Goldman Sachs Regional Offices

How strong are GS's regional offices? Specifically, these groups:

San Francisco - West coast advisory / TMT
Chicago - FIG / Industrials

In terms of exit opps, deal flow, etc.

Goldman Sachs San Francisco

GS TMT SF is stellar, and you can believe what you want but you ARE geographically constrained unless you intend on flying to NY for cocktails and breakfasts with each of the megafunds... in some cases with the same megafunds several times depending on how they recruit.

Goldman Sachs Chicago

The strongest groups for GS regional offices are pretty legit. Its more dependent on the group you go into. You'll do very well coming out of GS TMT west coast... or even GS FIG Chicago, but less so.

It has less to do with regional reputation and more to do with:

  • the opportunities you'll have available to you sitting in Chicago
  • the types of deals you'll be working on in a regional city

If you want to go buyside, its just going to be tougher getting on interviewer radars for NY shops when you're sitting in Chicago.

Recommended Reading

 
Best Response

Their Chicago shop is fine. Rahm Emmanuel used to work there and they've got a good relationship with Madison Dearborn.

That being said - the high touch old school coverage game being run out of shops like Chicago isn't how Goldman gets paid. Goldman gets paid by ripping off their clients in ways the clients don't even see coming. Goldman is well known for fucking their counterparties. It's just a fact. You hire Goldman because you know they can execute a given trade that nobody else can, but you're kind of making a deal with the devil. You know they'll take a pound of flesh from you from an angle you didn't contemplate.

So like... Realistically that attitude doesn't jibe well with the Chicago crowd. The guys you bank out of your Chicago office are generally old school hard asset or industrials or basic materials guys who like... Old school guys, not playing the rip and run like the tech faggots out in SF, in the game for life.

These are guys that might have goofy accents, but this isn't their first rodeo. They know when they're being fucked. Might not know exactly how you're doing it, but they know its happening, and they don't appreciate it.

Goldman isn't the best cultural fit in Chicago, a JP Morgan or Barclays or something works better. Plus when you're dealing with hard assets, which is common in Chicago, balance sheet matters, and Goldman doesn't exactly have the goods in that respect.

Goldman Chicago is well respected, but lets call a spade a spade - they don't have "friends" they have "counterparties." And everybody knows it.

 
peinvestor2012:

Probably right for S&T, but have you heard of issues w/the coverage groups re: advisory piece?

Know someone in the group and he loves it but another poster (maybe ADAE?) said the group was internally competitive and had issues culturally.

I think you would be better served relying on your personal friend's word instead of the secondary anecdote from a guy you can't remember on the internet.
 
NYCbandar:

Their Chicago shop is fine. Rahm Emmanuel used to work there and they've got a good relationship with Madison Dearborn.

That being said - the high touch old school coverage game being run out of shops like Chicago isn't how Goldman gets paid. Goldman gets paid by ripping off their clients in ways the clients don't even see coming. Goldman is well known for fucking their counterparties. It's just a fact. You hire Goldman because you know they can execute a given trade that nobody else can, but you're kind of making a deal with the devil. You know they'll take a pound of flesh from you from an angle you didn't contemplate.

So like... Realistically that attitude doesn't jibe well with the Chicago crowd. The guys you bank out of your Chicago office are generally old school hard asset or industrials or basic materials guys who like... Old school guys, not playing the rip and run like the tech faggots out in SF, in the game for life.

These are guys that might have goofy accents, but this isn't their first rodeo. They know when they're being fucked. Might not know exactly how you're doing it, but they know its happening, and they don't appreciate it.

Goldman isn't the best cultural fit in Chicago, a JP Morgan or Barclays or something works better. Plus when you're dealing with hard assets, which is common in Chicago, balance sheet matters, and Goldman doesn't exactly have the goods in that respect.

Goldman Chicago is well respected, but lets call a spade a spade - they don't have "friends" they have "counterparties." And everybody knows it.

