’t the maps debacle. It wasn’t iOS 6. It wasn’t even the fact that you’re not cool anymore. I’m not cool anymore so I probably shouldn’t really expect better from you.

No: the final straw was when you decided to replace the dock on the bottom of all your iPhones and iPads with the new “lightening dock”. I’ve heard your explanations: that it’ll allow your devices to be thinner, that it’s a faster connector and all that. I don’t buy it. The main reason you did this is the main reason you seem to be bringing your products out in ever shorter product cycles: planned obsolescence. You’re aware that the more frequently something is out-of-date, the more often we’ll have to buy more Apple stuff. Now, I was willing to put up with that when it felt as if there was genuinely progress between iterations, when there was a shed of aspiration about it, but by the time you unveiled the lightening connector I wasn’t so sure. All it means is that I have to throw out all the devices I’ve bought over the past years which plug into my iPhone: adaptors, radios, speakers and so on. It’s a really low-down thing to do – particularly since the lightening connector is patently not that much faster than the existing dock.

Anyway, I guess you could say it was a Eureka moment. Finally, I realised that you’ve been working your way here for years: the fact that you give up supporting old Macs far quicker than before; that you won’t let us download and delete our own music from your cloud. You realise there isn’t much money long-term in being a pure manufacturer. You want to turn yourself into a quasi-service, where we constantly need to buy or subscribe to one of your products. I see the point – it’s economic genius. The problem is that it’s not inspiring in the slightest; and the products are no longer wowing us enough to detract from the venality of it. And I’m just tired and, worse, bored of it.

5. I don’t need you any more

That’s right. I’ve realised – and it’s been a revelation – that I could get on perfectly fine without you. A couple of years ago when I moved to the States I couldn’t envisage a day without my iPhone. But today it strikes me I might be just as happy with one of your rivals. How do I know? Well… the truth is, I haven’t been entirely honest with you. I did spend a few months with someone else last year. Don’t be mad: I was between iPhones and I filled the lonely miserable gap with an HTC Android phone. And while I tried to ignore it at the time, the fact is, it was actually pretty good. Yes, there were niggles and a few annoyances, but we got along surprisingly well. And I’ll get on pretty well with it again, because the fact is, Tim: I’m leaving you for an Android. I can get everything I need from a phone from them as well. My email, my messages, maps that work, my contacts (they’re stored with Google anyway and that integrates far better into an Android phone); Evernote, Instapaper, Whatsapp, my tube timetables and bus times. I’ll probably ditch iTunes Match in favour of Amazon Cloud Player or Google Drive, and, frankly, good riddance after the way you’ve treated us mobile users of the service. I’ll miss some of the apps, I’m sure – Reeder to name just one. I’ll miss the hundreds of text messages sitting on my iPhone. I’ll miss… Actually, I can’t think of anything else right now.

I’ll hang onto my iPad for the time being. I’ll certainly keep the Macbook Air – I’m not quite ready to return to Windows yet. But right now, for the first time since I started buying computers, I’m no longer absolutely certain that the next piece of technology I’ll buy will automatically have your logo on the back.

Don’t take it personally. Well, do, if it helps inspire you to make better and bolder products. This need not be forever. You can still win me back: but you’ll need to do something special again, like you did in the good old days. Reinvent the TV, like you reinvented the phone. Revolutionise finance. Overhaul the home entirely. Think Different – as your predecessor Steve Jobs used to say. Perhaps the problem is you’re not the same person any more. You’re not Steve. Perhaps.

Either way, I’m tired of settling for mediocrity from you these days.

Goodbye.

Yours affectionately,

Ed

* Though I admit some – some – of the 3D maps of cities are seriously cool. But prettiness is not enough to compensate me for the times you’ve got me lost.

http://www.edmundconway.com/2012/10/dear-apple-im-leaving-you/

www.edmundconway.com
  • apple
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Comments

Bobb's picture

I've seen people upset with

Bobb
      AM
 
 
(Senior Gorilla, 986
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 2:20pm

I've seen people upset with Apple recently but none say they are ready to leave. I am actually impressed you gave other options a try as many Apple fans are stuck in the Apple ecosystem and refuse to use any thing else.

