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5/30/11

I need a job badly and at this point I'm willing to do just about anything. I've been out of work for a year and I don't know what to do - every single one of my strategies has flopped. So long as it's legal I'm willing to consider just about anything. Otherwise I'm going to try and get a job at McDonalds - I figure it's better than sending out more resumes to black hole career sites. If anyone has any leads let me know.

Comments (324)

In reply to monkeysama
Best Response
6/1/11
monkeysama:
ProdigyOfZen:

Wait so you are financially "set" because of some wealthy (notice you did not say just rich) relatives and you are looking for a job? Dude just start your own business wtf are you doing?

I am sorry but I have very little sympathy for you in this situation since you are living off of your "relatives" money and are financially set. You are not like most people who actually have to work for a living. You just want to do it because its "neat"

Seriously?

You have no idea about my monetary situation and your ignorance is showing. It makes you look crass and stupid.

I have enough money to take care of myself for one or two years. That's not enough to start a business or buy a franchise - I've been unemployed a year and have obviously looked at all of my options.

I don't just want a job because it's "neat" and I never said so. You need to learn when not to speak, it will go a long way to making yourself tolerable in polite company.

Oh really? Becuase I think you just commented above that you want a job in finance because it is "neat" and because you are interested in the Finance sector.

Honestly you sound like a rich prick without any social skills. NO NO you have enough money to "take care of yourself in NYC" for the next one or two years. If you moved to Texas you could stretch that money into 3 years without spending tons of money in NYC.

This is reality kid You made yourself sound like a stuck up rich kid when most of the rest of the world would KILL to be in your position. Not having to work for 3 years because you had enough capital to live in one of the most expensive cities in the world?

And I am the crass and stupid one? I think you are the one who is not tolerable in polite company, I bet you come off as a robot or as I said stuck up rich kid. Just above you said that

"I can't wok on my social skills anymore because of x and y" Well there you go, you can't adapt.

I apologize for being harsh on you but your writing makes you seem like a rich prick who now has no other connections to get a job in the desired field of finance.

You sound like "I want a job in finance and SHOULD have it just because of my resume and background" Well sorry buddy that does not get you in. It is the ME ME ME I deserve this generation. No you don't deserve a job, or healthcare or money or anything else. You have to earn it.

The one who does not fall, does not stand up

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5/30/11

Do you have any internship experience? I know from your previous posts you are interested in trading, etc, but what internship experience do you have? Just curious if I can help or not.

5/30/11

PM me with a quick overview of your background or post here (two sentences, one education, one work).

Also where are you willing to work, location wise? Depending on your background I think I can at least get someone above and beyond HR to put eyeballs on your resume, the rest will be up to you.

Still not sure if I want to spend the next 30+ years grinding away in corporate finance and the WSO dream chase or look to have enough passive income to live simply and work minimally.

5/30/11

I live in NYC, so I'm looking for jobs in that area. I don't have any internships, but I did work at the Federal Reserve in DC for two years. Here's my resume:
http://www.razume.com/documents/20187

5/30/11

Education: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign 3.5 GPA triple major in math, stat and econ. 180 hours of coursework (120 is a normal course load). National Foundation Fellowship in game theory as well as a consulting position in the department of statistics.

Federal Reserve: I worked for two years as a research analyst at the Federal Reserve in the Emerging Markets Section of the International Finance division. I put together presentations that my economists wrote that went to the FOMC (Federal Open Market Committee). Think writing pitch books for Ben Bernanke and the Board of Governors. I also forecast GDP for Emerging Market economies (specifically the Philippines and Indonesia) as well as maintained and wrote some of the excel structure that kept my sections forecast programs running. Did ad-hoc research during down times with other section economists.

5/30/11

I only read the first section of the bullet points from your most recent job. You should at least try to keep everything the same tense. There are small errors where you use a past tense verb and a present tense verb in the same bullet, that should be a rather simple fix.

