Lateral from BB investment banking to consulting? (say, after 2 years)

I'm sure there are some bankers who move into the consulting industry after 2 years (and realizing they hate banking and don't want to go into PE because it's too similar). How common is lateraling in from a bulge bracket investment bank to MBB or Oliver Wyman? What titles (Sr. Associate?) are they given?

 

I haven't seen a lot of bankers lateral to consulting positions. For better or for worse, once you complete two years in banking - most people find it hard to deal with the paycut, especially when they know that consulting hours at MBB level shops can also be painful (although of course, nowhere near banking). If people don't end up moving to PE, they move into a completely different non-advisory sort of role.

 

If you were to lateral to a consulting firm, you'd start as a Business Analyst like new grads. That's what I've heard and experienced at least. This mainly applies for the PHDs and industry experts that take the ego-hit as they start off in the same position as first years in consulting to gain a realization of processes.

This can vary based on types of firms, so in operations or IT you could go straight for the Senior Analyst roles if you have industry expertise, but for strategy? No way.

 

Probably a senior Associate after 2 years, at least credit for a year of tenure. But where you'd come in isn't as important as whether it would happen in the first place. Much more possible to come in as a Consultant post-MBA

Life, liberty and the pursuit of Starwood Points
 

The only thing I have seen is that people go into consulting after a year or less at a BB. One guy I know came in as a Fellow I believe (McK)

I'm talking about liquid. Rich enough to have your own jet. Rich enough not to waste time. Fifty, a hundred million dollars, buddy. A player. Or nothing. See my Blog & AMA
 

I know it's a different situation, but out of undergraduate I chose banking over consulting partly because I had the same concerns as the OP.

It seems to me that banking is more specialized, so you really need to enter as either an analyst or an associate. This means you go through the training and (moreover) you spend a lot of time building models in Excel. You can't really enter banking as a VP or an MD, unless you're hired out of industry/politics/etc for your contacts.

By contrast, I have this impression that consulting is more general, implying that one could go from banking to consulting at any stage of the game.

(Note: I chose banking over consulting for several other more important reasons. So I never thought too much about my above reasoning - it may be totally flawed! Feel free to critique.)

 

yeah that's what ive heard as well which is why i was asking...i mean it makes sense, banking skills can be transfered to consulting, since, in general, you're pretty much taking excel/business/financial skills to consulting where as if you go from consulting to banking you have the excel probably more business logic skills than banking but the key would be that you would lack in financials...

but it seems like ppl do go from consulting to banking and vice versa...which is good to hear for ppl in my boat

 

My perspective (and I hope some bankers chime in) is that it depends on the person. As a consultant with an interest in finance, I would be confident in take a banking job. The finance skills are relatively easy to learn, especially if you have done some finance work on projects. My roommate who is a BB banker, has seen me work/the output etc. and he thinks that banking-> consulting is harder but both are very doable. Keep in mind this is all pre-MBA.

I misread your original question (thought you meant consulting/banking, MBA, then switch). After an MBA, I would think it would have to be a case to case basis. Bankers usually join consulting firms in their corpfin divisions, but I don't anecdotally know too many. I do know a few partners who have gone to banks (Media partner -> Media group). No idea at the associate/principal level.

 

definitely true at the pre-MBA level -- not sure if that's true post-MBA because their classes tend to be much larger than summer intern ACs/BAs/Analysts

with a BB bank on your resume for the summer, it should be relatively easy to get an interview with a top consulting firm

 

brand name is very important in making transitions as well along with prior experience.

(ie Goldman vs. Baird when trying to go to McKinsey vs. KSA)

additionally, Big 4 accounting (more of the valuation/advisory practices) to consulting / banking is common as well.

------------ I'm making it up as I go along.
 

Not to be an ass, but if you are in retail banking, I doubt the questions will revolve around them breaking you down as to why retail banking is a promising career. Sure, it is a paycheck, but that's about it. You are going to need to sell yourself hard as to why you are a fit.

