Neither of the two groups have much that can apply directly to a PE experience. ECM, pack you bags and goto a HF, you (most likely) have no debt modelling, LBO modelling, nor M&A deal experience. That pretty much makes you dead in the water unless you have some sort of other in into PE. DCM, if you have done debt modelling and some sort of deal experience you can probably leverage that into something, but it is difficult.
If PE is truly your goal and you are already in ECM/DCM, spend a year or so in an industry group that does lots of M&A and LBO type work.
BB ECM to PE - Any value add? (Originally Posted: 03/01/2014)
I'm wondering if anyone on here has any experience with people making a move from an ECM group into PE after a couple years as an analyst?
Obviously the most traditional route is some sort of coverage or M&A or LevFin group where the analyst can talk about deals they have sold to a financial sponsor and can crank out a quick and dirty LBO in 15 minutes, but have any of you heard of PE firms hiring analysts out of top ECM groups? Clearly PE firms are always thinking about exits as well as opportunities, and taking a portfolio company public is an increasingly attractive option as the market hits all time highs. Will recruiters even give you the time of day and get your name in front of the right people?
My thought here is as long as you can make a fully functional 3-statement operating model (and have some experience with complicated revenue builds), then perhaps having some ECM experience could be a good way to separate yourself from the sea of applicants who all essentially look the same. Obviously you need to be able to pass the LBO modeling test, but again, not really that hard if you're prepping and frankly how many coverage analysts are making lbo models daily anyway? Could a PE associate with capital markets experience bring value to a PE team by having a better idea of how to position a company for an IPO exit?
Love to hear the opinion of some people who are actually in the PE world. Thanks.
Unfortunately this is probably not the answer you were hoping for, but no there is limited appeal for this and here is why.
The perception would be that your differentiated background adds limited value. First, there is not as much need for this as I think you are assuming, with the exception of big mega funds, exits by going public are pretty rare in practice for PE funds (even if they are being used more, it's still a relatively rare event on a fund level). And those big PE funds that do this more frequently often have their own capital markets departments to help out (KKR Capital Markets, Blackstone Advisory etc., you could definitely move to this type of group). Then beyond how frequently a larger MM fund would need these services, the PE firm is going to hire a bank with a full ECM team to assist them through the process. Having someone who used to work in ECM markets at a junior level is not going to add much to this full team of ECM they have hired who are still involved in the market day to day.
Then there is the issue of what people will perceive you are missing from skill sets that are needed in PE (some of it perceived deficiencies and some actual ). You will be seen as missing the heavy modeling experience, which is not the ability to build a simple LBO model (that's a check the box thing to make sure they don't hire an idiot) but it's those detailed revenue builds, modeling in specific costs, doing fixed vs. variable analysis to help justify operating leverage, looking at different financing scenarios (debt vs. equity, convertible securities, MoE vs. straight buyouts etc.), which are things that just are not done in (most) ECM groups. Regardless of your actual experience, this is the perception you are fighting against. Then beyond that, you will be missing all the process experience that IBD analysts get. This includes experience with full scale diligence, credit agreements, negotiations of key points of stock purchase agreements or transition services agreements, understanding signs of when a process is weak and how to bid / negotiate accordingly, what information you can tell the other side vs. what is important to hold back etc. It's just a world of the M&A process that PE analysts have to deal with every day and often are given responsibility to handle on their own. So someone from ECM who has almost no experience in these areas would be concerning to lead parts of a process. Lev Fin analysts are a little deficient in this area as well, but they are around the whole process with sponsors so they have exposure to it at least.
The path to PE here if you're a top analyst in an ECM group is to request doing a third year in an IBD group and then recruit for PE with that on you resume. Again, not as easy as going from Lev Fin => IBD => PE, but still doable if you get in a good IBD group. All the bulge bracket banks look to keep top analysts inside their system as long as possible, so if you've performed well in ECM you should have no trouble moving to IBD if you raise your hand early and make your wishes known.
