Banking sucks, where to next?

So I spent 8 months to a year preparing for interviews and what not. I finally got into investment banking...and I hate it. I realize now that I want to be involved in the public markets somehow. Since most of the stuff I read is IB related, now I don't even know what else is out there. Where can one go once banking has been ruled out? what positions are there that dont work you 80-120 hrs a week and have you knowledgeable about what is happening in there world with the ECB and QE infinity and what not. All I can think of that is worthwhile is S&T and that's just as crazy as banking, no? anything else?

 

Hahaha, this made me laugh. I'm having the same debate in my head where I'm spending at least several hours a week reading about IB related content that doesn't have a lot of relevance to my corp. fin job right now. I am so intrigued by the idea of working in the FO of a BB and then I realize it would probably take me 2-3 months to get the system down (like most jobs) and then what? I would be stuck working 90+ hr weeks in perpetuity while not further stimulating my intellectual curiosity? Sounds like a blast.

 

You can always go into financial institution regulation. I spent a summer at one of those agencies and while you start at a low level evaluating community/medium sized banks, you have the option to move up to SIFIs and then ultimately to become directors/policy makers.

The work/life balance is really good and most of these regulatory agencies also operate on a different pay scale than the government (decently higher and faster career progression). The top level people at the agency I work with interact with central bankers from many different countries, world bank, IMF, etc.

 
datphukinnewb:

You can always go into financial institution regulation.

That is an atrocious idea. To OP- Hours are better in S&T, but sounds like you are looking for AM/HF. If you are at a solid bank you should be able to transition. It's a little bit baffling that you are in IB and aren't aware of your options.
"For I am a sinner in the hands of an angry God. Bloody Mary full of vodka, blessed are you among cocktails. Pray for me now and at the hour of my death, which I hope is soon. Amen."
 
duffmt6:

Hours are better in S&T, but sounds like you are looking for AM/HF

That's actually exactly where I want to end up (HF), but from what I understand IB is the best way to get there. I just don't think I'd make it through the 2 yr program...plus my bank isn't top notch and I'm afraid I won't get offers. what other paths could I take to land a role at a HF?

BTbanker:

You've been working, what, 2 months?

You would positively fail at a hedge fund. Go work for the government.

Slightly longer but good guess. How'd you know that?

 
BTbanker:

You've been working, what, 2 months?

You would positively fail at a hedge fund. Go work for the government.

Slightly longer but good guess. How'd you know that?

because you are displaying every sign of first year burn out... every firstyear kid on wall street is probably feeling similarly now. just trust me it gets better over time.

and also because you sound like me x number of years ago when I was a first year! ..and all my friends in ibd or even outside of finance -- pretty identifiable traits. we are ALL happier kids now.

 
she_monkey:
BTbanker:

You've been working, what, 2 months?

You would positively fail at a hedge fund. Go work for the government.

Slightly longer but good guess. How'd you know that?

because you are displaying every sign of first year burn out... every firstyear kid on wall street is probably feeling similarly now. just trust me it gets better over time.

and also because you sound like me x number of years ago when I was a first year! ..and all my friends in ibd or even outside of finance -- pretty identifiable traits. we are ALL happier kids now.

eh, HF success is part luck, part skill. couldn't say for sure whether someone would fail or succeed. there are def people who left IB after 6 months (2 of those months being training, not even on the floor) and went to a Maverick and did great. and there are certainly people who did the whole 2 years, went to a HF and didn't do that well.

probably the best thing about banking is the whole pre-mba recruiting apparatus behind it though. can't think of any other job right out of college where people are aggressively recruiting you for jobs that pay double your current job when you're just months into your first job out of college. if you're in a good group and at a good firm, you'll definitely receive (if you haven't already) inbounds from headhunters. i'm sure you could find something, maybe even an immediate hire position.

 

Being a financial advisor sounds exactly like what you are looking for. There are other jobs too, but this is definitely one.

Keep in mind, just like IBD, different companies, different platforms, different groups within companies have different working conditions / compensation, so IF you decide you would wanted to be a FA, you would then need to ASK, "where is the best place, what is the best platform" for ME to be a successful advisor. Everyone is different and different platforms work better for different people. Here is a basic example, private bank vs brokerage house vs RIA...etc.

