Back to school season is just around the corner. In few days, millions of aspiring students will be attending college for the first time. And for most of them, attending college is a way to achieve higher income potential and better life satisfaction. But not all college students will be able to achieve their American dream because of the extremely unreasonable cost/benefit of the field of study that they chose.
Cortney could move someplace cheaper than her current home city of San Francisco, but she worries about her job prospects, even with her N.Y.U. diploma. She recently received a raise and now makes $22 an hour working for a photographer. It’s the highest salary she’s earned since graduating with an interdisciplinary degree in religious and women’s studies. After taxes, she takes home about $2,300 a month. Rent runs $750, and the full monthly payments on her student loans would be about $700 if they weren’t being deferred, which would not leave a lot left over.
Moral of the story: It is very important to make smart decisions regarding what to study, and which type of jobs that you want to have, because:
1/ The system is rigged. Colleges and banks are lending money to college students without even considering their ability to pay back, but students assume all the responsibilities for their decisions. There's no insurance policy for making the wrong choice.
2/ College degrees are becoming more and more commoditized due to the number of college graduates being produced every year and the rise of online education. The "education" aspect of the college experience is diminishing as an ten-year-old nowadays can go online and study whatever he wants.
Finance or GTFO
"interdisciplinary degree in religious and women's studies"
Are we really supposed to feel bad?
I need to find out where she's getting this $750/mo rent in SF. The lowest I've seen for a 1BR/1BA is about $1,000 without having to go to a shitty neighborhood. Probably has roommates or something.
Just go military and get it paid for.
^This^^^
Goes to NYU to major in religion and women's studies and takes a job in photography and we are supposed to feel bad for her? Take a real major that involves critical thinking or go to a cheaper/less prestigious school if you're going to take loans out for a women's studies and religion major lol.
NYU isn't prestigious. Stern is, but NYU isn't.
I would say NYU is prestigious, top 30 university with great global reputation.
The kicker is she ALSO wants to live in San Francisco. She just reeks of my generation's entitlement mindset. I'm coughing at my client site because I just choked on my coffee from the sheer ridiculousness of her decisions.
I looked her up, and +1 to her for even having a LinkedIn profile. Honestly didn't expect her to have one.
@John-Doe8 I just checked her LinkedIn and it said she majored in Sociology & Philosophy? Which one(s) is it?
Ha, guess she doesn't want to admit her REAL majors on LinkedIn. Only to the NYT.........
"After taxes, she takes home about $2,300 a month. Rent runs $750, and the full monthly payments on her student loans would be about $700 if they weren't being deferred, which would not leave a lot left over."
Maybe I'm being ungracious here, but $850 a month sounds like enough left over for me. Assuming she has a car with a payment of $450 a month (and she'd better not!) That's $100 a week left over. If you can't eat and pay utilities on $100 a week, there' s a problem. And that's only if she has a high car payment.
That is true but she is basically living paycheck to paycheck with no savings. Anyone can do that even without a college degree.
That's fair. But that's the price of debt. You do that until you pay off your debts, then you can start saving. She's basically choosing to let her debt just get bigger, and PROBABLY not saving anyway. That's the worst of all possible worlds.
As a new grad living in SF I can say that the math here is kind of wonky. $750 for rent means she must be sharing a studio in a bad part of the city. Either that or she really lucked into a rent controlled place, but is still probably splitting the place. There is no way she has her own place or a place that's even somewhat nice for $750. Everyone I know in the city is paying ~1500 at the minimum and the average is probably closer to ~2000 all in. Studios and 1 beds in good parts of the city can be $3000-4000 easily.
That aside my thoughts on College major are that it doesn't really matter if you come from a good school( Ivy, top LAC, top public etc). I've seen tons of people from HYPS have english degrees and end up on Wall Street or in Silicon Valley with no problem. It's almost a sin to see how easily some of the top Ivy kids find jobs and internships.
For kids without that, I think major is definitely more important and while I would encourage students to find their passion in college, I think there is something to be said for taking some time to think before college as to what one wants to do with life and how to pursue it in school.
Hahaha thanks for the morning pick me up. This is so depressing/naive/sad that it's hilarious.
Major in STEM/economics/finance or you'll be irrelevant in today's highly competitive job market. When I was in b-school I interacted a lot with law students, and most of them majored in nonsense BS and couldn't get jobs in finance or consulting. Hence, they were forced to attend law school, and they were utterly miserable.
top undergrad+good major+good gpa+solid internships>BB or MBB>PE>HSW b-school is the best path that one can pursue. Do it and you're set for life.
You are such a tool.
I think the underlying point is people should focus more on the ROI of their education.
You're so right dude, those losers couldn't get finance or consulting jobs so they were forced into law school. How are they ever going to put food on the table??? At least they didn't have to suffer the indignity of going to med school and becoming surgeons or something... then they'd really be fucked.
Anyone with bankruptcy knowledge care to enlighten us as to why Gov decided to make student loans some of the hardest debts to dispose of in bankruptcy but someone who worked at walmart in 05 qualifying for a 500k loan could dispose of this debt?
You are lending money to someone how has minimal credit and work experience, there is nothing you can repo/foreclose on, and yields lower than credit cards.
With everyone and their best friend getting a college degree these days a useless major is worth about as much as the paper it is written (maybe less when you factor in the debt burden), unless you went to an Ivy etc.
You would be better off lending money on LendingClub... at least you get yield and a work/credit history even if it is bad.
Because the govt backs them. Right now anyone can get a student loan for a degree from whatever university while studying religion because it is backed by the govt. If you could discharge them interest rates would go up and no one doing a stupid major from a terrible school would get one without collateral. This is actually a good thing imo but I doubt this would pass through both parties.
