Implications of getting fired (PWM)

I have been an intern at some shitty, no-name PWM firm. Anyway, I got fired for doing something stupid. The work was boring as fuck anyway.

I wanted to know what implications this will have on my chances of landing an IBD gig? Am I screwed? What can I do?

 

Usually takes a lot for people to fire interns - they know you're there to learn and that you're inexperienced, so it can't have been something you screwed up with work. Must have been something really stupid.

Tough luck, kid.

Currently: future neurologist, current psychotherapist Previously: investor relations (top consulting firm), M&A consulting (Big 4), M&A banking (MM)
 
Best Response

The biggest thing I take away from your post is that you don't know one of the most important things, everything matters.

I notice one thing when interns sit at my desk, their attitude. There are three types of interns: ones who understand, ones who don’t understand, and ones who don’t care. The ones who understand will take notes, ask questions, talk to me about things besides the work, and treat every task as if their life depends on it. The ones who don’t understand just show up, they don’t overachieve and they don’t underachieve. They just show up and do the work they are assigned and that’s about it. Lastly, there are the interns who don’t care. They are late to work/meetings/deadlines, don’t dress well, can’t get the simplest of tasks done because they think they are so awesome they don’t need to take notes or pay attention.

I hate people who don’t understand that everything matters, even if it’s ordering the desk lunch or using spell check.

 

I interned there for the fall semester. I already apied to IB positions with the job on my resume.

Alright, here's what happened. The PWM firm wanted me to choose them over school. Essentially, they wanted me to work during the same time I had a final exam, and I was not willing to sacrifice my GPA for them, so I informed them that I could not. So, they informed me that they were going to fire me, because I was "unreliable." Also, I went to NYC a lot this past month for networking purposes, so I wasn't at work as much as I should have been, thus they fired me.

 
rpatriot12:
informed me that they were going to fire me, because I was "unreliable." Also, I went to NYC a lot this past month for networking purposes, so I wasn't at work as much as I should have been, thus they fired me.
You do know networking for future jobs is stupid if you can't even keep your current job, right? Even if I were just working some "stupid PWM job", there's no way I would skip work to suck up to people that may or may not be able to help you in the future. I'm sure a day off here or there is fine, but you must have skipped way more than is professionally appropriate. I'm pretty sure the final exam was the straw that broke the camel's back, not the reason for your being fired.

It's the same reason people don't take interviews while they're at work. And if you do, you'd better be taking them during lunch or during your once-a-month "dentist" appointment.

Good luck when the banks do your background checks and found that you've been terminated. Might not matter at that point, but you never know.

Currently: future neurologist, current psychotherapist Previously: investor relations (top consulting firm), M&A consulting (Big 4), M&A banking (MM)
 

You don't deserve a decent IBD gig. How stupid is that? You put that on your cv, apply, and then you ask for advice here whether it'll worsen your chances? Damn, you're certainly not one of the brightest.

Whether you think you can or you think you can’t, your’re right. - Henry Ford
 

Its not the end of the world. Coming from an engineering background I once had a friend get fired from an internship for similar reasons. He ended up at a great S&T job so nothing is out of the picture. (he showed why he wasn't engaged and had a story).

I would first check if the shop has a policy about terminations, many will not disclose why they let people go. You can always spin a bad experience in your favor.

 

How long did you intern for? It it was for around 10 weeks you can still probably put it on your resume. I say just put it on your resume and no one will ask why you are leaving because it's an internship.

 

List it on your resume, noone's going to give a damn. Background checks are only done after the offer and even then, then only verify if you actually worked there. Contrary to what it may seem, HR people will not scrutinize the 150 new FT analysts and whether their boss at the PWM gig they did 2 years ago was happy/unhappy with their intern

 
monkeyleverage:

List it on your resume, noone's going to give a damn. Background checks are only done after the offer and even then, then only verify if you actually worked there. Contrary to what it may seem, HR people will not scrutinize the 150 new FT analysts and whether their boss at the PWM gig they did 2 years ago was happy/unhappy with their intern

this. it really doesn't matter, just don't bring up you were fired in the interviews. by the time hr checks it you're already in. just have a backup story to tell HR to just gloss over them

 

this guy has the right opinion out of everything I've read so far:

I notice one thing when interns sit at my desk, their attitude. There are three types of interns: ones who understand, ones who don’t understand, and ones who don’t care. The ones who understand will take notes, ask questions, talk to me about things besides the work, and treat every task as if their life depends on it. The ones who don’t understand just show up, they don’t overachieve and they don’t underachieve. They just show up and do the work they are assigned and that’s about it. Lastly, there are the interns who don’t care. They are late to work/meetings/deadlines, don’t dress well, can’t get the simplest of tasks done because they think they are so awesome they don’t need to take notes or pay attention.

at the same time if you got fired for fucking up, the most important thing you can do now is learn from it, accept responsibility, and get back on your horse and try again

if you fail on all three, well then, fuck you mothafucka, yer the kind of chump we all eat for breakfast. Just shake it off, realize your mistake, and don't do it again. I've fucked up multiple times, and managed to fall upwards each time after that...you figgah deal me?

