Dinged by GS / MS Career advice
Hi, WSO members!
The site has been of great help to me for the last 2 years and this is THE TIME when I especially need career advice. So, long story short: education is not my strong point (lack of focus, immaturity, party abuse), however I managed to get a great job every summer (chronological order, everything in a booming emerging market country):
- IBD in GS / MS, 3 months (last)
- PE with AUM of USD1.3 bn, 7 months
- Real Estate Investment Trust of a top-30 Asset Management company, 3 months
- IBD in CS / DB, 9 months
- Financial department of a top-30 commercial bank, 3 months
- Marketing department of #1 English newspaper, 2 months (first)*
After the final review in GS / MS I received perfect feedback, however the bank didn't give an offer to anybody after 3 months (initial arrangement), rather it said: "We would like you to work 2-3 months more as SA so that we can make a better decision", 1 guy got an offer after 6 months of internship. I couldn't stay more due to need to write a dissertation.
I got 2 calls from a staffer in October / November: "When will you come back? When is the dissertation deadline?" I wanted to win some time to find a job in UK and answered smth like: "Well, I don't know, no clear deadline set… But I'm looking forward to join you..." Finally, the staffer calls me and says: "We have talked one more time with the team, we don't see you as a full member of it."
So, I am free now, waiting for my dissertation results to come and seeking for a job. Anywhere but not in my Country. I want to go abroad! I want to work in IBD either in London or Hong Kong (dissertation: BRIC) and not to work in mediocre places. I prefer IBD (technology / financial sponsors groups), but will be ready to work in technology / internet equity research or anywhere else if given an offer =)
The issue here is that it's February now, I didn't apply anywhere, I will be able to come to London in late February. All the recruiting is done. All right, I will approach directly 200+ people from MS / GS, JPM, UBS, Lazard, CS, Citi, ML from London. Why 7 banks? Because I fear that other options will be a downgrade.
If I am not able to find a job in these 7 banks within a month, I will try to find a job in own Country. In my own country I want to work in the place where I worked this summer (IBD in GS / MS - best of the best in the Country). My parents have 2 friends, who directly know head of Country Office. One of them may do an IPO with the bank in the near future and he once told me: "I can approach head of Country Office with any your issue when needed, just ask". The guy doesn't know the whole story with being dinged by GS / MS.
My actions for the moment being:
- polish CV, edit cover letter
- construct a contact base
- use networking skills to get an interview with London banks
- get 100% sure with the technicals, brainteasers
- cold calls, direct approach.
Question 1: What are my chances of getting a job in London or Hong Kong now?
Question 2: Shall I even bother writing to PE funds in UK selling them a story of being super exceptional + PE experience + PE dissertation?
Question 3: I think I should try own Country options only after I fail to find a job in London or Hong Kong and not simultaneously to avoid a situation when a friend of parents' makes an effort and then I just say: Sorry, I don't need your help anymore. Am I right?
Question 4: Shall I be personal with the friend of parents' and basically tell him:"This is the situation, I want to work for them, persuade them to let me work as SA for 2-3 months more so that I prove that I am worth an analyst position"?
Question 5: What would be your actions if you were in my place?
If you want replies, shorten this.
ok, will just wait for a couple of days and then shorten if the question remains unanswered.
Alright, it's hard for me to follow, but it looks like you had a good chance with MS that you kind of blew somehow (can't imagine why you'd buy time to try to get something better than MS.) Onto your questions:
Q1: Depends on your network Q2: You can network with them and humbly point out that you feel you have related experience Q3: Umm...sure? Q4: You know your friend and his/her parents better than anybody on this site possibly could. Everybody is different. Know your audience. Maybe it's best to go through your friend, maybe it's best to be direct, maybe it's best to take them out to dinner...I have no idea, I don't what kind of community you live in, what kind of people they are, how close they are to you, etc. Pure judgement call on your part. Q5: I don't understand this question.
Onto the resume: Firstly, what's member of CFA? Are you a CFA charterholder? If not, change this because it seems deceptive. Lose fluent in English, I never like seeing that Formatting for the interests is screwed up Lose "references available upon request"
Looks pretty good, don't know what you're so worried about
x
Thanks, rebelcross! I wanted to work in London / New York / Hong Kong, not in XYZ.