Don't focus at all on your current position and why it is good, outside of how any relevant skill you are building might be applicable to the new role. You need to elaborate on what type of consulting role you are interviewing for before getting any real advice on what to expect.

 

[quote=nickelbags] "honestly, banking is retarded and even though i am on live deals, it's still retarded."

LMAO

"God takes care of old folks and fools, while the Devil takes care of makin all the rules", P.E. 1998
 
nickelbags:
is it common to see analysts who did banking for 1 yr then made the switch over to consulting?

honestly, banking is retarded and even though i am on live deals, it's still retarded. there's no real learning involved.. how bad is the bs on the consulting side? it seems any job excl pe and hedge fund related, there are guys complaining about the bs work. just trying to understand how bad it is over here

also, would it be worth it to leave a mediocre industry group at a 1-tier BB for a non-MBB consulting firm?

Dude, if you think working on live deals in IB is bullshit, you will not enjoy consulting.

And no, it would not be worth leaving a "tier-1" BB for a non-MBB firm (maybe Monitor/LEK, etc.) Also don't take it is as a gimme that you can land a spot. Lateral hires unfortunately aren't too common, but you would (obviously) be a strong candidate for the corpfin group at any consulting firm.

thanks for your advice ideating. are you in consulting yourself ideating?

it would be more of a lifestyle choice than anything - plus i do think you learn more soft skills in consulting and also have more time to actually absorb the knowledge you gain from work.

 

Yup. I personally am much happier with consulting, for me personally the hours and the lifestyle are just bearable enough while still having prestige/exit opps, etc. The money isn't as good as banking obviously, but it isn't bad either.

nickelbags:
thanks for your advice ideating. are you in consulting yourself ideating?

it would be more of a lifestyle choice than anything - plus i do think you learn more soft skills in consulting and also have more time to actually absorb the knowledge you gain from work.

At least in banking you get paid for results, e.g. whether a deal actually gets done or not. As opposed to paying for a 100-page report or getting paid by the hour in consulting.

It is most definitely not worth it to leave any BB for a less prestigious consulting firm. It would be more of a lifestyle choice than anything, you would not necessarily get more out of it despite claims to the contrary.

I went to a target and know plenty of people who did consulting and plenty who did banking and I'm very glad I did banking.

If you want something that doesn't involve a lot of BS work, forget about prestigious jobs like finance/banking/consulting.

 

Perceived strongly. This happens all of the time. I would argue that BB internship experience is one of the best things you can have on your resume to get a FT interview at MBB (second to only a few other things, like an internship with another MBB, maybe). They know you are capable of handling a lot of work, working hard, and are reasonably intelligent -- a lot of the things they would have to make guesses about otherwise. I've heard anecdotally that having an internship at a GS/MS/JPM is better than having an internship at a Deloitte or Accenture, because they view those banks as equivalently prestigious in another industry (as opposed to, as bad as this sounds, firms they consider second tier to themselves). The fact that you didn't get an offer is a little bit of a roadblock, but as long as you have a good explanation, you should have a decent shot. Good luck!

 

Completely agree with the above. I interned at a small regional boutique IB and got a lot of looks from consulting firms FT. Just be very prepared to answer the question "why consulting and not IB" as that was almost universally the first question always asked (honestly sometimes with a chip on the shoulder on the interviewers part haha).

 

if its a summer internship, you def still have the option, and from what ive seen, a lot of kids with bb internships end up at m/b/b for fulltime. this is esp the case since m/b/b has much smaller internship classes relative to their FT hire class than a lot of other firms like BBs. so i think it's an advantage nc bb's are competitive internships, and you wont be disadvantaged if you want to go to conulting.

if you take a fulltime at a bb, though, im not sure how easy it is to move to consulting then without getting an mba, but i dont really know.