Well on the flip side... http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2015/08/geoff-colvin-h…
I think the kind of things that a liberal arts education provides is extremely important, but as a degree (which is like a technical certification now) there's just so little incentive to do it given the costs and job prospects.
I'd say get a STEM degree but do not discount the importance of liberal arts, take a lot of electives and read a lot of books after you graduate.
Major in something that gets you grades and laids
"Ms. Munna, a 26-year-old graduate of New York University"
"For much of the time since her 2005 graduation"
"She started college at age 17"
Something doesn't add up.
Saw that too and it confused me until I looked at the date. It was written in May 2010.
If you don't go to an IVY/target for high paying entry-level jobs(yes even outside of finance), do stem. It's simple, I fucked it up, and everyone fucked it up. I at least did accounting though.
Of course this is on her. It doesn't sound like she made use of her time as an undergrad. Maybe instead of going home each summer she could have done research or an internship to better set her up for FT recruiting? Did she even go to the career fair? Obvious this is all hypothetical but you wouldn't believe how many graduating seniors I knew, without jobs, that didn't bother to either attend the career fair or even begin applying while in school. It's like we only attended school to party riiiight?
I went to CU and the majority of the students especially seniors don't take advantage of the career fairs. Then when 1 gets an internship everyone is like "waaaa how'd you get that?!?!?!" Even during my freshman year I went to them. But then again CU is a party school.
To me only major on these majors or just don't go to college (unless it's a full-ride/ near full-ride) : Engineering, Computer Science (some consider this as part of engineering), finance, accounting, nursing, or pharmacy. And if you're majoring in finance/ accounting better have 3.3-3.5+ GPA.
sorry, dear friend, but this sounds like you have an incomplete world view. I got STEM majors and little interest in the other majors, but I will still say that statement makes me furious.
Guess what Mr. Lloyd the CEO of Goldman majored in? History. Guess what school did Obama go? Law. The rest? Go figure. The value of those education cannot be simply measured by scholarships (although they help)
now I completely agree with the 3.3-3.5 bar for Finance accounting people. actually it's more of a general statement for ALL majors, unless you're in Berkeley or Ivys that you get a second look.
Those are some great examples, but I think if you're looking at an average person who's hoping to get a job after college those majors are still his/her best bet. I hate to see it come to it, but it isn't 80-90s anymore and in this competitive world it's very tough to get a job unless a person has STEM/ Business background. That being said, I do believe if a person is smart, ambitious, and hard-working enough it doesn't matter what his/her major is.
I don't know if you can hold that 3.3-3.5 bar for all majors. It is VERY hard to have that type of GPA in engineering unless all you do is study.
.
BTW the person above who said STEM/Finance/Acct etc as majors is right. The exceptions are the iveys where you can get away with studying history and still get into finance because you have to be pretty damn smart to get into those schools. The delta between religion and whatever this chick did at NYU and history at Harvard (Blankfein) is like the Atlantic Ocean, come on.
Just to add some more fun for a slow Wednesday morning.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/loan-binge-by-graduate-students-fans-debt-w…
Some gems:
You left out the absolutely best part of the Capella University one
Can't pay your Bachelor's degree loans? Let's get 2 graduate degrees at a for-profit school (on more loans) to delay paying them!
Absolutely infuriating. And saddening. But mostly infuriating.
Choosing a major for IB at UC schools (Originally Posted: 10/08/2013)Hello,I will be a transfer student to hopefully UCLA, UCB, UCSD or UCSB for fall 2014. I am currently trying to decide my major and trying to make it relevant to my possible career goals. I have a mentor right now who has been in I-banking and he said there is all different types of routes anyone can take so I am looking for some more info here.Anyways, for UCLA, I can apply as either Math/Econ or Biz Econ, I feel I have a better chance at being accepted into Math/Econ but I don't really know if all the extra math is needed (I do have an interest in math and have completed enough classes for transfer).At UCSB, there is a financial mathematics and stats major that I have not found much info on, but it seems to fall more into a career as a actuarian, although I could be wrong. They also offer an Econ/Accounting major.Lastly, I also would be able to UCSD as a CompSci major. I have an interest in CompSci but know how difficult it is but also opens up limitless opportunities into many industries.For UCB, I will probably be applying to Haas but feel my chances aren't the best, so I am also considering Econ/Math there as well.I know that a high GPA is extremely important but also am looking for something that has relevancy to set up career advancement, to not only I-banking, but the banking and financial sectors as a whole.I really appreciate any help.
I would worry more about getting into UCLA or UCB.
At UCB you can do Haas, or you can do Econ (basically the Haas backup).
I don't see anyone out of UCSB or UCB in banking.
Which is a better degree combination? Any input is valued! (Originally Posted: 10/28/2015)
I am curious about the general perception at first glance, of these three possible degree combinations. Any feedback would be appreciated. Thank you.
BS - Supply Chain Management
MS - Systems Engineering
BS - Supply Chain Management MS - Systems Engineering
Masters Certificate - Quantitative Economics
BS - Supply Chain Management MS - Financial Economics
What are you going to try and do with your degrees? Some context will help in trying to describe how it will be perceived.
I currently work in Oil&Gas, in capital projects. I work more on the buying & selling and project management. I would like to finish my Masters but I am in a spot to where I can switch easily without losing anything. I am currently doing the systems engineering program. I want to get more involved with Risk Management or switch it up totally and get into the financial sector. My dad works in the financial side and said getting a CFA, on top of what I am doing, might be the best option.
I would only recommend getting the CFA if you want to work as an equity research analyst or as a portfolio manager.