 
LHDan:
NYCbandar:

Their Chicago shop is fine. Rahm Emmanuel used to work there and they've got a good relationship with Madison Dearborn.

That being said - the high touch old school coverage game being run out of shops like Chicago isn't how Goldman gets paid. Goldman gets paid by ripping off their clients in ways the clients don't even see coming. Goldman is well known for fucking their counterparties. It's just a fact. You hire Goldman because you know they can execute a given trade that nobody else can, but you're kind of making a deal with the devil. You know they'll take a pound of flesh from you from an angle you didn't contemplate.

So like... Realistically that attitude doesn't jibe well with the Chicago crowd. The guys you bank out of your Chicago office are generally old school hard asset or industrials or basic materials guys who like... Old school guys, not playing the rip and run like the tech faggots out in SF, in the game for life.

These are guys that might have goofy accents, but this isn't their first rodeo. They know when they're being fucked. Might not know exactly how you're doing it, but they know its happening, and they don't appreciate it.

Goldman isn't the best cultural fit in Chicago, a JP Morgan or Barclays or something works better. Plus when you're dealing with hard assets, which is common in Chicago, balance sheet matters, and Goldman doesn't exactly have the goods in that respect.

Goldman Chicago is well respected, but lets call a spade a spade - they don't have "friends" they have "counterparties." And everybody knows it.

Ha, I think this is meant as some sort of insult due to the fact that he like points downwards at the end which my guess is meant to imply some sort of disapproval. But I'm not exactly sure..

Yeah, I suppose it's just my opinion. Which is, you know, what he'd be looking for by asking people in an Internet forum. Otherwise he could just look up league table shit or like check their financial statements to compare income.

So yeah, let it be known to the people that I have either accepted or not accepted your insult as intended or not intended, and am impressed by your notable ability to maintain an aura of smug douchebaggery while contributing absolutely fucking nothing of value to a conversation.

Yes you are so much wiser and more intelligent than everyone else that you needn't soil yourself with such petty formalities as actually making an attempt to formulate any kind of response to the person's question, or even type a single word.

I thought that the professional experience I have had with Goldman, in Chicago, and with Goldman Chicago would at least make it acceptable for me to add my impression of those guys to the chorus of a bunch of fucking people saying "I'm interested in learning about GS Chicago."

But now I understand how wrong I was. I was blind before. Now I see. Yes - the last couple of years you've spent printing fucking pitchbooks and yipping at the ankles of guys like me, and not even that really! yipping around the ankles of guys who yip around the ankles of guys like me. Like a bunch of little miniature chihuahua dog things with stupid gelled hair does and gay little boat shoes begging for fucking crumbs has I'm sure made you a complete fucking expert on every single detail of the business GS is running out of Chicago, everything from options trading, commodities iBanking coverage... and not just that - how they are viewed by their counterparties.

I was so stupid before - there is no god but god, and you are his prophet. There is no word but god's word, and god's word is a five second YouTube clip from a 90's Jim Carey movie. There is no truth but the truth, and the truth is... whatever the fuck you personally think it is. I guess.

And the truth that you and only you hold in your mind, this... epic understanding of all that is, was and ever will be, is a force so powerful that if you were to share it with any of us feeble little mortals, our puny minds would surely explode into tiny little bite sized chunks, potentially causing messes in our apartments and thereby angering our various roommates. You are at once the keeper of truth and our guardian from it.

But then, in all your wisdom and compassion, you have shared with us the 5 second YouTube link that explains it all. What more is there to say? Everything we need to know is contained in this Jim Carey clip. It doesn't just say everything that needs to be said about Goldman Chicago, it explains it all. The totality of the human experience. In this YouTube clip I see it all - my sons, the sons of my sons, and their sons, stretching forward into eternity, and my fathers and their fathers... back into the deepest forgotten depths of human history. All of them, I see them born and living and growing old and dieing. I see it all - war, violence, passion, power, fear, hunger, death, love, grief, pain, ecstasy... It's everything.

