How are military personnel viewed for MBA programs?
I am a sophomore in college (non-target but still good school), and although I have an IB internship under my belt and two internships set up for this summer (Foreign AM, healthcare startup) I am planning in case if I can't get a FT offer (plus a part of me doesn't want a full time offer because.....)
With that said, would say graduating with a 3.3/3.4 GPA from a solid non-target, going into the military, then shooting for a top MBA be looked highly upon?
Not to mention it would be paid for and also lets be real guys....military guys get hotter girls ;)
MBA’s and the military
There are a good amount of veterans on wall street. Most of them got there through making a transition with anMBA. There are integration programs at top banks and they are usually looked upon favorably.
You can highlight leadership skills your decision-making abilities and any other valuable skills learned in the military. It is the ultimate brotherhood so reaching out to other veterans who have gone through the same process should be a priority.
from certified user @FormerHornetDriver"
A good gmat score, combined with military experience will serve you well. Write good essays and do well in your interviews and you will be okay.
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this type of post... again???
great help brah, thanks repped
wouldhusband/10
PJ? Are you enlisting?
It's possible, but you need a high GMAT (>720). Also check: http://poetsandquants.com/2012/03/16/can-you-get-into-a-great-b-school/
[quote=Aarron]It's possible, but you need a high GMAT (>720). Also check: http://poetsandquants.com/2012/03/16/can-you-get-into-a-great-b-school/…]
touche, and to the guy above ^ depends on what I want to do, but if going officer then I would prob go air force
Let me first to say thanks for considering to serve.
There are a lot of wall st vets on the Street, including quite a few on WSO. It definitely is very doable and I personally know a few that went on this path.
I'll save you the trouble.
If you have always wanted to be a SEAL, you can try the SEAL Challenge Contract. Not sure why you're looking into Army or AF.
If pursuing Rangers or Green Berets, Option 40 and 18X is what you're looking for. Under these options you would be enlisted. You could forget about becoming a SEAL/SF Officer at this point.
With that said, if you're looking ahead towards an MBA, career, girls, a good time...YOU WILL NOT MAKE IT THROUGH TRAINING!
Good luck.
Nobody is going to look down on you for military service, it is a well respected use of one's time. I would say that mixed with a good GMAT score you could probably land yourself in a good MBA. You'll definitely have some stories to tell during interviews.
If you are worried about how awesome you are going to look and get hot girls because of your service, then you should just be a SEAL.
If you get an Option 40 contract with this attitude and try to be a Ranger, you will get crushed and quit. Life in the Regiment as a private is absolutely brutal and life as a Ranger is a grind. If you don't have the right motivation, you will not make it.
/s
I think it's fair enough to say that you won't make it through any of those processes without the right motivation.
Can no one take a joke? I was kidding
Gotcha.
You would be amazed at how many people on here talk about trying to be a super secret squirrel to hopefully land an IB job one day and slay hot bitches throughout the process.
Anyway, if it is what you really want to do then go for it; I just always tell everyone who is interested how terrible it is so that they know what they are getting themselves into and making sure they have good motivation.
There is more to being in a unit than passing a selection course. Obviously BUDs is extremely difficult -- SEALs and Rangers just have very different lifestyles, rotation and training schedules, levels of discipline, etc... Overall, SEALs have a better lifestyle.
Life as a Ranger private is just a continuous nut crusher, that is all. I have never seen someone succeed (not just passing the selection, but staying in the unit) who was only interested in picking up chicks or having good "exit opps", because in my opinion, it is just not worth it.
Rangers, SEALs, SEAL Team 6. We have heard it all. What about the Delta Force? Do they even exist?
I would think military experiences is a plus. But hey, who am I kidding. Who needs a meathead in a cubicle?
Don't join the military for any reason other than to serve. Period. Fuck. I say this shit every fucking week.
calm down bro...I do want to serve, it is on my head (well always has been). Just debating it now. My brother who went to a top business school (Wharton) is entering the CIA so he is nudging me to do it as well.
Not anymore...
