^What BTbanker said. If the lifestyle simply isn't for you, I suppose some type of engineering would be ideal. Good lifestyle, good pay. You aren't "shooting for the moon" here, but you can live a damn good life.

Lets get real though. Pro athlete is the best.

 

I love this question. As much as I hated working in finance (and I really did hate it for 90% of the time) I would absolutely do it again. I think it all comes down to attitude. If your goal in life is to be a corporate bitch and get a six figure gig right out of college and rise through the ranks on a pre-defined path, then I just don't see how you don't eat a shotgun barrel at the end of it.

Conversely, if you view Wall Street as your personal ATM machine, you'll do just fine.

 

I'd do it again. I think that people often go about life in general in the wrong way, and that the most important thing is to situate yourself such that you'll be happy with your end results no matter what you achieve, rather than basing your happiness on what you've done and where you are. I would definitely go about doing things differently, but remember that hindsight is 20/20.

Another thing people need to consider is that there are a ton of engineers who say, "I wish I just got a job in finance," and plenty of lawyers saying, "I should have just been a surgeon," as well as a bunch of doctors saying, "I should have stayed in engineering," along with all the accounting people going, "why didn't I pursue finance?"

in it 2 win it
 

It was either finance or accounting for me; ultimately chose finance because of the potential to make more money (at least initially). Before that, I wanted to go into international relations because I love foreign policy type stuff but realized that government salary wasn't gonna get me the toys I want. So if I were to do it again, I most likely would do finance.

 

Yes.

The only thing I might have done first instead was Marine Corps Officer out of undergrad.

"If you want to succeed in this life, you need to understand that duty comes before rights and that responsibility precedes opportunity."
 
TheBigBambino:

Yes.

The only thing I might have done first instead was Marine Corps Officer out of undergrad.

Great point - if there was one thing I could have done it would be service in the armed forces, and from a young age. Again using that perfect hindsight: work my ass off to go to a service academy for undergrad, then begin my field assignment. Difficult as it may be to be out in the field, I think that the experience is probably one of the best things someone can have under their belt.

As far as intellectual challenges go and what I've learned: I think that this depends on your background and personality. I personally find the work satisfyingly stimulating for my head, but I know that it isn't like chemical engineering, nuclear medicine, or astrophysics.

And I've learned a lot about life and the world through my work, but I'm not sure that you wouldn't learn the same things in any other job...

in it 2 win it
 
TheBigBambino:

Yes.

The only thing I might have done first instead was Marine Corps Officer out of undergrad.

I was literally going to post the exact same thing. Not necessarily sure about Marines specifically, but perhaps Army or Air Force also.

I've actually been looking at OCS now for myself, for a variety of reasons. It's always been on the back of my mind, and part of me thinks it's now or never, since you hit an age cutoff at a certain point. I'm still plenty young (26).

A reason why I didn't after college is I didn't like the four year commitment. Looking back, that would be finishing up for me right now. I want to make sure if I do it though that I do it since it's the right decision NOW, and not just because it's what I wish I did. But I suppose you never really know for sure if you're REALLY doing the right thing.

I do think it would be interesting to work in intelligence, either military or things like the CIA or related agencies. I'm under no illusions that this is going to be "rah-rah America is the best" kind of stuff, and I'm not convinced of it fully yet myself, but it is definitely something I've been thinking about.

 

im at a good MM and recently got an offer (lateral already and I started in july) for an EB that luckily had an opening and I still am considering quiting all together.

the hours aren't even the worst part (90 hrs/week for me on average), its the fact that you do mindless turns in a deck or do work in a model that last minute you have to change like 20% of it and that's hours of work to re-do. the part I hate the most about banking is that half the work you do goes to the garbage/recycle bin and that you are helping OTHERS make $ and you get a tiny fraction of a percent of the money you MD brings in.

I would EASILY do start ups. no question asked. the best way to be an entrepreneur is not to do banking->PE->start your own company. its to just start it when you're young and have less responsibilities and less to lose and can take more risks. fuck banking.

I don't throw darts at a board. I bet on sure things. Read Sun-tzu, The Art of War. Every battle is won before it is ever fought- GG
 

Yes. The only thing I would consider switching is that I would have done Computer Science instead of or concurrently with Math so that I would be qualified for more of a quant type role. I do get to build models in my current role but nothing as complex as the quant guys are, I would enjoy that a lot.

This to all my hatin' folks seeing me getting guac right now..
 

Tough call here - I'd say yes, I would do it again. I came from Silicon Valley & I knew back then I didn't want to go into engineering or CS. Met a lot of high caliber people along the path, opps for travel & income I probably wouldn't have had if I branched into something else.