I guess what I'm getting at is, go fuck yourself. Oh but wait, sorry I forgot - the "cool kids" who have decided they are the only ones with relevant experience aren't supposed to actually post words or speak to their experience or explain anything on WSO, they're just supposed to post stupid YouTube links like smug little turds. I am sorry for the major faux pas I've committed by speaking in words. Here is a YouTube video to make up for it.

Am I doing it right?

 
NYCbandar:
LHDan:
NYCbandar:

Their Chicago shop is fine. Rahm Emmanuel used to work there and they've got a good relationship with Madison Dearborn.

That being said - the high touch old school coverage game being run out of shops like Chicago isn't how Goldman gets paid. Goldman gets paid by ripping off their clients in ways the clients don't even see coming. Goldman is well known for fucking their counterparties. It's just a fact. You hire Goldman because you know they can execute a given trade that nobody else can, but you're kind of making a deal with the devil. You know they'll take a pound of flesh from you from an angle you didn't contemplate.

So like... Realistically that attitude doesn't jibe well with the Chicago crowd. The guys you bank out of your Chicago office are generally old school hard asset or industrials or basic materials guys who like... Old school guys, not playing the rip and run like the tech faggots out in SF, in the game for life.

These are guys that might have goofy accents, but this isn't their first rodeo. They know when they're being fucked. Might not know exactly how you're doing it, but they know its happening, and they don't appreciate it.

Goldman isn't the best cultural fit in Chicago, a JP Morgan or Barclays or something works better. Plus when you're dealing with hard assets, which is common in Chicago, balance sheet matters, and Goldman doesn't exactly have the goods in that respect.

Goldman Chicago is well respected, but lets call a spade a spade - they don't have "friends" they have "counterparties." And everybody knows it.

Ha, I think this is meant as some sort of insult due to the fact that he like points downwards at the end which my guess is meant to imply some sort of disapproval. But I'm not exactly sure..

Yeah, I suppose it's just my opinion. Which is, you know, what he'd be looking for by asking people in an Internet forum. Otherwise he could just look up league table shit or like check their financial statements to compare income.

So yeah, let it be known to the people that I have either accepted or not accepted your insult as intended or not intended, and am impressed by your notable ability to maintain an aura of smug douchebaggery while contributing absolutely fucking nothing of value to a conversation.

Yes you are so much wiser and more intelligent than everyone else that you needn't soil yourself with such petty formalities as actually making an attempt to formulate any kind of response to the person's question, or even type a single word.

I thought that the professional experience I have had with Goldman, in Chicago, and with Goldman Chicago would at least make it acceptable for me to add my impression of those guys to the chorus of a bunch of fucking people saying "I'm interested in learning about GS Chicago."

But now I understand how wrong I was. I was blind before. Now I see. Yes - the last couple of years you've spent printing fucking pitchbooks and yipping at the ankles of guys like me, and not even that really! yipping around the ankles of guys who yip around the ankles of guys like me. Like a bunch of little miniature chihuahua dog things with stupid gelled hair does and gay little boat shoes begging for fucking crumbs has I'm sure made you a complete fucking expert on every single detail of the business GS is running out of Chicago, everything from options trading, commodities iBanking coverage... and not just that - how they are viewed by their counterparties.

I was so stupid before - there is no god but god, and you are his prophet. There is no word but god's word, and god's word is a five second YouTube clip from a 90's Jim Carey movie. There is no truth but the truth, and the truth is... whatever the fuck you personally think it is. I guess.

And the truth that you and only you hold in your mind, this... epic understanding of all that is, was and ever will be, is a force so powerful that if you were to share it with any of us feeble little mortals, our puny minds would surely explode into tiny little bite sized chunks, potentially causing messes in our apartments and thereby angering our various roommates. You are at once the keeper of truth and our guardian from it.