I screen a lot of resumes at work, and something like that really turns interviewers off because it represents lack of attention to detail which is a must for any wall street job, be it GS SSG or State Street back office.

As far as what you can do outside the usual "go network'' or "contact alumni" advice, I can't really help, as I have only worked for one firm since college. Perhaps some of the other apes on this board can provide better advice.

5/30/11

what the fuck. how do you not have a job with a 3.5 and a triple major?

"Look, you're my best friend, so don't take this the wrong way. In twenty years, if you're still livin' here, comin' over to my house to watch the Patriots games, still workin' construction, I'll fuckin' kill you. That's not a threat, that's a fact.

5/30/11

I'll see if we have openings that fit your background in NYC. Feel free to PM me later this week if you don't hear back. I have a mediocre job and am still pursuing IB, but it's finance and it's better than Mickey D's - perhaps it will give you more options.

Still not sure if I want to spend the next 30+ years grinding away in corporate finance and the WSO dream chase or look to have enough passive income to live simply and work minimally.

5/30/11

DAMN sama you're still looking for a job.

The answer to your question is 1) network 2) get involved 3) beef up your resume 4) repeat -happypantsmcgee

WSO is not your personal search function.

5/30/11

Dude, you do know there are temp agencies that will put you in JPM mid office, paying like 22.00 an hour.

In reply to TNA
5/30/11
ANT:

Dude, you do know there are temp agencies that will put you in JPM mid office, paying like 22.00 an hour.

This, I was offered this position with much lower qualifications than you a week before my FT offer elsewhere. I can probably dig up some of the temp agencies that were very good to me when I was in the NY area.

Still not sure if I want to spend the next 30+ years grinding away in corporate finance and the WSO dream chase or look to have enough passive income to live simply and work minimally.

5/30/11

Sure, any help would be appreciated. I know I should have a job, but I'm just terrible at job searching. It's not like I haven't been trying - my last attempt was to essentially email everyone at a hedge fund that I can find. I've got a stack of printouts of every hedge fund analyst and manager sitting on my coffee table.

I've used recruiters before, but never with much success. If anyone knows a recruiter personally or has contact information I'd be much obliged.

5/30/11

wow, Im blown away that you're not employed.... if I hear of anything I'll let you know.

In reply to Mzz
5/30/11
Mezz:

wow, Im blown away that you're not employed.... if I hear of anything I'll let you know.

Thanks. I know everyone probably thinks I'm omitting something or maybe have some serious hidden flaw, but I just think I suck at job hunting. It's sort of like prom all over again, except with people who wear loafers and cufflinks.

5/30/11

Hey monkey,

You have a solid background and are a smart guy, so I suspect there's lots of stuff you can land. Now, it might not be in finance, but who cares. Get a job that pays okay money, live cheap, and keep trading on the side. It might take years for you to become a successful trader, but maybe that's what you got to do. Get a job at an economic consulting firm, or even a job doing stats/econometrics. A lot of those jobs pay $50K+ in your first year and only require 40 hours a week. You can have plenty of extra time and money to keep trading.

5/30/11

Wow. sucks man. Sorry. Economy must be pretty bad. That said, you have a solid background. Only thing to say is persevere and keep looking. Same thing happened to a friend of mine, graduated from Oxford with PPE but could not find a job. Worked at a bookstore for two years before he got a break. Works at the IMF now. Keep at it.

Agree with ANT completely. Temp work is your best bet. Something relevant to your skills will surely be found.

DO NOT GO TO MCDONALDS!!!

Agree on the resume as well. Definitely change the tense of your wording (i,e. first two points, note produced and led as you have on the final three bullet points) and probably switch the education and work experience around. Usual method is education first.

Good job on the Fed gig. Kinda what I'm hoping to get into following my masters.

Good luck.