If you want to break into finance I would recommend the financial economics masters. If you could take a few finance electives during the systems engineering courses that could also work.
You just want to be able to show employers you have some background or knowledge about finance.
Emory Goizeuta help me choose my major! (Originally Posted: 12/31/2015)
Hello this is my first post on WSO but I felt that this was the only forum that people could give me some more insight.
I currently attend Emory University and currently a freshman. After my first semester I ended up with a 4.0 GPA. My goal like many others is to get a job at a bulge bracket/investment bank analyst type role at wall street however at the same time I am also interested in big law.
I know Emory isn't a target school (more like a semi-target) but I was wondering how important it was for me to go to Goizeuta as a undergrad (BBA). Quite honestly I feel like its a waste of my time to be majoring in business when I could be pursuing other majors such as Applied mathematics or Comp Sci.
Do you think my chances of getting a job as an analyst would be impacted negatively if I decided to not go to Gozieuta and instead majored in mathematics or some other quantitative major?
.
I would also advise taking as many classes with Jong Kim as you can to prepare you for the Wall Street Warrior lifestyle. Instagas has an energy hedge fund in Atlanta that may provide useful internship opportunities.
On choosing the degree? (Originally Posted: 06/26/2015)
I've been accepted into the droit-économie-gestion program at Paris Descartes University (law - economics & management) for next coming semester, I was wondering what your opinions were on this school and program?
Thanks!
do CS build facebook
Majors to choose (Originally Posted: 12/20/2015)
I know this subject has been beaten to death, but I am having a hard time deciding between the two. I am extremely interested in Emerging Markets and exchange rate risk, Hedge and Mutual fund management, and international private equity and policy. I was wondering what the general consensus was for which degree to choose between the two.
What are you talking about man
I am trying to decide between Economics and Finance degree
Personally think it's between finance and accounting. Econ generally isn't a good choice for non-targets but definitely is at a target.
Choosing the Right Major (Originally Posted: 02/20/2014)
I studied natural sciences till 12th grade. But I've always had that strong keen interest to know more an more about how the world economy and daily business transactions could be actually summed up on a piece of paper, with all its mathematics stuff. And during my gap year, I've been doing ACCA level 1, 2 and 3 in order to acquire that accounting and financial knowledge. But i do not like that much Economics. So, what would be best major for me? Finance ? Accounting and Finance ? Or another major ?
I'm not going to pick your career for you. Think about your interests and jobs that interest you. There are a ton of subforums that give great insight into what you can expect from a career in PE vs. a career in S&T.
Also - you're in grade 12 so pick whatever interests you and go from there. You'll eventually figure out what you want to do.
Which Second Major is Better (Originally Posted: 09/25/2012)
I am an engineering major (currently Electrical but I may switch to Mechanical) at Rutgers-New Brunswick. I was wondering which second major would look better, Mathematics or Economics?
For what? Breaking into IB? Will be very difficult but there are definitely a few Rutgers alumni on the street. Join their LIBOR club. I'd take the time you would have spent on a second major and spend it on networking. Unless you think it won't affect your GPA. Maybe minor in Econ, Finance or Math rather than doing a double major.
I know that some Rutgers Math majors have gotten into some quant-y roles as well as S&T though.
double post
Which college major/pathway should I do? (Originally Posted: 06/19/2013)
I'm interested in doing something along the lines of F500 finance or FP&A.
I was accepted into Michigan State and UMich. I couldn't go to an out-of-state college due to my low socioeconomic status.
If I go to Michigan State: major in Finance and minor in Econ
If I go to uMich: major in Econ and minor in something simple like Psychology to boost my GPA.
Either will work for F500 finance. I'd go with the cheapest option in your case if rankings/prestige aren't too important. Obviously Michigan has more prestige and thus more upside in the eyes of recruiters.
Why not Ross?
Ross at UMichigan all the way. If you like Big 4 Michigan State is decent.
If it were me, um no second thought.
Just a guess but I'm thinking he didn't get pre-admit and is assuming he won't get in?
Choosing an undergraduate major (Originally Posted: 01/10/2013)
I'm currently a second semester sophomore at a target school (think HYPSW), I'm currently set to become an Economics major, but I was just wondering if it would make a difference for me to double major in Economics and Mathematics or Economics and Applied Math instead?
I would prefer to just major in pure Econ and spend more time exploring physics/psychology/computer science though. At the end of the day, does it matter which major I choose?
Will having an extra major in math affect my job prospects?
I think it depends on the quantitative reputation of your school's economics program. I went to UChicago, and our econ program is essentially an applied mathematics degree, so most kids that go there probably wouldn't get much benefit of adding math unless they are dead set on being a quant, or are just that interested/great at math. If your school has a similar reputation for their econ department, then stick with just econ and explore the other options you mentioned if they interest you.
Deciding Major Need Help ASAP!! (Originally Posted: 11/16/2013)
I am currently a sophomore enrolled in NYU's College of Arts and Science and debating wether I should pursue a joint major in Mathematics and Computer Science while also getting a "degree" in Actuarial Science. The thing is that the actuarial science degree is a stern major so I wont technically graduate with the stern degree I would only take the courses necessary for the Actuary major (which will definitely help on the tests). The problem with that is that I would have to take summer courses to actually complete it all but if it is worth it, I will go for it. My other option would be to just purely major in mathematics while taking all the actuarial science courses and minor in comp sci, which I can definitely fit in to my schedule, Im just not sure if a comp sci minor would be worth it (incase I want to retire and become anything comp sci related). My final option would be a joint major in math and econ. I need to have my schedule finished by thursday so if anyone could help that would be great!