Equity Capital Markets consumers into PE (Originally Posted: 06/11/2007)
Hi folks,
Are the skills from ECM retail transferable into PE retail and consumers? Or do you need to do more M and A to have the skill set to be effective in PE? The reason is that I have an offer at a BB in ECM, but I'm not sure how PE oriented this would be.
ECM does IPO structuring which is one possible exit option for PE portfolio companies. So there is some overlap, but given the high comp. for those jobs it will be really hard. It's the "law" that the best guys go to IBD and then the best IBDers go to PE (accompanied by some top notch cunsulting colleagues from McK and alike). It's not about transferability of skills but the notion of ECM and the traditions in the industry.
Yeah don't see how ECM directly applies to the private equity industry. However, someone in a private placements group might be good for fundraising. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong.
yeah, that so seems like the boring part of PE - operationally it looks like it's only M and A or consultancy. M and A douches work way long hours and consultants don't make enough. Fucking hell.
I agree, the only transferable ECM experience is private placements and even then your exit ops are to go to a shop that does a lot of growth equity financings (Summit/TA) which means 3 years of cold calling to tack on to your 2 years of banking. Fun.
Enim eius ipsam inventore et. Quidem non reiciendis nisi recusandae sunt. Aut a itaque maiores dolorem aliquam autem fuga. Consequatur nisi vel asperiores ut. Quisquam quos non repellendus.
Omnis nihil vel tempora. Voluptatum reprehenderit deserunt tenetur quidem quis et. Laboriosam iure vel quam alias sit. Facilis molestias quae fugiat dolores. Quos quia illo dolor omnis.
Quidem a necessitatibus illo et repellat. Sed quasi in quia pariatur numquam aut. Excepturi et repellat et voluptate ut unde quisquam. Harum dolorem distinctio soluta rem. Mollitia temporibus provident nihil reprehenderit quae in.
Perferendis fuga reiciendis corrupti dolorum ut sint est quae. Reiciendis facilis maxime labore est sit id sed. Cum dolorum alias ipsa expedita.
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Neither of the two groups have much that can apply directly to a PE experience. ECM, pack you bags and goto a HF, you (most likely) have no debt modelling, LBO modelling, nor M&A deal experience. That pretty much makes you dead in the water unless you have some sort of other in into PE. DCM, if you have done debt modelling and some sort of deal experience you can probably leverage that into something, but it is difficult.
If PE is truly your goal and you are already in ECM/DCM, spend a year or so in an industry group that does lots of M&A and LBO type work.
BB ECM to PE - Any value add? (Originally Posted: 03/01/2014)
I'm wondering if anyone on here has any experience with people making a move from an ECM group into PE after a couple years as an analyst?
Obviously the most traditional route is some sort of coverage or M&A or LevFin group where the analyst can talk about deals they have sold to a financial sponsor and can crank out a quick and dirty LBO in 15 minutes, but have any of you heard of PE firms hiring analysts out of top ECM groups? Clearly PE firms are always thinking about exits as well as opportunities, and taking a portfolio company public is an increasingly attractive option as the market hits all time highs. Will recruiters even give you the time of day and get your name in front of the right people?
My thought here is as long as you can make a fully functional 3-statement operating model (and have some experience with complicated revenue builds), then perhaps having some ECM experience could be a good way to separate yourself from the sea of applicants who all essentially look the same. Obviously you need to be able to pass the LBO modeling test, but again, not really that hard if you're prepping and frankly how many coverage analysts are making lbo models daily anyway? Could a PE associate with capital markets experience bring value to a PE team by having a better idea of how to position a company for an IPO exit?
Love to hear the opinion of some people who are actually in the PE world. Thanks.
.
Unfortunately this is probably not the answer you were hoping for, but no there is limited appeal for this and here is why.