5/30/11

I have been trading on the side. Funny story, I've been putting together trading ideas and emailed a "big name" with "I think you should do x because of y" and got a response. Made me feel real good.

My best trade so far is that I got the silver correction right, so that's good too. I'm short Japan, Brazil, and the Yen carry trade at the moment as well as AAPL and CRM. We'll see how things go.

As far as McDonalds, why not? I certainly can't put it on my resume, but some money is better than none. I will be officially one year out of work by June 15 and I'll start going from Starbucks to McDonalds to Subway etc. looking for help wanted signs. At this point, it seems to be my best option.

5/30/11

Monkeysama,

I really don't think that is a good idea. For some reason companies love people that have jobs. To add to that headhunters love people who have jobs and don't want to leave their current jobs. In a way it makes sense, because if you are doing a good job at your current firm you will want to stay there and you are probably an employee that will succeed at other firms.

In the past year I have received 10-12 calls from headhunters, some with great offers. I would look for a job in finance/consulting/anything applicable and use that to work your way up. My friend worked at a F500 operations role and ended up working at HF 3 years later.

In reply to theATL
5/30/11
theATL:

Monkeysama,

I really don't think that is a good idea. For some reason companies love people that have jobs. To add to that headhunters love people who have jobs and don't want to leave their current jobs. In a way it makes sense, because if you are doing a good job at your current firm you will want to stay there and you are probably an employee that will succeed at other firms.

In the past year I have received 10-12 calls from headhunters, some with great offers. I would look for a job in finance/consulting/anything applicable and use that to work your way up. My friend worked at a F500 operations role and ended up working at HF 3 years later.

I know, and I completely agree. I just haven't been able to find anything applicable after searching for jobs for a year. I can't stand not doing anything anymore - I need to work, not because I particularly need the money as I have a little financial stability, but because it's driving me crazy not to. If you know of anyone or anywhere to get a remotely white collar job in anything I'll take it. But I can't sit on my hands anymore I have to be doing something other than fruitlessly sending out emails all day. I'm sick of it.

5/30/11

Damn man, this is nauseating. Good luck, if I hear of anything, you will be the first to know.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

5/30/11

what happened to your fed job? how did you manage to go an entire year without any work? :S

edit: take "Looking for a job in NYC. Willing to do anything." off of your linkedin dude, does not look good.

5/30/11

^I'm wondering the same...why aren't you still with the fed? I don't know if you are serious with fast food joints or not. but shouldn't you be able to hop back on the the fed or irs pretty easily?

good luck tho

5/30/11

Man monkeysama, I can't believe that your'e still out of work. Best of luck -- you definitely deserve a break.

In reply to LLcoolJ
5/30/11
LLcoolJ:

what happened to your fed job? how did you manage to go an entire year without any work? :S

edit: take "Looking for a job in NYC. Willing to do anything." off of your linkedin dude, does not look good.

My Fed job was a two year term job. Undergrads are cheap and they rotate them out so people don't stay there forever (government jobs can create situations where people will retire at their desks - there were some obvious abuses they were determined not to see repeated). As far as going a year without work, it's been a comedy (or tragedy) of errors. I don't know if I want to go through all of it, but I've had hedge funds want me to tell them what monetary policy was going to be before hand (real classy), boutique IB firms that were writing memos on how Bernanke is crazy and ruining the economy (and use me as some sort of analyst/evidence of the fact), transfer pricing firms that were very shady (I don't want to help companies avoid taxes - it's dirty). I could tell you stories.

Anyway, at this point being out of work for a year has essentially made me unhirable, I'm afraid. This is sort of my last appeal before I go and get any retail job I can find. I don't know what to do other than go into Manhattan and asking door to door if anyone is hiring. It's all I've got left.

editted linkedin like you suggested. Thought someone would take me up on it, guess not.

5/30/11

Also the Fed is sort of, at least in my section, a job/internship at the undergrad level. If you were there you were there as a two year term contract - undergrads are a dime a dozen when you want to fill a position at a place like that. PhDs were what they were interested in and the screening process was obviously intense.

