How bad are non-targets?

How impossible is it? There are always stories of kids from non-targets making it but is this a 1-in-1000 scenario?

Junior
Finance Major
3.8GPA (Most likely stay at a 3.8/3.9 GPA by the time I finish)

Does work experience hold enough leverage to offset being a non-target graduate?

 

work experience likely won't give you the push that you need (unless it's like MM/BB IBD or something really prestigious like GE finance or something). networking and having senior and maybe junior folks at top firms refer you is the only way you'll get an interview. some firms like MS and DB tend to be less open to nontargets coming through, but firms like GS, JPM, Citi are extremely open and will give you the time of day if referred by someone senior within the firm.

Don't stop pushing for what you want and don't complain about how difficult it is for you coming from a nontarget; nontarget students break in everyday into top groups by doing exactly what i said above, and you can too.

 

I don't think you can generalize about this stuff. Depends on the firm, position, and the interviewer. If you are from a non-target, you might need to show more of the basic level of competency that is already expected at Wharton. But on the flip side, targets with good work experience can get grilled on deals and more difficult/practical questions. I came from a semi-target with no work experience so most of my technicals were just checking the box and they acknowledged the tough ones I wouldn't be expected to know. On the flip side, some friends got EB interviews and were nonstop grilled on things you could only learn on the job.

I'd look at more difficult questions as a way to distinguish yourself b/c you are already coming in a step down. If they just give you softball questions, you can't separate yourself and you'll definitely miss out to the Wharton kid when you both have the Vault guide memorized.

Beyond that, most of this very technical stuff is usually just analysts having fun. Not sure what position is asking about convexity. If it is just general IB, they are just screwing with you. If it is a job that uses convexity/math a lot, then I imagine they'll be asking everyone that question.

 

Your GPA is only 1 part of the story. Generally it needs to be a bit higher from a non-target school, but networking and the other things that would appear on your resume are crucial as well.

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My advice would be to compare all your offers, and then, if PwC is still the best/most prestigious offer, try to make your way over to the M&A department there.

I have a tender spot in my heart for cripples, bastards, and broken things
 

Like many have already said you have missed traditional recruiting by eight or nine months. You are now in competition for a relatively smaller number of positions against those from better schools, with better internships, or with more experience. Don't despair, as you still have a shot but you really need to network your butt off. You can't change your school or experience overnight but one good connection can make everything else meaningless. Work your alumni network, even if they can't get you into a position they can provide valuable advice as to how they did it.

 

You're gonna have to do this the old fashioned way. Pick up the phone and start calling people you have something in contact with. Since you probably have few alumns (although of course you should reach out to them as well) try to find other people you share something in common with, such as nearby schools that may have more of a presence (i.e. like I am from X area) or go through friends of friends of friends, etc.

It'ls going to take a lot of work on you're end, but nothing good comes easy. It is an uphill battle from a non-target. I should know -- I went to one for UG as well (and it was a small state school).

BTW, only 1 grade higher than a D?!?! I'm not for grade inflation, but at some point the teacher needs to take a step back and be like, "maybe it's me."

"They are all former investment bankers that were laid off in the economic collapse that Nancy Pelosi caused. They have no marketable skills, but by God they work hard."
 
subrosa:
Are you open to any type of job related to finance.... what city are you willing to work in?
To your first question yeah pretty much. One of the issues I have at this point is that my family owns a farm and I lack formal work experience and there aren't a lot of jobs in which having an economics degree is helpful in my immediate area so getting my foot in the door and start building valuable work experience has been difficult.

To your 2nd question Indianapolis right now. It is a fairly long drive from where I'm finishing school at, but I think its manageable.

 

You need to be more resourceful if you want to succeed in breaking into IB. Had you spent even five minutes searching, you would have seen that there are dozens, probably hundreds, of these threads that spell out exactly what you need to do.

Networking is the only way that you will get interviews. Make a list of the reputable banks out there (should be 40 or so) and then find contacts on LinkedIn. Send them an email (you will have to lookup their bank's email address format) and ask for some time. There are templates on WSO for this too. Good luck.

 

Keep the GPA up. Internship experience is helpful. Not sure how/why you already have a GMAT score but that's pretty impressive.

The key thing now is to network. Having a partner give you an info. session is a good place to start.

Keep in mind though that most internships are for juniors going into their senior year so don't over-do the networking portion (i.e. contacting them every month for the next two years)

 

Just keep doing what you're doing and network. If you keep your GPA up, your internship experience will keep getting better in terms of prestige, position, and what you want to do.

Don't forget to enjoy your life while you're doing all of this..

 

While the majority of hires come from target schools, MBB all take students from non-target schools as well. I would find alumni from your school who are one or two years in, and reach out to them to see how they got an interview.

As NanoStapler mentioned, there's no need to aggressively reach out now since internships are generally not available before junior year. Even if you are a junior in terms of credit hours, consulting firms care more about whether or not you are going to be able to return as part of their hiring class for the following year. Unless you're planning to graduate in 3 years, having more credit hours won't help you get around the juniors-only requirement. If you keep your grades up and keep doing internships, you'll definitely have a chance.

Good luck!

 

Maximize your network. Be clear about what you're interested in.

One resource I would suggest is Linkedin: Find the few alumni you know, friend them, and proceed to look at their second degree connections. You'll find at least some people in IBD, at boutiques and BB too. Introduce yourseld and ask for phone calls/meetings for advice. Really push your alumni network from school though. You're bound to find at least one person who has taken the IBD route. Look them up, do whatever it takes to find out more from them and NEVER leave a contact without asking for more contacts. Basic matter of sales.

Also, don't limit yourself to where you apply. Get to the core of what you want: for instance, let's say your goal is to work in IBD because you want to work in private equity. You don't need to be at JPM or ML to do this (though of course the brand helps). Plenty of MM/Boutique analysts go on to greatness and prestige as well, so make sure you continue to do the right things as an analyst and the doors will open.

Which brings me back to my main point: don't rule out regional boutiques, MM focused firms, groups that work in London, and anywhere else. You've got to flexible from a non-target and willing to do anything. Your network and the numbers game (applying to as many places as possible) are your best bets for getting offers. Spend this month building that network and putting together a list of all the regional, BB, and everything in-between firms that you want to apply for. GL.

 

Hey man...agree with everything Alphaholic said. Definitely don't let the Non-Target factor bother you one bit. I just got an offer from a top MM bank and here's my background:

Very Non-Target State School (only 2 recent alums in IB that I know of) Major: Ex-Computer Science then Economics major GPA: 3.0 So-So Leadership

I do have full time experience but in a related field. My point is, just keep networking and do anything you could to get in. As long as you get the interview, it's time to impress and it doesn't matter what school you went to.