Depends a whole lot on what you want to do when you graduate. What do you have in mind?
Yup, no idea how to advise you w/o knowing what career you want.
Computer science based on almost nothing.
Which Major? (Originally Posted: 01/26/2007)
My school offers financial engineering (specifically for ibankers) and accounting. I want to double major with one of the above and economics. I know accounting is very important but financial engineering might provide me with more relevant knowledge. Which should I choose?
Both of them are good majors, I would major in the one that I would think would get me a higher GPA.
Id do FE just because its more interesting and can demostrate good quantitative mastery.
If you can roll them both might as well go w/ FE
what school?
If it's Columbia, I'd say FE. Their program is very prestigious.
the frattiest major you can have is history. it will take you very far in life and among the right circles.
I agree 100%. Philosophy is also good.
Communications is a fanatastic major
I go to Binghamton University (in NY).
Finance Major: Which Specialization Track? (Originally Posted: 05/18/2012)
Hey Guys
I am approaching my second year at McCombs and Finance majors have to pick a special track. I narrowed it down to Investment Management track or corporate finance/Investment Banking track. Managing funds/wealth management and investments always seemed pretty cool to me but IB also sounds very cool as well. It's kind of too early to think about this but I am a proactive person but as far as both of these tracks go how is the demand/job prospects/opportunities fare, internship opportunities (especially in Texas), moreover what type of careers can you get with these two tracks? Any help is greatly appreciated
Thanks, ad23
Many of the Finance tracks lead to similar career paths. My academic advisor has always told me to select tracks based off your interest in courses instead of career path. I was in your shoes a year ago trying to decide between the Energy and Investment Management tracks and ended up going Energy after looking at the credit requirements and realizing the optional courses allow for great scheduling flexibility. Check out the track requirements on the Finance page of our website.
Keep in mind that the Corporate Finance track requires the most accounting credits of all the Finance tracks.
Could anyone tell me which major should I study please! I really want to do something about corporate merger and IPO (Originally Posted: 03/27/2011)
I am applying for the master drgree but I am confused about the major.The master of finace would be a great choice but few schools have this kind of program. What other programs would alow me to find a job in investment bank? THX! (P.S. I am major in computer science and have taken the GRE test (1500=700+800) )
You don't need a masters. Just watch American Psycho, Wall Street and Boiler Room for 12 semester hours and you've just saved yourself 1 year and $40K.
If you went to a nontarget as an undergrad and didn't really try to break in then getting a masters might be the best course of action. However, it's more important that you study at a target school (ie Princeton, Wharton, Stanford, etc.)
Thanks a lot ! However, I think, I have to take a master degree because only a bachelor degree was not enough to break into IB, let alone a bachelor degree in computer science . Plus, I knew little about the financial world. Therefore, I want to know about what major is suitable for me to get a job in IB. (P.S I do not want to do any thing about math or statistics.).
MBA
FARTMAN
Is this a joke?
Yes.
Help me decide my major + minor! Top 10 undergrad business school student (Originally Posted: 08/27/2013)
What jobs are available for Finance + Management majors with a Comp Sci minor?
I go to a top 10 undergrad business school.
I was interested in double majoring in finance and computer science but credit-wise, I don't think that's possible.
I'm interested in computer science as a subject but I don't want a job in computer science. I would most likely want to work in equity research, consulting, corporate finance, or some type of business analyst role. (I know these are very different. I'm a sophomore and I'm just trying to give a general idea).
Given this, what are the positives and negatives of the following combinations? This is based on what I'm interested in, but I don't know if they make sense for a job in one of these fields. I also want a degree that will offer flexibility through different fields.
I will minor in computer science. Which major? 1) Finance 2) Finance and Management 3) Economics and Management 4) Finance and Economics 5) Economics and Statistics
I'm leading towards #3, but I go to a school that is very good and very well-known for finance majors, so I don't want recruiters to wonder why I didn't major in finance.
How about Statistical Management of Financial Economics?
My vote is for Economic Management of Finance and Statistics.
FInance and management
Finance & Economics and take accounting courses if you have extra space.
Thank you hlang and BEAST MODE BANKER!
Any particular reasoning for those responses?
Any more real help?
Choosing a Major/Avoiding underemployment (Originally Posted: 07/30/2013)
Hey People of the world. I'm going to college in the fall and have this nagging feeling in my head. What should I major in? It's between business and engineering. I feel like if I choose Business, I wont find a good career right after school. I'm good at math that's excellent for fiance, but not Calculus. If anyone who recently received a BS in either field, please comment and let me know how its going for you.. For the older gentlemen ( and ladies), how did you beat/ get out of underemployment. Thank you in advance.
It seems like you're asking two questions here. One is business vs. engineering, and the other is finding a good career once you graduate. From my perspective, this is what I would suggest.
For the whole business vs. engineering question, the real question you should be asking yourself is which do you (or think you would) prefer to do more as a career. If you are anywhere decent in whatever you decide to pursue, you should be able to find a job in that field. Choosing a career field solely for finding a good job is a bad way to go about deciding your educational future (IMO). If you're skilled and know how to network, you should always have option at hand for obtaining employment and financial security.
However, if you are truly worried about your employment prospects when you graduate, get a degree in accounting. As long as the world revolves around capitalist-based economic systems (and as long as you don't absolutely suck at accounting) you should never have to find yourself wanting for a job.
cant decide my major (Originally Posted: 12/17/2014)
I am going onto sophomore and need to decide my major. I am primarily interested in market making and S&T.
