Moving from Asset Management into IB / PE
I just finished my first year as an analyst at an institutional Asset Management firm (e.g. PIMCO, BlackRock, Vanguard) in New York. I'm on the front desk side, where I work in commercial mortgage-backed securities portfolio management.I graduated a year ago from a top ten school with an Economics major (my school didn't have an undergrad business/finance program). I wear a lot of different hats at my job. I've traded CMBS, assisted with new issue syndication for ABS, written macros to streamline various processes, looked at credit quality in new issue CMBS. I really like the people I work with, and I'm definitely learning valuable skills, but I have two main concerns. First, I don't think I'm particularly suited to a career in markets. It requires the ability to read quickly, absorbing massive amounts of information and synthesizing it--in short, a large working memory--and that information shortly becomes irrelevant once the market reacts. I've always been more of a problem solver (hence the Econ major) I enjoy the continuity of process-driven work (work that produces an end product, e.g. a model ). Second, we had rotations our first week on the job, and I was placed with the structured finance desk. This is also a concern because issuance parts of this market--namely, RMBS and CMBS--has largely died out since the glory days of 03-07 (think $30bn a year in issuance now vs. 500bn /year during that time period). In short, I'm worried that I'm learning structured finance-specific skills that will be irrelevant in a few years.
However, I've gotten to work on a number of opportunities for our hedge fund strategies. Most of these have involved me building a model from the bottom up, which I've really enjoyed. I liked the chance to get to know every aspect of a new business, and I also thrived on the variety of it.
This has brought me to the conclusion that I'd like to move away from financial markets into the private, dealmaking side of the industry. This will give me a modeling skill set and also prepare me for a management role later in my career, if I so choose. I did a boutique banking internship summer before senior year (didn't lead to an offer but it wasn't expected to). I interviewed with investment banks senior year, had a couple superdays, and got 2 offers from solid, smaller regional banks (think SunTrust Robinson Humphrey, Morgan Keegan, EdgeView) in locations like Charlotte or Atlanta. Ultimately, I chose a more prestigious firm as my first job rather than focusing on job function. While this may have been a mistake (i don't think it was...I've learned an incredible amount here), here I am.
Sorry for rambling, but the point of my post is this question:
How, and more importantly when, do I leave asset management for the private side, namely investment banking or PE? (probably IB, assuming PE firms typically hire IB analysts). I've thought about it, and I have the following options.
- Try to network my way into a bulge bracket firm right here, right now. I could also leverage my commercial real estate experience and excel/VBA skills and I'm confident that if I got an interview I'd be fine. I'd also spin some of the private debt deals I've worked on (e.g., mezzanine off-balance sheet financing). There is a risk of pissing a lot of people off at my current job (they trained me for a year and then I left...it's not really a 2 years and out program), in an industry that is pretty small. But if I really do want out of AM I guess that shouldn't be an issue.
I guess if I choose this, should I go before campus recruiting starts? also wondering if I'm being realistic....Ideally I should have posted this when I was applying for jobs senior year, but I was too busy doing other things (drinking).
I currently have a ton of friends in the industry so getting my resume under the right nose would be easy if I called in a few favors.
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Sometimes you have to step slightly backward to move forward in another direction. I could apply for boutique banking jobs in New York. This may be helpful because I'd still get the experience and skill set of being able to understand a company from the bottom up. Since I don't necessarily want to stay in banking long term (I'd love to move into VC or PE but those types of companies typically look for a banking background). I could also apply for ones that focus on industries I'm interested in (tech, real estate, etc.)
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I work at my current job for 2 more years, then apply for an MBA program. I then use the MBA program's on campus recruiting connections to apply for jobs in VC or PE (or IB first, then transfer to VC/PE later. The benefit of this is that I will have had a great deal more responsibility in my current role (I will have my own book,etc., and have tangible results to show for my work), even though it's in an industry that doesn't really interest me long term.
What do you think?
Questions/comments are much appreciated.
Only read title, but all I can say is that I did AM -> IB SA so it's definitely possible.
most people tend to move the other way IB -> AM. I think you have an advantage here.
Honestly, stay where you are. IBD is getting killed right now. Also, the ONLY reason most people do IBD is to get to AM/PE, so focus on PE....and yes, it's possible.
Even though my current role isn't directly relevant to a PE job? The thing is I'm not picking up a PE skill set right now.
hey so how did this go?
Asset Management for IBD? (Originally Posted: 07/13/2011)
Hey guys,
I can potentially intern at a big Asset Management firm during t he school year. Think (fidelity, putnam, babson) Would it be better to go to a no name VC/PE shop instead or go with AM?
I'd probably end up doing structured finance or quantitative bond investing at the AM firm.
also the PE shops are really tiny, 4-5 people, investments they consider are probably generating a range of 20 - 600 million in revenue on average.
edit: just saw the title. Even a tiny VC or PE shop would be better for IBD, but I'd be surprised if you could find a place that would let you work during the school year.
no name over am. anyday.
The kind of AM firms you've mentioned will be all sales and if you really want to do AM you'd benefit more by doing PWM at a place like UBS or ML. no-name VC/PE > PWM > Fidelity, Putnam, etc.
this is wildly backwards. pwm is more sales than almost all pure sales jobs. and this is coming from someone who spent a summer+ interning in PWM. it gives you 0 skills that are in any way transferable.
the big AM firms look so much better on a resume than some rando PWM job at one of the thousands of retail branches of UBS or ML.
i gotta disagree... Everyone here has to get the notion that there is only one path to IBD out of their heads and accept that you can get there by other means. If you're working at a big name Asset Management shop that is respected across the street, it depends on what you'd be doing and how you would spin it. Sometimes something that may not look like the "right choice" really offers a better option than you might expect.