 

I am a bit confused as to why the two options are so completely independent. Why do you think that if you choose an econ major you will not be trying to land a job out of undergrad?

Beyond my confusion though, taking accounting courses will definitely be valuable for IB. I do not think that you need to be an accounting major, but taking the major accounting courses is definitely beneficial. It will help you crush the accounting questions in interviews, and then it will help you have less of a learning curve once you are on the job. That being said, I do not think that an econ major is looked down upon. I firmly believe that econ is valuable, both in that it is applicable to the real world, and that it teaches a good way of thinking (also a lot of target school kids are coming out with econ degrees).

So basically, I think that both majors are valuable in their own respects. But I think you should be careful of picking a second major. I would not underestimate the side effects it could have. If you find that you do not like it, your finance classes become harder, etc. you could find yourself in a position where it is nullifying its value by dragging down your GPA. And coming from a non-target, having a high GPA is vital.

If I were you I would take a few acc classes and a few econ classes so that you have an idea of what they are about. After you have done that, if you particularly like one then have a minor in it. I do not think that having a 2nd major vs. a minor will make or break your chances.

 

I would also be trying to land a position even if I take the economics route. Sorry I did not clarify. I just feel that I would look better for msf programs with a double major in finance and econ (especially since I am considering doing research in econ), as well as to banks because I'll be able say that I managed to maintain a high gpa even with two majors. You are not the first person to suggest though focusing on just one major so I have been giving it some thought.

 

And to my point about the MSF, I would have that only as a last resort. You still have two years to get an internship and then a full-time job. That should be what your plan is, not to cop out and hope a MSF program can get you recognized. You are much better off trying to get in now, and only using the MSF as an absolute last ditch effort.

 

in general, math classes are more applicable than economics classes for an msf but, accounting classes are more applicable for banking

overall though, your major probably plays a much smaller role than your internships and extracurriculars

ex) joining finance club probably will pay more dividends than the time invested to take extra classes

ideally, you could take some extra classes, have strong ECs and bag a good internship

 

Generally the way it works for a non target is for a non target to have a high GPA and possess 3 or 4 relevant internships at well recognized shops. Try interning unpaid during your school year at a local boutique and possess a paid or unpaid PWM internship at a BB.

 

well, think about it. Why would a BB bother looking at online apps when they could fill their Analyst class just through the schools they recruit from?

Chances are slim

 
sloppyj:
I'm from a non-target (and a LAC in the Midwest at that) and my IB offer came from an online app. I think it just depends on the bank (and the resume too, of course).

Same here. It was for an SA gig in IBD at a BB, fortunate enough to get an offer after the summer. Don't count out the online app. I viewed it as a necessity so my first email to HR could say I already completed the online application.

I'm sure I'm the exception to the rule, but not filling out the application online can only serve to hurt you.

 

Cheer up bro. It's not the end of the world. An alternative can be a F500 company where you can get great exposure experience and leadership skills. A lot of people tend to disregard them for completely because IB carries such prestige. If working at a BB is a dream, try again after you complete an MBA. Complaining wont do anything. Accept your situation, network, strive for a decent gig, rock it, butt rape the GMAT and get into a top MBA. Heck, apply to an MSF if you're solely set on IB. Just realize that the sooner you accept your current situation, the more time you'll have to find an alternate route to achieve your goals.

 
Best Response

Well, honestly man network harder?

Do you have relevant alumni at your disposal? I know somebody that wanted his shot soooooo badly he got a job in one of the best GYMs in NYC for the summer sophomore year so he could have a shot at "bumping into" a PM/Banker/Stockbroker really any Wall Streeter. He spoke with many many people that summer and 1 offered him a PWM internship at the BB in NYC, and he was a baller salesman so he convinced that MD to speak with the MD in the IBD. Junior year rolls around and he went IBD at the BB. He now is a MD in S&T ( he like the markets more so he made the switch)

But moral of the story is that its all about desire. Go out there speak with people I went a Finance conference in SF and got hooked up with a VC gig ( I am interested in ER, but VC wont look that bad).

The WSO Conference also seems like it will be a great opportunity for everybody. You have to pay your dues one way or another the ivy kids worked their asses of in high school, so they dont have to work THAT hard to get an IBD job. Us non-targets fucked off off (atleast I did, didnt even go to class have the days senior year), so we need to work hard in college to get our name out there.

I respect the difficulty of breaking W.S., because that is what makes it attractive for me.

I want a lady on the street, but a freak in the bed, Go Bucks!!
 
Ambition:
I know somebody that wanted his shot soooooo badly he got a job in one of the best GYMs in NYC for the summer sophomore year so he could have a shot at "bumping into" a PM/Banker/Stockbroker really any Wall Streeter. He spoke with many many people that summer and 1 offered him a PWM internship at the BB in NYC, and he was a baller salesman so he convinced that MD to speak with the MD in the IBD. Junior year rolls around and he went IBD at the BB. He now is a MD in S&T ( he like the markets more so he made the switch)

Lets be serious here. Few people want it as bad as this guy you know. Because if they did they wouldn't come on here and complain about it. They would do whatever it takes.

By any means.

The answer to your question is 1) network 2) get involved 3) beef up your resume 4) repeat -happypantsmcgee WSO is not your personal search function.
 
Ambition:
Well, honestly man network harder?

Do you have relevant alumni at your disposal? I know somebody that wanted his shot soooooo badly he got a job in one of the best GYMs in NYC for the summer sophomore year so he could have a shot at "bumping into" a PM/Banker/Stockbroker really any Wall Streeter. He spoke with many many people that summer and 1 offered him a PWM internship at the BB in NYC, and he was a baller salesman so he convinced that MD to speak with the MD in the IBD. Junior year rolls around and he went IBD at the BB. He now is a MD in S&T ( he like the markets more so he made the switch)

But moral of the story is that its all about desire. Go out there speak with people I went a Finance conference in SF and got hooked up with a VC gig ( I am interested in ER, but VC wont look that bad).

awesome story. If more people on here were like this there'd be more success stories and fewer sob stories.
 

It's called breaking in for a reason.

"After you work on Wall Street it’s a choice, would you rather work at McDonalds or on the sell-side? I would choose McDonalds over the sell-side.” - David Tepper
 

Moral of Ambition's post: Don't network harder. Network smarter.

- Bulls make money. Bears make money. Pigs get slaughtered. - The harder you work, the luckier you become. - I believe in the "Golden Rule": the man with the gold rules.
 