I haven't had an Apple product since I bought an iPod in 2004 (still works and I think is their best product) but acknowledge that they do make good products. To me the iPhone is simple and boring. I don't like that Apple forces you to use the rest their products (charges, itunes etc) and you have no customization. You said it, iPhone is now seen with older generations and its perfect for them

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BTbanker's picture

Meh. I've used Android for 3

BTbanker
      IB
 
(Senior Neanderthal, 5,340
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 2:27pm

Meh. I've used Android for 3 years now, and after I switched to an iPhone 5. The difference is night and day. You will soon see your phone grow exponentially slower and you won't be able to update the software. What's more with the iPhone is that there is no price premium that other Apple products have, while there are some Androids cost 30% more. The quality of the iPhone 5 surpasses what the price point would suggest relative to Motorola, Samsung, etc. devices.

"A man generally has two reasons for doing anything. One that sounds good, and the real one." - J.P. Morgan

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In reply to BTbanker
ladubs111's picture

BTbanker: Meh. I've used

ladubs111
      IA
 
(Senior Orangutan, 436
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 2:30pm
BTbanker:

Meh. I've used Android for 3 years now, and after I switched to an iPhone 5. The difference is night and day. You will soon see your phone grow exponentially slower and you won't be able to update the software. What's more with the iPhone is that there is no price premium that other Apple products have, while there are some Androids cost 30% more. The quality of the iPhone 5 surpasses what the price point would suggest relative to Motorola, Samsung, etc. devices.

i agree with ya, my Samsung phone is a lot slower and freezes more now. And about the price points, well not all countries subsidizes their phones to the $199 price point so price might be a factor for some.

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In reply to BTbanker
Bobb's picture

BTbanker: Meh. I've used

Bobb
      AM
 
 
(Senior Gorilla, 986
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 3:00pm
BTbanker:

Meh. I've used Android for 3 years now, and after I switched to an iPhone 5. The difference is night and day. You will soon see your phone grow exponentially slower and you won't be able to update the software. What's more with the iPhone is that there is no price premium that other Apple products have, while there are some Androids cost 30% more. The quality of the iPhone 5 surpasses what the price point would suggest relative to Motorola, Samsung, etc. devices.

Thats a problem (or benefit I suppose) of Android. Way to many products (fragmentation) and I can tell you that after a year my Galaxy Nexus is faster than it was day 1. Also my friends with iPhone 3GS and 4 complain their phone has slowed down as well

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shark-monkey's picture

Updated maps is not bad brah.

shark-monkey
      HF
 
 
(Senior Orangutan, 386
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 3:05pm

Updated maps is not bad brah.

Fear is the greatest motivator. Motivation is what it takes to find profit.

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BlackHat's picture

Happily short since 698

BlackHat
      HF
 
 
(Senior Neanderthal, 5,127
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 3:06pm

Happily short since 698

I hate victims who respect their executioners

Follow BH & Co. on Twitter: @DumbLuckCapital
twitter.com/DumbLuckCapital

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IlliniProgrammer's picture

I've now switched to

IlliniProgrammer
      ST
 
 
(Almost Human, 9,257
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 3:14pm

I've now switched to downloading music from Amazon, paying about 30% less for an album and never more than 99 cents for a song- and loading it onto my ITunes.

Cloud Player means I can listen to my music wherever, just like ITunes. And it costs less.

Just downloaded Dvorac's symphonies on AMZN for a 40% discount to what I'd pay at AAPL.

Work hard, play hard.

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In reply to IlliniProgrammer
WallStreetOasis.com's picture

IlliniProgrammer: I've now

WallStreetOasis.com
      EN
 
 
(Human, 12,207
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 3:23pm
IlliniProgrammer:

I've now switched to downloading music from Amazon, paying about 30% less for an album and never more than 99 cents for a song- and loading it onto my ITunes.

Cloud Player means I can listen to my music wherever, just like ITunes. And it costs less.

Just downloaded Dvorac's symphonies on AMZN for a 40% discount to what I'd pay at AAPL.