5/30/11

Stop looking at it that way. Spin the hell out of it and use the name to your advantage. Sure IB analysts learn a good amount by doing repetitive work over 2 years, but a lot of people recruit them because of the rigorous nature of the I-banks' recruiting.

Being able to point to everything in your resume and say, "this was the most amazing experience because of x, y, and z" will by far be the most helpful. And don't kid yourself, even though you don't have a job you're definitely still a rockstar. Best of luck man

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

The WSO Advantage - Land Your Dream Job

Financial Modeling Training

IB Templates, M&A, LBO, Valuation.

Wall St. Interview Secrets Revealed

30,000+ sold & REAL questions.

Resume Help from Finance Pros

Land More Interviews.

Find Your Mentor

Realistic Mock Interviews.

5/31/11

Have you considered taking an unpaid internship at a boutique IB/consulting firm (given that you have financial stability)? I just graduated, don't have a job either, and am about to do that (actually in NYC as well). Your story scares the crap out of me honestly. I know the economy is bad, didn't know it was THAT bad.

5/31/11

You definitely have an impressive resume -- are you willing to relocate? Please PM me, might be able to help.

5/31/11

Are you at least getting interviews?

The answer to your question is 1) network 2) get involved 3) beef up your resume 4) repeat -happypantsmcgee

WSO is not your personal search function.

5/31/11

USe LInkedIn! Make a post in one of your groups you a member of and say who you are, what you're interested in and how they can contact you.

Make sure to keep it short and post in several groups to enhance your changes. Good Luck!

5/31/11

hang in there buddy. i job hunted for 2yrs before i found my gig. The recession really jacked a lot of good people.

All things are possible with Him i have to deal

5/31/11

If you want to avoid the whole job search, you can quickly and easily get a job at http://www.goworkit.com

5/31/11

Hey dude use a job search engine site like indeed.com, and just search for "analyst". You can find many jobs betterbthan mcd for sure.

Good luck!

5/31/11

st84at - I've been unemployed a year. If there's a way to apply for a job online I've done it.

Walkerr - I've linked to and sent private messages to tons of people in the financial community on linkedin. No dice. Although I now have a 1000 friends or so which is crazy.

blackfinancier - I've had about 12-15 interviews I think. I've lost count. That includes phone interviews but not necessarily phone discussions. My last set of interviews were 4 2 hour interviews after which they said they didn't want me. My favorite was that the interviewer wanted to know who my 'hero' was as if this were some sort of qualification for a job.

5/31/11

If those JPM BO temp things don't pan out, it probably wouldn't be too hard for you to get some kind of SAT or GMAT tutoring gig, which would probably pay way better than McD's and be maybe something you could put on your resume.

5/31/11

Maybe you've mentioned this in a prior post, but have you looked at getting an MSF or master's in economics? It seems like you're very well-qualified, but for lots of government jobs, I'm under the impression they want someone with at least a master's degree.

5/31/11

sofib09 - I'm not willing to spend the money on a masters degree until I have a little bit more experience and I see how the education bubble plays out. What's the point in going back to school and going into debt if I come out without a job again? I've seen it happen to lawyers and it could very well happen to MSF, MBA, etc.

5/31/11

Bumping this up until monkeysama gets a job.

5/31/11

Monkey,

If you have to work at McDonald's, then I guess you have to work at McDonald's. However, I feel like there's plenty of other jobs that pay better and you could land. Temp agencies, data entry, bartending, waiting tables, etc. A step above this is stuff that taps into your technical skills, such as stats/econometrics, programming, market research, actuary, etc. Somewhere in the middle is stuff like working at a non-profit, tutoring, etc.

