A letter or multiple phone calls? Most of the successful people I know that have used connections have had more than just a letter. Typically, it's someone that send a letter and then follows up with a phone call or two. If they hold enough clout, they'll get to talk to the Dean or the Dean of Admissions. That can help a ton. A standard letter from a bigger time alum definitely won't hurt, but also won't get you in. Many (most?) applicants from PE have big hitters from HBS/GSB/Wharton as their bosses, and have worked their asses off for them. The ones that really make a difference are the ones that are 1) connected enough to do something for you and 2) like you enough to spend a decent amount of time making it happen.
Also, how weak are your GPA and GMAT? People on this forum sometimes have odd ideas of what bad GPAs are, but if your GPA and GMAT are both not good, it's going to be hard to make up for it, no matter who you have going to bat for you. H/S knock out too many 3.8/740s from PE, so it's a battle to overcome it if you significantly lower.
Honestly, your chances are good. You didn't mention what you got on the GMAT as an overall score, but even if it was "bad" (e.g. sub-700), I think you still have a very good shot of getting in.
If this "ultra-wealthy alum" was your father, you would be 100% to get in. No question. The school would accept you since they wouldn't want to reject you and than risk pissing your father off and losing out on future donations.
Look at if from the school's perspective: do you give a spot to a subpar applicant with a father who is a wealthy alumnus who will donate millions in the future, or give a spot to a stronger (but not outstanding) candidate without the wealthy alumnus?
The subpar applicant will probably not amount to much, or might just get a cushy director-level job at his father's company, etc. In either case, there is still the prospect of receving significant donations in the future.
The stronger candidate will probably be more successful than the subpar applicant by his own merit, but there is no guarantee he is going to have a future net worth that is 9 figures or even 10/11 figures. One data point to keep in mind: The median income of a particular graduating class from HBS 25 years after graduation. Median income: $350,000, median net worth: $6 million
Obviously, a $6 million net worth is nothing to sneeze about, and this is much, much higher than what the average person could ever hope to attain, but a $6 million net worth is probably not going to donate a new school building or endow a chair. We are talking more like a modest $50,000 donation once a decade. What the schools really want, however, are alums who are going to donate $1 million, $10 million, or even $100 million.
Honestly, top business schools classes are usually filled with outstanding applicants (excellent GPA, excellent GMAT) from modest families and subpar applicants (below-average GPA, below-average GMAT) from wealthy families (e.g. George W. Bush).
It's the students who are in the middle of the two extremes (good grades, good GMAT) but from families with modest means who get the short end of the stick since they are not as strong as the outstanding candidates, and they don't provide schools with monetary incentives of non-guaranteed but very likely future donations.
The question you should be asking yourself is how much does this guy really care about you? Are you like a son to him? If you were rejected, would he be pissed? If the answer is "yes," your chances will be approaching 100%. If not, you still have a good chance, much better than the average person applying, but it is not guaranteed.
I think this one is out my league, and probably out of everyone on WSO's league. I mean, if Ron Perelman is writing you a badass, personal rec. letter to Wharton, where he's donated like $250M to Penn, I think your odds go up significantly to the point of getting in. At the same time, I have no idea where on that sliding scale a donor has to be to overcome your numbers, especially at a GSB or HBS.
I'm rooting for you man. Sounds like you've overcome a bunch and have crushed it at work. Have a feeling with this connection and your ability you'll probably do well no matter what school you go to.
The bottom line is you don't make sense, from a numbers standpoint, at just about anywhere in the top ~12 or so. Great work experience would give you a shot at places like Darden, Fuqua, etc., but you have a lot to overcome.
Random question: does this guy (or his firm) hire from the school he wrote you a rec for? I always feel like people getting recommendations from Henry Kravis or David Rubenstein are in much better shape than those getting one from like, T. Boone Pickens (I chose him randomly), because KKR and Carlyle are actually potential employers for students, in addition to those guys being big time donors.
Hmm. Amazing that you got solid IB+PE jobs with a 3.0 gpa. And yes, GMAT is VERY low for those schools.
Usually, alumni letters don't mean that much, but in your case it's different since the alum in question is a major donor to the school. That's a HUGE game changer. I think you have at least a 50% chance at the alumni's school in question. The other 2 your chances are a lot lower due to your numbers.