 

Help someone! I need some form of advice and guidance. I am currently a soph student and i attend a public target/semi school. I would be interning with Accenture (consulting) in a big city this summer,for approx 12 weeks. and i was hoping if such an experience working on projects, might help me get interviews with the BB for investment banking. I am specifically interested in M&A. I have heard of the SEO program reading forums on this site but am a person who believes in going through the main door as everyone does. I have had a diverse background living and growing up in three continents.My GPA is a 3.7.

 

The problem is I already accepted it (after my summer internship with the BB). I just want to switch over to MC as soon as possible.

I wanted to be a part of the Fall recruiting since I'll have little experience in BB and perhaps will make it easier to transition at an early stage in consulting rather than going for an experienced hire later on

 

I'm confused about what you are trying to do.

To recap (let us know if this isn't right):

You summered before senior year at a BB and accepted their exploding offer to return full-time (assuming 2-year contract after graduation).

You are now in the final semester of your senior year and want to have a consulting job after graduation instead. You are thinking about interviewing with consulting firms this upcoming fall, when you are just a couple months into your BB job, with the hopes of securing a consulting job.

Questions

  1. Why did you not go through full-time consulting recruiting last fall (or did you)? Just because you had already accepted an offer to return to a BB?

  2. Are you targeting a job to start with a consulting firm in fall 2013 or summer 2014? More importantly, are you thinking you would join as a 'first-year' or join the class of analysts who graduated the same year of undergrad that you did? This will impact the best approach; can't really answer the question without more context.

 

1) I didn't try recruiting since I had already accepted an offer

2) I definitely want to join as a first year analyst-I wont have relevant experience to lateral into a strategy role after a year..Thats why I wanted to apply for Summer 2014 start

When do I try to lateral into a consulting firm? What would be the best time to start actively applying?

Thanks for your response

 

Agree with Andre, you are going very much against the grain trying to get an MBB offer 1-2 mos. into a BB job when they are already looking at thousands of kids out of ugrad...

The easiest route is to stay minimum 2 yrs at the job you accepted, and then try for MBB through B-school recruiting.

If you try to go against the grain now and fail, they will have a record of your interview as 'not impressive'. Not impossible to get hired after that but I do think your chances are better through MBA OCR.

 

You don't necessarily have to go to business school to get it - bankers actually don't have the worst track record when they try to lateral to consulting (admittedly, not many people try it). BB analysts definitely look more attractive than the hordes of Big 4 people who try to lateral.

So do banking for a year, and then try to get into the lateral interview pool for a fall 2014 start. You'll actually have better luck shooting for a fall 2015 start, when you'll have 2 years of banking behind you, but if you really want to get out you can try a year earlier.

One of those lights, slightly brighter than the rest, will be my wingtip passing over.
 

its possible, you just need to convey to consulting firms that you have picked up the skills needed in whatever positions you've had in the past.

check out managementconsulted.com

------------ I'm making it up as I go along.
 

Can you tell me more about the background of these individuals?? My first year as an analyst is swiftly coming to an end and I am curious to learn more about consulting (MBB or MBB-type firms).

How hard is the switch? What is the best way to go about it? Let me know. Thanks.

 

In making the switch - what MBB would look for are a few things - problem solving and analytics, presence, communication skills, top achievement (grades, leadership, extracurriculars etc)

I think equally important is being able to show that you fit into the firm's culture, and are really interested in consulting. (Think also about the airport test)

Also, during interviews - it is important to take a big picture view of the case (look beyond the numbers) to show you are not just a quant jock.

Disclaimer: Interviewed numerous candidates for FT jobs at top firm. Unfortunately most ex-bankers were only focused on numbers during the case which did not help their candidacy.

 
quest777:
So to set up for FT MBB, one is better off having a junior year BB IBD internship as opposed to a lower lever (Deloitte, etc...) consulting internship?