Really depends on your experience and the economy. I come from a complete non-target with a 3.3 and had some decent IB internship experience, and had a ton of interviews last year at MM firms for IB and two BBs. Luck plays a role as well as networking your ass off.

'We're bigger than U.S. Steel"
 

What about the term non-target confuses you? It is, by its very definition, not ideal so of course its going to be more difficult.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford
 

I don't think it's going to be much harder from a non-target though for a qualified candidate.

Step 1) Save $150K and do in-state STEM. Step 2) Get 3.8 GPA and a 2350 SAT. Step 3) Apply everywhere. Step 4) Make it through computer filters, land on someone's desk. Step 5) Only get interviewed by the smart managers. Step 6) Get an offer.

It's honestly not that difficult. Getting a paper published in IEEE- now THAT's difficult.

 
IlliniProgrammer:
I don't think it's going to be much harder from a non-target though for a qualified candidate.

Step 1) Save $150K and do in-state STEM. Step 2) Get 3.8 GPA and a 2350 SAT. Step 3) Apply everywhere. Step 4) Make it through computer filters, land on someone's desk. Step 5) Only get interviewed by the smart managers. Step 6) Get an offer.

It's honestly not that difficult. Getting a paper published in IEEE- now THAT's difficult.

Nothing on your list says 'Not that difficult' to me.
If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford
 
IlliniProgrammer:
I don't think it's going to be much harder from a non-target though for a qualified candidate.

Step 1) Save $150K and do in-state STEM. Step 2) Get 3.8 GPA and a 2350 SAT. Step 3) Apply everywhere. Step 4) Make it through computer filters, land on someone's desk. Step 5) Only get interviewed by the smart managers. Step 6) Get an offer.

It's honestly not that difficult. Getting a paper published in IEEE- now THAT's difficult.

This is so much bullshit...

  1. OK I guess
  2. Pulling a 3.8 in a STEM is difficult. The majority of college students could dedicate their sole existence to this pursuit and they would not succeed. Also, a 2350 SAT puts you in the 99.5%. Do you realize that the majority of people probably could not score over 1800 even if they were to study their asses of for it? An 1800 already puts you in the 80%.
  3. OK
  4. You have absolutely no control over this and even with a great resume, grades and sat scores you probably will not make it through the filters, especially in economies such as ours right now where firms filled up their entire class through SA's.
  5. You have no control over this.
  6. Even if you managed to go to this point, you will be interviewed and evaluated by kids who are just as good if not better than you. So again, your chances of moving on past this point are slim and your chances of even getting to this point are near non-existent.

Moral of the story is this kids, DO EVERYTHING YOU POSSIBLY CAN TO GO TO GAIN ADMISSION INTO A TARGET SCHOOL. It will make your life so much easier. Anyone who tells you that "it's not that difficult" from a non target is straight up lying to you. It's very difficult and you should do everything you possibly can to avoid it.

"Life all comes down to a few moments. This is one of them." - Bud Fox
 

Everyone doesn't get these jobs. They are very highly sought after and the probability of anyone getting a BB/MM FO job would start at probably 5% freshman year and only decreased after that. We are in a very bad hiring environment and there are a lot of extremely qualified Ivy League/Top tire university grads that are still looking, despite having all the neccessary boxes checked. It was hard in the bull markets, and its even harder in a bear market. Not everyone can play for the varsity team, but anyone can make a lot of money, you just have to be innovative, creative, and lucky

 

This thread is fuckin stupid.. I hate this shit so I am going to try to railroad it with a rant to non targets.

First, if you can't beat targets at the UG-level (for the 8,000x reasons you come up with to console yourself) do something else and go to a target MBA or MSF program.

Level the playing field and beat them at their own game (should be easy right? since you think the process was rigged and unfair and you're a stud, but just couldn't get noticed). If you can't 'break-in' from there you just wasted a shitload of money and time b/c you couldn't be critical about yourself and see that it might just be a "you" problem and settle on something other than IB.

Second, I'm in the same boat as all the other non-targets, I interned on the buyside this summer and thought I was pretty well-connected, but I got blown the fuck up during this recruiting season. MD's that loved to talk in August and September didn't seem to be returning calls or emails in October. I still piss and moan about being a non target b/c my stats rival every target and then some, but no one fucking cares.

So if you think you're good and you know it's not a "you" issue holding you back, be patient work that "shitty job" till your MBA or go do an MSF. When you "break in" tell everyone to fuck off... but until then non targets, stop posting these gay ass threads. Life's not fair wah wah.

'Before you enter... be willing to pay the price'
 

IP: shouldn't step one be to invite Jesus into your heart to gain some righteous perspective?

Seriously, it is not that difficult. Was talking with a friend and he was lamenting how many mediocre resumes he's seen that have the same pablum. He's looking for a some ambition and intellectual curiosity with a basic level of aptitude and work ethic, for which target schools help provide--but don't determine--screening. If you're interested in poker do you play in WSOP events or just 1/2 games? If you like to run, go run an ultra marathon. Do something interesting and you'll get a look, even if you have to barnstorm MD's at their barbershop.

But, pray tell me, what would compel anyone to slave away for so little in such a hellish city? Even most MD's in the city have mediocre 2-3 bedroom apartments.

I rich, smarts, and totally in debt.
 
MrDouche:
If you like to run, go run an ultra marathon. .
This doesn't even warrant a response. Thats like saying 'if you like water, go build a ship.'
If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford
 
IP: shouldn't step one be to invite Jesus into your heart to gain some righteous perspective?
Dude, this is secular New York. :D Besides, while I'm one of those folks who thinks there's a definite truth to the universe, I'm not foolish enough to think other approaches can't at least make you a more ethical person.
Seriously, it is not that difficult. Was talking with a friend and he was lamenting how many mediocre resumes he's seen that have the same pablum. He's looking for a some ambition and intellectual curiosity with a basic level of aptitude and work ethic, for which target schools help provide--but don't determine--screening. If you're interested in poker do you play in WSOP events or just 1/2 games? If you like to run, go run an ultra marathon. Do something interesting and you'll get a look, even if you have to barnstorm MD's at their barbershop.
I agree, but I think a lot of mediocrity is self-imposed. People have to learn to step out of it. It took me a long time and it didn't happen until AFTER I'd landed on the street and read through resume books of interns and analysts I considered fairly ordinary. There is a trap that a lot of people get stuck into of "I'm incredibly competent and hard-working but I don't think that makes me special." These are folks that Googles and Microsofts and IBMs absolutely love and use to create a lot of value. If only there were a way to get those folks producing the same value in finance.