Want to be a trader and my options are
computer science + finance single major (it is called computing & financial management)
or
Math majors (statistics,applied math, etc) + computer science minor
cfm kids tend to lean towards more technical jobs like electronic market making and algo trading
a few stat majors go work for prop firms (with less quant) I think.
The thing is I do not know what I am truly interested and what the best fit is for me.
any recommendations or thoughts?
wtf
why don't you figure out what you like and what you're good at and major in that
and not worry so much about S&T
like did someone tell you those were the only paths into S&T or something
yo math majors are not statistics, applied math, etc.
math majors generally study stuff like real analysis, algebra, and topology
and yeah if you take that stuff seriously, it helps you think through logical arguments more carefully
turns out that can help in a lot of areas
including finance
basically learn stuff you're interested in and good at but keep an open mind towards learning various areas
example!
credit correlation was pretty hot in the first part of the 2000's
then the crisis came, and credit correlation more or less got destroyed
meaning half of those dudes are now in risk management
but if some of those dudes knew something about macro or money markets (w/ benefit of hindsight here)
they may have foreseen what was about to happen to them
when the environment changes, hopefully you can adapt
having a broad mindset and learning beyond your area of specialization helps in that regard
tl;dr pls don't pick a major based on preconceived notions about where it will get you in S&T
Deciding on a Major (Originally Posted: 06/06/2010)
This is my first post here on WSO. I have been a long time reader and enjoyer of the site and I have a few big decisions coming up and figured Id get a few opinions if I can. I have searched and read many a post concerning whether to major in business or economics and whether being from a non-target will become and issue and such, but I would still like to just get a few ideas on this.
I have completed my freshman year at school and after my first semester sophomore year I will have to declare a major. When I graduate I want to start out as an analyst and go from there back to B-school. After that I dont know, it can all change in a second, but as of now thats how I really feel. My question is whether to major in business or economics due to the fact that I attend a very well ranking liberal arts school that does have a dedicated business program. Many liberal arts school do not but mine does, and the program is very impressive and in fact has a limit on how many people can declare it as a major. Many people from my school who majored in the business program have gone on to analyst positions at AIG, JP Morgan, and Goldman, I am unsure of others.
Would an economic major coming from a liberal arts school be as reputable when applying for such a position as compared to a degree in economics from a non-liberal arts school? Any comments would be appreciated, I am aware that this question must be quite common and almost painful to hear over and over but, I really would appreciate the help to make sure I am not overlooking anything.
Of the two, which one do you prefer and in which subject do you think you'll achieve the best grades? The aim is to ensure you get a high GPA.
This seems like a pretty simple decision Pete. You have a proven path (business) that has a history of attracting top companies in the field you want. Why go against the grain of something that is proven to work? Go with the best school you can and get the best grades you can. If you have the choice to enroll in a target program you would be foolish to pass it over for a non-target.
Choosing a major at a non-target (Originally Posted: 05/13/2013)
Starting this fall I will be enrolling as an undergrad at American University in D.C. At the moment I am interested in going into S&T after graduation and hopefully working in NYC. Im having trouble choosing between majoring in History or in Finance (Kogod) . Im more interested in finance but I believe I will maintain a higher GPA if I majored in History and feel its an area where Im naturally good at. I know going to a non-target (especially AU) is already a disadvantage when trying to get recruited by a BB and Im concerned that not majoring in something relevant to finance will cause a bigger disadvantage. Is it better if I major in history and potentially earn a high GPA (3.7+) or to major in finance and do not as well but still quite good (3.5 area)? Any responses will be appreciated.
I know that you can get in with a major in History, but only if you go to a tippy-top school (as in HYP).
I don't know about S&T but I imagine people will tell you to major in finance and double in math...
Do not major in history or any other non Business or STEM field at a non-target. End of story.
Business or STEM major. To help your cause you can add a stat minor, complete half of it, and drop after you land a junior SA gig if you're worried about GPA.
major: accounting, stats, math, or light engineering/science major (want a good gpa and enough time to network, its like an extra class)
minor: stats, psychology, or computer science (programming, VBA, C++ those are good)
If you double any of the above, looks even better. but keep GPA 3.7+ keep like a scale in your mind. 3.6 below, 3.7 average. 3.8,3.9 above. 4.0 sweet, but not worth the time.
non-target: know excel and powerpoint like the back of your hand, seriously, even if S&T, know markets obv. and know every single stupid interview question on WSO guides at ALL times, starting after your freshmen Xmas break.
and read WSJ daily.
major in finance...imo not worth it, but history is not even a choice for wallstreet at a non-target.
Which Major (Originally Posted: 03/27/2014)
Computer Engineering (B.Eng.) Electrical Engineering (B.Eng.) Software Engineering (B.S.E.) Computer Science (B.S.)
Minors: Minor in Finance, Minor in Management, Minor in Marketing, Minor in Operations Management
In terms of what I like, I guess I am on the computer side. I m pretty profficient with it and I have built one in the past. I wished I could do a dual degree of compsci with finance but it isn't possible at my school.
Aiming for Investment banking or some finance jobs like trading.
A computer science degree is a science degree. Are engineering degrees looked more highly of than a computer science degree?
I'm a double major in finance and computer science, so I'll chime in even though I have no idea how each degree will look in the workplace.
All of those degrees sound substantially different. I'm not entirely sure what computer engineering is, but that sounds like more focus on hardware engineering, which I think would be useful in the way an electrical engineering degree can be useful in the financial industry. In other words, the math and engineering thinking skills you learn in CE will be useful, not so much the actual technical skills (e.g. circuits).