I still prefer a service like Spotify...any reason not to use Spotify? It's renting, yes, but it's also incredible to be able to listen to almost anything unlimited times, create any playlists you want, etc...

WSO Conference 2013

Private Certified User Chat

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In reply to IlliniProgrammer
AndyLouis's picture

IlliniProgrammer: I've now

AndyLouis
     
 
 
(Almost Human, 6,142
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 3:32pm
IlliniProgrammer:

I've now switched to downloading music from Amazon, paying about 30% less for an album and never more than 99 cents for a song- and loading it onto my ITunes.

Cloud Player means I can listen to my music wherever, just like ITunes. And it costs less.

Just downloaded Dvorac's symphonies on AMZN for a 40% discount to what I'd pay at AAPL.

good idea will look into this, especially since grooveshark is only option i can get internationally and streaming isn't always seamless

WSO's COO (Chief Operating Orangutan) | My story | Connect with me on Linkedin.

2013 WSO Conference

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AQM's picture

Spotify is where it's at.

AQM
      IB
 
(Orangutan, 336
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 4:04pm

Spotify is where it's at. Also, I think it's a good time to buy Apple, hopefully their year end numbers are gonna be good because of the holiday season.

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In The Flesh's picture

Cheer up, it's just a

In The Flesh
      HF
 
 
(Neanderthal, 2,884
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 4:11pm

Cheer up, it's just a company.

Head of Metal Website: www.headofmetal.com

https://twitter.com/headofmetal2012

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In reply to AndyLouis
Edmundo Braverman's picture

AndyLouis: IlliniProgrammer

Edmundo Braverman
      ST
 
 
(Human, 14,705
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 4:19pm
AndyLouis:
IlliniProgrammer:

I've now switched to downloading music from Amazon, paying about 30% less for an album and never more than 99 cents for a song- and loading it onto my ITunes.

Cloud Player means I can listen to my music wherever, just like ITunes. And it costs less.

Just downloaded Dvorac's symphonies on AMZN for a 40% discount to what I'd pay at AAPL.

good idea will look into this, especially since grooveshark is only option i can get internationally and streaming isn't always seamless

Grooveshark fan here, too. Works great in France.

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Going Concern's picture

OP, putting aside your Apple

Going Concern
     
 
 
(King Kong, 1,884
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 5:00pm

OP, putting aside your Apple crusade (which I am in support of), I'm curious to hear your thoughts on Apple TV. I bought a 3rd gen box recently, and interested to know if your experience with it matches mine. Thanks bro.

You have to play the game to find out why you're playing the game.

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whatwhatwhat's picture

i'm sure apple misses your

whatwhatwhat
      HF
 
(King Kong, 1,431
 
Points)
 on 11/7/12 at 11:46pm

i'm sure apple misses your 2.73984 shares

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Kenny Powers's picture

try a windows phone 8, i had

Kenny Powers
      O
 
(Senior Gorilla, 911
 
Points)
 on 11/8/12 at 12:05am

try a windows phone 8, i had windows phone 7 and it was awesome.

pick em, lick em, stick em

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In reply to Edmundo Braverman
wolverine19x89's picture

grooveshark is good, but

wolverine19x89
      O
 
(King Kong, 1,849
 
Points)
 on 11/8/12 at 1:54am
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If your dreams don't scare you, then they are not big enough.

"There are two types of people in this world: People who say they pee in the shower, and dirty fucking liars."-Louis C.K.

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In reply to IlliniProgrammer
APAE's picture

IlliniProgrammer: I've now

APAE
     
 
(Neanderthal, 3,714
 
Points)
 on 11/8/12 at 1:55am

A lot of people do certain things to add days to their life. I do things to add life to my days.

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sandsurfngbomber's picture

Spotify > Grooveshark? What

sandsurfngbomber
      IB
 
(Senior Baboon, 180
 
Points)
 on 11/8/12 at 4:36am
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SECfinance's picture

tl;dr

SECfinance
      IB
 
(King Kong, 1,432
 
Points)
 on 11/13/12 at 10:58pm
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In reply to sandsurfngbomber
wolverine19x89's picture

sandsurfngbomber: Spotify >

wolverine19x89
      O
 
(King Kong, 1,849
 
Points)
 on 11/13/12 at 11:22pm

If your dreams don't scare you, then they are not big enough.