I don't expect people to have all of that figured out right away. In fact, I really respect that in someone just straight out of school if I can figure out that he's got the intellectual goods to clearly not be mediocre.

So little? A nice 2-3BR in the city is 2-3 bucks.
2-3 bucks in most places gets you your own private island with a 5 bedroom mansion. Or at the very least, 2500 square feet and half an acre on Malibu beach. IMHO, 1/2-2/3 of folks in finance work in NYC because they HAVE to, not because they WANT to.
 
Pulling a 3.8 in a STEM is difficult. The majority of college students could dedicate their sole existence to this pursuit and they would not succeed. Also, a 2350 SAT puts you in the 99.5%. Do you realize that the majority of people probably could not score over 1800 even if they were to study their asses of for it? An 1800 already puts you in the 80%.
A 3.8 in STEM isn't too hard and 2350/1550 is actually a little below average for quants and research folks.
4. You have absolutely no control over this and even with a great resume, grades and sat scores you probably will not make it through the filters, especially in economies such as ours right now where firms filled up their entire class through SA's.
Well, yes, which is why most folks- target and nontarget alike- get their offer through their summer work. By apply everywhere, I mean apply for a summer program everywhere.
Moral of the story is this kids, DO EVERYTHING YOU POSSIBLY CAN TO GO TO GAIN ADMISSION INTO A TARGET SCHOOL. It will make your life so much easier. Anyone who tells you that "it's not that difficult" from a non target is straight up lying to you. It's very difficult and you should do everything you possibly can to avoid it.
Again, if you have the grades and the test scores, you make it through the computer filters and generally get an interview. Then it all comes down to your competence. If you're the kind of person who can get into H/Y/P/M/CHI/S, why waste the money on undergrad? You'll get in from a state school easy anyways. And it REALLY pisses folks off who think it's all about connections and pedigree, as everyone can see here.
 
IlliniProgrammer:
Pulling a 3.8 in a STEM is difficult. The majority of college students could dedicate their sole existence to this pursuit and they would not succeed. Also, a 2350 SAT puts you in the 99.5%. Do you realize that the majority of people probably could not score over 1800 even if they were to study their asses of for it? An 1800 already puts you in the 80%.
A 3.8 in STEM isn't too hard and 2350/1550 is actually a little below average for quants and research folks.
4. You have absolutely no control over this and even with a great resume, grades and sat scores you probably will not make it through the filters, especially in economies such as ours right now where firms filled up their entire class through SA's.
Well, yes, which is why most folks- target and nontarget alike- get their offer through their summer work. By apply everywhere, I mean apply for a summer program everywhere.
Moral of the story is this kids, DO EVERYTHING YOU POSSIBLY CAN TO GO TO GAIN ADMISSION INTO A TARGET SCHOOL. It will make your life so much easier. Anyone who tells you that "it's not that difficult" from a non target is straight up lying to you. It's very difficult and you should do everything you possibly can to avoid it.
Again, if you have the grades and the test scores, you make it through the computer filters and generally get an interview. Then it all comes down to your competence. If you're the kind of person who can get into H/Y/P/M/CHI/S, why waste the money on undergrad? You'll get in from a state school easy anyways. And it REALLY pisses folks off who think it's all about connections and pedigree, as everyone can see here.

Most recent grads on wall street are Ivy League English/Art History/Arts&Crafts major with mediocre SAT scores who went to prestigious private high schools. If you do not match that description, you will not fit in and will soon be clawing for a way out.

 

I don't necessarily disagree with anything you've said. A lot of business that used to go to the banks is moving to the Chicago prop shops and electronic transactions. Still, if you want to spend a few years on Wall Street before the fiscal conservatives in Washington take over and stop the bailouts, I think that's the path of least resistance and least cost for someone who can get into a target anyways.

There's still a lot of anti-prestige pragmatists left on the street, although they're quietly slipping away to Connecticut, California, and Chicago.

 

mono,

hardwork can be in many forms..... it doesnt have to mean that they spent more time in the books. speaking with people, going to meetings, paying money and going to conferences can easily wear you down.....networking is also a lot of work

I want a lady on the street, but a freak in the bed, Go Bucks!!
 

Haha well Croato,

The world is getting more global as we speak and this means that, even on Wall Street, they are looking into hiring people of many backgrounds, because clients can be anywhere and anyone. Wall Street is not some USA happy-go-round. I hate using this reference but it seems applicable; in Wall Street 2 when they have those asian clients, shia labeouf uses his knowledge of the traditions they followed to win them over, he was smart and capable, but dont you think it would be handy to have a asian employee at that time?.

Also the people who make it to MD ARE NOT prestige whores. My family friend was a Department Head at a BB and he went to UPenn both Undergrad and MBA, and he is a complete clown! He is energetic enjoys life, jokes about stupid things (we were talking about how much ass size correlates with beautiful faces).

Also most clients (in the USA) want guys who ARE NOT cookie cutter Ivy WASPS, they want to speak with someone who can relate to them. Since lots of clients work on main street, do you honestly believe that they want to deal with someone who is a prestige whore/ "cookie cutter" Ivy kid? No. I have met some MD's and lots of them are chill guys who just love simple things like family life, watching basketball, football ( there are some douche bag MD's, but nobody talks to them much they are good at what they do and that is why they are MD's).

I want a lady on the street, but a freak in the bed, Go Bucks!!
 

You want to hear a really funny story that is just bound to piss this guy off?

I went to a total non-target. Im talking like not even a top 350 school, well might be top 350 I never looked. I got medicore grades. Had one internship, for like 4 weeks in PWM. Landed a IBD job at a regional bank on their M&A desk. Did that for a year and a half then I jumped to a HF and I am a distressed debt analyst. This industry is not that hard to break into. Its only hard if you make it hard.

Follow the shit your fellow monkeys say @shitWSOsays Life is hard, it's even harder when you're stupid - John Wayne
 

the trick to getting in from a non-target (form my experience) is to be as well prepared for IB interviews as you target counterparts (this is extremely rare, as non-target foks tend to be extremely clueless) and to constantly look for opportunties.

the officers at my non-target school's undergraduate finance organization, (the ones who went on WSO, M&I, and made friends with target kids) ended up at front office roles at the following banks:

Houlihan UBS Barcs Goldman

i was a little less prepared than my buddies and landed an interview from Citi Tech M&A through a connection and didn't get the gig (but then again, not all target kids get IBD offers).

BE SMART, BE PREPARED and BE PERSISTENT. if you follow these rules, the odds will be in your favor.