Software engineering and computer science are also a bit different from each other, since it's possible to slide through CS major without doing much coding at many schools. I for one am doing exactly that because I can take math-ier classes (e.g. algorithms, computation theory, linear algebra) for elective space. Software engineering would be more focused on actual coding skills. Obviously, coding and math give you different advantages in the financial industry.
Basically, take a look at the courses you have to take for each program. The focus of each program will give you different advantages.
How about major in what you like? You won't be successful unless you're passionate about what you're doing. You seem very unsure in your post and a lot of things contradict each other...for example, IB and S&T are polar opposites. Computer Engineering is hardware focused and practical, while Computer Science is software focused and theoretical. Maybe you should do some more research, then start off with what you like to do and figure it out from there.
Thanks for the responses.
TBH honest my first question in an interview would be why as an engineering major would you want to switch to finance. Getting an engineering degree is no joke. Did you originally want to be an engineering major going into undergrad?
Which degree? UK EDITION (Originally Posted: 10/15/2013)
so basically I was trying to decide where to study (undergrad), My grades are not good enough to go to a target and study econ, so my two options are as follows
Economics at Semi-target in the UK (Bristol/Nottingham/Durham)
Management at Target in the UK (UCL/Warwick)
P.s if it makes a difference i am interested in trading not IBD
would appreciated answers from people in the UK
I would go to UCL/Warwick
UCL. Where's Warwick? Never heard of them
That's like answering: "get a Nissan, never heard of Ferrari"
(not saying Warwick is a Ferrari, just an example)
Definitely UCL or Warwick. No matter what your degree is, as long as you are from Oxbridge LSE UCL Imperial or Warwick, you'll get your fair shot and acing the interview will be only up to you.
Durham does pretty well for econ. Personally I would go UCL/warwick and try to do an internal transfer to econ.
Durham econ will place best in BB in London from that list - strong program and good rep. Cant really go wrong with UCL and Warwick although management programs are never really considered on par with econ
Thanks for all the replies, i think ill apply to management courses at UCL/Warwick, might as well give LSE a punt but my chances will be slim.
hopefully i will get into UCL as i would prefer to be in london, then i will try to transfer to a econ course, such as econ with stats or econ with business. I hear UCL are quite relaxed on internal transfers, as long as you do it very early into the year and meet the requirements of the chosen course
P.s to LDNBNKR i prefer Nottingham/Bristol to Durham for many reasons which i will not go into now...
One more question, UCL have the Information management for business course, i could probably get into there, would this be sufficient for Trading, on their website one of their graduate destinations is analyst at GS, so i assume it is, could someone clarify
wait youren ot in yet? why not apply to both programs?-_-
What would be better Bsc Economics at a semi target or BA economics and business with east European studies at UCL? the course at UCL is not taught by the econ department, and it is a BA, this is putting me of.
Choosing a Major (Originally Posted: 04/30/2013)
I am going to the University of Minnesota, and I am planning on doing a double major. I love business as a whole and am still not sure whether I want to do the IB/corporate finance thing or do something with starting a business/entrepreneurial. I am for sure majoring in finance, and I am just looking for opinions on a good second major with that. The options I would consider for a 2nd major are: Accounting, Entrepreneurial Management, or MIS. Thanks a lot to anyone that responds.
Accounting. If you're looking at banking, it's probably the most useful skill.
Still, you should know that there isn't really some sort of requirement to major in finance in order to get into investment banking. A lot of other subjects are accepted, and as a incoming freshman, you should really pick the one you're most interested in.
I totally agree with mitt Romney, accounting is a desirable major. Are you going to Carlson?
somebody might find this report useful:
http://blogs.wsj.com/atwork/2013/04/29/and-the-highest-paid-college-maj…
Yes I am going to be in Carlson. I know accounting is an invaluable skill to have, and that's why I think it would be smart to major in. However, accounting is just so damn boring, and I would much rather study entrepreneurial management. Also I am going into finance for sure because I love finance.
The MIS program in Carlson had 100% job placements last year. Something to keep in mind as a safety. Accounting safety job would obviously be Big 4 Audit. The Entre major is extremely flexible and it is possible to triple major if you're coming in with credits to spare. It would also be worth it to look into one of the enterprises (consulting, brands, ventures, or funds) to do your junior/senior year.
I'd pick MIS. Big Data is the future and even knowing more about it is sure to help you even if you don't work in the industry.
http://blogs.kenan-flagler.unc.edu/2013/04/29/the-big-data-talent-gap/?…
I don't want to just do finance, because I believe a double major would make more marketable and could boost my chances at getting into a better b school for my MBA.
The double major doesn't help THAT much really.
Did Philosophy as a minor (Economics-Finance Major), enjoyed it and found it interesting, made me stand out in my applications. Almost every interviewer has asked me about it as well. If you aren't going to do something that will blow them away and make you useful for a specialized team (Hard Science/Math), do something you find interesting.
Just start with a Finance major, then decide a second major after you have had some good internship experience. If you are thinking entrepreneurship, try to find an internship with a start-up and see if it is something you enjoy. If you are thinking banking - get an internship there or even a part time job as a teller.
Thanks everyone!
Which major is right for me? (Originally Posted: 11/27/2010)
I know this question is asked a lot, but I cannot find any posts on it with the search function. Basically, I want to get an MBA after college. Obviously a better GPA helps in admissions, and major I know does not matter too much.
Do business schools have any bias towards a certain major in admissions? More specifically engineering vs. business undergrad.
I want to major in Industrial Engineering, but I also love investing and finance. Engineering will perhaps offer me more opportunities, but my GPA will be lower. Not to mention finance will actually teach me what I want to know. However, I can learn finance before my MBA without a finance degree.
