Trending Content
| +50 | Jane street suing MLP | 33 | 16h | |
| +48 | Top Long Only vs Small SM HF | 9 | 1h | |
| +43 | Investment principles | 11 | 6d | |
| +28 | How to Know if HF L/S industry is for me? Wealth Management instead? Feel lost | 7 | 22h | |
| +26 | Realistic HF Career Earnings | 22 | 1d | |
| +22 | How to move from prop to MM for quant? | 3 | 6h | |
| +21 | Advice for Incoming Structured / Securitized Credit HF Analyst | 4 | 11h | |
| +20 | Analysts Launching Out of MM | 16 | 2h | |
| +19 | Career Trajectory for Data Scientists in HF | 6 | 6h | |
| +18 | Possible exits from BB role below | 1 | 6d |
Career Resources
Also very interested
.
Firm: small multi-strategy HF
2x PM are in office these hrs: 8AM - 6PM
They don't go to daytime outside events (i.e. group lunches, breakfasts or out of office meetings/conferences), those are covered by analysts.
To be honest I don't think hours in the office are actually "working hours", since the PMs have a lot of gala dinners, broker dinners, relationship building (raise AuM) etc. which happens outside of office hours. Furthermore, as you probably know, "working" doesn't end when they step outside the office. Especially the most senior PM is up to date about every event in the market - hard to tell him something he hasn't already seen. I'd say office hours are ~50 hrs/wk, but hours spent on work are more like 80 (thinking of new strategies, reading over weekend etc.).
This is interesting thank you.
A bit more color on mine for discussion. Similarly, PM probably in the office from 7-6 with most of this being "active" hours ie speaking with companies, reviewing analysis, trading etc.
He is incredibly hands on / in the weeds on models and analysis so typically he works nights and weekends and will update / flex work as he sees appropriate. I wouldn't be surprised if he works ~70 or more "hard" hours before marketing / planning. This increases during earnings (as expected).
On top of this he routinely wakes up at 3am to watch / trade Europe. I honestly don't know when the man sleeps.
That sounds like a sickening routine indeed.. We are active in one geography/timezone only so we don't have the necessity for quirky things like overnight trading.
In terms of company-specific analysis: the analysts do all the modelling and the PMs simply fire questions and generate trade / investment ideas. It seems like your PM tries to do everything himself, which is quite odd to me. Is your office understaffed?
Once had a PM who was exactly like this. Would respond to emails within a minute, rebuild new models for every single name in his book (despite already having models built and maintained by the analysts), somehow was awake for Asia, Europe, US every day, all whilst constantly churning out new ideas. I could never be certain if he was actually human.
Agree. I have some friends that are PMs or close enough at HFs and they generally shit all over PE guys working around the clock. But then you're out on vacation with them and you hear them striking up a random conversations with a stranger about the German bund market or sitting inside reading 3 news papers and the economist while everyone else is outside socializing.
So like I said, I agree with this view (at least from what I've seen second hand), fairly reasonable in-office hours, but it never really stops... you can't really turn it off.
Maybe I'm just jaded but in my experience most senior guys don't actually work as much as they pretend to or convey an impression. A 3 am email here; a pop-quiz on obscure market events there and a quick review of a model with a couple tweaks is enough to make junior guys think they work nonstop when in reality they don't.
I remember thinking my bosses worked way harder than me when I first started only to eventually realize their understanding of a lot of stuff was actually pretty superficial, and that they hadn't really read 90% of the stuff they pretended to.
Again, just my experience...
Sounds like a consulting PM (project manager), but not a HF PM lol.
Lol no
Context: small team covering US, Europe, Asia; long/short value; fairly concentrated, PMs have a very analyst mentality
PMs are in the office 7am-5pm mostly discussing ideas / positions with analysts, doing calls, analysing the portfolio. Pretty plugged in on weeknights, either reading, doing more calls, or changing trades (btw, it is a massive pain to trade multiple time zones, even if you're generally fairly long term). Would say they're in the office around 50 hours a week, probably working around 60-70 hours a week.
Worked for a family office operating a rather large portfolio with a long-biased fundamental equities strategy focused on large cap corporations in US and Europe.
My PM literally worked 9am to 430 pm and spent a lot of time on the phone with his wife. He somehow manages to pull in impressive, steady, HF-level returns every year.
Investment analysts worked 60 hours/week, mostly focused on modeling. The PM did very little modeling, mostly just debating qualitative stuff with the investment committee on prospective opportunities.
Not sure how he gets away with it, but I really want his job.
Long only Australian equities
The hours are typically 8-6. The PMs have some sector coverage (on top of anything portfolio-related), but a reasonable chunk of time is spent dealing with investors, asset consultants, etc. Seeing and hearing what they go through, I don't envy them. I think we'd all be lying if we didn't do some personal admin during the day. At least the returns are good so the complaints are minimal.
Thankfully the late night/early morning emails are a very, very rare occurrence. I might send some interesting article to everyone but that's really the extent of it. Being glued to the phone is not a philosophy we have.
I don't work at a HF, but my mom unknowingly babysat for the CEO of a well known Absolute Return HF that specializes in MBS and Structured Credit (you can probably guess the fund....). To my knowledge, he is one of three PMs. I think he was in the office ~60 hrs/wk, but probably worked ~80 factoring in all the stuff he did outside of work (no weekends).
9-630 in the office. Definitely countless hours outside the office on nights and weekends. Hard to get any piece of news past them that they do not already know.
Probably around 50-60 hours a week.
There is always something in the reading pile
Bump, curious to see if anyone else has any input.
Aliquam placeat et inventore ea excepturi nobis et. Excepturi et explicabo possimus aperiam mollitia corrupti nostrum. Autem omnis dolor quis veritatis tempora dolorum iusto.
Ducimus aliquam dolor architecto vel sit qui. Est doloribus consequatur ipsam debitis eius qui quae.
Cupiditate numquam corporis cum labore nihil quis id. Error consectetur voluptatem in illo quod quod eius. Eaque esse cum ut minima dolorum. Aut aut pariatur ratione et.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...