"There are two types of people in this world: People who say they pee in the shower, and dirty fucking liars."-Louis C.K.

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Web Site Security Rules. Users are prohibited from violating or attempting to violate the security of the Web Site, including, without limitation, (a) accessing data not intended for such user or logging into a server or account which the user is not authorized to access, (b) attempting to probe, scan or test the vulnerability of a system or network or to breach security or authentication measures without proper authorization, (c) attempting to interfere with service to any user, host or network, including, without limitation, via means of submitting a virus to the Web Site, overloading, "flooding", "spamming", "mailbombing" or "crashing", (d) sending unsolicited e-mail, including promotions and/or advertising of products or services, or (e) forging any TCP/IP packet header or any part of the header information in any e-mail. Violations of system or network security may result in civil or criminal liability. The Company will investigate occurrences which may involve such violations and may involve, and cooperate with, law enforcement authorities in prosecuting users who are involved in such violations.

Specific Prohibited Uses.

The Company specifically prohibits any use of the Web Site, and all users agree not to use the Web Site, for any of the following:

  • Posting any incomplete, false or inaccurate biographical information or information which is not your own accurate resume
  • Using any device, software or routine to interfere or attempt to interfere with the proper working of this Web Site or any activity being conducted on this site.
  • Taking any action which imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load on this Web Site?s infrastructure.
  • If you have a password allowing access to a non-public area of this Web Site, disclosing to or sharing your password with any third parties or using your password for any unauthorized purpose.
  • Notwithstanding anything to the contrary contained herein, using or attempting to use any engine, software, tool, agent or other device or mechanism (including without limitation browsers, spiders, robots, avatars or intelligent agents) to navigate or search this Web Site other than the search engine and search agents available from the Company on this Web Site and other than generally available third party web browsers (e.g., Netscape Navigator, Microsoft Explorer).
  • Attempting to decipher, decompile, disassemble or reverse engineer any of the software comprising or in any way making up a part of the Web Site.
  • Aggregating, copying or duplicating in any manner any of the materials or information available from the Web Site.
  • Framing of or linking to any of the materials or information available from the Web Site.

User Information.

When you register for the Web Site, you will be asked to provide the Company with certain information including, without limitation, a valid email address (your "Information"). In addition to the terms and conditions that may be set forth in any privacy policy on this Web Site, you understand and agree that the Company may disclose to third parties, on an anonymous basis, certain aggregate information contained in your registration application. The Company reserves the right to offer third party services and products to you based on the preferences that you identify in your registration and at any time thereafter; such offers may be made by the Company or by third parties. Please see the Company's Privacy Policy below for further details regarding your Information.

Registration and Password.

You are responsible for maintaining the confidentiality of your information and password. You shall be responsible for all uses of your registration, whether or not authorized by you. You agree to immediately notify the Company of any unauthorized use of your registration or password.

The Company's Liability.

As a condition to your use of this site, you release the Company (and our agents and employees) from claims, demands and damages (actual and consequential, direct and indirect) of every kind and nature, known and unknown, suspected and unsuspected, disclosed and undisclosed, arising out of or in any way connected with such disputes. If you are a California resident, you waive California Civil Code d1542, which says: "A general release does not extend to claims which the creditor does not know or suspect to exist in his favor at the time of executing the release, which if known by him must have materially affected his settlement with the debtor."

We are under no legal obligation to, and generally do not, control the information provided by other users which is made available through the Web Site. By its very nature, other people?s information may be offensive, harmful or inaccurate, and in some cases will be mislabeled or deceptively labeled. We expect that you will use caution and common sense when using this Web Site.

The Material may contain inaccuracies or typographical errors. The Company makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness, or timeliness of the Web Site or the Material. The use of the Web Site and the Material is at your own risk. Changes are periodically made to the Web Site and may be made at any time.

You acknowledge and agree that you are solely responsible for the content and accuracy of any resume or material contained therein placed by you on the Web Site and you agree to let any users that are identified as recruiters (designated in the sole discretion of the Company) to have access to your resume.