Q5 is basically "What would you do if you were in my case?" Am I doing the right thing now? Shall I try something else?
Thanks for CV comments.
Well...that was certainly an eye full of information. Your action item list is on point. With all of your internship experience you definitely want a sharply polished resume and cover letter. Additionally, brushing up on the technicals and your interview skills, as well as getting your contacts in order and beginning to reach out is smart. In addition to all of that, you definitely want to have good answers to 2 questions: 1) why are you interested in leaving your "booming" country, and probably more importantly, 2) why didn't you get the return offer with all of your positive feedback - what went wrong - did they make any offers to SAs, etc
To your questions:
You should have a pretty good shot at getting a job in London (assuming your GPA isn't completely atrocious) given your experience and some networking/cold calling. That said, if you really want to get out of your country, you might need to broaden your firm search - target more BBs for example, and not just those that you feel are on par with your past IBD internship - there is a diff between SA and FT - if you want IB in London, go for BBs, don't just limit yourself to 5 or so firms - if you get multiple interviews and offers, great, pick the best - but the longer you delay,the less opportunity you'll find.
Why not - cold calling/emailing is fine - worst case scenario, they pass on you - cast a wide net.
I would apply at the same time - again - time is quickly turning against you for quality FT opportunities - that said, I would NOT call on your close contacts (parents' big time friends) unless you need them - meaning you've found no luck in UK/HK - since they could probably open a few more doors and you don't want to play that card unless you need to.
That is your choice - if you are going for FT, then see what they can do on that end. If, however, you think you'll have more luck continuing the SA position and then hopefully earning a FT role do that - keep in mind, however, that if you go back to SA, you might be in the exact same boat in 3 months and this time, with far fewer FT opportunities available in both London/HK and your country.
Specifically regarding your resume - while the format is pretty solid, the content definitely needs some work. All of your internships sound pretty similar and non are selling your candidacy terribly well. You've got GS/MS IBD but nothing of quality - no strong analytical work, modeling, documentation drafting, impact on live deals, etc - you need to punch up your experiences for sure - more powerful action verbs, showing how you achieved your projects and what the team used them for, etc.
PM me if you have additional questions and good luck.
2 BankonBanking Thank you so much!
2 Omoba De Jonz O Your reply was of great help, however, I thought I could get somewhat more precise information concerning current hiring environment in London or Hong Kong. (Or do you think I should simply ask for this particular issue in a new forum topic?)
Lots of info, try to shorten this up. The CFA on your resume is confusing, what CFA? Are you a chartholder?
You have a decent shot at getting a job elsewhere. Stay connected with these folks and continue to network!
2 Ben Shalom Bernanke Thanks! No, just was a member of the CFA society, those who organized classes for the Uni for the CFA preparation.
Wow! Looks like my Nouveau Richie account has finally arrived!
From my PM box:
Anyone else get this?
Don't flatter yourself...at least 6 other people got that (those were just the ones on the PM I got)
Sounds to me like if 6 other people were on your PM, then happypantsmcgee didn't even receive an individualized message!
haha, It's clear that OP looked up the user league tables and performed some naner valuation to decide where to put his focus!
;)
I got it too. OP is a jackass. "Woe is me, I didn't get a FT offer at one of the top 2 banks in the world...but at the same time, I'm not casting a wide net because I'd rather not have a job than 'downgrade' to a lesser bank. Oh, and I forgot to mention that the regional/country head of MS/GS can get me a job."
Anyways, if I read this correctly, why does he need our urgent help? He should just keep applying for jobs. Whatever the "situation" in London is, doesn't mean he shouldn't apply there. What's the worst that can happen? He gets dinged and doesn't have a job? He already doesn't have a job.
It's amazing how little common sense some people on this board have, and yet they've managed to get into some of the most exclusive universities and jobs in the world.
Here's my advice: you're a moron. The guys were literally asking you to work for them and you told them you needed to leave to do a dissertation "with no clear deadline set." And now you tell me you need to focus on brainteasers? How's this for a brainteaser, why did you not seize the opportunity when you had a chance? Just so you know, if I'm interviewing you, and I am aware of this background, there's literally no way I would vote to hire.
This.
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