Money Never Sleeps? More like Money Never SUCKS amirite?!?!?!?
 

went to a non-target myself. you don't HAVE to work for a BB. wasn't interested in IBD, but i work for an ER shop now covering special situations/distressed. after a few years, experience/work ethic trumps it.

don't get me wrong, the prestige of a BB helps, but i feel as though plenty of people who aren't at BB's still are doing what they want to do and getting exit opportunities as well.

just keep plugging something will come along that's worthwhile

 

Pretty soon all these Ivy league schmucks will suck your kneecaps.

- Bulls make money. Bears make money. Pigs get slaughtered. - The harder you work, the luckier you become. - I believe in the "Golden Rule": the man with the gold rules.
 
happypantsmcgee:
Stop being a fucking vagina. Life is hard.
Life is actually really easy. It doesn't take that much to be successful, do the things you want to do, and just generally be happy. Problems arise when people aren't willing to man up and go after what they want, but instead sit back and wait for things to go their way.
CompBanker’s Career Guidance Services: https://www.rossettiadvisors.com/
 

It does suck OP, but what can you do? Just gotta keep plugging at it and understand that there are plenty of others in the same shoes as you (me included).

Pretty women make us BUY beer. Ugly women make us DRINK beer.
 

Getting a BB IBD analyst job isn't the end all be all of life. It's tough to see as an undergrad, but you can literally do anything and then jump to an BB IBD later.

After all, if you're just chasing it because everyone else is chasing it, you'll never be happy in life. And if you really do want it, just bust your balls with a boutique job until you get the referrals, contacts, or experience to lateral in. It's not a race to get there first. It's a journey and you just want to reach the end. If you explore other things along the way, it never hurts.

 
NYC:
I'm noticing that there seems to be an inverse correlation between the audaciousness in a poster's name and where they actually are / are headed.

lol ... now theres a million dollar analysis!

Get it!
 
NYC:
I'm noticing that there seems to be an inverse correlation between the audaciousness in a poster's name and where they actually are / are headed.

If only weaponized_cum was in here...

“...all truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.” - Schopenhauer
 

Went to a non target, who cares. I had a great time in college and I'm having a good time now. I don't work for a BB IBD cause I don't really work anywhere FT right now. Looking for a job, enjoying each day, staying productive, meeting new people, its cool.

TBH I could care less if I work at GS/MS/JPM/XYZ or not though. I'm going for the highest pay and shortest hours I can find, don't care what name is providing it.

"Quote from a book/movie about wall street" - Main character in that movie.
 
__________:
Went to a non target, who cares. I had a great time in college and I'm having a good time now. I don't work for a BB IBD cause I don't really work anywhere FT right now. Looking for a job, enjoying each day, staying productive, meeting new people, its cool.

TBH I could care less if I work at GS/MS/JPM/XYZ or not though. I'm going for the highest pay and shortest hours I can find, don't care what name is providing it.

high pay and short hours in IBD don't compute...

'Before you enter... be willing to pay the price'
 
Thurnis Haley:
Yes, students at target schools get stuff handed to them. But one day those people will actually have a job and daddy won't be able to help them advance anymore.

Also, this is a pretty shitty way to go through life too. Imagine if these people actually worked hard to get into an Ivy! what the fuck would we do then, with no straw man to throw shit at? Whatever, some people are born into wealth and connections and all that, and some work hard and get it themselves. Do the second one.

"Quote from a book/movie about wall street" - Main character in that movie.
 
Thurnis Haley:
Yes, students at target schools get stuff handed to them. But one day those people will actually have a job and daddy won't be able to help them advance anymore.

Lol you can't be serious. We all worked hard to get where we are. People at targets just worked harder in high school while you slacked off. Now we target kids can take a little break since we worked so hard in the past, while you non target kids must work harder NOW.

 
Thurnis Haley:
Yes, students at target schools get stuff handed to them. But one day those people will actually have a job and daddy won't be able to help them advance anymore.

^ just like the other poster said, most of them probably just worked a lot harder in high school while you were playing warcraft

 
Hahaha okay. Yes, many people at targets work very hard. But many people got in based on legacy. Now banks assume you must work so much harder than everyone else because you go to a target. Maybe that's true. Or maybe it's not. You assume you worked harder than me in high school because you were able to get into a target. For all I know daddy got you into your school. There's a hiring freeze right now. Good luck getting an IB job with your $50k/year education.

Actually to get into an ivy league based on dad's money- you'd have to donate in the 7 figures- very few parents (even the wealthy ones) do that. Second, SAT ranges and GPAs for legacies are actually HIGHER than the average- no doubt this is because wealthy/educated parents demand that their kids succeed - but the academic achievements are still there. I'm at a "lower-tier" ivy, but I know for a fact that HYP has so much money they really do not care about whether you are poor (in fact you're more likely to get in if you show that you've overcome obstacles). I personally know a princeton student right now who has homeless with his single mother during his middle school years - he has a full-ride- tuition, living expenses, everything paid. And that's not uncommon.

This is just speculation, but at least I have first hand experience- out of every 1,000 students at an ivy league, about 950 completely deserved it. And 50 were partially helped by non-academic factors. So if you want to really bitch about unfair advantages- you should complain about the people who get into BBs with bad grades solely through family connections. But I wouldn't recommend that- because that'll just make you a sour whiney bitch :(

 

Ivy League students are obsessed with money. In fact for most of them money IS the end goal. That's why they set up the investment banking and management consulting industries. They offer services that add nothing to the economy to leech money from companies. It works pretty well. Once daddy hires a private tutor for you, you can be assured of straight A's at your private school. Then he'll hire a private SAT tutor so you can get 2200 and he'll call up his buddies and get you a nice spot at Harvard (he'll pay the $50k/year for that of course). Once at Harvard you can major in philosophy, get a 3.9 taking mostly intro classes. Around your junior year Goldman Sachs will come recruit on campus. Now mind you interviews are competitive but fuck it, your buddy from the dinner club's daddy will give you a nice spot filling out spreadsheets for 100 hours a week. Once you graduate you'll spend another 2 years filling out spreadsheets for $20/hr. Then it's time to go to buyside! Luckily for you you have a buddy from the yacht club whose daddy works at big PE fund. No problem getting a job filling out spreadsheets there! Now maybe you'll get paid $25/hour! See how your career takes off after Harvard?? You go from filling out spreadsheets for $20/hour to filling out spreadsheets for $25/hour and who knows what's next? Maybe this time next year you'll be changing fonts on Powerpoints for $30/hour. Gotta save up for that BMW M3!