Finance is a dime-a-dozen major, especially at a state school. So I don't want to waste my education on a useless major when I could do industrial engineering - which is kind of like economics. The finance degree is just a business degree with a finance tag on it (state school).
Basically, I am asking if it would be better to major in engineering and get a most likely low GPA or major in finance or econ and get a high one.
I think you all understand me.
Thanks.
If you're from a nontarget state school, a low GPA will get you dinged.
Agree with the above. If you go to a non-target, focus on getting the highest GPA.
I think it is a fair question mind you. My best guess would be to focus on having a great GPA (over 3.5), however, my knowledge on this matter is quite limited. I would ask the question to an admission consultant.
According to me you may have to focus on GPA to get good points. I also advice you to go to consultant and get help from him.
It doesn't really matter, if you do what you love you should do well (if you study your ass off). If your plan is to go for an MBA and you want to get into a top school, keep in mind that the top schools expect you to work for 2-4 years between undergrad and your grad degree.
Engineering or the sciences I think would make you stand out more than just a marketing degree. Depending on where you are, there are some free events coming up that might help you in your decision. First, CASS in the UK is hosting a free networking seminar -
http://www.businessbecause.com/mba-admissions/cass-offers-prospective-s…
And Nyenrode is flying potential students out to the Netherlands to experience what that school has to offer -
http://www.businessbecause.com/business-school-news/fly-to-nyenrodes-in…
Either way, it would be a good way to experience MBA culture and get a feel for what is expected of you.
Help with choosing majors please! (Originally Posted: 07/19/2013)
Hey guys,
I'll be a rising sophomore at a target school. Long story short-GPA plummeted freshmen year due to underestimating what curves can do (and laziness)/taking random difficult(in terms of grading) classes to explore. I was and still am undecided but feel pressured to transfer/dual degree with our business school but my GPA is too low for that to be an option. Especially since I won't have the b-school branding, I want to best spin myself for a possible career in banking/consulting (before college I didn't even know about investment banking). I am very interested in energy research, agriculture and environmental management(waste/water) in general but I think I would like to work on the business/legal side rather than research. What would you suggest I major in in order to have an appealing pitch to recruiters? Venture capital seems best aligned with my interests but beggars can't be choosers so I'm willing to work in ANY industry that offers me the platform to achieve my goals(ibanking, hedge fund, PE, start-up, consulting, wealth management,research).I was contemplating two majors-perhaps one in Materials Science and Chemistry or Material Science , Legal Studies/Economics/Mathematical Economics (closest alternative to finance without transferring although honestly I'm not passionate about Econ), and Material Science with soft-non-quant major(ie. International Relations/Env Sci) and a minor in something quantitative.
If possible, would you guys be able to also suggest what I should be doing during the school year? I am debating between doing research and joining another club or rushing for a social sorority, business frat, or community service frat. Currently, I am on the board of 3 clubs and have a job as a loan officer at a local bank. I have the opportunity to take more leadership positions at the local bank next summer but perhaps interning at a firm would more beneficial? How do you recommend I find such an internship? Apply for major firms(where I probably will have slim chance given relative inexperience in finance) or cold-call/email small boutiques? Any other general advice on what resources to utilize, networking, classes to take, clubs to join would be also highly appreciated.
Thanks everyone for taking the time to read this! Any feedback is highly appreciated.
Well you're at a target school which is good.
Honestly, I'd major in what interests you. You can always double major/minor in a more relevant subject, but be sure to take relevant classes the next couple of years.
Utilize your alumni network well, and with luck, should be able to get a finance-related internship next summer. If that doesn't work, cold-calling/emailing boutiques is what I would do.
Finally, don't join a frat for the network; join one because you want to and like the people in it. Same goes for clubs. Good luck.
Finance, Econ, Business, Math, Stats, CS
Thanks Beny23, I think I'll probably choose econ as I have no background in CS, can't transfer to the B-school for Finance, and not THAT mathematically inclined. Will I learn sufficient modeling/excel skills with Econ major though? I have around 8-10 electives that I can do and I was hoping to take some of the B-school offerings-FNCE/OPIM/STAT/LGST/MGMT. Would FNCE courses be the most relevant and useful?
Need help choosing major please (Originally Posted: 04/05/2013)
I'm currently a junior at the University of Chicago. I've done enough courses in two majors to be able to graduate in one of them: Econ or Poli Sci. If I major in Econ, I'll have a 3.60 GPA for FT recruiting (fall of this year). If I major in Poli Sci, it'll be either a 3.64, or a 3.7 (rounded up from 3.66).
Which (Econ w/ average GPA, Poli Sci w/ good GPA) is better for finance recruiting?
As an additional note, I've taken courses in Financial Accounting and corporate finance. I'm in my college's investment club. Also, I'll be doing an investment banking internship in HK with BNP Paribas this summer, after being in equity research the previous one. Interested in working in either Asia or the US; does geography affect the answer to my above question?
One last one: with Econ, I'll graduate with a 3.45 GPA, and with Poli Sci a 3.65 - which would be better for business school 2+ years down the road?
econ but bump
bemp
Bump
One last bump....
Wow, that's a very good question. Sorry can't answer but posting here just to hear what others have to say.
Confused about why your overall GPA would be different. Do you mean your GPA in your major? Or, are you guessing about some future GPA?
Yup I'm predicting my future overall GPA. I'm near 100% confident of my predictions as to what my GPA will be at FT recruiting, and at graduation (I know that sounds unlikely, but please take my word for it!).
Major in Econ.
-
Help selecting major (Originally Posted: 01/24/2012)
Hey all, I'm kinda undecided with the undergrad major/degree that i should choose to apply for.