But then, in all your wisdom and compassion, you have shared with us the 5 second YouTube link that explains it all. What more is there to say? Everything we need to know is contained in this Jim Carey clip. It doesn't just say everything that needs to be said about Goldman Chicago, it explains it all. The totality of the human experience. In this YouTube clip I see it all - my sons, the sons of my sons, and their sons, stretching forward into eternity, and my fathers and their fathers... back into the deepest forgotten depths of human history. All of them, I see them born and living and growing old and dieing. I see it all - war, violence, passion, power, fear, hunger, death, love, grief, pain, ecstasy... It's everything.

I guess what I'm getting at is, go fuck yourself. Oh but wait, sorry I forgot - the "cool kids" who have decided they are the only ones with relevant experience aren't supposed to actually post words or speak to their experience or explain anything on WSO, they're just supposed to post stupid YouTube links like smug little turds. I am sorry for the major faux pas I've committed by speaking in words. Here is a YouTube video to make up for it.

Am I doing it right?

For the love of god... Please shorten your insult. I don't care to read this much.
 

I honestly have no idea what this clown is talking about. Ripping clients' faces off is so 2007. It is also completely irrelevant for investment banking.

The products/services investment bankers offer are pretty market... M&A fees are generally not big enough to rip anyone's face off... maybe a light scratch from grazing a fingernail across the back of their hand in passing. M&A fees are also probably one of the more earned fees on Wall Street.

Equities are perhaps one of the most commoditized capital markets product on Wall Street... and its largely used as a chip to repay favors. Thats why every $150 million IPO has 2 lead bookrunners and 11 co-managers splitting fees. DCM/LevFin is a very transparent market. You're not going to be doing much business if you're placing bonds that trade at 110 on day 1. Financing deals/fees are also very market, and what makes them profitable is scale. You make money by doing a leading 20% of a 4bn financing and charging 200 bps not by doing a $400m offering and charging 800bps; it just doesn't happen.

Banking is a business that runs on relationships. You keep seeing the LBO financing for the same company going to the same bank over and over because that bank happens to know every investor pocket that currently holds that paper, and their credit committee knows the business cold and the diligence/approval process will be a non-issue. It allows the bank to be more aggressive and get better execution on the deal. Companies keep hiring the same bankers for M&A because they "get it" in the opinion of the CEO/CFO/Biz Dev guy.

Where is there an opportunity to make a boat load of money in investment banking? The answer is not really anywhere. Its a very competitive business. The place where you can really make money is with the more exotic/opaque/less transparent stuff, which is usually invested in/bought by more sophisticated capital market partipants... like hedge funds. GS was able to rip people's face off (even back in the boom days) by again --- cranking volume -- and marketing more bespoke/exotic instruments (i.e., a CDO where Paulson specifies EXACTLY which MBS he wants in which tranche)... and the Paulson's of the world (i.e., the Banking Clients) were NOT the ones getting their faces ripped off. It was the investors, who themselves were sophisticated market participants.

The first half of this post was to discredit whatever the hell that guy thats been reading too much Matt Taibbi and Liar's Poker was talking about. It has nothing to do with banking.

GS regional offices are pretty legit. Its more dependent on the group you go into. You'll do very well coming out of GS TMT west coast... or even GS FIG Chicago, but less so.

It has less to do with regional reputation and more to do with: a. the opportunities you'll have available to you sitting in Chicago b. the types of deals you'll be working on in a regional city

If you want to go buyside, its just going to be tougher getting on interviewer radars for NY shops when you're sitting in Chicago. There are already 3 dozen GS FIG analysts in NY, why include a 37th from Chicago in the process unless theree is something stellar about them. That being said GS TMT, GS FIG are enough to get you solid traction no matter what office you're based out of. You could do a lot worse.

 

Agree with most of the post. But the part about GS NY offices getting far more looks from headhunters than certain regional offices is a bit ridiculous. GS TMT SF is easily one of the best opportunities on the Street. They will probably get more interviews with all the top MFs (regardless of geography) than most groups at Goldman NY and almost every group at MS NY except M&A.

 
Marcus_Halberstram:
That being said GS TMT, GS FIG are enough to get you solid traction no matter what office you're based out of. You could do a lot worse.