PE > AM for IBD. turtles is right, they're gonna have you doing sales.
I would definitely try to get a PE internship over the asset management spot if you're interested in IB.
well heres the thing, I've already done banking and equity research at boutiques. The only reason I want another internship is to add some decent brand names on my resume to counteract my nontarget school name.
do you think, for the sake of getting through initial screening, would having something like fidelity / wellington / babson be better than adding a another no-name boutique in PE/VC/ER?
I've done internships at no-name IBD and equity research boutiques. I've also done a VC internship (twice) at a great fund that isnt very well known outside of their industry focus (and I am not as interested in that industry as some others).
Investment Banking after Asset Management (Originally Posted: 08/19/2015)
Hi,
have several questions here... First, I have been invited to interview with a big bank for investment banking, after spending the last 7 yrs in Asset Management - first as an analyst, now as a PM. I also did 1yr of Private Equity before going for Asset Mangement (changed because of the crisis..). Given my PE experience, I kinda know what to expect in terms of work, but what kind of questions can I expect in the interview? After all this time, I think it is clear I know valuation, excel, etc, so is it going to be more fit questions? Or what I think about the economy and where would I invest and the kinds of companies I usually invest in and why? Any ideas?
Also, the contact was made by a head hunter - and all I know the bank is that it is supposed to be big and international and it is for a role in continental Europe. How do I prepare for this kind of interview? What do I expect in terms of salary, working hours, etc from a bank in continental Europe (he told me it would be for France or Spain. I'm fluent in bith languages, so I'm actually looking fwd to that).
Then, Asset Management doesn't use the whole Analyst/Associate/VP/MD scale. At least the asset management firms I have worked for (all of them European) went for Associate/Analyst/Sr Analyst/PM/Sr PM. What would be the level for me, given that I have not much of a record doing transactions? Associate? As a general rule, would it be possible to climb the ladder quickly or would it be the usual 3 years? Would it be smart to go from PM to associate?
Thanks - I know I asked a lot, but any insight you have would help me a great deal.
If you are currently a PM (not a junior PM), then I would imagine at the VERY least you'd come in at the VP/Senior VP level. Otherwise, I'd question whether it's worth your time.
Yes, 3 years as a PM, the 2 years before as a jr PM/Analyst and 2,5 years before that Analyst (and about 10 months prior to that, Private Equity). I lack the transaction experience, though, and clients. Wouldn't that preclude me from going straight into a VP role?
Why leave to go to IBD?
Does an Asset Management Internship look good for IB? (Originally Posted: 06/12/2016)
I will completed my sophomore year of college next year, and I was curious as to whether obtaining an Asset Management internship would look good on a resume to help me obtain an IB summer analyst position my junior summer?
Anything in the realm of finance will help you land a summer internship for IB junior year. It's all about how you spin it.
Networking from AM to IB for FT (Originally Posted: 02/18/2018)
Hi everyone, I've been a long-time lurker on WSO, but this is my first post.
I'm currently a junior at a target school, and I have a summer internship lined up in the asset management division of a well-known endowment/pension/insurance co. I took this opportunity because it was my best option, considering I got into the recruiting process kind of late (had one IB OCI, didn't go so well). I'm definitely excited for this internship because I want to be in AM/HF in the long run, but I'm worried that if I accept this role for FT after graduation, I'll be extremely limited in my exit opps. I'm hopeful though because after some LinkedIn stalking, I found that past interns successfully made the jump to BBs.
As of now, I really don't have connections with anyone in IB, besides emails from a couple people I met at recruiting events. My question is, how do I start networking for a fulltime IB position without my summer employers knowing? Is it already too late to try for IB?
Does anyone have any advice?
Bump, just moved this to the IB discussion board.
Bump
In a very similar situation. Nothing to add but very interested in the answer.
.
Wealth/Asset Management to Investment Banking (Originally Posted: 10/17/2017)
Currently, a student at UC San Diego majoring in Economics. Let's say I get into Asset/Wealth management for a few years and then decide to transition into IB would they hire as a first-year analysis? or is it uncommon? Trying to find a way to get into IB.
Hi abt7786, check out these resources:
More suggestions...
Hope that helps.
Possibility of move from AM to (top tier)IB (Originally Posted: 12/28/2017)
Hey guys, I'm a current Junior at a semi-target who failed to get any SA offers from the top BB's/EB's this past recruiting cycle. I did receive an offer from a top tier AM firm, but I was wondering what the chances would be of re-recruiting into (top tier) IB for FT. In other words, how much of a disadvantage am I at compared to those who are jumping from one IB to another.
why do you want to move from asset management to IB? it seems like a lot of people want to do the opposite esp at a "top tier AM firm"
Career progression at the firm seems to be very slow based on Glassdoor and my own networking. I also want to eventually move to HF, which, based on my research, more attainable coming from a top tier IB rather than AM.
Hey how did the AM to IB transition pan out? I'm in a similar boat...
Turned out well. Here was the path CMBS asset management -> real estate PE within same global asset management firm -> REPE at different (better) firm giving me international work experience -> MBA from HBS -> technology growth private equity. Worked out but I think easier path would have been to apply for banking jobs pretty much around the time I made OP. This gets you looks from headhunters that don’t happen if you’re in asset management 2 years out of undergrad
Congrats, and thanks for following up. I'm actually in CMBS Asset Management right now. Thought about a path similar to yours, but played out the chess game, so to speak, and I'm starting a proptech company (I know how to code). Don't feel like waiting 10-15 years before starting my own thing...
Looks like it turned out alright considering OP is now in PE.
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