All the world's indeed a stage, And we are merely players, Performers and portrayers, Each another's audience, Outside the gilded cage - Limelight (1981)
 

I would definitely go into finance again - but with greater focus on investment management.

I started college as pre-med. When I became interested in finance, I first wanted to do M&A, then slowly shifted to investing. I completely passed on some incredible opportunities due to believing in the EMH. I didn't even apply to some great hedge funds that did internship OCR, and didn't interview with several asset managers that recruited on campus.

I managed to get into ER senior year, thinking it would provide more transferable skills than my IB offer. However, I overlooked the extent to which entry level buyside hires are sourced through the IB -> Headhunter pipeline. Although I've become a better investor working in ER, it's nearly impossible to get interviews.

It might just be my analyst, but sellside ER is as intellectually stimulating as banking, to damn it with faint praise. It has actually killed my enthusiasm for my coverage sector since I can't invest in any of the companies we cover. We're so model oriented that management / competitive position / strategy are all overlooked. We basically assume that the near future will look like the recent past.

 

Great post about ER. I have a major problem with investment banking influencing what equity research analysts publish. IPO's only want to choose major IB analysts that will always write bullish reviews. Yet, 5 years later, if that company doesn't give the investment bank any fees, they will close the research coverage also. So even if that bank was the top analyst covering that company, the bank would terminate the coverage if they aren't making any fees... It just doesn't add up.

 

It's not that bad post global settlement. Research analysts at a manager/co-manager of the IPO can't even speak about the stock for 40 days following the offering.

I mean you'd still think twice before rating something a sell, whether you underwrote the offering or not. Management doesn't respond well... really, a sell rating can be assigned safely under 2 scenarios:

(a) Valuation: the stock has done really well and run up. Mgmt generally doesn't take offense to that.

(b) The stock is going down in flames e.g. Zynga. You don't need to worry about the impact of your comments on future management relations... because the future is going to be quite limited.

However, although Spitzer reduced conflicts of interest, the quality of research is lower. Why? Analysts can't generate banking revenue now, meaning lower pay for analysts, meaning a brain drain to the buyside.

The quality of sellside research is atrocious on the whole, although there are a few exceptions. It's a lot of group think. When publishing your own estimates, the first thing you do is look at what everyone else is doing.

Not only that, but company IR departments will straight up have you send them your model. And since the sellside tends towards groupthink... it is very easy for management to massage earnings to fit consensus.

 

If I had to do it all over again I'd start off by getting a finance undergrad degree and not doing engineering. I would also have gone to a better school as I went to a top engineering school that didn't specialize in anything else so I would go to U of M (Ross) for my undergrad.

But in the end, my end goals would be the same. I can't help that I like this stuff.

make it hard to spot the general by working like a soldier
 

Why finance in place of engineering? Do you believe the acquired skills would have been of better use in the finance industry?

Victory at all costs, victory in spite of all terror, victory however long and hard the road may be; for without victory, there is no survival. Winston Churchill
 

Because I didn't like engineering. I graduated with a computer science degree and I didn't like that either. So if I would have just went for finance in undergrad I would be better off.

make it hard to spot the general by working like a soldier
 

Not sure. Always wished I could be some sort of traveling political/economic journalist/writer/philosopher/savant, who could spend their day reading, writing, meeting awesome people, and seeing awesome things. Sort of like Umberto Eco or Gore Vidal.

People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for freedom of thought which they seldom use.
 

If I could do it again I would probably pursue degrees in Biotechnology and Computer Science.

"He that hath a beard is more than a youth, and he that hath no beard is less than a man." ― William Shakespeare, Much Ado About Nothing
 

I would probably do finance again but there's still a part of me that wonders what it'd be like to do Marketing/Brand Management at a company like EA Sports / Nike / MillerCoors. It would be interesting if someone has a friend in this type of role who would do an "Ask Me Anything".

 

I started off in computer science before moving over to finance. If I had a dice re-roll, I'd definitely stick with computer science/engineering. Like most people have pointed out on the boards, everything in finance can be easily taught and seemingly anyone from any side of life can cut it in finance as long as you work hard and have a clue.

 

I would probably study CS/Physics as I was always good at math/physics and then later work in tech industry. Guess it's too late to change now.

"When a defining moment comes along you define the moment or the moment defines you."
 

Until I can pull that Edmundo Braverman "write for a living from anywhere" life, you better believe I'd do it again.