Was I unclear?

You'll get more looks at the same group but based out of NY.

I don't think MS M&A was ever brought up.

GS FIG and GS TMT out of NY you'll be at every single megafund, you'll get more looks than any other group on Wall Street / any other office. Period.

GS TMT SF is stellar, and you can believe what you want but you ARE geographically constrained unless you intend on flying to NY for cocktails and breakfasts with each of the megafunds... in some cases with the same megafunds several times depending on how they recruit.

Admittedly its been a few years since I was making the recruiting rounds, but even a few years ago recruiting was shifting to a very group and region specific process. From what I understand that has continued to be the trend.

 

Marcus_Halberstram, do you have any info about exit opps and deal flow for the GS SF non-TMT group (generalist west region advisory)? They work on cleantech, healthcare, consumer/retail, natural resources, etc

Would it be hard to get PE and MF interviews out of this group?

 
silverfish:

Marcus_Halberstram, do you have any info about exit opps and deal flow for the GS SF non-TMT group (generalist west region advisory)? They work on cleantech, healthcare, consumer/retail, natural resources, etc

Would it be hard to get PE and MF interviews out of this group?

Sorry, don't have much intel into that.

But I'm sure some of the dip shits posting above would be more than happy to make some random shit up for you.

 

I think GS TMT or FIG is generally viewed as a strong pedigree factor, which when everyone (and I mean everyone) is from a top school and top bank, every extra ounce of pedigree helps.

That being said, you'll have to do a little bit more work on your end vs. your GS FIG NY counterparts, not much but some. Maybe reach out to any headhunters that you haven't heard of from for some reason, make sure everyone knows you're committed to NY, have a compelling story why you went to Chicago in the first place etc.

I interviewed for an opportunity an Boston and one in SF, in both cases in the final round a major consider is do you have any ties to the area,,, you're living in NY right now, why are you ok moving to SF/Boston? These offices often times recruit out of their regional markets for that exact reason. And I'm speculating here, but I would assume the same (reverse) logic applies to your situation. You're living in Chicago (whereas NY is the center of banking/PE), its clearly a decision you made, why are you ok moving to NY? Its probably not as big a deal as the NYer interviewing for a regional office... but something to be aware of.

Key takeaway is GS FIG is plenty competitive in terms of buyside placement, you'll have to be a bit more proactive in terms of making sure you're on everyones radar and you'll have to make the added effort of coming out to NY whenever the MF bell rings (which btw is often with 24-48 hours notice when the interview process kicks off) while balancing that with work. Keep in mind the week of MF interviews, you'll be in NY ALL week most likely... and possibly with very short notice. So again, logistics. This can be very easily solved with an understanding group.

 
Marcus_Halberstram:

I think GS TMT or FIG is generally viewed as a strong pedigree factor, which when everyone (and I mean everyone) is from a top school and top bank, every extra ounce of pedigree helps.

That being said, you'll have to do a little bit more work on your end vs. your GS FIG NY counterparts, not much but some. Maybe reach out to any headhunters that you haven't heard of from for some reason, make sure everyone knows you're committed to NY, have a compelling story why you went to Chicago in the first place etc.

I interviewed for an opportunity an Boston and one in SF, in both cases in the final round a major consider is do you have any ties to the area,,, you're living in NY right now, why are you ok moving to SF/Boston? These offices often times recruit out of their regional markets for that exact reason. And I'm speculating here, but I would assume the same (reverse) logic applies to your situation. You're living in Chicago (whereas NY is the center of banking/PE), its clearly a decision you made, why are you ok moving to NY? Its probably not as big a deal as the NYer interviewing for a regional office... but something to be aware of.

Key takeaway is GS FIG is plenty competitive in terms of buyside placement, you'll have to be a bit more proactive in terms of making sure you're on everyones radar and you'll have to make the added effort of coming out to NY whenever the MF bell rings (which btw is often with 24-48 hours notice when the interview process kicks off) while balancing that with work. Keep in mind the week of MF interviews, you'll be in NY ALL week most likely... and possibly with very short notice. So again, logistics. This can be very easily solved with an understanding group.

