All,
So i'm 6 months into my new position. Most of you know I was an FLDP in Aerospace and I immediately left that company for what I think was a promising position in healthcare at a smaller more meritocratic. I make 80k base and was given a 10k signing bonus and i'm the only junior analyst working on the reporting and restructuring of some properties we own that are in bankruptcy. I'm 24 and the next youngest finance guy is a mid level associate who is 29, has his MBA, and worked in banking for 3 years before his MBA,
So around 4 months in I started getting work directly from the CFO, a senior VP, and a Director. I get the same level work the associate does at the minimum. I've now been told directly by the CFO, the Senior VP, and the Director that I do better work then the associate and I now always get the more challenging work. The associate has even, at times, asked me how to do some analysis.
So my question is this, since I know for a fact he makes 30k base more then I do, is it right for me to bring that up this soon at the new company? Should I wait until my year anniversary? I'm annoyed at my predicament but I also don't want to tip my hand too soon.
Yeah, I'd wait on that. He may ask you how to do a few things, but I promise his industry experience trumps whatever technical assistance you could offer. Wait until a mid year / annual review and then broach the subject. If the company sees you as a top performer (and its documented) you will at least have something to point to.
Try to keep it in perspective. If you like what you do, and you're not killing yourself, 80k base isn't bad. I assume in industry you are probably have a 15% bonus target, so you're looking at 92k comp and likely close to $100k with other benefits.
You will realize throughout your career that you work for people less qualified than yourself; suck it up, and be humble. Some of the best career advice I have received: your job is not to do your job, your job is to make your boss look good.
Keep at it. If the firm doesn't recognize your contributions in a year or so (and you are still interested in that work) look for other opportunities.
But ya, I get what you mean, thanks for bringing me down to earth.
I wouldn't bring it up yet being only 6 months into the job. Be happy that you're getting additional responsibility and recognition from the higher-ups. There's alway going to be some dipshit who makes more money than you who you can run circles around. Just the way it is. You'll get what you deserve, just don't make it seem as if it's all about the money.
You should learn the difference between than and then.
80k base is pretty dang good at your age/exp. I wouldn't rush to ask for a raise. You will probably be better in the long run to ask/wait for one a year to a year and a half in.
Lets say you ask for the raise now - 6 months in - if you do get the raise, it probably wont be more than the associate makes. If you wait until your annual review more than likely your raise will surpass the associate and be more than what would have been offered at the 6 mo period...
Just putting some positive vibes out there.
Definitely disagree here. I doubt the raise will even get you to the associate's level, though I don't have the full rundown on your situation. It should even the playing field a good bit, though.
Note: you're in this for the long-haul (I'm guessing). 6 months is definitely too soon for a raise up to the associate's level. Even a year is a very short amount of time. Aim for closing the gap by 3/4 now. If you feel good about how things are going, aim for more. It can be dangerous to be that expensive at this point in your career.
You disagree that later on in his employment his value will increase, thus increasing his chances of a larger raise? Or do you disagree that he will not make as much or more than an associate based on his career level.
Not challenging, just interested.
Just leaving this here so I remember to get back to it.
Okay, there are a couple of reasons. I want to preface by saying that this comes from experience I've had in other industries as well as discussions with a number of people both in and outside of finance.
1) You don't want to piss anyone off. That associate's been there for a while, if he gets wind that the new guys is making as much/more than him, how do you think that's going to go over? It may not seem like a big deal as you're better than him, but he's been there longer and has a network. I suppose this is more of a "keep your salary info under wraps" warning. Don't let a single person that might even bump into someone you work with know what you make.
2) You don't want to piss off your boss by pressing for something too quickly. A year seems like a long time, but keep in mind most of the people you work with have probably been there for at least a decade. A year is a good amount of time to see your work product, but it says nothing about your willingness and interest in building a career with that company.
3) Who gets shown the door first when cuts need to happen? You better believe it's the young guy with the huge salary. They were able to function before with just that associate, they'd be able to function after.
4) MOST IMPORTANT: You have to feel this out. If you're sure the company's financially stable, #3 doesn't matter. If nobody catches wind of your salary, #1 doesn't matter. If you keep performing exceptionally and your boss/superiors are very happy with what you're bringing to the table, that can easily overcome #2.
All we can give you is a few key things to look for. You really have to feel things out, factor in the company culture, factor in your boss's attitude, etc. I won't say don't push for a raise to that associate's level, but I will say be careful about it.
If you like the job/company and want to have a career with that company, can you live with making less than him for another year knowing it'll even out in the long run?
EDIT: Also forgot to mention, I don't know if you have full knowledge of what that associate does. There very well could be a reason he makes that much more than you. That could be someone he knows at the company or something specific he was hired for.
Instead of simply asking for more money, why not apply for an internal promotion that offers increased responsibility and higher pay at the one year mark?
It is different at every company, but from my experience asking for a raise without applying for a new role or additional responsibiliry can be difficult. If I'm the hiring manager, why would I give you more money to do the same work you're already doing for me? Now if you talk about taking on more responsibility with a new role or applying for opportunities with another division within the company, that is when you start to get some leverage, especially if you are good and they like you. I'm solely speaking from my experience, but my managers in the past never considered giving me more money until they realized they might lose me.
I'm guessing that at 2-3 years out of college with a bachelors degree, you are more than likely already making more than average based on your education/experience, which could make it even more difficult for your manager to justify a raise with HR.
That said, it never hurts to ask and the worst that will happen is they say no.
As far as a promotion in what I want to do, the only promotion I think would be a legitimate step up and keep me on the path I want to go on is to the associate level.