 

It's very hard to fail as an intern. The performance expectations are always quite low, and even when you mess up on some technical aspects, there's always someone who'll help to quietly clean up your work. I certainly was not a great technical intern...I actually failed at some laughably simple technical tasks, that now, I could perform while riding a unicycle and balancing spinning plates.

What does matter for interns are soft skills: primarily showing up to work dressed appropriately, staying awake (I heard about a narcoleptic intern who probably will never find work in the industry in this city), bringing a good attitude, and getting along with the team. That said, we let our interns take time off for exams and other school responsibilities all the time--within reason, and I suspect that most other companies operate the same way. So being a passable intern (i.e avoiding getting terminated) certainly is not particularly difficult.

So that said, for your own sake, don't list that internship, and don't ever bring it up if you want to find other work. Your story probably won't hold water and certainly won't reflect well on you, especially when you start badmouthing your former employer.

 

I'm a little surprised to see people offering this individual advice along the lines of "don't put it on your resume", "lie about it", etc. Why is anyone telling him or her how to trick the system? I would want this "experience" on his or her resume so that when he or she applies to my bank, we have some chance of weeding him or her out. And it further confuses me to see anyone offering advice on how to lie his or her way out of it if some bank is unfortunate enough to offer an interview.

RPatriot12: In my experience with PWM and IBD, if you think the former is "boring as fuck" as a part time intern, you will not enjoy IB. Just my two cents.

 

I would be cautious keeping it in your resume. In my final round last year the hiring manager asked to speak with a contact at two of my previous employers on the resume from a while back. Thankfully I still keep in touch with them and they had positive things to say about me, but that could easily back fire if the same thing happened to you.

This was a small firm, so I don't know how common this type of thing would be for a larger bank, but still something to keep in mind.

"I must create a system or be enslaved by another man's." William Blake
 
funzone36:
you could try MBA

Correction: you should* try MBA.

IB will see you as someone outside their industry and won't take you for a role unless you do MBA. They want fresh grads for analyst spots and MBAs for associate positions.

Unless you know someone that can get you in...

in it 2 win it
 

hmm

I really dont want to do an MBA right now at all.

Anything else besides IB that I can try? I dont think im that out of their industry considering I had to work alongside a bunch of them for prior transactions.

Im hoping to get another year or two of experience before getting an MBA because Im not sure I want to do Ibanking post MBA

 

Well what do you want to do post MBA if not I-banking? The only reason to do I-banking now is if you want to stay in it, or you want to do PE/Hedge Fund. You will need to get an MBA for that too seeing you have no real relevant experience to go into either one right now.

Basically you need to figure out what you want to do first not just to I-Banking becuase its the "best thing to do".

 

Try looking for banking jobs in your industry (so maybe a FIG somewhere?). I have seen many, MANY bankers in energy groups that got their start working for Big Oil. From engineers to strategy/middle-management folks and finance-types, I know quite a few that moved in with no MBA or banking experience.

I will say that this may be mostly specific to natural resource groups because the modelling/valuation they do is so different from others. I DO however know someone that moved from a financial services company to a 1st-year analyst position in whats basically the top group at a top BB.

 
confused23:

I have a classmate who was fired recently. I know that getting fired means that the firm has a non-business/redundancy reason to let you go (misconduct..) and you do not get any severance. If you do get fired, how does that impact your next job search? Do you have to disclose getting fired or can you skate by and find the next job without letting your future employer know?

Also, why would a firm fire you when they can give you a heads up and let you quit voluntarily. If they don't have to pay you severance if they fire you or if you quit, why do the disservice of screwing you over?

Was he at a fancy, high-profile job? I actually know someone who was fired from his first job and then ended up getting hired by McKinsey (lol).

You can probably skate it a bit, but he'll have to come up with some sort of convincing, quasi-truthful story for HR/recruiters/networkers.

 
holla_back:
confused23:

I have a classmate who was fired recently. I know that getting fired means that the firm has a non-business/redundancy reason to let you go (misconduct..) and you do not get any severance. If you do get fired, how does that impact your next job search? Do you have to disclose getting fired or can you skate by and find the next job without letting your future employer know?
Also, why would a firm fire you when they can give you a heads up and let you quit voluntarily. If they don't have to pay you severance if they fire you or if you quit, why do the disservice of screwing you over?

Was he at a fancy, high-profile job? I actually know someone who was fired from his first job and then ended up getting hired by McKinsey (lol).

You can probably skate it a bit, but he'll have to come up with some sort of convincing, quasi-truthful story for HR/recruiters/networkers.

Same here, except my friend went to Bain. Guy was fired on the after 6 years of great reviews after one dumb thing.

(to be fair he never worked in finance in the US ever again)

 
Beny23:

You might have to disclose it. If you don't and they call your ex-employer you might be in trouble.

Depends on the company. Happened to my girlfriend and the company said if someone calls the only thing they will verify are the dates she worked, nothing regarding how it ended.

Frank Sinatra - "Alcohol may be man's worst enemy, but the bible says love your enemy."
 

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