Take a job you are going to be passionate about doing well in. If that is in the military, then go there and have impact. If it's at a non-profit, then it's there. What adcoms look at is what you have done with your time and what you brought to the table. Why you above the other military, etc. Adcoms do not care about how "cool" your military job was, they care about how you used your time. You could go work at an Easter Egg factory and if you make significant impacts, the adcoms will appreciate that. Do what you want to do.
As a side note: the military can be a young man's game so do it now or move on without regrets.
^^^What about people who are desperate not to go back to their 3rd world countries. I personally know people who have enlisted to get U.S. Citizenship. One of them is in Afg right now. Totally worth it I would say. I would do anything to get U.S. Citizenship.
Enlisted military experience and business school (Originally Posted: 09/16/2011)
What's the perception of former enlisted guys among business schools? I tend to think they generally don't know the difference between officer and enlisted. If I highlight the leadership skills I picked up, is it possible I'd be in the same position as a former officer? Seems to me like it could go either way: 1) not an officer, 2) even rarer...
I have plenty of great things to fill an essay with in any case based on my time. I served on a submarine and took part in the initial salvo in Iraq.
I haven't taken the GMAT so I can't give that data point but I graduated from a target after completing my enlistment and work at a BB in New York. I also have a genuine interest in alternative energy financing that spans college, work and volunteering.
In very short, yes they know the difference between officer and enlisted.
They know the difference. But you graduated from a target and work at a BB - that's what is going to get you into b-school. It's not as if you are currently enlisted and trying to get into b-school. Military experience can generally only help your cause given the experience and skills gained.
Your brother going to work for the CIA is irrelevant. Do what you want but do it for the right reasons.
Military Applicant to B-School (Originally Posted: 08/17/2012)
Ladies and Gents,
Hello. I'm an Infantry Officer in the Army, and wanted to get a gauge of where I should be applying to b-school. I'd really like to end up in management consulting with a big firm, location immateriel. Here's a little about myself:
-BA in Political Science from the University of San Diego (3.2 GPA)
-Army: 1. Infantry Platoon Leader in charge of 40 personnel in Iraq (2 years); Bronze Star for service. 2. Infantry Company Executive Officer (1 year): Ran the daily operations of a 130 man infantry company, supervising training, logistics, maintenance, etc. Planned training. 3. Operations Officer (1 year): Responsible for synchronizing and planning near term activities for a 2800 Soldier Regiment, which serves as the Opposing Force for 10 Brigade Combat Teams, annually, preparing for combat deployments. 4. Horse Detachment Commander (1 year): Interacted with higher level commands and the public to provide horses, mules, and goats for training exercises as well as ceremonial roles during parades, public events and demonstrations.
I haven't taken the GMAT yet; in your response, could you please indicate what gmat score I'd have to receive to get into the given schools. Thanks for any answers!
Lewis
Well it is more along the lines of "maybe working for the government isn't so bad after all"
You're hostil e tonight - strong negative correlation between username and attitude
Need GMAT to give accurate advice.
It's going to be tough. I recently interviewed someone for Wharton who... I kid you not... was a Lt Commander. Had been a seal. Just recently he was in charge of a squadron, administratively, of something.
He got into Wharton.
Although I respect your service, is there anything you did in your experiences which really mark you out as unique? I mean, for example, having to arrange shit despite no resources around you? Things like that?
Brutally honest....
Your undergrad record is weak. Non-target, low GPA in a relatively easy major.
However, if you smoke the GMAT you will be competitive for a Top 15 school. A good gmat score, combined with your military experience will serve you well. Write good essays and do well in your interviews and you will be okay.
It would be a good idea to pay serious bucks for a GMAT review course......I'm talking about a few thousand bucks. Take it seriously, study hard, take many practice tests and you will be able to vault yourself into a competitive category.
Best of luck....
Hey bud, I'm in the same boat... thinking about business school, but fairly curious - how much does undergrad GPA matter? I'm working with a pretty strong GMAT, pretty long military career (for b-school, does age matter? I'm not exactly typical age probably), but a 3.28 GPA so wondering how much that will hurt me for top b-schools?