I'm pretty set on doing accounting as my first degree/major, however I'm undecided if I should do Economics/Finance/Quantitative Finance. I am eligible for the double degree programme in the school of my interest.
One of my concerns is that finance would not provide me with enough quantitative coursework should I choose to pursue a masters in finance. Econs is not in the business school and I would have to do a double degree, and I'm not sure if it will be useful in the future.
Given that I'm coming from a semi-target/non-target at best, which second major/degree would provide me with the best opportunities?
Do Finance/Quantitative Finance. It's really hard to give solid advice without knowing which school you're going to, but all else being equal, do Finance. Also, don't putz around with a dual degree. If getting into IB/PE etc is your dream, focus on one thing and kill it.
When recruiters are looking at your resume, they aren't going to care about your Finance/Polynesian History double major. They're going to care about your GPA. So focus your energy in one place and post a high number.
Also, since you're at a "semi/non-target", start networking like crazy. I go to a top 10 bschool and only about 25% of the people recruiting for IB got offers. It's a bitch out there.
Thanks for the advice. Will definitely start networking soon, hopefully when i graduate the job climate won't be so bad.
Anytime. I am almost 100% certain that it will be very different for you by the time you graduate. However, if you hustle it'll just be that much easier.
Different for him good or different for him bad? LOL
Which degree is best for what I want? (Originally Posted: 05/13/2011)
I am currently a liberal arts student (history/econ) at a non-target school. I want to go into consulting eventually, but with my average undergrad (GPA will be around 3.4 when I graduate, sad I know) what are my chances at breaking into this field? I have considered a few grad option such as management masters like UF, Wake Forest, Duke, and UVA, but I am afraid my average undegrad record will haunt me forever in the job search.
Another route I have looked at in an MACc/MPA/MSA (whatever the correct title is) and trying to break into TAS, since banking also interests me. But, ultimately, I want to get into management consulting. I looked at MSF degrees as well, but most of those seemed a bit narrow and would keep me out of consulting.
Get some business experience and go for an MBA at a top school
Would love to go that route, I guess as of now I just feel lost as what to do. Tuesday I am going to talk with my econ professor (who does consulting on the side) and see if he has any connections to the industry he could share with me.
Jon I feel ya man. Same boat I was/am in. Everyone says F500 job, then top MBA- but thats not all that easy because the 3.4 is going to naturally get you dinged at a few places. I actually have 1.5 years of experience in F500 Finc Services, and have decided to bolster my resume now with an MSF/MMS in order to supplement my resume and put less emphasis on my poor UG GPA.
MS MGMT is definately the better fit if you want to do consulting.
Bumping this with a few more questions. Can anyone comment on how selective Big 4 TAS/TS is? I've been looking into this and can't seem to find anything on how selective they are or where they recruit. Would a top MPA/MACc be enough to get looked at by them? I don't really have BB banking dreams, as my undergrad record will never be good enough for that, so I'm looking into this and then maybe moving a MM later.
Bump again...would highly appreciate any advice regarding grad school.
big 4 advisory is pretty selective. but doing a mpa/mac at a top program will get you in. I know for a fact UTAs MPA places well into top tier consulting/banking too.
What year are you? If i were you i would shoot for smaller consulting shops, f500, boutique IB or anything that will get you into a decent MBA. I would also apply for MSFs,MAC, and MPAs for a backup plan
I have thought about an MSF, but I don't think my math skills are up to par for that. I've also thought about UVA's MS in commerce program, as I can finish the few pre-req's by graduation and it has finance track. I have 1.5 years left until graduation, according to my degree audit. I plan on doing a lot of research on job possibilities this summer (only a few days left until then now!!) and studying for the GMAT. I also have thought about learning some financial modeling skills.
Does anyone have any thoughts on the quality of wallstreetprep's modeling training? WSO has links to it, and I was considering buying the basic package this summer.
Bump
Another bump..all helpful advice is appreciated!
Bumping this again instead of making another thread...
I want to know a bit more about Wake Forests MM program. It seems really expensive and doesn't focus very heavily on finance related material (at least from what I read on their page) I also have looked at University of Florida's management masters program and it seems interesting, as it allows 5-6 elective courses on top of core classes.
college sophomore having trouble deciding on a major/minor (Originally Posted: 03/22/2009)
Hi all,
I'm a sophomore at a target school, and I intend on pursuing consulting upon graduation.
Being a business major, I want to broaden my horizon (so to speak) with either a math major or a few more technical minors (like math and computer science).
Would having a business/financial math dual major look more attractive for consulting firms, or would business major and a few more minors look better (assuming 3.8+ GPA for both?)
Honestly I would much rather do the minors since math by itself is a bit too dry for me, but I also worry that firms don't hold minors in high regards at all...
Do what you're interested in, not what you think will look good.
Your major (unless it a wharton or not situation) will not matter. I would say do what ever you are interested in besides business for a minor. if its financial math great, otherwise do something else - they need a diverse group everywhere
Agreed. We do not have a business major, and I know multiple people from my school (Target top 20 private)who majored in fields as diverse as history, biochemistry, economics, civil engineering, English, and one kinesiology major, who are now working at top firms: History - D.E. Shaw & Co. Bioch - BP Econ - Deutsche Bank Civil Eng - Bain English (double in history(?) I think) - Goldman Sachs S&T Kinesiology - BCG
On the other hand, I know one triple major (Biochem, Math, Econ) with no people skills who tried to get an IB job and failed - probably due to no people skills. It's all about how you sell yourself at the interview. Don't pick your majors according to what looks good - interviewers see through that lack of sincerity pretty easily.
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