You should delete some of the information about your recommender. Too much info, and you don't want to be outed before admission decisions come out. Tons of people in finance read WSO, and you never know who might come across this.
EDIT: although b-school is more enjoyable than work, it's not exactly a vacation either. This is a common misconception that youngsters have about b-schools. Classes, networking events, recruiting, etc., is a ton of work, much moreso than I had anticipated. Just go in with reasonable expectations.
Hmmm, so GPA of 3.0 and GMAT 640. BGP2587 is correct. You don't make sense from a strictly numbers standpoint. Therefore, this letter of recommendation from this big-time alum is going to be important. With that said, however, I still think you have a chance.
One thing that occured to me: Is this alumnus aware of what your numbers are? Did this come up at all when you asked him for the letter? I'm guessing since this guy is so high-level, he doesn't care or have time for such details and he simply assumes that you are a "smart kid" (e.g. the typical cookie-cutter 3.7+ GPA, 700+ GMAT). If that is the case, then he might not have pushed as hard as he potentially could have.
If I was the alum, and I was writing letters of recommendation for two candidates: the first being 1) the cookie cutter 3.7+ GPA/700+ GMAT and the other 2) a smart, hard-working candidate with low stats, you can bet that both letters would be glowing recommendations, however, in the latter case, I would definitely be emphasizing different things such as how your stats were not an accurate reflection of your intelligence, future potential, etc. After writing the letter, you can also bet I will be getting some people on the phone and go to bat for you. I probably wouldn't go that far for the guy with the higher stats since it's not necessary/overkill.
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Perferendis fuga sapiente modi. Dolorem ducimus et repudiandae possimus ut. Non cupiditate similique quasi praesentium qui. Libero molestiae culpa at dolorem nisi non ut. Nobis molestias itaque earum aut tenetur earum.
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A letter or multiple phone calls? Most of the successful people I know that have used connections have had more than just a letter. Typically, it's someone that send a letter and then follows up with a phone call or two. If they hold enough clout, they'll get to talk to the Dean or the Dean of Admissions. That can help a ton. A standard letter from a bigger time alum definitely won't hurt, but also won't get you in. Many (most?) applicants from PE have big hitters from HBS/GSB/Wharton as their bosses, and have worked their asses off for them. The ones that really make a difference are the ones that are 1) connected enough to do something for you and 2) like you enough to spend a decent amount of time making it happen.
Also, how weak are your GPA and GMAT? People on this forum sometimes have odd ideas of what bad GPAs are, but if your GPA and GMAT are both not good, it's going to be hard to make up for it, no matter who you have going to bat for you. H/S knock out too many 3.8/740s from PE, so it's a battle to overcome it if you significantly lower.
deleted
Honestly, your chances are good. You didn't mention what you got on the GMAT as an overall score, but even if it was "bad" (e.g. sub-700), I think you still have a very good shot of getting in.
If this "ultra-wealthy alum" was your father, you would be 100% to get in. No question. The school would accept you since they wouldn't want to reject you and than risk pissing your father off and losing out on future donations.
Look at if from the school's perspective: do you give a spot to a subpar applicant with a father who is a wealthy alumnus who will donate millions in the future, or give a spot to a stronger (but not outstanding) candidate without the wealthy alumnus?
The subpar applicant will probably not amount to much, or might just get a cushy director-level job at his father's company, etc. In either case, there is still the prospect of receving significant donations in the future.
The stronger candidate will probably be more successful than the subpar applicant by his own merit, but there is no guarantee he is going to have a future net worth that is 9 figures or even 10/11 figures. One data point to keep in mind: The median income of a particular graduating class from HBS 25 years after graduation. Median income: $350,000, median net worth: $6 million
Obviously, a $6 million net worth is nothing to sneeze about, and this is much, much higher than what the average person could ever hope to attain, but a $6 million net worth is probably not going to donate a new school building or endow a chair. We are talking more like a modest $50,000 donation once a decade. What the schools really want, however, are alums who are going to donate $1 million, $10 million, or even $100 million.
Honestly, top business schools classes are usually filled with outstanding applicants (excellent GPA, excellent GMAT) from modest families and subpar applicants (below-average GPA, below-average GMAT) from wealthy families (e.g. George W. Bush).
