Life insurance company Real Estate "prestige", and exit ops
Hey everyone, I've been reading through a ton of really useful threads on WSO with regards to the various divisions and movements throughout the RE industry. However, one thing that I found that was not really discussed frequently is where life insurer real estate analysts fit in the grand spectrum, and exit ops.
I'm interested in eventually making it to a large REPE firm, or potentially a top tier REIT firm. I'm curious about what potential path I might be able to take in order to get there. I'm not sure how favorably/unfavorably my resume will be looked upon, especially among the plethora of candidates who have entered the REIB programs. I recently graduated from a top tier university with a finance degree, and an average GPA. My current program will give me good exposure to all parts of RE, but I'm wondering whether I have a chance to directly make the jump (if so, how will I have to prepare for it), or whether I should just aim to make a lateral, or to wait a couple of years and try to apply directly for a top tier MBA and then go through recruiting.
Also, another question with regards to the REPE (and REIT companies) and the skillsets they are looking for. Would they prefer more debt-side experience or acquisitions experience?
I would really appreciate some advice, especially for those who might have a similar background, or anyone who might have some colleagues who have come from similar backgrounds. Thanks!
I don't have any advice as I am in the same exact position...just to add on to your comment, I feel that what I am doing is typical of any investments shop and includes the following:
Debt Analysis($5m-$30m for all asset types) - modeling / market / tenant analysis Equity Analysis (Always with a local partner and our investment is similar to the above) Some Asset Management (Yearly reviews, Major Lease Approvals, Sell/Hold Analysis for REOs) Relationship Building with Brokers and Local Operators Investment Memo Write-ups for Formal Investment Committee
If there is anything missing that analysts at 'True RE' shops are doing, please let me know so that I can make sure to become viable candidate in the future..
How out of reach is a top debt fund or REPE - is an M-7 MBA a necessity?
I have one example of a guy I know who left a lifeco analyst/associate role for a top 3 MBA before bb REIB and then a top REPE. If you ask him why he did it, he'll say he felt like he was in a pretty narrow role and wanted to become more flexible across the capital stack etc. And I guess he accomplished that, and I'm sure he is making a boatload, but I can't help but wonder if he could've eventually made the leap without the MBa. Maybe NYC really is that competitive? He was at a very respected lifeco. One would think that if he wanted to do REPE, he could at least go to some small fund, even if he had to move to San Diego or some shit. Guessing he wouldn't be making the same amount of money though.
Kinda sucks because I've seen very experienced, very well-off real estate guys express great respect for top lifeco experience.
I don't think there would be any great reason stopping you from going from Principal Financial to Colony Capital other than a) prestige and maybe b) lack of m&a/corporate experience. And (a) is obviously bullshit, but that's what you get when you're jockeying for the highest paying jobs in the real estate business I guess... it's a fucking rat race, what can I tell you ....
+1 to this. The MBA makes it easier but definitely doable without (acquisitions for a smaller REPE group --> top REPE)
Have to move to San Diego or some shit? San Diego would be great dude.
I think it really depends on which life co you are talking about.
There are the Standard Corporations/Nationwides that deal with the smaller stuff and act/feel more like regional banks, there are the New York Life's/TIAAs that are almost exclusively core/institutional, there are the Prudentials/Metlifes that play a bit more across the spectrum and then there is Cornerstone that is actually fairly opportunistic.
I'm at one of the big life cos working for a (relatively) small value add/core plus account at the moment. However, I have a debt background as well and when I was job hunting earlier this year, I was able to secure several really good offers (including a finance/debt placement position at a large fund and an originations position at a REIT), but ultimately decided to stay because I wanted to transition to equity.
We had a senior retail debt specialist leave earlier this year and a month later announce they were the new debt placement person at a top 3 mall operator.
About 3 weeks ago one of my colleagues announced that he was leaving to be a PM at a sovereign wealth fund that is a JV partner of ours. They liked him so much as their JV AM, when he mentioned he would be interested in moving abroad, they offered him a job.
Given, that is 3 people in an organization of 400+, where probably less than 5% leave in any given year. But I think there are exit opportunities if you look for them and use your network.
One of the best things about being a lender is that you generally have access to a lot of people across a very wide spectrum. And it is usually fairly senior people, even if you yourself aren't very senior.
I can't tell you how many closing dinners or golf outings I've been to where it was me as an analyst/associate + my lawyer and then the CEO/Principal/CFO of the borrower and their lawyer. You really can't get a better networking opportunity than that.
I will say that B school is probably going to be your quickest path to a top REPE/REIT job, but depending on your age/career and what your book looks like, you may not need it.
Curiously - where is the mark of delineation between the 'regional bank-like Life CO' and 'reputable Life Co'?
Is the categorization based on deal size, volume, or the complexity of loans?
My team works on everything from $5m-$30m but most of the deals have significant structure, earn-outs, and the like. I see GS teams that do similar size loans, does that mean GS/BS would be a possible exit op or is there something else going on here that i am not aware of?
I've always thought the easiest way to gauge was to look at who your borrowers were/which groups you lose deals to. If you lose deals to GS, then you can probably go there. If you sometimes lose deals to them, but mostly lose them to regionals, then you are probably on the regional bank-esque life company list.
Just sort of a side comment on this one -- getting a top MBA is not an optimal route towards a top REPE firm unless you already have substantial real estate / finance background prior to MBA. It's similar to normal top PE where there is limited scope for deviation around a desired resume.
It isn't quite as bad as IB or HF yet, but I do fear that the RE industry is moving towards looking for "perfect" candidates more and more.
Taking these last couple of comments back to Life Co's and how they are looked at in the industry (as far as exit ops and the such) -
wouldn't you consider spending time on a small team that does Equity/Debt (get exposure to both) 'substantial RE/Fin background'?
Or since the trend is moving towards the 'perfect' candidate am I doing myself a disservice by planning to stay on this team until an MBA?
Thanks everyone for the great advice and input,
With regards to this 'desired resume', do you think they are all mainly looking for REIB experience in analysts? Then does it seem to make more sense to shoot for an REIB position? (not sure how that move would work, or if the BB banks are looking only at fresh college grads, or MBA candidates, and if that's the case should I look into making that jump ASAP?)
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