Actually, I'd do it right and actually be a finance major as well so I don't have to jump through CRE, GMAT, and MSF hoops later

Commercial Real Estate Developer
 

Most likely yes. I came into finance during the boom, so it's hard to say there were better options at the time. My stint in finance has given me a good pedigree and plenty of money, so I feel like I have a fairly unique opportunity now to re-calibrate and figure out what exactly it is that I want to do. Not many other professions afford that kind of luxury at such a young age.

 
Best Response

I would definitely do it again. Everything described above about the misery of making other people rich is true of any job where you don't have an ownership stake in the business. At least in a front office finance role, there is a very clear path to MD/Partner where you are essentially given the equivalent of an ownership stake (profit sharing). Most people go through their entire lives working for others and only keeping a fraction of what they produce.

Also, while the hours and type of work you're doing indeed suck at the junior-most levels, it gets better very fast. I stopped being responsible for modeling and most powerpoint assembly four years into my career. Compared to many other jobs, I consider this quite good. If had you asked me five years ago when I was starting my second year as an IB analyst if I'd do it again, I'd probably have said no. But once you're through to the other side, you're really glad you made the journey.

CompBanker’s Career Guidance Services: https://www.rossettiadvisors.com/
 
CompBanker:

I would definitely do it again. Everything described above about the misery of making other people rich is true of any job where you don't have an ownership stake in the business. At least in a front office finance role, there is a very clear path to MD/Partner where you are essentially given the equivalent of an ownership stake (profit sharing). Most people go through their entire lives working for others and only keeping a fraction of what they produce.

Also, while the hours and type of work you're doing indeed suck at the junior-most levels, it gets better very fast. I stopped being responsible for modeling and most powerpoint assembly four years into my career. Compared to many other jobs, I consider this quite good. If had you asked me five years ago when I was starting my second year as an IB analyst if I'd do it again, I'd probably have said no. But once you're through to the other side, you're really glad you made the journey.

This is gold. Someone give this man a banana

Commercial Real Estate Developer
 

Every one of my friends is either an engineer or computer scientist of some sort. The funny thing is, all of them wish they could go back and do finance and would switch jobs with me in a heartbeat. You guys really have no idea what you're talking about.

At least the pay increase in finance is worth the hours and work. Many engineering jobs outside of the top 5 companies don't pay nearly enough for the hours of coding you do. You also get no ownership stake either...same as in finance. The worst part is that you don't have enough money to go and venture on your own and being creative enough to come up with an app, website or product idea has nothing to do with what you studied or what your job is. Not to mention that college is straight hell when you major in engineering. My roommate was CS major and he never slept, had no time for anything other than work. It was as if he started working as an analyst in undergrad. While I hung out with friends, he studied and coded.

Yes, I wish i had studied CS as well but only because I feel that it would make me smarter and better at problem solving...not so I can be a engineer.

"Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's not a threat, that's a fact.
 
Will Hunting:

Every one of my friends is either an engineer or computer scientist of some sort. The funny thing is, all of them wish they could go back and do finance and would switch jobs with me in a heartbeat. You guys really have no idea what you're talking about.

All engineers and CS guys, your crew must really clean up at the bars. Entry-level petroleum engineers make equable salary/bonus to analysts often working less than 60 hours a week ($75k + up to 30% bonus at Breitburn). 95% of C-Level execs in oil/gas firms have engineering degrees, including hedge funds and private equity groups [yes, sometimes even CFOs]. If ambitious engineers get bored, they can lateral into finance. I have no idea what your mouth breathing group of friends is doing if they're jealous of your finance lifestyle

 
CaR:
Will Hunting:

Every one of my friends is either an engineer or computer scientist of some sort. The funny thing is, all of them wish they could go back and do finance and would switch jobs with me in a heartbeat. You guys really have no idea what you're talking about.

All engineers and CS guys, your crew must really clean up at the bars. Entry-level petroleum engineers make equable salary/bonus to analysts often working less than 60 hours a week ($75k + up to 30% bonus at Breitburn). 95% of C-Level execs in oil/gas firms have engineering degrees, including hedge funds and private equity groups [yes, sometimes even CFOs]. If ambitious engineers get bored, they can lateral into finance. I have no idea what your mouth breathing group of friends is doing if they're jealous of your finance lifestyle

First of all, judging somebody's "ability to clean up at bars" based on occupation is some kindergartner shit. How fucking old are you? And I feel bad for you if the first "fun" thing you can think of is hanging out in a bar.

Second, 3 of the guys in my group work at Goog/amazon/FB/MSFT etc. I'm pretty sure they have some of the best gigs an recent engineering grad can get. And from first hand experience, no the pay is not the same. Maybe it is close the first year (if you define a 20-30k difference close), but after 3-4 years it really is no comparison since their pay increases are not even remotely similar.