There is definitely an influx of high quality military professionals that are seeking MBAs; military service is looked upon favorably, but IMO is not as much as a novelty as it once was. That being said, in my experience exemplary military service and combat arms MOS seem to get more attention. But again, the shit only gets you so far... you may get a boost up from your service, but if you're lacking in other areas you're going to get nailed and knocked down some pegs.
For your S.A. I'm on the enlisted reserve side 03XX so take my comments w/ a grain of salt.
I'm looking at apply to B-School and I am looking at the online option (I know, please leave the unproductive responses for Facebook). I've been an officer in the Marine Corps for a little over 8 years, it'll be 9 come application time. I graduated from the University of Vermont with a BA in Economics, 2.82 GPA, a C- in Calculus (freshman year goofing off) and a C in Econometrics. All in all, not a very impressive undergrad resume. I've been a Supply and Logistics officer for 6 straight year, 2 combat tours (1 in Iraq and currently in Afghanistan) and one short deployment to Northern Norway, working with European forces and embarking/disembarking throughout the fjordes. I know I can get some good recommendations and I have 4 personal awards that can attest to my character. I haven't taken the GMAT yet and I'm worried that I won't break 600. I most likely see myself getting a 550. Since I have to apply for an online program (because I am going to stay in the Marine Corps until the 20 year mark), I'm looking at UNC, Indiana, Temple, UofF Hough, Syracuse Whitman, ASU, Northeastern, and Suffolk (safety).
My question is, should I even bother applying for an MBA at all with my current credentials, and if so, do I have a shot at UNC, Indiana, or Temple as my top 3? Do I even have a shot at the rest?
If you can't break a 600 w/ your GPA you've got a huge problem... even at Syracuse a serious non-target. The GMAT is very 'studyable' why don't you take some time and crack it to put yourself in a better position.
Well I've started studying now that I'm in Afghanistan, but I'm not very good at standardized tests. I have a good buddy of mine that studied his ass off and got a 550 and I'm pretty sure he is smarter than me. I'm going to study my ass off and even take a course when I get back to the states.
The question is, should I look at getting a Masters Degree in something just to get my GPA up? Being in the military, I have access to relatively inexpensive programs from state schools. I can get a Masters in International Relations from the University of Oklahoma for roughly $11k. I don't really have a desire for that degree and I would only do it to put up an impressive GPA. Would having a 3.9 during a masters program and above a 600 GMAT make it easier for me.
Is it even worth it to get an MBA if it's not from a Top 20? I know it means something for the world of finance, but I'm not really looking for finance, I'm more for Supply Chain Management/Logistics MBA or General MBA.
Military to Business School (Originally Posted: 04/08/2014)
Hello everyone, I've been following this site for a while, but never posted anything.
A little bit about myself: graduated from a US service academy with a BS in electrical engineering and been in the US Army for the past 5 years as an Armor Officer (general management in the armored forces, i.e. tanks). I will be starting a full time MBA in the Boston area this fall. I have also worked for a Chinese Energy SOE in Houston and interned at a Chinese PE firm based in Beijing. I plan to get into M&A and hopefully (or eventually) PE after B-school.
I am looking for any advice on how a military guy without any finance experience could get an internship and job offer in M&A or PE.
Working for the government != being in the military.
http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/gs-veterans-integration-program
Look for GS (Maybe MS has one also) veteran integration program
You'll cry on pick up day
Leaving the Army for B-school (Originally Posted: 06/25/2010)
Hey guys, I have been studying for the GMAT in my free time for some time now. I am deployed in Afghanistan, but am coming back stateside in a few months. I am pretty worried about the GMAT because I have my heart set on a top 10 school. From those with more knowledge than I, what gmat score will I be needing for a top 10 b-school with the following credentials...
3.7 GPA - Finance - W.P. Carey school of Business @ Arizona State 4 years as an Army officer (1LT currently) in the armored division.
I went in to the Army right after undergrad, so I have no professional experience. Thanks for your insight guys.