 
Best Response

you're just having typical first year feelings.. about 2-3 months in is when EVERYBODY start to get tired of their jobs and realize that college was more fun. obviously, it's a little worse when you are working those IBD hours.. but trust me, everyone even those in 9-5 jobs will find something to complain about. "too corporate.. i'm better fit for a start up/smaller company" "my boss is an asshole" "the guy i work for isnt as smart as me/college professor/ivy league classmates" ..

yes you'll feel a little out of touch from the world..and behind on your personal sht from talking to gf/girls to checking your email to calling your mom back. this is normal. anyone that is 'overwhelmed' (and most fresh graduates inevitably do around 3 months in) will be behind on their personal lives, which snowballs into frustration then burn out. contrary to what you may feel, many 9-5ers do not spend 5pm-12am+ (ie. the # of hours you're in the office and they'are not) as efficiently as you think.. most do NOT know much about the world outside their immediate industry; at least you are reading some news.

in any case.. you'll get faster and will have more free time as a result. additionally, you'll also learn to balance and maximize the little time u do have outside of work since you are JUST learning to live without the random 1-2 hour breaks you had in college. 'public sector' (or god know, any other job in the world) may sound better now, but you are in no condition to make a fair judgement.
don't jump because you burnt out, jump because it's really a bad fit. you won't know whether it's a bad fit until you've worked the job for a bit longer... hang in there. it'll get better.

 
HBS1989:

The IMF/WB seem like two places you may be more comfortable. You'll definitely get to learn more about the world in general working there. Though their recent grad position are few and far between, and you will be competing globally for a spot.

I suspect this is true as well, and it was my immediate thought when reading this post.

That said, you can kiss your near-term chances of landing a spot at either goodbye if you jump ship from your first job after 3 months.

Work is tough: many times you move to a new city, have inadequate time to develop a new network of friends quickly and in IB, as we know, you're toiling away at less-than-life-fulfilling work. It's a shock coming from college, understandably. That shouldn't be used as rationalization for switching jobs this early, because I assure you that it's (mostly) not IB that's causing your problems, it's the reality of moving into the "real world". Your friends working 50 hours per week are not living it up and loving life - they're in the same spot you are, with more time to feel lonely.

In any case, you won't be doing your long-term happiness any favors by contemplating (or actuating) a departure this early on.

"For all the tribulations in our lives, for all the troubles that remain in the world, the decline of violence is an accomplishment we can savor, and an impetus to cherish the forces of civilization and enlightenment that made it possible."
 

I interned in S&T on the derivatives desk. I rotated but spent majority of time with sales team on the interest rates and commodity desks. Worked 50-60 hours a week. No weekends. We always left work in the office (no worries of blackberry emails after 5pm or on the weekends). It's way different lifestyle from IB corporate finance. I liked it and found it to be very interesting. Keep in mind that in S&T you will be working on a desk (team) that specializes in one area (e.g. interest rates). So your technical knowledge will be very focused, but there are also groups that cover broader areas (e.g. equity solutions team). This specialized knowledge could help or hurt you depending on what group you're in (in S&T) and what type of asset manager / hedge fund you're going for after.

Had I stayed, I would have continued on the sales side. I liked it because the whole job was about the markets. Our team would spend part of our time figuring out and analyzing the market (with our traders and other investment professionals), then spend the other time talking and presenting to clients. Keep in mind that as an analyst, you will be doing mostly analyst type stuff (preparing PPTs and excel spreadsheets, bloomberg data mining, drafting investment memos, etc) but you do get the opportunity to start doing higher level stuff. Hope this sheds some light about S&T.

 

Also, if you have a job with an easier schedule, you can spend more time networking and recruiting. I did BB IB, but got crushed so bad that I had no time to network or recruit for exit opps after.

It also depends on what type of asset manager / hedge fund you're interested in. Talk to a headhunter and let them know that you're interested in leaving IB asap (some might help, some may brush you off). You'll be much better off recruiting while you're working (as opposed to quitting first). And don't feel bad about interviewing for other jobs while still working in IB. That's the nature of the game. (Remember, you could get laid off at a moment's notice).