The perception would be that your differentiated background adds limited value. First, there is not as much need for this as I think you are assuming, with the exception of big mega funds, exits by going public are pretty rare in practice for PE funds (even if they are being used more, it's still a relatively rare event on a fund level). And those big PE funds that do this more frequently often have their own capital markets departments to help out (KKR Capital Markets, Blackstone Advisory etc., you could definitely move to this type of group). Then beyond how frequently a larger MM fund would need these services, the PE firm is going to hire a bank with a full ECM team to assist them through the process. Having someone who used to work in ECM markets at a junior level is not going to add much to this full team of ECM they have hired who are still involved in the market day to day.
Then there is the issue of what people will perceive you are missing from skill sets that are needed in PE (some of it perceived deficiencies and some actual ). You will be seen as missing the heavy modeling experience, which is not the ability to build a simple LBO model (that's a check the box thing to make sure they don't hire an idiot) but it's those detailed revenue builds, modeling in specific costs, doing fixed vs. variable analysis to help justify operating leverage, looking at different financing scenarios (debt vs. equity, convertible securities, MoE vs. straight buyouts etc.), which are things that just are not done in (most) ECM groups. Regardless of your actual experience, this is the perception you are fighting against. Then beyond that, you will be missing all the process experience that IBD analysts get. This includes experience with full scale diligence, credit agreements, negotiations of key points of stock purchase agreements or transition services agreements, understanding signs of when a process is weak and how to bid / negotiate accordingly, what information you can tell the other side vs. what is important to hold back etc. It's just a world of the M&A process that PE analysts have to deal with every day and often are given responsibility to handle on their own. So someone from ECM who has almost no experience in these areas would be concerning to lead parts of a process. Lev Fin analysts are a little deficient in this area as well, but they are around the whole process with sponsors so they have exposure to it at least.
The path to PE here if you're a top analyst in an ECM group is to request doing a third year in an IBD group and then recruit for PE with that on you resume. Again, not as easy as going from Lev Fin => IBD => PE, but still doable if you get in a good IBD group. All the bulge bracket banks look to keep top analysts inside their system as long as possible, so if you've performed well in ECM you should have no trouble moving to IBD if you raise your hand early and make your wishes known.
Equity Capital Markets consumers into PE (Originally Posted: 06/11/2007)
Hi folks,
Are the skills from ECM retail transferable into PE retail and consumers? Or do you need to do more M and A to have the skill set to be effective in PE? The reason is that I have an offer at a BB in ECM, but I'm not sure how PE oriented this would be.
ECM does IPO structuring which is one possible exit option for PE portfolio companies. So there is some overlap, but given the high comp. for those jobs it will be really hard. It's the "law" that the best guys go to IBD and then the best IBDers go to PE (accompanied by some top notch cunsulting colleagues from McK and alike). It's not about transferability of skills but the notion of ECM and the traditions in the industry.
Yeah don't see how ECM directly applies to the private equity industry. However, someone in a private placements group might be good for fundraising. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong.
yeah, that so seems like the boring part of PE - operationally it looks like it's only M and A or consultancy. M and A douches work way long hours and consultants don't make enough. Fucking hell.
I agree, the only transferable ECM experience is private placements and even then your exit ops are to go to a shop that does a lot of growth equity financings (Summit/TA) which means 3 years of cold calling to tack on to your 2 years of banking. Fun.
Enim eius ipsam inventore et. Quidem non reiciendis nisi recusandae sunt. Aut a itaque maiores dolorem aliquam autem fuga. Consequatur nisi vel asperiores ut. Quisquam quos non repellendus.
Omnis nihil vel tempora. Voluptatum reprehenderit deserunt tenetur quidem quis et. Laboriosam iure vel quam alias sit. Facilis molestias quae fugiat dolores. Quos quia illo dolor omnis.
Quidem a necessitatibus illo et repellat. Sed quasi in quia pariatur numquam aut. Excepturi et repellat et voluptate ut unde quisquam. Harum dolorem distinctio soluta rem. Mollitia temporibus provident nihil reprehenderit quae in.
Perferendis fuga reiciendis corrupti dolorum ut sint est quae. Reiciendis facilis maxime labore est sit id sed. Cum dolorum alias ipsa expedita.
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