It's the students who are in the middle of the two extremes (good grades, good GMAT) but from families with modest means who get the short end of the stick since they are not as strong as the outstanding candidates, and they don't provide schools with monetary incentives of non-guaranteed but very likely future donations.
The question you should be asking yourself is how much does this guy really care about you? Are you like a son to him? If you were rejected, would he be pissed? If the answer is "yes," your chances will be approaching 100%. If not, you still have a good chance, much better than the average person applying, but it is not guaranteed.
deleted
I think this one is out my league, and probably out of everyone on WSO's league. I mean, if Ron Perelman is writing you a badass, personal rec. letter to Wharton, where he's donated like $250M to Penn, I think your odds go up significantly to the point of getting in. At the same time, I have no idea where on that sliding scale a donor has to be to overcome your numbers, especially at a GSB or HBS.
I'm rooting for you man. Sounds like you've overcome a bunch and have crushed it at work. Have a feeling with this connection and your ability you'll probably do well no matter what school you go to.
The bottom line is you don't make sense, from a numbers standpoint, at just about anywhere in the top ~12 or so. Great work experience would give you a shot at places like Darden, Fuqua, etc., but you have a lot to overcome.
Random question: does this guy (or his firm) hire from the school he wrote you a rec for? I always feel like people getting recommendations from Henry Kravis or David Rubenstein are in much better shape than those getting one from like, T. Boone Pickens (I chose him randomly), because KKR and Carlyle are actually potential employers for students, in addition to those guys being big time donors.
Hmm. Amazing that you got solid IB+PE jobs with a 3.0 gpa. And yes, GMAT is VERY low for those schools.
Usually, alumni letters don't mean that much, but in your case it's different since the alum in question is a major donor to the school. That's a HUGE game changer. I think you have at least a 50% chance at the alumni's school in question. The other 2 your chances are a lot lower due to your numbers.
You should delete some of the information about your recommender. Too much info, and you don't want to be outed before admission decisions come out. Tons of people in finance read WSO, and you never know who might come across this.
EDIT: although b-school is more enjoyable than work, it's not exactly a vacation either. This is a common misconception that youngsters have about b-schools. Classes, networking events, recruiting, etc., is a ton of work, much moreso than I had anticipated. Just go in with reasonable expectations.
Hmmm, so GPA of 3.0 and GMAT 640. BGP2587 is correct. You don't make sense from a strictly numbers standpoint. Therefore, this letter of recommendation from this big-time alum is going to be important. With that said, however, I still think you have a chance.
One thing that occured to me: Is this alumnus aware of what your numbers are? Did this come up at all when you asked him for the letter? I'm guessing since this guy is so high-level, he doesn't care or have time for such details and he simply assumes that you are a "smart kid" (e.g. the typical cookie-cutter 3.7+ GPA, 700+ GMAT). If that is the case, then he might not have pushed as hard as he potentially could have.
If I was the alum, and I was writing letters of recommendation for two candidates: the first being 1) the cookie cutter 3.7+ GPA/700+ GMAT and the other 2) a smart, hard-working candidate with low stats, you can bet that both letters would be glowing recommendations, however, in the latter case, I would definitely be emphasizing different things such as how your stats were not an accurate reflection of your intelligence, future potential, etc. After writing the letter, you can also bet I will be getting some people on the phone and go to bat for you. I probably wouldn't go that far for the guy with the higher stats since it's not necessary/overkill.
Fugiat autem id et pariatur. Ea nulla totam voluptas commodi est quos. Pariatur minus inventore aut sunt et eius quasi. Ipsum veritatis recusandae aliquid eos rem sed.
Perferendis fuga sapiente modi. Dolorem ducimus et repudiandae possimus ut. Non cupiditate similique quasi praesentium qui. Libero molestiae culpa at dolorem nisi non ut. Nobis molestias itaque earum aut tenetur earum.
Non distinctio dolorem quidem ipsam natus ut. Rerum eum consectetur nulla quasi vitae laudantium omnis. Nostrum quos nisi dolore molestiae. Aut eveniet et dolores aut dignissimos dolor voluptates nam.
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