Don't worry about people who say that you're weak for quitting (or wanting to quit) after two months. That's bullshit. Working 80-120 hours/wk might be a safer way to get ahead, but it's not necessarily the best way to get ahead. The "best" way has to be analyzed on a personal and individual level. Keep that in mind.

Private banking can be a good option if you're interested in the markets. Asset management firms also have a variety of roles (client services, fund wholesalers, etc.). These can be lucrative careers in the long term.

Judging jobs by near-term exit opps isn't always best. You can also think of jobs as careers. Our lives are long and we have plenty of time to move up the ladder and make bigger bucks later on. You don't need to make six figures in your 20s. I've found that free time is more important to me at this point in my life (25 years old), so I can socialize, meet girls, experience new things, etc. (and free time is especially important for those hungover days!). That's just my strategy.

 
alphamale:

Don't worry about people who say that you're weak for quitting (or wanting to quit) after two months. That's bullshit. Working 80-120 hours/wk might be a safer way to get ahead, but it's not necessarily the best way to get ahead. The "best" way has to be analyzed on a personal and individual level. Keep that in mind.

Whether or not the OP is weak is completely irrelevant. Quitting a job after two months will raise questions and be a red flag for the next 10 years of his career. That's not something you want to do lightly.

"For all the tribulations in our lives, for all the troubles that remain in the world, the decline of violence is an accomplishment we can savor, and an impetus to cherish the forces of civilization and enlightenment that made it possible."
 

I agree that it should not be a "light" decision (and I believe OP understands this since he is asking the right questions), but I disagree that quitting after 2 months would "be a red flag for the next 10 years of his career." This is a great overstatement. It will only significantly matter for the first position after you quit. Yes, the question will be raised, but it's not a definitive red flag. Just explain your reasons, they'll understand. Most intelligent people will not knock you for leaving a job for a better job--even if it's only better for personal reasons. This assumes that you're leaving your previous position on your own will and have performed well (which is why it's good to recruit while you're still working).

Also depends on OP's recruiting skills.

Two years of IB might be a safer path to HF than most other paths, but that does not mean it's best for OP. It's easy advice for others to tell you to suffer and suck it up for two years. But, if OP loses friends, health and his soul during those two years, he might find that it's not worth it. It may be a better strategy to "risk" another path that is less destructive to non-work life. That's why I left IB after one year. I decided the marginal benefits of the second year weren't worth the marginal costs FOR ME (you could also think about it in terms of opportunity cost). It's a personal decision that depends on your risk tolerance, goals, lifestyle, etc. And, personally, I'm of the "quit early, quit often" mentality (see Professor Deepak Malhotra speech). But this is not for everyone.

 

Look at IMF / UNICEF financial development / any regulatory agency. I met a guy who went through white collar boot camp and now serves in a strategy role at a regulatory agency in DC. Loves it bc he has an idea of what processes/legislature needs to be struck down/implemented. Good benefits too.

Array
 

@"CompBanker" has good posts on this topic. The hours get better at the more senior level. The best exit option is PE if you can break into it.

"He that hath a beard is more than a youth, and he that hath no beard is less than a man." ― William Shakespeare, Much Ado About Nothing
 

Jumping to a credit rating agency wouldn't be a bad place IMO. Get a lot of flack in financial world (maybe from stigma of 08/ perception of employees being banking rejects), but I think they do some pretty interesting stuff. Hours are great, pay no so great, but I'm sure you'll be making decent figures in a few years time if you do well.

People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for freedom of thought which they seldom use.
 

you could always just change professions entirely i'd recommend staying for at least half a year though

anything less sounds kinda bad

I'm not concerned with the very poor -Mitt Romney
 

If you're a first year analyst then standards have really slipped since I was going through recruiting. What you said, quite literally, made zero fucking sense. You're not working 120 hrs / week, shut the fuck up. Guys who get staffed up the asshole to where they're working 110 hrs don't write like an 8th grader.

Ace all your PE interview questions with the WSO Private Equity Prep Pack: http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/private-equity-interview-prep-questions
 

Just trying to bring back a little bit of old school WSO smack talk. I know when I first joined (circa like 4 years ago now? damn, getting old sucks) someone would've got shredded for posts like this. But nonetheless, will do. Maybe cut down on the profanity going forward. Thanks, Patrick.

