From Big 4 consulting to MBB
Hi all,
I have been working for a Big 4 strategy consulting division for two years now, and I am looking to shift to one of the MBB firms. On the company profile of the MBB firms on LinkedIn I see that most of the experienced hires in this firm come from the likes of Accenture, Deloitte Consulting, PwC Consulting, etc. Of course I cannot see in what division of MBB they start. Could be technology division at McKinsey for instance. What is your opinion on this: is a transfer from the strategy division of a Big 4 firm to a strategy role at MBB possible?
Kratos
Laterals from lower-tier firms will likely be one of two things:
1) Junior people who are strong performers at their firm losing tenure to make the jump as generalists - driven by one-off business needs (off-cycle spots) 2) Strategic hires of more senior people (managers and partners) in specific practice areas/functions they're trying to grow - driven by one-off business needs. Likely to also delay your career in the short-term.
In short, be good, willing to take a half-step back, and most importantly, get lucky.
or you could just go to B-school first.
from what i've heard from my MBB friends, you are gonna need a lot of that if you don't take the b-school route
I've heard it's possible but like others have said, you have to be good, and you need a bit of luck. Is there a reason you're not considering b-school?
He's from Belgium if I read correctly - MBA/ B-School is not that common in Europe. Probably already holds a Master's, then under some circumstances it might actually make more sense to get a PhD if you want to enter McK/ BCG/ Berger/ Bain in Europe.
I don't know how strong Big4 advisory is in Belgium, it will depend a lot on that. In Switzerland I believe they are fairly strong in strategy, in Germany not so much. Most people here can speak for the US market, but not really for other countries (apart from general advice).
As others have said, doable with a good dose of luck.
One thing I'd add is that the non-MBA hires from other consulting shops I know of have come in with at least 4 years experience, and have an edge in terms of deep experience in a particular function or industry.
Big 4 advisory (Tech Consulting) to MBB (strategy) (Originally Posted: 01/10/2015)
Hello folks,
I am pursuing a graduate degree from one of the top 20 US B Schools. I received a summer internship offer from one of the Big 4 in their advisory practice (tech consulting). I am looking forward to joining the firm full time if I get an offer after internship. My long term goal is to transition to strategy consulting at MBB,
Little background on myself: 2 year experience at a top software product company. Currently pursuing masters in Information Systems.
I am considering the option to doing an MBA after few years at Big 4 firm. My main issue with this option is that I will be 27 by the time I start working and most B Schools have average age of ~ 28. tldr: I will be too old to make it to a good school.
What do you folks suggest as a good option?
A) Join big 4; try to move to strategy consulting and network my way up to a MBB job
B) Work in tech consulting at Big 4. Do an MBA (Executive) and recruit on campus for a MBB position
Looking forward to your suggestions and guidelines. Thanks In Advance.
Neither.
1) 27 is not too old for an MBA at a good school.
2) You're only doing an internship this summer. Do well and get the offer, and apply at MBB full time. If things go well, you've met your goal. If not, work at the firm for a few years, do your MBA Full time, and try again.
Big 4 Acct. Advisory -> MBA -> MBB? (Originally Posted: 01/11/2016)
Hi WSO,
Long-time reader, first time poster.
I need help on my career plan over the next 2-5 years. My mission is to get into MBB. I enjoy consulting and I think it will be a great fit for a few years at least.
I went to a mid-atlantic school of similar caliber as BU or Northeastern. I had planned to go to WUSTL or Tufts but I was kicked out of prep school Senior year for drinking. My SAT is 2110. I had a 3.6-3.7 GPA in college.
I started in Big 4 audit for 2 years where I won an 'Employee of the Quarter Award', worked on a tech IPO and in-charged a carve out audit of a defense subsidiary with $1bn in revenue. I did well and I leveraged that after two years to land a job in 'Accounting Advisory' at a separate Big 4 at a 30% raise. I am now 2.5 years into my career and a CPA.