Congrats on using petroleum engineering as your example, btw. Chemical engineering is the least popular engineering degree at most schools that offer an engineering program. It is incredibly specialized and I wouldn't expect you to know that since you're spewing shit out of your mouth. People want to be in tech, that means ECE and CS. So yes, when you spend 13 hours per day coding, your life isn't much different than a 1st year IB analyst, except that you get paid less, and have no exit opportunities except to other engineering firms. You can go the start-up route but again, that requires creativity, balls, and the ability to convince people that you're worth it...which again, is something not taught in engineering classes.

"Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's not a threat, that's a fact.
 

Definitely would do finance again. Your upside is much higher than most other industries and the work is at least as interesting. You can get more responsibility at a younger age than most other industries. Everybody wishes they could do something different, but the reality is there aren't many better industries to work than in finance. The level of innovation is also quite high in finance, which also keeps it interesting. Consider that money market mutual funds were considered pretty innovative 30 years ago.

 

I would do it again and hope that I'm lucky enough that I get to be where I am right now. Having the power to make investment decisions on behalf of people at my young age is a fucking great feeling. Using the enormous amounts of information to try to logically problem solve and come up with the most well though out decision possible is intellectually stimulating. I love it.

For those who say Petroleum Engineering, its as cushy as it gets. However, unless you go on your own, you will just be upper middle class for the rest of my life. Not saying is a bad thing, chances are you will out earn 99% you know, but is not a path to great riches. This is coming from someone who's father is a high up at a major oil service company.

 

PetE or ChemE at an oil & gas or petrochemical firm definitely commands the high salary and low working hours you are talking about. I was personally offered 80k base +10-20% bonus for a 45-50 hr/wk chemical engineer job. Upstream jobs generally pay a bit more for similar hours. However, it's not necessarily a better lifestyle. Trust me, you'd much rather work 100 hrs/wk in an air-conditioned cubicle rather than working in a chemical plant or oil rig in the middle of nowhere in the Texas.heat. Also, as Will Hunting mentioned, the pay doesn't really go up that much... think 5-10% raises every year, whereas in finance you could be making twice as much in less than 5 years.

Working at a tech firm living in Cali does seem sexier, but I can't really comment on that. But the nice thing about engineering is that the average engineering guy is going to be much better off than the average finance guy.

 

I'm sure it will be worth it later in life, but I got a degree in engineering from a well-known eng school. I only stuck with it b/c I liked the challenge and thought employers would appreciate it as well. Turns out finance recruiters get all confused when you show up for an interview, badgering you about why you want to do finance (though I have a lot of finance internship experience). Much easier to get a job in IBD if you just get a simple degree focused on accounting or some shit..

 

Definitely. Work on the buyside is so interesting and fulfilling, I am likely to be involved in this in some way or the other until death. So many different content areas and sectors to learn about - and the learning experience apparently never stops, plus an incredible range of interesting personalities. I could also see high-end military career areas (basically special forces) being interesting and fulfilling, however finance has the advantage of potentially offering you true freedom vs. the military always being politics' bitch.

 

PetE is about as good as it gets when it comes to engineering. $95k base w/ 20% bonus isn't a bad deal for working about 50hrs a week. But like others have said the pay increase isn't as rapid as in some branches of finance. There are opportunities to make a great lifestyle though. A drilling engineer with 5-10yrs deepwater experience can go become a contract Drilling Supervisor in the Gulf of Mexico making $2,500/day working a 2 weeks on / 2 weeks off schedule. ~$450k gross with half the year off isn't too terrible if you ask me, and 90% of the companies pay your airfare so you can pretty much live anywhere. There's also the option of working in PetE, particularly Reservoir, for 2-4 years then going to an energy PE/HF firm (may require MBA if you can't sell yourself and learn the modeling skills).

Rise early, work hard, strike oil.
 

You guys seem to really hate your jobs. I think we need to have a discussion on why you even chose IB.

Once I did bad and that I heard ever. Twice I did good and that I heard never.
 

I am happy where I am right now, however there would've been other routes as well.

Medicine three people in my family are very senior medical professionals (surgeon and doctors) and, after residency and the steep learning curve, they seem to have a great lifestyle. I am very interested in this field but I don't know where I would have ended up.

Law I initially wanted to become a finance lawyer but changed to Finance literally at the last minute. However, law would have been interesting as well. One of my professors offered me an internship at Linklaters through his network, actually.

 
Beny23:

If not I would love to become an actor.

I'm very interested in that, @"Beny23". How would you do that?

