IB vs. Medicine

If you want to make money go into Plastics, which is so much easier said than done. You need to really temper your expectations about finance, and quite frankly unless you are at an Ivy league school (or same level), you have fractions of a percent chance of even making it into IB.

Medicine isn't something you just go into though. Almost everyone in the profession that I've conversed with has said they love where they are at but if they had to do it over again they probably wouldn't have done it. Those people had a "calling" to do it as well.

Here's what you don't want to have happen, you don't want to get a degree in Biology or Chemistry and have to work through taking a full load of hard weed out classes, have your GPA sink a bit and decide Medicine isn't for you because of how hard and long the schooling will be. At which point you are screwed with a Biology degree.

To make the argument fair, compare the life of a 30 year old banker/PE investor to a 30 year old surgeon.

All the shit that you do before that age - MBA, Med School, analyst stint, residency, all-nighters, etc. are pretty comparable relevant costs to both career paths.

I'll let you dig a bit deeper to figure out which lifestyle at age 30 sounds better to you.

Do whatever you are passionate about. It boils down to the fact that you will probably be spending a large portion of your life doing whatever you decide to do, so you should do something that isn't mind-numbingly boring. That being said, I would look into a larger variety of fields, because I have yet to meet a single doctor who suggests going down the med path wholeheartedly. I was recently at a dermatologist who was going on and on about how I should do something interesting with my life (like his friend who was some type of crazy engineer), so you wouldn't be like him checking people's skin all day.

enjoying what I do but being limited (doctors won't ever be worth 100 mil)

Wow... you have really high expectations... I know docs at OrthoCarolina and a rare disease hematological doc that make well into the millions, but you just want to blow it out of the water don't you...?

We all have career aspirations, just do what you're passionate about, in the moment you're passionate about it, 100%. Everybody changes their minds often, and everyone is uncertain about what they actually want in their life/career/etc..

Quit worrying and just get into college for now.

Thanks guys

What you have said has been very helpful. I do have big aspirations, but I recognize that those are not likely to happen - why i think about medicine. However, you guys are right that medicine is not something I can just walk into. Either way I go I'm going to have to work hard. I could make it into an ivy (2300 SAT, valedictorian, built libraries in Africa - just extracurricular bs) but I am looking to UT BHP to energy bank in Houston.

I wouldn't want to be a plastic because the nobility in being a doctor comes from actually saving someone and plastic surgery wouldn't do it for me. I'll probably study finance/Eco and try to go IB but we'll see.

Thanks for the advice guys.

I have given this advice to a lot of people who are considering medical school - if you have anything else in the world you can see yourself having fun doing, try that first and find out if its for you - you can always go to medical school later. I know people who are in their 40's going to medical school, in their late 20's, early 30's, etc. If you find that you aren't happy with life outside medicine, then just apply to a post-bacc program, do 2 years there, do well, then apply to med school and you will get in then BOOM you are in the medicine pathway and you just keep your head down and you will make it through to whatever specialty you want. I advise this because if you try medicine first but find that you don't care for it, its very difficult to get off that train once you've boarded and taken on those loans and family expectations.

not sure why you think breaking into a good med school is easier than breaking into IB or why the MCAT is easier than CFA or GMAT. they're all difficult in their own right, do what you're passionate about. if you're a high school senior, your future in IB will depend where you go to school, and same for med school. also, if you're a white male, the mountain to climb to get into a good med school just got a whole lot steeper.

bottom line, do what makes you happy, if that's finance, medicine, engineering, or welding (highly underappreciated trade), none of us can make the decision for you. I will say that you're choosing between 2 extremely difficult careers to get because of their barriers of entry, so if you're asking which is easier, the answer is neither.

so much misinformation in this thread... medicine is not something you just walk into, finance is in no way similar in the amount of work you need to put in.. you have mcat's, step one, step two, step three, boards, 3-4 years of medical school, 3-4 years of residency, 1-7 years of fellowship depending on your specialization if you want to specialize.. and even after that you are constantly studying trying to keep up with procedures and such.. Depending on your group and specialization, you might be on-call on your off days.. Its really something you have to be passionate about to succeed in it. Go to college, take your gen ed's, figure out what your interests are.. During your sophmore or junior year, shadow a doctor and figure out if it is something you are passionate about and then go from there.. Its a long way between your high school graduation and actually graduating med school. Med school is not easy to get into, chances are the odds of getting into med school are lower than your odds of breaking into finance.

chiclanda:

...only 6 years before my residency (where I will actually begin to make money)...doctors won't ever be worth 100 mil...

Whatever you do, for heaven's sake, don't go into medicine. It's is definitely not for someone who just likes talking to people and making a big buck. Given your interests, I'd say real sth like real estate brokerage might be a pretty good fit - it's social, it has variety and if you're good at it, there's literally no limit to what you can make. And you could start right after high school, doing college on the side (if you'd even bother).

chiclanda:

Moreover, I could maybe trim my undergrad experience down to 2 years and get a full ride to a school like Texas A&M if I went the medicine route, which would make it only 6 years before my residency (where I will actually begin to make money).