Ideally 700+
Please study hard and good luck.
I hope you meant that you will have completed 4 years of service when you ETS and not that you are still a 1LT after 4 years.
Agree with above - 700+
yeah how did you only make 1LT after 4 years? you should be an XO or on battalion staff as a captain by now
The Army has been delaying promotions for some junior officers. Typically army guys are supposed to make captain after 3.5 years. Air force, navy, USMC, its 4 years.
but they are short on mid level officers and everyone i know has been promoted on time, thats strange
I'm going to Navy OCS early in 2011 and hoping to do the same thing that you are doing. From everything I have read the top b-schools LOVE officers, but many of them are somewhat short on the academics side. I would say with your gpa you would need a 690ish to get into a top school. I think with a 700 you could lock in a spot at a top 5 (assuming the rest of your application is solid).
Good luck and thanks for serving our country.
Also, the service commitment for the Army is 3 years, it is 4 for Naval officers. I am not 100 percent about the other branches.
Military Experience Question Re: Business Schools (Originally Posted: 11/19/2009)
Hello all,
I am a frequent reader of these forums, but an infrequent poster. I have a question regarding the evaluation of my future business school application. I am entering the United States Marine Corp as an officer next year, with the intention of eventually applying for business school once my active duty commitment is up.
I am joining the Marines because I want to do something to serve my country while I am still young and able bodied. However, I do feel that business school is something that I want to do sometime in the future.
My question then, is if 4 years as a commissioned officer as my only fulltime post-bachelorette work experience will be sufficient for serious consideration at a top 10 program.
I will graduate next month with a 3.42 GPA from a non-target undergraduate university with a degree in political science. I have taken the GMAT and earned a score of 700. I have no relevant finance or consulting work experience, and have a very average resume, having worked in various roles in numerous office jobs in my undergraduate career, earning promotions, but not in any field that would raise any eyebrows.
I have heard that business schools look favorably upon military applicants, but I am unsure if 4 years in a leadership position in the Marines is sufficient by itself.
Any help would be appreciated.
Thank you in advance.
Also, military guys do not get hotter girls. Google Frog Hogs and you'll see what I mean.
it mostly depends on what you do during your 4 years and how you present it. the important thing is to be able to display the qualities of a leader, getting things started, getting them done, inspiring others, displays of moral integrity and the such. the world is your oyster. 700 gmat is decent (won't be a detriment i think) and your average gpa could be easily outshone by achievements during the coming 4 years. consulting and finance skills are easy to learn. what they look for is the basis for a successful business man. they want to see a fully developed personality, mature, intelligent, thoughtful, driven, high-achiever. you have 4 years to build up your resume. shouldn't be too difficult.
If you can get a 700 on the first try you might want to consider taking it again. A 700 is a checkbox, but if you can get 750+ it really helps. I went from 480 to 720, so its definately possible to improve. If you want to talk offline, PM me. I'm military applying from Iraq to top programs and learned a lot from the app process.
Top MBA programs do look favorably on military experience, but as dagro said, it really depends on what you do during your years in the military. It's a great opportunity to showcase a number of the traits they look for in people who have the potential to be great business leaders -- performance under pressure, leadership, management, teamwork, tenacity, initiative, etc. You will want to shape your military experience and application essays to highlight those.
You're wise to start thinking about this now. You have plenty of time to build a compelling case for MBA applications. BTW, my advice is not to re-take the GMAT. 700 is good enough that it's not an issue. If you're confidant you can do 40+ points better, by all means re-take it, but not worth it otherwise.
Here are a few different perspectives to think about, one from someone who runs a high profile program preparing people for MBA applications, and another from an MBA student.
Your Roadmap to a Successful MBA Application - http://bit.ly/UNlts
5 MBA Admissions Tips - http://bit.ly/ft78t
the fact that you are female will also help your chances
Um, I'm not female, but thanks for the advice.
i wonder where that came from..
First, thank you all for the guidance and advice you have given me so far. It is very much appreciated.
I have a related question that I felt unnecessary to create another thread for.