 
Thurnis Haley:
Ivy League students are obsessed with money. In fact for most of them money IS the end goal. That's why they set up the investment banking and management consulting industries. They offer services that add nothing to the economy to leech money from companies. It works pretty well. Once daddy hires a private tutor for you, you can be assured of straight A's at your private school. Then he'll hire a private SAT tutor so you can get 2200 and he'll call up his buddies and get you a nice spot at Harvard (he'll pay the $50k/year for that of course). Once at Harvard you can major in philosophy, get a 3.9 taking mostly intro classes. Around your junior year Goldman Sachs will come recruit on campus. Now mind you interviews are competitive but fuck it, your buddy from the dinner club's daddy will give you a nice spot filling out spreadsheets for 100 hours a week. Once you graduate you'll spend another 2 years filling out spreadsheets for $20/hr. Then it's time to go to buyside! Luckily for you you have a buddy from the yacht club whose daddy works at big PE fund. No problem getting a job filling out spreadsheets there! Now maybe you'll get paid $25/hour! See how your career takes off after Harvard?? You go from filling out spreadsheets for $20/hour to filling out spreadsheets for $25/hour and who knows what's next? Maybe this time next year you'll be changing fonts on Powerpoints for $30/hour. Gotta save up for that BMW M3!

yea fuck you state schoolers

 
Thurnis Haley:
Ivy League students are obsessed with money. In fact for most of them money IS the end goal. That's why they set up the investment banking and management consulting industries. They offer services that add nothing to the economy to leech money from companies. It works pretty well. Once daddy hires a private tutor for you, you can be assured of straight A's at your private school. Then he'll hire a private SAT tutor so you can get 2200 and he'll call up his buddies and get you a nice spot at Harvard (he'll pay the $50k/year for that of course). Once at Harvard you can major in philosophy, get a 3.9 taking mostly intro classes. Around your junior year Goldman Sachs will come recruit on campus. Now mind you interviews are competitive but fuck it, your buddy from the dinner club's daddy will give you a nice spot filling out spreadsheets for 100 hours a week. Once you graduate you'll spend another 2 years filling out spreadsheets for $20/hr. Then it's time to go to buyside! Luckily for you you have a buddy from the yacht club whose daddy works at big PE fund. No problem getting a job filling out spreadsheets there! Now maybe you'll get paid $25/hour! See how your career takes off after Harvard?? You go from filling out spreadsheets for $20/hour to filling out spreadsheets for $25/hour and who knows what's next? Maybe this time next year you'll be changing fonts on Powerpoints for $30/hour. Gotta save up for that BMW M3!

you are undoubtedly the whiniest fucking bitch on this site. Seriously, you need to shut the fuck up and take ownership of your lifes fuckups. Sorry some people are just smarter than you, bro. Not everyone gets things handed to them, just because you think they do. oh, i went to a nontarget as well, but you don't see me bitching like you, cause i went out and fucking did something about it rather than sitting on this site bitching about the entitled ivy league kids. most of them aren't entitled whatsoever, but hey...keep bitching. whatever helps you go to sleep at night.

 
Thurnis Haley:
Ivy League students are obsessed with money. In fact for most of them money IS the end goal. That's why they set up the investment banking and management consulting industries. They offer services that add nothing to the economy to leech money from companies. It works pretty well. Once daddy hires a private tutor for you, you can be assured of straight A's at your private school. Then he'll hire a private SAT tutor so you can get 2200 and he'll call up his buddies and get you a nice spot at Harvard (he'll pay the $50k/year for that of course). Once at Harvard you can major in philosophy, get a 3.9 taking mostly intro classes. Around your junior year Goldman Sachs will come recruit on campus. Now mind you interviews are competitive but fuck it, your buddy from the dinner club's daddy will give you a nice spot filling out spreadsheets for 100 hours a week. Once you graduate you'll spend another 2 years filling out spreadsheets for $20/hr. Then it's time to go to buyside! Luckily for you you have a buddy from the yacht club whose daddy works at big PE fund. No problem getting a job filling out spreadsheets there! Now maybe you'll get paid $25/hour! See how your career takes off after Harvard?? You go from filling out spreadsheets for $20/hour to filling out spreadsheets for $25/hour and who knows what's next? Maybe this time next year you'll be changing fonts on Powerpoints for $30/hour. Gotta save up for that BMW M3!

You do realize that you are describing less than 5% of target students right? Mind you there are plenty of people in targets who have affluent parents who can afford to pay for their schools (not me I took out all loans), but all that means is that maybe the parents make 300-400k a year as a lawyers ,accountants, small business owners, consultants, doctors, etc. None of these parents have "buddies" that can get their child into Harvard, and none of them have "buddies" from dinner clubs who are MD's at GS or in PE firms. There simply aren't that many "well connected" people out their in the world that can pave such a road for their children, and if they can their children are usually so spoiled by then that they have no chance of having the dedication to even survive banking. Even on a proportion basis, how many MD's are there in GS/MS/BX banking, and how many close friends do you think they have who's children they just get into a job easily? Maybe let's say 300 MD's who have 3 close friends each with let's even say 2 children. So that's 1800 people who get the easy road that you described, now compare that to how many target students there are per year, and then multiply that by 10 because people don't just keep popping out future banker kids, they stop at 1-3.

Being angry because life isn't as easy as it is for very, very few is just not practical. If every kid in Harvard or Stanford had everything so easy as you described, then I would understand. Or if this was the 1940's and you were a woman trying to get into finance but couldn't because you neglected your housewifing duties, then I would understand. But the world simply does not exist for 99% of people as you project it, and thats a fact.