Yes by all means. BB IBD is much closer to MBB in terms of job requirements, calibre of people, even sometimes type of work. Also Deloitte brand would stigmatise you while e.g. MS on CV would be quite nice.

 
m2:

A friend of mine did this a few years back after about a year. Actually all of the MBBs were interested.

What was his background (i.e. what group was he in, where did he go to school / what did he major in)? I'm closing in on the end of my second year in BB banking and am looking to jump to MBB in a medium sized market. Consensus seems to be that it's actually quite difficult to pull this off but I'm hoping that my ties to that city and their need for additional bodies will help.

People tend to think life is a race with other people. They don't realize that every moment they spend sprinting towards the finish line is a moment they lose permanently, and a moment closer to their death.
 
djfiii:
How are your hours / travel right now? Are you prepared for that at McK? (family, kids, etc). That can have a huge impact on your happiness with a transition like that.
Hours go up and down depending on the project but there has not been so much travel (luckily). Would this be so much different at McK? You have a point, with McK globa staffing, there can be significantly more travel.
 

Do you plan to make a career out of consulting or just hop off after a couple of years? Lifestyle at McK can suck (a lot), especially in your 30's and starting to think about family. How is compensation? I think at your career level already you should think about what you plan to do in the long term and stop hopping around.

If you are into consulting for a career, go for McKinsey - no better place to do that. But it will be a tough ride.

 
Nutry:
Do you plan to make a career out of consulting or just hop off after a couple of years? Lifestyle at McK can suck (a lot), especially in your 30's and starting to think about family. How is compensation? I think at your career level already you should think about what you plan to do in the long term and stop hopping around.

If you are into consulting for a career, go for McKinsey - no better place to do that. But it will be a tough ride.

I would make the opposite conclusion as Nutry. In other words, if you are into consulting for a career, stay put! If you are going to stay in consulting long term, and you are happy now, you should stay where you are (especially since you're at a BB that is presumably growing, has/will have enough good work to spread around staff, etc. -- and your "lifestyle" will probably take a hit by switching to McK because of increased travel)

On the other hand, if you aren't into consulting for a career, and are looking for exit opportunities, I think McK a more viable option -- if, as your post seems to suggest, BB doesn't offer the same opps you think McK would given its more mature brand name in your current (which I presume is also your desired) region. If exit opps are your concern, and you're in the US, I don't think it really matters all that much between MBB (differences in opps, I think, are smaller than differences in culture, hours, etc. etc.).

 
BB entered the market much later so still playing the catchup game (though gaining market shares).

From this I am guessing that you are not in the US. and BB = Boston Bain, not Bulge Bracket (at least I hope).

What geography are you at?

If Bain in Europe for example - take McK and never look back.

I like pickles...
 
mk2012:
BB entered the market much later so still playing the catchup game (though gaining market shares).

From this I am guessing that you are not in the US. and BB = Boston Bain, not Bulge Bracket (at least I hope).

What geography are you at?

If Bain in Europe for example - take McK and never look back.

Ah, good point. I totally thought he was saying BB = Bulge Bracket. Yea, if you meant Bain or BCG, you're already adapted to the lifestye, might as well go for McK.

 
  • Yes BB=BCG/Bain
  • I am in Europe (in a smaller city), in a more established market (US/London/Germany etc) this would not have been an issue
  • I can think of doing consulting for a few coming years, however as you know there are no guarantees in the up-or-out world so exit options are always important
 

BB means BCG in this case, since Bainies aren't tied to their office. (BCG is a huge pain when it comes to sharing resources with other BCG offices, McKinsey and Bain give much more travel opportunity.)

I'd say pick the Firm, but I'm biased. :) At McK it won't matter what office you work for because of the "one firm policy." You can get staffed anywhere in the world, on international teams, if you so choose. You get much more exposure and many more opportunities. If you wan to subscribe to the staffing newsletter in Thailand its a phone call away, whereas that would be near impossible at BCG.

 

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