The Company is not to be considered to be an employer with respect to your use of the Web Site and the Company shall not be responsible for any employment decisions, for whatever reason made, made by any entity posting jobs on the Web Site.

THE COMPANY DOES NOT WARRANT THAT THE WEB SITE WILL OPERATE ERROR-FREE OR THAT THE WEB SITE AND ITS SERVER ARE FREE OF COMPUTER VIRUSES OR OTHER HARMFUL MECHANISMS. IF YOUR USE OF THE WEB SITE OR THE MATERIAL RESULTS IN THE NEED FOR SERVICING OR REPLACING EQUIPMENT OR DATA, THE COMPANY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THOSE COSTS.

THE WEB SITE AND MATERIAL ARE PROVIDED ON AN "AS IS" BASIS WITHOUT ANY WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND. THE COMPANY, TO THE FULLEST EXTENT PERMITTED BY LAW, DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, WHETHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING THE WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NON-INFRINGEMENT. THE COMPANY MAKES NO WARRANTIES ABOUT THE ACCURACY, RELIABILITY, COMPLETENESS, OR TIMELINESS OF THE MATERIAL, SERVICES, SOFTWARE, TEXT, GRAPHICS, AND LINKS.

Disclaimer of Consequential Damages.

IN NO EVENT SHALL THE COMPANY, ITS SUPPLIERS, OR ANY THIRD PARTIES MENTIONED ON THE WEB SITE BE LIABLE FOR ANY DAMAGES WHATSOEVER (INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, INCIDENTAL AND CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES, LOST PROFITS, OR DAMAGES RESULTING FROM LOST DATA OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) RESULTING FROM THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE WEB SITE AND THE MATERIAL, WHETHER BASED ON WARRANTY, CONTRACT, TORT, OR ANY OTHER LEGAL THEORY, AND WHETHER OR NOT THE COMPANY IS ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES.

Links to Other Sites.

The Web Site may contain links to third party web sites. These links are provided solely as a convenience to you and not as an endorsement by the Company of the contents on such third-party Web sites. The Company is not responsible for the content of linked third-party sites and does not make any representations regarding the content or accuracy of materials on such third party Web sites. If you decide to access linked third party Web sites, you do so at your own risk.

No Resale or Unauthorized Commercial Use.

You agree not to resell or assign your rights or obligations under these Term of Use. You also agree not to make any unauthorized commercial use of the Web Site.

Limitation of Liability.

The aggregate liability for the Company to you for all claims arising from the use of the Materials is limited to $1.

Termination.

The Company reserves the right, at its sole discretion, to pursue all of its legal remedies, including but not limited to immediate termination of your registration with or ability to access the Web Site and/or any other service provided to you by the Company, upon any breach by you of these Terms and Conditions or if the Company is unable to verify or authenticate any information you submit to the Web Site registration with or ability to access the Web Site.

Indemnity.

You agree to defend, indemnify, and hold harmless the Company, its officers, directors, employees and agents, from and against any claims, actions or demands, including without limitation reasonable legal and accounting fees, alleging or resulting from your use of the Material or your breach of the terms of these Terms and Conditions. The Company shall provide notice to you promptly of any such claim, suit, or proceeding and shall assist you, at your expense, in defending any such claim, suit or proceeding.

General.

The Company makes no claims that the Materials may be lawfully viewed or downloaded outside of the United States. Access to the Materials may not be legal by certain persons or in certain countries. If you access the Web Site from outside of the United States, you do so at your own risk and are responsible for compliance with the laws of your jurisdiction. These Terms and conditions are governed by the internal substantive laws of the State of New York, without respect to its conflict of laws principles. Jurisdiction for any claims arising under this agreement shall lie exclusively with the state or federal courts within New York, New York. If any provision of these Terms and Conditions are found to be invalid by any court having competent jurisdiction, the invalidity of such provision shall not affect the validity of the remaining provisions of these Terms and Conditions, which shall remain in full force and effect. No waiver of any term of these Terms and Conditions shall be deemed a further or continuing waiver of such term or any other term. Except as expressly provided in additional terms of use for areas of the Web Site a particular "Legal Notice," or Software License or Material on particular Web pages, these Terms and Conditions constitute the entire agreement between you and the Company with respect to the use of Web Site. No changes to these Terms and Conditions shall be made except by a revised posting on this page.