Ace all your PE interview questions with the WSO Private Equity Prep Pack: http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/private-equity-interview-prep-questions
 

Stick with it! You worked hard to get where you are now so suck it up and ride it out a year. Leaving after two months WILL hurt you down the road.

I'm bi-winning. I win here, and I win there.
 

I feel compelled to share my 2 cents on your question. I have been working in the Management Consulting industry for the last 10 years...think one of the top 10 firms. My billing rates is few hundred dollars/hour and I earn fairly handsome salary. Despite all that, I am thinking of making a switch to I-Banking. Definitely not for the money but because of my interest in the industry.

You're suffering from burnout may be cuz you're not used to of working long hours. On the contrary, I have been on assignments where I have nothing to work on literally. Week in/week out, I go to the client office and baby sit their staff doing nothing. I wanted to use some choice words here but you get the idea. I get paid to do nothing. My frustration has always been that the clients are so stupid and dumb that they have no work for me but they keep spending 100s of $$$$ every hour to show their importance in the organization. Total and utter waste of my time and their money and sometimes that money comes from the tax payer's pocket. What right do they have to burn it like that?

In term of my own intellectual progress....do I get a better idea of the outside world/industry while sitting in their conference room? Hell...no! My MD says...if they want you to sit on your ass doing nothing...do it. You are as asset to the firm. :)

Bottom line is you will never get satisfied in any line, any job and always find people who are not happy with their line of work. Don't leave your IB job cuz of hours, leave it only if you don't LOVE the work.

 

Lol, you thought it didn't suck?

“...all truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.” - Schopenhauer
 

No shame in not doing banking. I looked over the edge of that abyss and backed away from that cliff senior year.

But now you committed, so suck it up. If you quit now early you will have it 10x worse finding your next gig. Banking, law, whatever... the 2 year commitment is more or less in stone. Unless you want to start your own business or Peter Lynch's personal office calls you up or something, you can't quit if you ever want to live "The Good Life" with relative ease.

Get a hobby. Do it 30 minutes a day. Make it your release, it will keep you sane. Read on your way to work, or something.

 
venturecapitalista:
No shame in not doing banking. I looked over the edge of that abyss and backed away from that cliff senior year.

But now you committed, so suck it up. If you quit now early you will have it 10x worse finding your next gig. Banking, law, whatever... the 2 year commitment is more or less in stone. Unless you want to start your own business or Peter Lynch's personal office calls you up or something, you can't quit if you ever want to live "The Good Life" with relative ease.

Get a hobby. Do it 30 minutes a day. Make it your release, it will keep you sane. Read on your way to work, or something.

The 2 year block on your resume is a MUST!

 

Try to move to MBB now -- friend of mine in London went from BB IBD to MBB in his first year because he also found the work in banking retarded (he is loving his consulting job). What you need to realise is that a lot of work in consulting is also really boring though...

 

It depends on what you want your life to look like going forward. If you want to stay in the corporate world, you're going to have to suck it up for at least a year, ideally 2. Sorry, that's just how it is - if you leave now it looks like you were fired. That would end your career as far "top" jobs are concerned. If you want to leave the corporate world altogether, like you want to go be a psychologist or a firefighter or whatever, just fucking quit. Why not? Just make peace with the fact that you can't come back, at least for a few years.

 

Disagree. 18 months is enough to land at nearly any higher-end job outside of IBD. If you stuck out 18 months in IBD and you can interview well in trading, and there's a spot open (big if), they're not going to hold the missing six months against you.

6 months or less means you're a total flake. 12 months means you got laid off because you weren't worth what they were paying you. And IBD folks say that 24 months is the norm. But 18 months means you're a guy who sticks to his commitments and has a certain level of competence even though he HATED his last job. OK, we can respect that in the trading world. 18 month work history is just as good as a 24 month stint for the purposes of 95% of the hiring managers out there. Frankly, trading and research don't care what rules the IBD guys have for careers just as long as you respected your previous managers, turned out competent work, and you could stick to your commitments.

OP is more than 12% of the way through this. He needs to get out a calendar and start up the countdown to 17 months in. Then when he makes it to 17 months, he can decide whether seven more months is worth it for an 80 hour/week career paying the big bucks for ten more years.