 
Ivy League students are obsessed with money. In fact for most of them money IS the end goal. That's why they set up the investment banking and management consulting industries. They offer services that add nothing to the economy to leech money from companies. It works pretty well. Once daddy hires a private tutor for you, you can be assured of straight A's at your private school. Then he'll hire a private SAT tutor so you can get 2200 and he'll call up his buddies and get you a nice spot at Harvard (he'll pay the $50k/year for that of course). Once at Harvard you can major in philosophy, get a 3.9 taking mostly intro classes. Around your junior year Goldman Sachs will come recruit on campus. Now mind you interviews are competitive but fuck it, your buddy from the dinner club's daddy will give you a nice spot filling out spreadsheets for 100 hours a week. Once you graduate you'll spend another 2 years filling out spreadsheets for $20/hr. Then it's time to go to buyside! Luckily for you you have a buddy from the yacht club whose daddy works at big PE fund. No problem getting a job filling out spreadsheets there! Now maybe you'll get paid $25/hour! See how your career takes off after Harvard?? You go from filling out spreadsheets for $20/hour to filling out spreadsheets for $25/hour and who knows what's next? Maybe this time next year you'll be changing fonts on Powerpoints for $30/hour. Gotta save up for that BMW M3!
  1. everybody wants money/power/influence.
  2. nobody can gurantee a spot at Harvard unless they are willing to shill out 7 figures. Trust me. Too many powerful/wealthy people want to send their kids.
  3. Tutors help but nobody is going to get 2200+ unless they are somewhat smart or hard-working. A tutor won’t take the test for you (and you shouldn’t need one- I didn’t). They’re just another teacher- if you didn’t listen to your teachers in HS and pander to them for grades, why would you listen to a tutor?
  4. Getting a 3.9 in philosophy is something very few people can do (certainly much harder than getting a 2200 on the SATs). Those essays aren’t cupcake writing seminars.
  5. I’d guess ~75% of people at Harvard wants to work at GS. If you can beat out the other super-accomplished people at Harvard to get a spot, good for you. I’m sure GS’s Harvard intake/applicant is lower than 5% (and that’s very conservative)

Look, keep bitching and refuse to take ownership of your shortcomings- see where that leads you. Good News: In life, the best always rise to the top, even if they fucked up early on (in high school, college, etc). I still believe that. Life is a very very very long race, and you can make up for early stumbles if you run fast for the rest of it. But that won't happen if you spend all your time crying and asking why you're not already on top of the food chain. Either that, or go bomb GS and Harvard out of jealousy :)

 
imnottheonlyone:
Ivy League students are obsessed with money. In fact for most of them money IS the end goal. That's why they set up the investment banking and management consulting industries. They offer services that add nothing to the economy to leech money from companies. It works pretty well. Once daddy hires a private tutor for you, you can be assured of straight A's at your private school. Then he'll hire a private SAT tutor so you can get 2200 and he'll call up his buddies and get you a nice spot at Harvard (he'll pay the $50k/year for that of course). Once at Harvard you can major in philosophy, get a 3.9 taking mostly intro classes. Around your junior year Goldman Sachs will come recruit on campus. Now mind you interviews are competitive but fuck it, your buddy from the dinner club's daddy will give you a nice spot filling out spreadsheets for 100 hours a week. Once you graduate you'll spend another 2 years filling out spreadsheets for $20/hr. Then it's time to go to buyside! Luckily for you you have a buddy from the yacht club whose daddy works at big PE fund. No problem getting a job filling out spreadsheets there! Now maybe you'll get paid $25/hour! See how your career takes off after Harvard?? You go from filling out spreadsheets for $20/hour to filling out spreadsheets for $25/hour and who knows what's next? Maybe this time next year you'll be changing fonts on Powerpoints for $30/hour. Gotta save up for that BMW M3!
  1. everybody wants money/power/influence.
  2. nobody can gurantee a spot at Harvard unless they are willing to shill out 7 figures. Trust me. Too many powerful/wealthy people want to send their kids.
  3. Tutors help but nobody is going to get 2200+ unless they are somewhat smart or hard-working. A tutor won’t take the test for you (and you shouldn’t need one- I didn’t). They’re just another teacher- if you didn’t listen to your teachers in HS and pander to them for grades, why would you listen to a tutor?
  4. Getting a 3.9 in philosophy is something very few people can do (certainly much harder than getting a 2200 on the SATs). Those essays aren’t cupcake writing seminars.
  5. I’d guess ~75% of people at Harvard wants to work at GS. If you can beat out the other super-accomplished people at Harvard to get a spot, good for you. I’m sure GS’s Harvard intake/applicant is lower than 5% (and that’s very conservative)

Look, keep bitching and refuse to take ownership of your shortcomings- see where that leads you. Good News: In life, the best always rise to the top, even if they fucked up early on (in high school, college, etc). I still believe that. Life is a very very very long race, and you can make up for early stumbles if you run fast for the rest of it. But that won't happen if you spend all your time crying and asking why you're not already on top of the food chain. Either that, or go bomb GS and Harvard out of jealousy :)

Wish I had a SB. Shut the fuck up and curb your jealousy. I'm smart, but not smart enough to go to an Ivy, and I'm okay with that; I think that once I can get my foot in the door, regardless of where I am, I'll be able to prove my worth and be successful.

 
Thurnis Haley:
If you don't have connections getting into an Ivy League school is a complete crapshoot. It's like saying that flipping a coin takes hard work.

Once again, what the fuck are you talking about? I didn't go to an Ivy but I went to a strong target and friends of mine/coworkers who went to Ivys had absolutely no connections. It's a crapshoot in the sense that there might be 3 applicants with the exact same gpa/sats and they'll pick 1 based on 1 person playing tennis vs. the other two playing baseball, but if your a stronger applicant on paper they'll pick you.

Nobody has these bloody "connections" that you are so fascinated by.

 
Thurnis Haley:
If you don't have connections getting into an Ivy League school is a complete crapshoot. It's like saying that flipping a coin takes hard work.

my wife came from a lower middle class family in the midwest, with zero connections anywhere. she got in to harvard, dartmouth, and princeton.

 
Thurnis Haley:
If you don't have connections getting into an Ivy League school is a complete crapshoot. It's like saying that flipping a coin takes hard work.

Lol my girlfriend came from a poor immigrant family and got in to all 4 ivy league schools she applied to and she didn't have connections. But then, shes underrepresented (is asian underrepresented?) and from the poor fam. It takes hard work for sure.

“...all truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.” - Schopenhauer
 
seabird:
Thurnis Haley:
If you don't have connections getting into an Ivy League school is a complete crapshoot. It's like saying that flipping a coin takes hard work.

Lol my girlfriend came from a poor immigrant family and got in to all 4 ivy league schools she applied to and she didn't have connections. But then, shes underrepresented (is asian underrepresented?) and from the poor fam. It takes hard work for sure.

I wouldn't say asians are under-represented...sooo many asians everywhere

 

i got to a non target however I do not hold ANY resentment towards kid who do go to targets. I have many friends at targets and 98% of there because they BUSTED THEIR ASS in HS to get there. im talking 10+ AP classes, 4.0+ gpas, 2100+ sats (so what if some of them had tutors? it still takes a shit of work and practice to get ur score up) and a ton of random clubs and whatnot. They are there for a reason, its because they are relatively smart and they worked hard in HS. so more power to em

I know damn well why im not at a target...cuz i was a lazy shit in HS. I had high SATS and a terrible gpa with 0 extracurriculars.