I want to do an MBA and I want MBB - my questions include: when seems right (am I waiting too late) and will I have an okay resume with 2-3 years acct advisory pre-MBA for post-MBA MBB?
My current idea is (1) to level 1 CFA in December and level 2 CFA in June, (2) Study GMAT in Summer 2017 and (3) apply to MBA M7 + Berkeley in 2018.
Questions:
I would start the MBA as a 28 year old and join MBB at 29-30. Is that too late? Should I try earlier and not do a full 5 years (2 audit, 3 advisory) at Big 4?
Is accounting advisory/CMAAS advisory at all attractive to MBB? Obviously, its not strategy consulting or FDD but I work primarily on transactions and revenue recognition. Any advice or comments on this career path are greatly appreciated.
Is there any point to the CFA for MBA/MBB? I want to do it to get a firmer grasp on finance and boost resume going into MBA applications. Are there other certifications that might be wiser to spend time on pre-MBA instead?
Thank you for your time.
As someone who joined MBB after my MBA, please see below for my perspective:
Unless you think that fifth year is going to improve your chances at getting into a better MBA program (and it most likely will not), there is no point in waiting. There are plenty of MBB MBA joiners that are 30+ so age wouldn't be a concern but rather, it's not going to do much for you.
I've met a decent number of people with your background so it's definitely not unattractive. In fact, MBB takes people from a variety of backgrounds so as long as you can network well and kill your case interviews, your pre-MBA career won't have a material impact on your chances.
In my opinion, there is no need for a CFA for either MBA or MBB. Is it good knowledge to have? Absolutely but I'm just not sure that it's worth it if you stay in consulting. All the finance that you will ever need to know at MBB can be easily picked up in business school. If I were you, I'd focus my time on studying for the GMAT and crafting your "why MBA at X school" story.
Just my two cents.
Is it possible to move from Big Four Advisory to MBB? (Originally Posted: 11/15/2012)
Hi, everyone!
Is it possible to move from Big Four (Consulting/Advisory) to MBB? If so, how?
I am graduating at the top of my class with honors, research, and great leadership activities. However, I am attending a state (non-target) school (full ride). I interned this summer with PwC advisory and am headed to an EY rotational advisory program. For what it's worth, I am hard-working and smart...but I am also creative, social, and good at interviewing.
Thanks!
everything is possible unless they drug test you
you are also very modest person.
about the smart part - the "asian.." nickname is not the best choice..
Big 4 vs MSc => MBB? (Originally Posted: 01/16/2013)
Hello everyone,
I'm currently interning in Big 4 Consulting, in the Europe, and from the discussion with the managers, it may be possible to get to an FT position later on.
I like my current firm apart from the fact that they don't really train juniors and there are quite a lot of operational projects.
I'd like to hear your opinion on staying with the firm or on going for a 1 year MSc in Management at a top 10 EU university and then trying to break into MBB.
Thanks in advance.
A 1 year MSc in management is money down the drain. The only management degree that adds to your MBB chances is an MBA.
You are probably talking about the US recruiting. Msc's add value or are pretty much a prerequisite for most positions in EU.
OP, Imperial/Warwick's 1yr Msc won't add much and firms hire mainly for regional offices from other top schools.
Yeah is that true? Give us a link. What a load of sillyness. MScs enable you get to get a PhD later on -- not have access to larger recruiting pool -- even in Europe.
Yes, I can confirm this. Without a Master's degree you can't apply to most of the good jobs in Europe and will generally be disadvantaged. From my experience, more than 90% of my fellow students started their Master's studies within 1 year after completing their Bachelor.
It's a different system where an MBA usually only adds value for non-business students.
Not perfectly sure if all this holds true for the UK though, but definitely for continental Europe.
At least 90% of the consultants that started with me had a MSc. If you don't plan on staying with Big 4 consulting in the long run and you want to stay in Europe, get the MSc. From your Big 4 position, it will be very difficult for you to get into a good enough MBA program so that you can transfer to MBB and it will take a lot longer than one year.