Life is tough, and if work were always fun and easy, someone else would be doing it for free. OP needs to demonstrate to his next employer that he understands and respects the basic facts of life. That means sticking it out for 18 months. Yes, you didn't sign a 5-year tour of duty with the marine corps that you're going to jail if you try to get out of, but there's still an implicit contract in the job market that your first manager takes a risk on you and you give him 18 months. And he knows that if you don't give him 18 months, it will be hard for you to land the same kind of job you could if you did.

 
IlliniProgrammer:
Disagree. 18 months is enough to land at nearly any higher-end job outside of IBD. If you stuck out 18 months in IBD and you can interview well in trading, and there's a spot open (big if), they're not going to hold the missing six months against you.

6 months or less means you're a total flake. 12 months means you got laid off because you weren't worth what they were paying you. And IBD folks say that 24 months is the norm. But 18 months means you're a guy who sticks to his commitments and has a certain level of competence even though he HATED his last job. OK, we can respect that in the trading world. 18 month work history is just as good as a 24 month stint for the purposes of 95% of the hiring managers out there. Frankly, trading and research don't care what rules the IBD guys have for careers just as long as you respected your previous managers, turned out competent work, and you could stick to your commitments.

OP is more than 12% of the way through this. He needs to get out a calendar and start up the countdown to 17 months in. Then when he makes it to 17 months, he can decide whether seven more months is worth it for an 80 hour/week career paying the big bucks for ten more years.

Life is tough, and if work were always fun and easy, someone else would be doing it for free. OP needs to demonstrate to his next employer that he understands and respects the basic facts of life. That means sticking it out for 18 months. Yes, you didn't sign a 5-year tour of duty with the marine corps that you're going to jail if you try to get out of, but there's still an implicit contract in the job market that your first manager takes a risk on you and you give him 18 months. And he knows that if you don't give him 18 months, it will be hard for you to land the same kind of job you could if you did.

So technical, and soo right...but there is one caveat. If you can keep a glowing recommendation from your MD or principal you can leave at any time. There are many reasons to leave a job well done early (family, kids, illness, etc.).

If the glove don't fit, you must acquit!
 

but what happens in those 2 weeks (the hours) will pretty much be the same through-out the year. its not the work, which could change, but the hours. i thought i might be able to do it, after talking to the, nope.

 

its not for everyone (including me) but whats the point? It took you 428 posts on this site to realize the hours suck? really? REALLY??

think about what that says about you.

my girlfriend (math teacher) knows this about IB - her neighbor is in it, he makes a boat load of $, he works a TON. That's the common (and accurate) perception of IB - it took you 428 posts. congrats

 
sleepyguyb:
congrats on assuming my only purpose here is to learn about ibanking. you would do poorly on the lsat.

I actually took the LSAT yesterday, performed quite I think... (I know your comment wasn't directed towards me)

Logic games were a bit tricky on this one, as well as the reading comprehension having comparative passages in one out of the 4...

What made the test worthwhile was the stunning 5'10 italian looking girl sitting to my right...

 

My buddy hated it up through week 5/6 last year. I wanted to take his life for him he was so miserable and depressed. I didn't think he would make it out of the summer alive. Something happened the last few weeks and he really started to get into it/ get used to it. He got a FT and can't wait to get back there. It's hard to make any decision after two weeks ... one reason they are ten.

I was in S&T, so I had a very different experience.

 

Where I work now, this former BB ibanker was telling me about how many of his friends had their female relationships end because of ibanking. Some of them were multi year relationships. How someone could let that happen perplexes me. Its just a job.

 

Haha I think it's a French thing, when somebody brings out a good point in a French forum. Instead of going WOW DUDE RIGHT ON! you go "+1"; it's discrete and is done with just a lot of flair. I've been living in the US for 7 years now though, lost most of my French style, that +1 might have felt a little too dry, might have used some lube or something to make it work.

 
Disjoint:
I've been living in the US for 7 years now though, lost most of my French style.

Don’t ever lose that panache. This world is too dry.

 

The rest of the world may be too dry, but hey.. at least it's not French right?

kidding of course, but it's always fun to poke fun at the French.