Lastly, I'm not trying to be a dick, but you should ask yourself how strong your social skills are? I've never met you, so I have no idea. The only thing I know, is that some bright people get held back big time because people don't like them. If it's not your social skills, then how strong are your interview skills? Have you read interview guides and seriously prepped for individual interviews? Anyway, I'm not saying you should answer these questions in this thread, it's just stuff for you to think about. We know it's not your hard/technical skills, which basically leaves two things: 1) bad luck; and 2) bad soft skills.

5/31/11

unknown4ever - I like your style.

econ - It could be my social skills but I don't know how to improve them. Other than trying to eat right, trying my best to be a nice and courteous interviewee. There's really very little for me to do to improve myself there, I can't take a course or get a certificate etc. but I try my best and that's about all I can hope for. As far as other jobs, I just don't know where to start. Bartending might work, but I have absolutely no idea on how to do that. I'll have to think a bit about it.

5/31/11

Have you thought about trying to do a Mock Interview with WSO's service? They're doing that whole 50% off (so it's like $99 or something) and you get access to the Mock Interviews library for a year. Might be worth it to get some feedback from some experts

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

5/31/11

monkey,

Monkey, i feel you. i am in somewhat similar situation. i have my BA in Eco n Bus management, series 7, 55, 63. Been an equity trader the last 9 years. Did very well from 02 to 08, formed my own LLC, mkt crashed in o8, lost everything. Took a year off playing poker. did ok, but hate the life style...back to trading again...have not made anything the last 2 years.. tried online poker, it was showing some good results...then...black friday happened ( us poker players no longer be able to play online...) in fact i still got some money stucked on fulltilt and UB . now, actively looking for job, any jobs..but so far no luck..jobs that called me back were all sales jobs, which i hate..i need a job that pay salary or anything that i can pay my bills...my fiance is about to call off our engagement, if i dont find anything soon. I ahve some good friend that let me manage their tiny little Etrade accounts n if i make moeny i will get a cut from that n i am trying to take the CFA level ( not sure its a good idea, but since i have so much time...). Funny i also m shorting CRM....( this stock is so manipulated) anway, i wish you the best, pls knowing that, we have to keep our head up, and keep trying, be positive. It will come. Good luck to you

5/31/11

Wow dude I was just wondering how you were a few days ago. I know it's easy for us to say but don't give up man, I'll let you know if I have anything here on my end. Good luck.

People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis, you can't trust people Jeremy

5/31/11

best of luck sama--ive seen you looking for a job for far too long at this point. wish i was in any type of position to help out.

keep your head up man.

5/31/11

McDonalds? You have to be kidding, with a math/stats/econ triple major from a solid school?
At least just apply to office jobs, clerk somewhere for one of the myriad law, finance, etc firms out there.

6/1/11

jorge/leverage - thanks guys.

Gutshot - ok, sounds like a plan. Know anyone that's hiring? I'll do whatever you've got.

6/1/11

You showed desperation on your linkedin, which is something most HR people will look at during initial screening, then you said you have the names of every analyst, manager at certain hedge funds. Imagine you're working at a hedge fund and you get a random email with a resume and find out every person in the office got the same. Would YOU want to hire him?

6/1/11

Oh and your resume boasts 1410 on SATs, your GRE, LSAT scores and registered for CFA. Shows you to be an uncommitted directionless person. Firstly, who lists their SAT scores on a resume? Even if you had a perfect 1600. Then you took the exams for grad school and law school without actually going and now plan to take the CFA exam a year in the future.

Aside from inconsistencies in tense, which may be overlooked if you're some quant geek, you need to rethink your resume.

6/1/11

shera - ok...So I'm supposed to be aloof on my linkedin? Then you would say no one would hire me because I'm being to picky. I didn't email everyone at every hedge fund right away - I emailed one analyst and one PM every three weeks from each firm. I had a system and was trying to build relationships. I'm glad that you think sans any real input that I'm an "uncommitted and directionless" person. I put my scores on my resume as they are part of my accomplishments and show that I am at least moderately intelligent; enough to pass the exams anyway. Aside from your rambling insults, which may be overlooked as you're a huge douche, you need to rethink your criticisms.