How is military experience viewed by European business schools? If I were interested in applying to Warwick, HEC, LBS, INSEAD, LSE, or others, would they care that I was in the American military? Could it possibly even hurt me, considering how some countries (such as France) view the ongoing conflicts?
As always, thank you in advance for your help.
Work Experience in the Army (Originally Posted: 02/20/2010)
I graduated in 2008 from Wheaton College (IL) with a 3.4 GPA. I am anticipating taking the GMAT in spring 2011 to apply for Business School in Fall 2012. I have heard from many places, here included, that work experience is highly encouraged before applying to Business School. Since graduating college, I have been serving on active duty in the United States Army as a commissioned officer. As a Cavalry officer, I do not have any direct financial work experience, but leadership is something that is certainly not in short supply in my job.
Sorry for the long-windedness, I guess my basic question comes down to this: will I be behind the curve of my peers applying to Business School who have experience working for accounting firms, banks, etc? I am sure the military is looked favorably upon for the most part, but I want to size up my position compared to other applicants. Thanks!
Military experience is looked upon very favorably.
Your W/E isn't the weak point. Its the fact your undergrad college isn't really that known. I am not trying to knock you--I am a military guy with my own application shortcomings, but trust me--you need to kill the GMAT and really have a solid story for your application essays. You work experience as a military officer is solid.
By the way, you are only compared to other military guys. They don't compare bankers to soldiers. They compare the west point grad with a 3.8 GPA, 770 GMAT, and a bronze star for leading 50 men in a combat zone to the Air Force Academy grad with a 2.9 GPA and 720 GMAT with engineering research experience. And the West Pointer will win that battle every time.
Thanks Gordon, that is valuable information. I did not realize I was compared to other military applicants only, and I suppose that makes the most sense. Appreciate it!
ebonn 101,
I'm an ex-Army officer. My best friends from the Army also got into top schools (HBS and Columbia). The best thing that you have going for you is you should kill the b-school essays about leadership experience. Combat experience goes a long way. Also, banks love military guys. You'll do fine man.
Xango
I am prior military and I just killed the application process (went 3 for 5 and got in everywhere I actually wanted to go). My advice is to reach out the vets on campus and ask them to look at your stuff. Most guys were pretty helpful to me. Best of luck.
Great news man. Always good to hear about guys succeeding after the military. From what I've seen (and heard) so far, the military guys really look out for their own.
Finance or Military out of college? (Originally Posted: 09/05/2013)
Currently a sophomore at an ivy, participating in the army rotc program. Until the recent post about military vets being desired by recruiters, I intended to go reserves and pursue investment banking. However, now I am considering pursuing full time after commission. Due to the time constraints as a student, I feel that focusing my attention and extracurriculars on either finance or military would be more beneficial. Here are my questions:
-To what degree are military credentials important (schools, rank, ext.) To MBA applications.
Rank doesn't matter, as you'll get to O-3 and stay there. Takes much longer to get O-4. Long enough that you might as well make it a career.
With that said, don't join the military for the exit ops.
What are your reasons for wanting to join the military?
I was in a similar position when I was in college and I opted for the Marines. Two years in so far.
By the sound of it, I think his interest in the military is a distant MBA application.
I have been active in the military community for 3 years. 2 in highschool participating in junior programs and 1 in college with rotc. I sincerely enjoy the work, but am unsure wether I would enjoy it more or less than working in finance. While I know that I do not want to be career military, I am debating the benefits of a 4 year active stint vs. The full 8 years in reserves. I am not considering the decision solely based on exist ops, but I isolated that part of the discussion for this conversation.
Participating in Army ROTC as in just taking the class? Or are you going to PT, FTX, and lead lab as well? I would get on scholarship and do the 4 years active. Bear in mind, the ability to go active has become very competitive and most are being forced into the reserves out of ROTC.
The issue with going into the military is the limited control over what you actually do. You could get stuck doing something you don't like, get assigned to a sub-par unit (they vary more than most people think), etc. You may not get the experience you were hoping for. Then guess what? You can't quit.
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