Being in finance (real estate) and married to a doctor I've been disappointed in the transparency of the medical school > residency > fellowship process. I have found it difficult to find quality databases or forums regarding national rankings of specialized programs, pros & cons of different opportunities, residency salary of said programs, etc.

That being said, you should realize that after 4 years of being a top performer in undergrad, and 4 tough years of medical school, first year residents ("interns") make $40,000-$55,000, with only minor (~3%) bumps for each year of residency. If you choose to go the specialized surgery route, you can expect a 5 year residency program followed by a 2-3 year fellowship program, which doesn't pay much better.

Graduate UG at 21, finish Med School at 25, complete residency at 30, fellowship until 32, and now you get to make real money and pay back those undergrad and/or med-school loans.

If you love medicine, want to help people, and think you can handle hitting the books for 4 extra years while your fresh out of college friends are partying in Uptown/Washington St/6th St every night of the week, do it. If you're looking for a lucrative career, DON'T BE A DOCTOR, there is plenty of quicker and easier routes that allow you to accumulate wealth and live a normal life during your 20's. If you're a top-performer you'll progress in your field and your earning potential in your early 30's may not be far off from what most doctors at that point in their career. You also need to take into account the uncertainty in healthcare right now, and realize that doctors salaries are likely to be compressed in the coming years.

Oh and if you're a female and plan on having kids, delay that money making timeline appropriately as you'll probably need to get to it by your early to mid thirties.

Everyone overrates the amount of money doctors make in relation to their hours worked and debt.

And A&M places extremely well into IBD in Houston/Dallas along the lines of UT. So if you wanted to do Finance and work that angle then I would, but more inclined to say do UT if you can.

Medicine is great, but it requires much more a time constraint AND honestly more intellectually consuming. The debt and time requirements makes it something which I wouldn't pursue just for money, although it will end up with a steady 250-350 job in you mid thirties, many routes can give you this if you're willing to put in 70-80 hour week for 10 years.

Hell the best software sales reps make in the MM's or the like by putting in that hard work & being bright. Chief Human Resource Officers (CHRO's) can pull in numbers around 300k+ by forty (more diluted talent pool). There are roofers who started huge companies who are now millionaires. If you want money, then pursue what you're really good at and find the careers in that field which you can exceed. I'm a big advocate of going into a rather underrated profession or one where the talent pool is diluted and then work hard and be the top 0.01% in that career. The top 0.01% of welders make more than the top 10% of WallStreeters. And honestly it's easier to be that 0.01% of HR/Sales/Welders than in top 10% on WallStreet. DISCLAIMER: I"m biased because my goal is to be the top 0.01% in commercial insurance (field without many Type A personalities) and scale the ranks, possibly launching and managing a consulting firm dealing with high wealth individuals and construction companies.

Although with the number you listed (100MM) high finance is where you need to go. Get into UT BHP or better yet an Ivy League (Wharton preferably) and you'll have all the chances in the world.

People here seem to be missing the job security in medicine. Finance is great, but now I'm starting to realize how much it not only sucks with the spector of having a huge boss bureaucracy over your head to fire you whenever, but also the specter of being hired after layoffs, etc, stuff doctors don't have to deal with. Yea, you have head residents, but firings only happen for egregious things I hear. In the corporate ladder, how many people ever get seriously promoted/move up/be chief-anything? What happens after layoffs, long-term unemployment, etc.? This is a serious advantage doctors have in that they deal with much less of that. Doctors also get serious perks, like the IRS will let them be delinquent forever, people give them things, cops rip up their tickets, and they can go tutor B/C/P as a moonlight easily for 100-150/hr.

Also, I would agree your school is more in IBD per se (namewise) than for med school admissions. But remember, the acceptance rates at nearly all US Med schools are single digits. The flip side here is the importance of schmoozing, which is easier done getting into finance than with med school. Probably IBD and Med School have similar numbers, assuming IBDs hire between 1 and 10 percent of applicants (or interviewees).

Also, if you don't get into med school, what do you do? Nurse or PA? (ie second act with salaries you can find in the MO or even back office). DPT? You also don't just become one of those either. You'd then have to go to school for that and then become one of those. I mean you could also work in a lab, but then you'll just be moving liquids into other test tubes. At least in finance, you can just apply for consulting, accounting, IBD, MO, etc. simultaneously.

With finance, your major actually matters a lot more for getting a job (except if you're at Harvard/Yale/Princeton) than for med school. With med school, they only care about having B/Ch/Ph/M. If I were in your spot, I'd major in finance with either a double major or minor in physics or chem. Med schools would probably like that your finance knowledge will keep you above water if you need loans and help you be successful (and give back to the school someday). Knowing accounting is good for if you are in a medical group, now that single practice is dead, and you'd also know of the pharma business.

I love finance, but had I know how much math I'd have to go back and learn (I'm basically redoing all calc I and some of calc ii sans the trig part), I'd have also applied to post-bac programs as well as MSF. Having an MD and CFA would be an amazing deal.