PRIVACY POLICY

The Company recognizes that you are concerned about privacy. We are committed to preserving your privacy and safeguarding your sensitive information. The following statement describes the general information-gathering and usage practices of our sites.

Our staff, contractors, Internet service providers and others involved in this site follow this policy or similarly strict policies regarding your Information.

Disclosure

The Company is committed to fully disclosing our policies regarding the collection, use, maintenance, disclosure and security of personal information obtained from users of our site. The term "personal information" includes a name, address, email address, or any other information which could be used to contact you directly or to identify you personally.

Use and Disclosure Limitations

The Company only uses personal information about its Web site users for specific purposes. We do not share user information with third parties except when we have told users about the disclosures, when we have prior consent, or when required by law.

Use Policy: When the Company gathers personal information from users, we ask for permission first. We also disclose, at the time of collection, how the information will be used by us. Personal information is used for activities such as auto-completion of commonly-used forms and helping us contact you when you solicit information from us.

Disclosure Policy: We do not normally disclose personal information to anyone outside of the Company unless we have previously informed users about the disclosures. However, some data may be used from time to time by outside contractors, including auditors or consultants, to assist us in carrying out necessary financial or operational activities. These uses will be consistent with this privacy policy and all contractors using this potential personal information must agree to safeguard it, to use it only for the authorized purpose, and to return it or destroy it upon completion of the activity.

The Company might be required to disclose personal information in response to a valid legal process such as a subpoena, search warrant or court order.

Although unlikely, it is possible that we may have to make certain disclosures to ensure the security of our Web site, to protect its integrity, or to take precautions against potential liability. In any of these situations, we will take any reasonable steps to limit the scope of the data disclosed.

Web Logs: The Company maintains standard Web logs that record basic information about visitors to our Web site. These logs contain: * The Internet domain from which you came to our Web site. * Your IP address. An IP address is a series of numbers which uniquely identifies your connection to the Internet. Although it is possible in some instances, certain types of IP addresses may be used by interested persons to identify users but we do not attempt to identify users in this way. * The type of browser (e.g., Internet Explorer or Netscape) and operating system (e.g., Windows 98) you use. * The date and time you visited the site, and the pages you saw.

We use Web log information to design our Web site, identify popular features, and in similar ways. We do not try to identify individuals from Web logs or to link Web logs to other user information. However, if someone tries to damage our Web site or use it in an unauthorized or illegal way, we may share Web log information with law enforcement agencies. The Company may provide aggregate information such as the number of users who visit particular pages of the site, or the number of people who link to certain external sites from our site, to other parties.

Changes to Privacy Policy

The Company's features and services will change over time and our information-gathering practices and policies may also change.

While our philosophy of protecting user information from inappropriate uses and disclosures will not change, this policy will be updated occasionally to include any change that materially affects the collection, maintenance, use, or disclosure of personal information.