-------------- Either you sling crack rock or you got a wicked jump shot
 
GBB_19NHS:
like some other job would be better.

(being an entrepreneur as an exception)

ya, only if you're making it though lol. You have to work much harder/longer as an entrepreneur, and assume all the risks.

Prop Trading is definitely better if you're actually smart and can handle the pressure. But i'm doing banking precisely because I don't really want to use my brain and don't want to assume risk while still making good cash.

sigh guess I'm stuck in this shit hole

 
couchy:
Despite all the warnings, only after interning at a boutique do I really know what banking is like. If I ever gave interviews, I would fucking laugh if someone told me they would love doing this.

banking is really for fucking monkeys. You are literally an overpaid data entry slut.

I wish you all the best of luck as you deepthroat your MDs ##### sized cock.

thanks for reading my rant... back to spreading comps/my ass cheeks

peace

Banking is great. Where else are you gonna get paid a 6 figure salary for doing what is essentially glorified admin work?

You know you've been working too hard when you stop dreaming about bottles of champagne and hordes of naked women, and start dreaming about conditional formatting and circular references.
 
boutiquebank4life:
your boutique obviously sucks and does no modeling and just pitches.

if u only pitch, ur life is hell.

if you are on lives, its not so bad. i love designing deal toys. AWW YEA

I've actually only done modeling and besides one pitchbook.

I can't imagine what some other places that only give pitchbooks to interns would be like. fuck lol

 

I am always deeply, deeply suspicious of anybody on this site who talks about how awesome it is that they get to model all the time. All real banks use a template model (anyone who builds models from scratch every time they need to model a transaction is wasting their time), so "running a model" essentially means taking PE/management/research numbers, plugging them into a spreadsheet and then constantly pres-linking/pasting model outputs into powerpoint decks when your MD wants to adjust leverage by a quarter turn or change the mix of cash and stock. Real fun.

 

@Sterling Archer:

Agreed. Modeling actually kind of sucks in general. Shit is not fun and when you are turning a model again and again and again, it gets really painful.

Also, no matter how much "exposure" you get to portcos in PE at the jr. level, it is still boring as fuck.

 

For any profession that is worth pursuing, from big law to medicine to computer programming, entry level job always sucks. But as you become more experienced, things would get better gradually. This is true in every field and every profession. You are not entitled to a life at the beaches when you leave the school and start working in the real world.

 
Dingdong08:

So, did you start banking and are leaving it or you came to this conclusion while still in school?

Both, actually. I've been interning with a boutique bank part-time during the school year and full-time over the summer. Going back to school in the fall and graduate early.

 

Being able to write your ticket is a pretty good way to spend two of your 'golden years'. Personally I think software is a better field to be in, but if you are hell bent on finance and had the opportunity to go IB. It would be a very foolish move not to, even if you ended up being miserable the entire time.

Your resume is your 'product', its how an employer can assign value to you as a commodity. The more valuable you are, the easier it will be to write your ticket elsewhere. IB is far from the be all and end all career fields. Entry level work sucks wherever you go. Being able to add an excellent brand name to your resume and put you into a higher income level is an excellent spot to be in by your mid to late 20s.

Besides, you just had 4 years of college getting easy pussy. Bust your ass for a few years and get back to getting some easy pussy when young women start liking guys with more success.

 
HedgeKing:

Just think about those computer programmers who stay up all night trying to fix a piece of buggy software ...

Other than getting stuck after hours with the occasional code review, developers are on a cushy 9-5 and work from home on Fridays.

Investment banking is a different animal.

 

That's not very encouraging ... I'm same age as you but interning at a consulting firm, I'm going to miss "normal" working-hours ... but do you consider your experience in IB really worth it ? I completely agree with @archervice, I truly think it is worth it if you stick a couple of years and learn a lot of useful things ...

 

Work in retail for 2 years, and tell me you don't hate your life more than you do now. I swear to god being in a retail job is the most soul-suckingly wretched job you could ever have. I only needed two months on the job to figure out that I wanted to be as far away from a sports or clothes store or restaurant later in life, but I was stuck there for 2 years in high school/1st year of university.