In Germany Master's are still standard with Consulting companies such as McK encouraging people to get a PhD (or MBA when from unrelated disciplines) after a two year stint.
Hello again everyone, Thanks for all your answers. I'm especially glad to see that it wasn't just me who thought that MSc Degrees are a prerequisite for MBB in Europe. As "atleastimnotabanker" and "marcrich" said, I also believe that you can't really get into MBB w/o a presigious MSc.
That being said, to be honest I don't really think that I would get too much knowledge from a 1 year MSc. which would be transferable to MBB. Especially considering the training that MBB puts you through.
I was also wondering if it wouldn't be easier to stay 2 years in Big 4 consulting and then transition to MBB as an experienced analyst. What do you guys think? Is it possible to get into MBB from Big 4? especially considering the differences between consulting projects.
What I also found interesting was that you guys think it's quite hard to get into MBA from Big 4 consulting. With regards to this, what profile do you think would have better chances: 1. 26 year old w/ a couple years of undergraduate work experience of and 4 years of Big 4 consulting experience (of which 7 months internship). or 2. 26 year old w/ 6 months internship, 6 months Big 4 consulting, 1 year MSc and 2 years MBB.
That's the end of a too long post. Thanks again for your help. It's of great value to me to hear your opinions.
Cheers
They don't care, it's more about the prestige and academic inflation in the EU which is starting to creep into the UK because of the recession.
If you want to get a fair shot at MBB then an MiM at LBS is probably the best option because it gets recruited HARD for consulting (and IBD it is pretty gearded for consultancy). Then Oxbridge > LSE > Warwick, Imperial, Manchester
Due to the ridiculous UK fees for an MSc, and having spoken with a few LBS alumni, the ROI is pretty bad, unless you get hired in the UK at MBB, which rarely happens.
I believe that continental Europe has a few pretty good schools and you could get by cheaper. I was thinking a bit at Rotterdam since the MSc costs about 2k Eur and is well ranked (albeit not as good as LBS).
Is a Big 4 Consulting internship valued by MBB? (Originally Posted: 07/24/2015)
Hey all, just wondering your thoughts on what MBB thinks of big 4 consulting internships. Is it positive, negative, in the middle..?
Positive
If by big 4 you mean Deloitte, then positive/neutral. The others? I'd say neutral/negative. Did you apply to MBB for the internship and got passed over?
I'm at MBB and did a Big 4 (not Deloitte) consulting internship the summer before my senior year. While it certainly wasn't bad experience, I think they were far more impressed by my previous internships and academics (I would elaborate but it's rather unique, don't want to give myself up). So try to distinguish yourself in other ways, don't rely too much on leveraging Big 4 alone
I'm a recent MBA grad, interned with Deloitte, and at least 4 of us are going to MBB for full-time. Another classmate came from a non-Deloitte big 4 firm and is interning with MBB. Based on that, it seems that there is some upward mobility around the MBA level, and probably holds true in undergrad as well.
MBB hires far less for summer than for full time, so it seems like it would be pretty positive to get an internship as close to big-time consulting as positive.
I would say it's neutral. It's a nice brand name on your CV but it's not MBB or BB bank.
I worked in a MBB where sometimes they hired people with 1 or 2 years of experience at Deloitte (or other big4), and the hired used to start as Business Analyst lvl 0.
Taking the Leap - Big4 to MBB - Possible? (Originally Posted: 07/28/2011)
Hi Everyone, The recruiting season has finished here (australiasia), and i have been lucky enough to receive an offer from a big 4 firm as a strategy and ops analyst. While this is an awesome result ( getting into ANY consulting firm is a pretty awesome acheivement) this was definitely not my target - rejected straight up from most top tier firms, and made it to the interview stage at L.E.K. Anyway, i was wondering, what is the liklihood of moving from being a 1st year analyst at a big4 firm to a MBB firm after 12 months? surely MBB's would prefer an analyst with 12 months actual consulting experience to a fresh grad? any thoughts/opinions/ advice would be greatly appreciated!