Forum Topics

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  • Last year Dalian Wanda Group bought theater chain AMC Entertainment for $2.6 Bn, and now it is snagging up Sunseeker International. [quote] Dalian Wanda said it would pay £320 million for a 91.8 percent stake in Sunseeker, based in Dorset, England, with the remaining stake to be acquired by...
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  • Is anyone familiar with this firm? Started by 3 experienced guys in the media industry. Looks like they've done a couple notable deals in the past 2-3 years. How big is the firm (esp. analyst & associate level)? How is the dealflow? Do they only have an office in SF? Thanks in...
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  • Hi everyone! Some of you may remember me, I stopped posting on this forum about a year ago because I got tired of the site for a number of reasons and it wasn't worth it for me anymore. However I'm a big believer of giving back, and I did learn a lot from this site and from a few of the...
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  • This question is regarding background checks and references. I worked at a boutique IB and want to use my old boss as a reference. However, my old boss no longer works at the boutique IB anymore. Is it still acceptable to use him as a reference, or will employers want a reference who still...
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  • 1:41pm: Buy 200 shares WFC @ $41.10 on 99% margin. Currently down $87.98 + $0.90 interest. I normally stay away from margin. I was having a good day and got cocky. Today wiped out a week's worth of profits for me. Note: I swing trade with some day trades thrown in. What would you...
    I Made a Stupid Bernanke-Inspired Trade: Exit?
  • Hello everybody, I just finished up my sophomore year at a semi target and now am trying to choose an internship which will best position me for IB recruiting next year. I'm trying to decide between two internships - one is a credit analyst position at a commercial bank where I would...
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    PE in Miami
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  • Dealbook: http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2013/06/19/wesley-clark-retired-general-joins-blackstone-as-an-adviser/ I still can't believe these guys are cashing in before Tim Geithner....
    Gen. Wesley Clark Joins Blackstone
  • I'm interested in doing something along the lines of F500 finance or FP&A. I was accepted into Michigan State and UMich. I couldn't go to an out-of-state college due to my low socioeconomic status. If I go to Michigan State: major in Finance and minor in Econ If I go to...
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  • Title says it all. I'm ~2 years removed from my banking days and I'm moving apartments so figuring out what to do with my old lucites (they've been sitting in a box for the past 2 years). Feels wrong to just throw them out but assuming I don't come back to banking (and I...
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<em>Mod note: make sure to see the great comment below by CompBanker</em> I come from a small town where nobody had ever heard of consulting or IB. I was fortunate enough to attend a top target college (a good Ivy) and land a gig in IB at a BB/EB. I'm starting full time this...
Finance Culture - Personalities
<strong>Background</strong> I randomly discovered WSO nearly seven years ago just weeks after I secured a FT MM IB position. The website was extremely nascent at the time with only a few thousand registered users. The majority of the users were college students with only a handful...
How WSO has enhanced my IB/PE career
<em>Mod note: <strong><a href="http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/faq/what-are-the-best-qa-threads-and-interviews-with-top-finance-professionals-on-wso ">Click here</a></strong> to see all of our q&a's and interviews</em><P> I figured I...
Open for Questions - Equities in Dallas
<em>Mod Note: This is a syndication from Jared's Daily Dirtnap daily market newsletter. WSO readers qualify for a $100 discount...just email [email protected] and mention "WSO Monkey Discount" You can follow Jared on twitter at @dailydirtnap</em> This one has...
THE LAST MILE
After over one year in the making, the <strong><a href="http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/2013-wso-compensation-report-full">2013 WSO Compensation Report</a></strong> is here! Access to the FULL 108 page 2013 WSO Compensation Report is <strong>100%...
2013 WSO Compensation Report has Arrived
When I first started as a PE analyst, I constantly struggled with judging the amount of time I should spend on reviewing sourced deals. How much time is enough to really get a handle on the company’s revenue streams? How granular do I need my analysis to be on industry threats? With this...
Misguided Efforts: A Cautionary Tale
Fellow Primates, We are looking for 1-2 students on each campus to help WSO in its sales efforts to student clubs/career centers, and overall promotion at your school both online and on the ground. Below is a description of the position and benefits...thanks in advance for your help! <a...
WSO is Looking for Campus Reps For Summer/Fall 2013 (and beyond)
Many of the questions that have come in surround recruiting for front office Wall Street careers from a non-target so we’ll start with some ideas for recruiting, move on to interviewing, preparing for the job and finally long-term career management advice. Before we begin, it has been...
Stand Out as a Non-Target: Recruiting (Part 1 of 4)
Any Asset Management people here who could give me some insights on it, such as the nature of the work, the pay, the hours, the potential for career advancement, ect? I was looking into IB before but I've decided that I would rather pursue a career that's more intellectually...
Asset Management a better choice than Investment Banking?
<img src="//img.pandawhale.com/48721-Sexually-Oblivious-Female-Meme-Ze2w.png" alt="Sexually Oblivious Female Meme - Favorite Position? I would like to be a CEO.">
If you could be the richest person in the world with your dream job only as a public virgin forever would you do it?
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