"You rarely have time for everything you want in this life, so you need to make choices. And hopefully your choices can come from a deep sense of who you are." - Mister Rogers
 

I don't think that banking is any worse than anything else at the entry level. The hours suck, but the path up is a lot faster. You can with luck and skill make MD in your mid to early thirties, in a F500 you might be a director then. It's a tough road and it's good to figure out if it's what you want, but it's nowhere near the worst.

 

I have absolutely no desire to work a 9-5 with no future professional/personal growth opportunities. In fact, sitting in an office in some high-rise downtown just seems like a waste of life to me. Considering that I have an entrepreneurial personality, it makes perfect sense to spend 80+ hours per week on my own venture versus making someone else richer.

 
Roma:

I have absolutely no desire to work a 9-5 with no future professional/personal growth opportunities. In fact, sitting in an office in some high-rise downtown just seems like a waste of life to me. Considering that I have an entrepreneurial personality, it makes perfect sense to spend 80+ hours per week on my own venture versus making someone else richer.

Entrepreneurship is great. You just need the right idea, the capital to fund it while supporting yourself and the ability to execute. The capital is typically the toughest part when you're young, unless you have a rich family willing to stake you, because it's tough to raise money from outsiders because you don't have experience.

 

Unless you are independently wealthy, along the lines of a huge trust fund or are in line to inherit an already very lucrative family business. It'll take you probably a decade or two to earn the seniority and expertise required to receive capital backing. As far as I'm concerned the best business opportunities are those that arise naturally at some point in your career where starting your own firm/company makes a lot of sense.

Otherwise you just don't have the expertise and no one is going to trust you. I suppose you could own a gas station or another business, but any business like that is generally a miserable experience and you will make more working for someone else. Do you know what it's like to wake up every morning in the red? Because until whatever product or service you provide brings in money, you are in fact, losing money. How about going on vacation? Take Qualcomm, at 10yrs tenure you can get 5 weeks off, 11 holidays (B-Day incl) and 10 sick days per year. Not to mention flexible hours, at least relatively to other industries.

"...no desire to work a 9-5 with no future professional/personal growth opportunities."

All of the same traits that will make your 'own venture' successful will be the same qualities that will give you professional growth and future opportunities working for someone else. The difference is your 'product' is your resume and that keeps increasing in value regardless of whose name is on the door or what happens to the business (unless you fucked it up). What happens if your venture fails in 8-10 years and you didn't make squat during those years? Tell me the value your resume has of unsuccessfully creating/managing a business.

Start-ups, ventures and whatever other buzzwords aren't the glorious beacons of entrepreneurial spirit as they are made out to be. The key to success can be summed up in four words; stick to your strengths. My unsolicited advice to you, take the best opportunity that comes your way and run with it.

 

I agree with most of the nothing's easy in life comments. Would simply add that while finance is painful (ib, investing,etc), if you do it right (try hard/sacrifice), you can set yourself up for an early retirement which is something 99 percent of the population will never be able to do assuming they have kids, mortgage etc

 

I feel like 99% of the people talking about being an entrepreneur are only saying it because they want to sleep in and get wasted during the week. Building a business is fucking hard a shit. Honestly, if you hate the hours in banking don't think it will be any easier doing it on your own. Oh, and make sure you have capital to support yourself and the business for a long time as many of these businesses have a long ramp to profitability.

If you like finance, but have no interest slaving away in M&A you should realize that finance is a lot more than just IB. You can go into a capital markets role, you could be a commercial banker, you could go into private banking, corporate banking, sales. All kinds of shit. Yeah, being in an office when you could be doing fun shit blows, but sometimes life sucks.

 
TNA:

I feel like 99% of the people talking about being an entrepreneur are only saying it because they want to sleep in and get wasted during the week. Building a business is fucking hard a shit. Honestly, if you hate the hours in banking don't think it will be any easier doing it on your own. Oh, and make sure you have capital to support yourself and the business for a long time as many of these businesses have a long ramp to profitability.

If you like finance, but have no interest slaving away in M&A you should realize that finance is a lot more than just IB. You can go into a capital markets role, you could be a commercial banker, you could go into private banking, corporate banking, sales. All kinds of shit. Yeah, being in an office when you could be doing fun shit blows, but sometimes life sucks.