"It's very easy to have too many goals and be overwhelmed by them... The trick is to find the one thing you can focus on that represents every other single thing you want in life." -- @"Edmundo Braverman"
 
Alexander Hamilton:
Beny23:

If not I would love to become an actor.

I'm very interested in that, @Beny23. How would you do that?

Asking yourself questions is lame.

People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for freedom of thought which they seldom use.
 

The fact that I've learned no real world skills in trading makes me want to do something different if I could do it again.

Most likely go into politics or foreign affairs if I could.

Fuck it. Making too much of a killing trading.

CNBC sucks "This financial crisis is worse than a divorce. I've lost all my money, but the wife is still here." - Client after getting blown up
 

Yeah finance was a good place to start for me.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
 

No. I'd be in grad school for a Phd in economics. Like you said, I felt like I was too far behind to start when I figured it all out, plus I didn't want to be poor for the duration of my 20's.

I'm starting grad school in the spring. I chose to do it anyway because there's always someone better prepared. If you think you have true talent for something you could probably be better than average...obviously a late start will hold you back in some ways but it's not too hard to be 51st percentile in a profession you're passionate about because putting in long hours to make up for lost time will come naturally.

 

"It's too late for me to study comp sci on my own now"

Why do you say that? There are code bootcamps all over the place that have great placement. There was a guy on here who left PE to pursue that path. Can't recall his name right now.

I think about your question from time to time. All in all, finance set me up pretty well (both in terms of finances and a good skillset). I wouldn't say that I LOVE it though... I have some friends that genuinely love what they do, but I am not (and never have been) certain what that might be for me.

 

As a former military man, I don't know that I'd necessarily recommend the military versus a civilian job as something good to have young. (background: military academy, top MBA, now in commercial RE)

Thoughts:

  • Do you have a passion for anything else? ANYTHING?

If so, unless it's specific to the military, it may not be possible to do that in the army. Finance, the arts, high level math/engineering. Those don't really exist on the level you are used to thinking about them. Think of an officer's job as working in GM/GE as a manager - middle management. That's most of it. Managing people, projects etc. Exception would be medical.

You can be a doctor. They'll pay for school, but demand a lot of your life. And you won't get compensated the same as a normal doctor. That's true of anything you get "for free". You pay with time. Your 20's are more valuable than a free education or the chance to wear camouflage.

When I resigned from the army, it was one of the best days of my life.

  • War sounds sexy. It's not.

Unless you are in love with the military, it's mundane. Just like other corporate jobs. And a deployment literally puts your life on hold for a year.

  • Location. No one wants the army next door.

The navy and air force have it better in terms of locations for bases. The army is located in some terrible places. Want to live in NYC, Chicago, LA? Too bad. Off to Kansas for you.

Related to passion. If you spend four years in a military academy and 5-7 years in the military, then immediately start an MBA to go into say....ibanking or consulting (the predominant follow-on careers) you are now 30-32 starting something new. And you won't command the same pay as the PE/HF, start-up, etc. peers who have stayed in one industry.

You also lose something in the way of creativity and intellectual depth. At least I did. I was in the fine arts in high school and was a mechanical engineer as an undergrad. Today I have stagnated artistically and couldn't solve (or even define) a Laplace Transform with a gun to my head. The army just doesn't demand massive intellectual capital. But then again, I'm finding that the corporate world doesn't necessarily demand it either...

  • It's not all bad.

You learn a lot about yourself, tend to develop a different outlook globally and on the things that matter, gain a lot of discipline, and potentially learn a lot about leadership. Would I do a service academy again? Yeah. Would I skip the actual army part? Yeah.

Before you convince yourself or your sons and daughters to sell their souls to the government in exchange for a college education or a good story, make sure you research a little past watching Top Gun and Saving Private Ryan.

 

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People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for freedom of thought which they seldom use.
 

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Aut explicabo et corporis quia officiis. Laudantium sed suscipit reprehenderit ratione et sequi. Quam placeat perspiciatis consectetur minus laudantium accusamus nostrum. Voluptas dolor alias sit aspernatur deleniti quis eum. Et molestiae odit et velit animi dolores sed.

Doloremque tenetur unde et recusandae. Doloremque non ea inventore laudantium veniam. Sit quaerat id neque sed non natus. Est dolorum quis eum non.

 

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Excepturi consequuntur est officiis et eum incidunt ratione. Dolores veritatis perspiciatis similique est vitae illo soluta. Eum molestiae beatae ut quos rerum consequuntur maiores accusantium. Animi consequatur voluptatem et non distinctio quisquam. Et est impedit ratione.

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