Gurl's gotta get paid. Ask for all the money. These betas just don't know.
Here's another way to think of it: the best recommendations for promotions, B school, even other jobs, tend to come from senior managers who know you are underpaid relative to your value, who continually look good as a result of you busting your chops for them, and who believe you to be humble and appreciative.
Don't ruin a good thing by getting ahead of yourself.
Do you have leverage? If you have plenty, and are confident you can negotiate successfully...then go ahead. Just make sure you verify that your boss(es) know you're damned good, and they believe that you're worth the raise.
I think you have to tread carefully as you don't want to sully the positive relationship that you appear to be cultivating with your senior folks, which is potentially more valuable in the long term than a slight increase in base. An ask after only six months could appear pushy, greedy, opportunistic, or ungrateful.
Pay doesn't always correlate with ability and skill, it's often dependent on age and experience, particularly within the organization itself.
Just because your work is liked does not mean that someone wants to shell out more cash for you...this isn't a charity, and people are paid the minimum amount that senior staff thinks they can pay you to continue doing your job and not quit.
As the above poster said it helps an awful lot if you have some type of tangible leverage, such as an expertise, knowledge base, skill, or network that is needed or at least very useful for some aspect of the business to function and you're the only one that has it.
6 months is wayyy too early to be asking for a raise. At least wait a year.
I think you are comparing apples and oranges here. This guy has the higher job title, 5 years older, has an advanced degree, and (appears to) have more work experience on him. True, you may do better work or analysis - the same can be said of analysts and associates at IB.
Companies would perform better if they were more meritocratic and that's why I left my old job. However, as an update, I was recently told (without asking) that I was in line for a possible full promotion in the 12-18 month range (6-12 months from now) to that level (and pay) if things kept going at the current pace. So I have decided to hold off on saying anything.
Thanks all for the advice.
Good call. To get a little more into the reasoning behind it, it comes down to uncertainty. Just about every senior guy could give you an example of a young guy that came in and killed it the first year, got a big raise, got bored, stuck around because of the fat paycheck, and eventually got fired. They generally just want to make sure you're committed to sticking around and performing at the level you're at.
It's not personal, it's biznass
What is the best way to ask your boss for a salary hike? (Originally Posted: 12/21/2016)
I am a first-year analyst at an Angel Network and I am five months into the job. It is a small team (I am the only junior level guy) and the management is easily accessible. I usually tend to be pro-active as I like the work and have been complimented for my work-ethic. It is a mix of a FO/BO role (small team, remember).
To be honest, I screwed up the compensation negotiation while joining (this was hinted to me by my colleague) and am considering whether I can re-negotiate. Do you guys think it is too early to shake the boat? What should my strategy be?
P.S: Looking for some genuine advice....personally, it is more about being compensated for the value add rather than the money.
Honestly, yes too early, however- by how much do you think you undercut yourself? Are we talking $5-$10k here?
Maybe. Somewhere near the lower end of the ballpark.
How would your colleague know if you screwed something / what are you comparing to if you are the only junior level guy? Fix your story.
Colleague is actually the senior level guy who was there during the discussion. He didn't state it directly but something along the lines of 'you should do your negotiation better'. Comparing to the market value.
Wait a full year, list your accomplishments, then compare them against your company's baseline expectations. Then determine if you've exceeded expectations. In the interim research market rates for the position and responsibilities at a fund with similar size and strategy
I'd love to hear Fear the Bulge's response to this.
Fear The Bulge
Asking for a salary increase or promotion should be based on what tangible value you're adding to the business (ideally in dollar terms - profits, revenue, cost savings, productivity gains, etc) and if that's commensurate with what you're asking for. If you can demonstrate both then go for it, otherwise don't bother
that should only apply to sales type jobs.
I would wait until a year, generally speaking. Asking too early (unless you did a great deal) can hurt your image at the firm.
Bring it up during the annual review. - List of things that you have done (a part of your job). - List of areas that you would like to improve or work on (adding value > beyond your current job scope). - Proactively seek feedback on your performance. New job scope + list of new responsibilities > new salary adjustment
That sounds logical. Thanks.
Find a way to get them into a hot deal/find them a really interesting deal everyone's trying to get into. That should give you a good basis to ask for a raise during annual review.
Wait a year and back it up with numbers and facts. Do your research in the meantime.
My advice? Use less hyphens.
Haha. That should guarantee a hike.
Fewer
too early now, but at year end I am sure you will be subjected to some sort of review where you can request that your compensation should be increased as a reward for your contributions to the team and your potential.
Ask for feedback year round, at least once a month and if you get good feedback you can use that during the reviews to make your case and see if they will put their money where their mouth is. good luck.
Don't ask, Please watch " Allied "
Just got my ticket to go see this.
Be methodical and be sure to back up your request with research. It makes it tougher to reject if it's within the means of your supervisor to provide.
You miss 100% of the shots you don't take -The great one
Similar here..small investment team (CEO,CIO,Director, Monkey (me))..was happy to leave a BO job for my chance to be involved in the investment decision process..thus I took the first offer..I knew I was under market .. but I really realized it when my director left and a month later I decided to ask him what my market should be..and I was 10k less than what he thought I was doing (Only CIO was in the $ process)..thus when they gave me an increase 2 weeks ago that was below this amount I was sad but accepted it because I did not want to poison my relationship..but during the day I grew some balls and requested it..and he told me that he was happy I asked him..because He wanted me to be happy and he liked my work but did not really know what the market was for analyst with my background (CFA +masters) (He's a former partner at a consulting firm)...I asked for 5K more..because I was a little bit shy to ask for another 10K ..but still it's getting closer...
End results..Give it a try bro..
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