6/1/11

Sama, time to narrow down to the very few u wish to work for and personally call the manager themselves.
And of cos, standard rules apply and pitch your ideas.

All the best!

6/1/11

Wow, this sucks. I was unemployed for about 2 months when my shitty little "I Bank" basically went under. I panicked. I ended up getting a role as an analyst at a F500, which was not what I wanted to do but has turned into a decent career.

Things to think about.
1 - Why are you set on NY? Are you living with your parents or are you there bc of the finance opportunities? I'm not a NY basher, but if you've struck out at the IB's, HFs, etc... maybe it's not the place for you. Plus the UIUC name probably carries more weight in the midwest.
2 - Are you willing to take a ft role at a corporation? If so, it shouldn't be that hard for you, but NY may not be your place. I'll warn you now - many of the roles will be more accounting based (boring) but you can set a great career path for yourself.

If you'd consider Chicago I may be able to help you a little more. I have a few connections in the types of roles you're really looking for, but many more in corporate. I also know a pretty good corporate recruiter out here.

6/1/11

I'm not an expert at getting a job in finance by any means. But I can say I've learned how to be fairly socially manipulative... So I'll say this.

Contact someone at a firm you want to work for. Don't ask for a job; ask if you can buy them a drink. Seriously.

Stalk some people if you have to. Look at those hedge managers. Find the location of their firm, wait til they get off work, see if they all have a bar or restaurant or anything they hang out, find a to strike up an innocent conversation with them in person, when they ask what you do you can explain your backround and your job search.

They might be able to help. I almost got a job at Chase because I DD'd for a friend of a friend who worked there. Meet the guy once, drove him home from the bar and from that point on he was helping get a job. Unfortunately he got fired so that plan blew up. But what I took away from that experience was it's really all about making people like you so they will give you what you want. Make of it what you will, but it is what it is.

6/1/11

I work for a PE firm here in Chicago and we had a few interns who bailed on us for the summer. What do you need to make?

6/1/11

I got my first intern job using LinkedIn.

6/1/11

DealMaker1 - I'm more or less financially settled thanks to wealthy relatives, but what I need most are friends and contacts. If you can promise me I might learn something and I won't just be getting coffee for people salary is negotiable.

Mammon - Man, I understand what you're saying. I've stalked some people (not literally of course), but I've struck out in any number of ways. I've yet to become creative enough to think of another. I've gone door to door to companies handing out resumes in the freezing rain (Chicago in January). I've called people at work and home. I've hung out at bars where people who work at places I want to work at work. No luck.

accountingbyday - I am definitely willing to relocate. I guess I went to NYC for the following reasons.

1 I always wanted to see the city and live here for a while.
2 NYC has 4 percent unemployment - almost entirely frictional.
3 It has great networking opportunities due to population density.
4 I wanted to get into finance and it is the heart of the financial world.

I'm not so dead set on finance as I used to be. It's something I think is neat and I'm passionate about, but at this point I just need a job, if to keep me from going batty. Definitely willing to go FT for a role in corporate if it has some sort of career path and I don't think the job will be outsourced tomorrow.

6/1/11

Wait so you are financially "set" because of some wealthy (notice you did not say just rich) relatives and you are looking for a job? Dude just start your own business wtf are you doing?

I am sorry but I have very little sympathy for you in this situation since you are living off of your "relatives" money and are financially set. You are not like most people who actually have to work for a living. You just want to do it because its "neat"

Seriously?

The one who does not fall, does not stand up

In reply to ProdigyOfZen
6/1/11
ProdigyOfZen:

Wait so you are financially "set" because of some wealthy (notice you did not say just rich) relatives and you are looking for a job? Dude just start your own business wtf are you doing?