Are you serious?

Entrepreneurship is enticing because it's something YOU own. You don't work just because your MD wanted some shit that he won't even see because he changed his mind. You work to improve and grow your own business. Imagine if you had a huge stake in something's success and built that up yourself, wouldn't that help you go to work everyday?

 
<span class=keyword_link><a href=/company/trilantic-north-america>TNA</a></span>:

I feel like 99% of the people talking about being an entrepreneur are only saying it because they want to sleep in and get wasted during the week. Building a business is fucking hard a shit. Honestly, if you hate the hours in banking don't think it will be any easier doing it on your own. Oh, and make sure you have capital to support yourself and the business for a long time as many of these businesses have a long ramp to profitability.

If you like finance, but have no interest slaving away in M&A you should realize that finance is a lot more than just IB. You can go into a capital markets role, you could be a commercial banker, you could go into private banking, corporate banking, sales. All kinds of shit. Yeah, being in an office when you could be doing fun shit blows, but sometimes life sucks.

Don't get me wrong - I have no issue working long, hard hours. I'll hustle until 3AM every morning with a smile on my face. The work load is not an issue, however, the mundane nature of the work (at least at the analyst level) is not intellectually stimulating and I feel as if I would be leaving something else out on the table by continuing to pursue this as a career.

 

Anyone who went into investment banking under the delusion that it was "models and bottles" not having done due diligence on one of the most important decisions of their life ie their initial career choice and then decides to become an enterpreneur likely:

  • Has done fuck all due diligence on entrepreneurial risk/reward because he/she is lazy and just looks for an off-the-shelf branded formula path to material success

  • Will likely lose a lot of money

If you haven't gotten out of the middle class teenage mindset of treating life like a choice between spoon-fed formulae to success by the time you finish college, your brain is too deeply stuck to ever escape.

My impression is that US colleges contribute to this through their programs which groom their students for particular career paths, hence the threads you see on WSO from students complaining that their non-target doesn't tell them about IB opps etc, or people complaining that some aspect of the system is not "fair" because it doesn't deliver success into their lap.

That reinforces the general consumeristic "I can buy my lifestyle off the rack" society we live in. You see extremes of this mindset like "I check boxes A, B and C for what society tells me is attractive, but I can't get a hot girlfriend and a nice car [shakes fist at the heavens at the UNFAIRNESS of the system that told him for so long that A + B + C = hot wife]; the old system must be broken... I'll blame feminism and resort to the PUA C + D + E = numbers = fucking wenches formula instead".

Whether you're a good entrepreneur or a good banker or good professional anything, you take responsibility for your own career (no one else is going to lose sleep over it), do your own due diligence and look for your own opportunities.

You don't suck the system's cock, then complain that it tastes salty rather than the sweetness advertised on TV.

Sitting around hoping for a paternalistic system to spoon feed you and give you a credible formulaic pathway to "models and bottles" success and satisfaction ("will this resume + target university = internship at BB then FT offer then PE exit opps = hot wife and satisfaction with my life?!") is naive idiocy.

Ween yourself off dependence on the cookie cutters. The "system" and its formulae are not designed to make you happy. They are designed by evolution to make you toil, consume and breed more consumers.

Consumerist capitalism doesn't want you to be happy. It wants to dangle the carrot of happiness in front of you so you keep trotting on the toil & consume treadmill.

And then you die and the screen goes dark.

This is a general Friday morning rant, so OP you don't have to respond how your position matches what I'm describing. But you can take the comments about fools who chase a pre-packaged formula without doing due diligence as applying to you.

Those who can, do. Those who can't, post threads about how to do it on WSO.
 

And just so people don't think I'm an anti-capitalist pinko-leftie, I contrast consumerist capitalism with:

  • socialism = toil and breed, but you only get a consume a little and that little is shit
  • authoritarian capitalism (eg China) = toil and breed, get to buy some shitty stuff and watch the corrupt authoritatrians consume all the good stuff
Those who can, do. Those who can't, post threads about how to do it on WSO.
 

I know many people who have fun at work but are miserable with their personal lives. Sure, they have freedom to talk to their peers and don't care about skipping a day of work, but that's because they make minimum wage and are stocking shelves at Walmart.

 

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