Best bet: You straight out of campus? If so, do 3 yrs Big 4 S&O (I'm guessing Deloitte, right?) > M7 MBA > MBB easily.
Hate to say this but MBB don't prefer people with experience to young grads for entry-level roles.
+1 for the maximum likelihood reference. And I've never heard of it either, but I have some sort of prior belief that it's not truly impossible, so your odds are slightly higher than zero.
mxc is 100% right. Hence suffering for 3 yrs then hit up an M7 MBA does wonders for you. Just make sure you get on the mega, serious projects that MBB will identify with when you're making your move post MBA.
Advice on making a move from Big4 internship to MBB full time (Originally Posted: 07/24/2011)
Hi everyone and thank you for reading my post. I am just completing my Big4 advisory internship in a CIO consulting type group. I am on a global fortune 200 client in an associate role for 2 strategy/technology projects and I would consider myself a leader in my intern class. I would like to make a move to an MBB firm for a full time position and I had a few questions to pose to the experts.
Some background - I am a computer science/networking/information systems student from a very small non-target school.
"McK BTO"
Bingo.
Its difficult, BTO would make more sense. Practice your cases, anyone with a big4 should get interviews...
MBB looking down on big 4 internship (Originally Posted: 08/26/2013)
--
Try some humility "Mr. Flawless"
But in all seriousness, I'm trying to figure this out too. My understanding is that it should be fine, and in fact, score some points (you're doing consulting at a big-name firm after all)
lol at all the comments. i actually come across as a very humble guy, but thanks to everyone just wanted to make sure i wasnt damaging my experience
It won't be as impressive as another MBB. It will be more impressive than someone with lower tier consulting experience or none at all.
I think the fact you sound like an arrogant prick will be more damaging to your candidacy than PwC on your resume.
Source: A former MBBer who went out of their way to ensure pricks they met on campus did not get interviews.
Just trying not to sell myself short, I think the anonymity of posting on a forum gives people the right to be honest - - and rereading my post i don't think I sound arrogant at all. I was just trying to provide my credentials and stress the fact that I've always interviewed very well - - and believe me I've done enough menial manual and service jobs from early on in my life that I know very well how to hide and maintain my "confidence".
And a banana to Peter for keeping jerks out of firms.
Peter is spot on.
Low emotional intelligence, you'll have a tough time in the working world. G'luck.
sticks and stones son. already in the working world and doing fine
Big 4 ---> Tier 2/MBB (Originally Posted: 07/26/2016)
Graduated in 2015, been with Deloitte's Tech Practice ever since as a BTA. 1 year off from a promotion, and I have two (really 3) options
1: I'm opposed to going back for my MBA at this point in my career, as I believe I'm just not ready for that process/commitment...maybe down the road.
2: Also opposed to this because I don't see myself going all the way with Tech Consulting. I work in the Federal practice so the constraints that come with that have started to make me feel like a government drone.
3: I'd kill for a spot at OW, BTO at McKinsey, and literally anything with an MBB (open to relocating...even internationally). At some point I'd like to steer my career towards a spot at an MBB, so if I could lateral it'd be optimal.
Again...1 year with Deloitte Tech....trying to be realistic, but 99% of the people I work with are in that Deloitte Tech for life mindset, so I'm hoping someone on here can give me advice from a different perspective.
You are too young for your mba because you don't have enough experience yet. Your best way to transition to MBB is to go to an MBA business schools">m7 bschool in 3 years and use on campus recruiting to get an offer. It will be incredibly hard to lateral out of tech
Thanks for the reply. Pretty much agree with you! But I was wondering if it'd be possible to lateral to a tech position at an MBB? Do they even hire experienced for those roles? Specifically pointing to the BTO role at McKinsey.
get promoted at Deloitte, top mba, use that to leverage MBB. however i would ask what you think that you will get out of MBB that you are not getting out of Deloitte. Likely much the same work maybe with more prestige factor? does not sounds like its worth years of work as a goal. maybe make your new goal what you are going to do after tech
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