Since you've gone through the recruiting process, I was wondering if you have any intel on Chicago PE firms. Are there quite a bit of legit MM PE firms in Chicago where the comp/opportunities are comparable to NY? I'm interested in living in CHI long term and want to target the BB banks in CHI for that reason, but I'm wondering if the opportunities in PE are limited in CHI.

 

Anyone know the informal policies regarding recruiting at the Chicago/SF office. Obviously the firm wide policy is incredibly strict- the thought being that it would be incredibly tough (even more so) to recruit with buyside shops trying to do it in private and from Chicago (as opposed to down the street in NY). Just something that hadn't been mentioned.

I think the difference between the GS FIG Chicago and NY offices is a pretty large one- Chicago works on some teams with NY, but for the most part their deal sizes are very very small- it tends to be a long term/career banker type of office, with a lot more people staying on past their analyst years onto associate/VP roles. I think the lifestyle/culture of the office is much better than GS FIG/Industrials NY (2 of the more toxic groups culture wise), and that is probably the biggest trade off- better lifestyle for worse exits. Madison Dearborn and GTCR are good shops in Chicago- sure, you'll get some looks from NY MFs, but you'll have to put in work for that- I think people are understating that.

 

I'm not too familiar with the regional offices, but I remember Greg Smith saying that the Chicago office is one of the best GS has and it produced many of the top guys who also later lead GS in executive roles.

I'm talking about liquid. Rich enough to have your own jet. Rich enough not to waste time. Fifty, a hundred million dollars, buddy. A player. Or nothing. See my Blog & AMA
 
Marcus_Halberstram:
Matrick:

I'm not too familiar with the regional offices, but I remember Greg Smith saying that the Chicago office is one of the best GS has and it produced many of the top guys who also later lead GS in executive roles.

Seriously? Greg Smith as in the underachieving VP that left after getting bottom bucket a few years in a row?

I don't know if he was underachieving, but he's the guy who wrote that article about why he left GS etc.

I'm talking about liquid. Rich enough to have your own jet. Rich enough not to waste time. Fifty, a hundred million dollars, buddy. A player. Or nothing. See my Blog & AMA
 
Marcus_Halberstram:

I didn't recognize the name when you cited it. I googled it thinking it was some John Whitehead or David Viniar I hadn't heard of and it turned out to be the Sr. VP who's comp peaked at $500k 12 years into his career.

Halberstram not impressed.

Earnings aside, I don't know if I'd value that schmucks opinion.

Yeah, I get where you're coming from on this one. However, that's something that one can easily verify no?

I'm talking about liquid. Rich enough to have your own jet. Rich enough not to waste time. Fifty, a hundred million dollars, buddy. A player. Or nothing. See my Blog & AMA
 

no, you are assuming incorrectly. those 'non-traditional offices' are wealth management offices. there are no S&T or investment banking there.

they probably take SA's for PWM/wealth management, and comp should be on par.

 

i have a friend who interned in their offices in dubai, he was bawling !!! but the offices weren't that big their

I don't want to be a product of the environment, i want the environment to be a product of me
 

LAWM, when you say finance what exactly do you mean by that? Does that refer to some specific job function, because I was under the impression that basically all of the front office positions at an IB were considered finance.

 

It depends on what you want to do. If this is TMT in SF, take it and don't look back. If it's NatRes in Houston and you know you like the energy space, take it, you'll have great exits, enjoy greater realized earnings (substantially lower cost of living and no state/municipal tax), and be in a cleaner, healthier atmosphere than Manhattan. If it's either of the two groups in Chicago, avoid and go to New York. If it's advisory out of LA, you're probably going to be better off in New York if placement is what you care about.

If you provide specifics, I can answer more. I know you PMed me already about the other thread.

I am permanently behind on PMs, it's not personal.
 

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