In the end though, if you work hard enough, it wont matter where you went. just my .02c

"Life all comes down to a few moments. This is one of them." - Bud Fox
 
noke2012:
In the end though, if you work hard enough, it wont matter where you went. just my .02c
Nope. That's where you're wrong. The Ivy League alumni have formed a money leeching cartel and the only thing you can hope for is the illusion of success.
 

noke2012 .....right on. "In the end though, if you work hard enough, it wont matter where you went."

Gotta be hungry and you can't stop eating....With time.....everything....

 

lets be honest here the target kids are getting there asses handed to them

face it target kids america is starting to realize you are not the brightest of the bright as a few presidents have shown

I wouldn't be surprised if IB start passing up the target schools all together and just go with state schools who weren't spoon fed since birth

 
blastoise:
lets be honest here the target kids are getting there asses handed to them

face it target kids america is starting to realize you are not the brightest of the bright as a few presidents have shown

I wouldn't be surprised if IB start passing up the target schools all together and just go with state schools who weren't spoon fed since birth

doesn't matter if the target kids are not the brightest of the bright, they are still likely to outsmart state kids, which is what matters. would you rather hire from a pool where 50% of kids are dumb fucks with rich daddy, or from a pool where 95% of kids are...you know state kids.

 

Going to a non-target does indeed suck, but I can't blame anyone but myself but where I'm at. Hopefully a solid graduate program will help me get things turned around. (along with networking)

"There are only two opinions in this world: Mine and the wrong one." -Jeremy Clarkson
 

I go to a non-target and it was because I didnt try my hardest, but I dont regret it at all......... i was busy banging my way through other things ( if you know what I mean). But I just need to work hard now and I realize that.

Its a part of growing up I guess. And yes if you go to a non-target and you do something outstanding you still have a shot at IBD my non-target is almost a semi ( you can say 2-3 peps go to goldman for FO every year).

I want a lady on the street, but a freak in the bed, Go Bucks!!
 

I totally sympathize with the OP it certainly doesn't feel 'fair' that no banks come and do OCR at my school; I think its fine to have those feelings, I definitely do at times. And in my case going to a target / non-target was not remotely based on how 'hard' I worked in H.S.

That being said, realize (I have) that no one else gives a fuck about your feelings and what you think is fair / why it is or isn't and instead get some traction somewhere boutique to BB through sheer brute force or dumb luck. Otherwise you'll be stuck feeling that way for a long time which IMO doesn't feel great.

'Before you enter... be willing to pay the price'
 

I come from a small town that probably has close to as many cows and apple farms as it does people. I still ended up getting into a target (Chicago), but I didn't know what the fuck an investment banker was in high school (was interested in other fields), they didn't offer me one cent of aid and I couldn't afford it, and it was 10+ hours away from home. Do I regret not picking Chicago? In hindsight, obviously. You can't keep dwelling on your past forever though, it'll kill you. I'm probably going to do an MSF, and once I break into the career I want, I'll appreciate it that much more. So maybe it'll all be for the better in the long run.

Sure, there are people at Ivies and other targets that come from the silver spoon background. But, like a lot of the previous posters have said, most of those people worked their asses off in high school to get into the target in the first place. They deserve to have it easier. We all have to put the work in to get into banking at some point, they just did it earlier than we did.

 

Thurnis, I believe you are on the wrong site. Let me redirect you. http://www.acorn.org/about

No patience for your shit here. Most posters are probably non core here, including myself. You are a whining piece of shit who thinks something should be handed to him because some kid at Yale got handed something and you are therefore entitled as well. That logic is retarded and I am glad I will never have to work with you because you are definitely too much of a retard to even be the janitor at UBS. Life ain't fair, no one ever said it was, hopefully I wont miss the urinal next time you are on day shift.

 

Thurnis, Speaking from personal experience of going to a state school to a school that is decently recruited from, let me tell you, the grass is DEFINITELY greener on the other side. But the point is not even just getting in, its surviving and rising to the top there and moving on. I do not hate on the targets because I now realize getting in..yea thats nice...but you got to MAKE it most of the time. I just found out this morning that Blackstone recruits at my school. I almost got emotional because looking back a year ago where I was, i could have never dreamed i would even have the opportunity for my application to even get read. However, just cause you are at a Target DOES NOT guarantee you a job on the Street. You got to work hard and make a way there, and having a target (or semi-taget) name on your resume helps, but you still have to perform.

Its like getting drafted to the NBA, you signed a contract...yay...but you got to perform if you want to get to the big time (Lakers, Celtics, Heat, etc.). So just keep trying.

 
venturecapitalista:
This thread = why I opted to not go IB and I'm still making bank working 45-55 hours a week and I LOVE my job.

Keep on keepin' on, kids...

wht do you do? VC i am guessing?

I want a lady on the street, but a freak in the bed, Go Bucks!!
 

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I want a lady on the street, but a freak in the bed, Go Bucks!!
 

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I want a lady on the street, but a freak in the bed, Go Bucks!!
 

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If your dreams don't scare you, then they are not big enough. "There are two types of people in this world: People who say they pee in the shower, and dirty fucking liars."-Louis C.K.
 

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[quote=patternfinder]Of course, I would just buy in scales. [/quote] See my WSO Blog | my AMA
 

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Fuga ex est quod molestiae. Officia reprehenderit rerum delectus quod molestiae. Ut omnis soluta repellendus in deserunt maxime dolorem accusamus. Dolores earum ipsa occaecati maxime quis.

 

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If your dreams don't scare you, then they are not big enough. "There are two types of people in this world: People who say they pee in the shower, and dirty fucking liars."-Louis C.K.

Career Advancement Opportunities

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Jefferies & Company 02 99.4%
  • Goldman Sachs 19 98.8%
  • Harris Williams & Co. (++) 98.3%
  • Lazard Freres 02 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 03 97.1%

Overall Employee Satisfaction

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Harris Williams & Co. 18 99.4%
  • JPMorgan Chase 10 98.8%
  • Lazard Freres 05 98.3%
  • Morgan Stanley 07 97.7%
  • William Blair 03 97.1%

Professional Growth Opportunities

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Lazard Freres 01 99.4%
  • Jefferies & Company 02 98.8%
  • Goldman Sachs 17 98.3%
  • Moelis & Company 07 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 05 97.1%

Total Avg Compensation

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Director/MD (5) $648
  • Vice President (19) $385
  • Associates (86) $261
  • 3rd+ Year Analyst (13) $181
  • Intern/Summer Associate (33) $170
  • 2nd Year Analyst (66) $168
  • 1st Year Analyst (202) $159
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (144) $101
notes
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