I am sorry but I have very little sympathy for you in this situation since you are living off of your "relatives" money and are financially set. You are not like most people who actually have to work for a living. You just want to do it because its "neat"

Seriously?

You have no idea about my monetary situation and your ignorance is showing. It makes you look crass and stupid.

I have enough money to take care of myself for one or two years. That's not enough to start a business or buy a franchise - I've been unemployed a year and have obviously looked at all of my options.

I don't just want a job because it's "neat" and I never said so. You need to learn when not to speak, it will go a long way to making yourself tolerable in polite company.

6/1/11

Having read what you've written in the past 2 pages, I don't think anyone on this forum would be willing to hire you either.

6/1/11

dealmaker1 sent you a PM. Cheers.

6/1/11

If anyone else has any more ideas/suggestions/comments please let me know.

In reply to monkeysama
6/1/11
monkeysama:

DealMaker1 - I'm more or less financially settled thanks to wealthy relatives, but what I need most are friends and contacts. If you can promise me I might learn something and I won't just be getting coffee for people salary is negotiable.

...It's something I think is neat and I'm passionate about, but at this point I just need a job, if to keep me from going batty. Definitely willing to go FT for a role in corporate if it has some sort of career path and I don't think the job will be outsourced tomorrow.

Dude, your prior posts mentioned getting a job at McDonald's. I would like to think that getting coffee for people at a PE firm would be a much-needed step above that. If you can pull it off, go for it.

In reply to shera
6/1/11
shera:

Oh and your resume boasts 1410 on SATs, your GRE, LSAT scores and registered for CFA. Shows you to be an uncommitted directionless person. Firstly, who lists their SAT scores on a resume? Even if you had a perfect 1600. Then you took the exams for grad school and law school without actually going and now plan to take the CFA exam a year in the future.

That was the impression I got when I first saw it. Even if you're the most committed person with a very clear direction for your future, the mere perception of being uncommitted and directionless will be enough to put your resume in the circular file (i.e., trash bin).

Just my two cents, though, so if you disagree, then you disagree. No harm, no foul.

In reply to sofib09
6/1/11
sofib09:
monkeysama:

DealMaker1 - I'm more or less financially settled thanks to wealthy relatives, but what I need most are friends and contacts. If you can promise me I might learn something and I won't just be getting coffee for people salary is negotiable.

...It's something I think is neat and I'm passionate about, but at this point I just need a job, if to keep me from going batty. Definitely willing to go FT for a role in corporate if it has some sort of career path and I don't think the job will be outsourced tomorrow.

Dude, your prior posts mentioned getting a job at McDonald's. I would like to think that getting coffee for people at a PE firm would be a much-needed step above that. If you can pull it off, go for it.

Sure. I didn't mean to sound flippant. I just wanted to communicate that I want to do something useful and learn about the business.

In reply to sofib09
6/1/11
sofib09:
shera:

Oh and your resume boasts 1410 on SATs, your GRE, LSAT scores and registered for CFA. Shows you to be an uncommitted directionless person. Firstly, who lists their SAT scores on a resume? Even if you had a perfect 1600. Then you took the exams for grad school and law school without actually going and now plan to take the CFA exam a year in the future.

That was the impression I got when I first saw it. Even if you're the most committed person with a very clear direction for your future, the mere perception of being uncommitted and directionless will be enough to put your resume in the circular file (i.e., trash bin).

Just my two cents, though, so if you disagree, then you disagree. No harm, no foul.

Eh. I'm a bit touchy these days. I may need to rethink that part of my resume.

In reply to DealMaker1
6/1/11
DealMaker1:

I work for a PE firm here in Chicago and we had a few interns who bailed on us for the summer. What do you need to make?

Ppppfffff... I'll take the opportunity! I need to make whatever it costs to live there. I actually think I have long lost relatives in the area I might be able to crash with.

Intern at PE >>>>> What I'm doing now.

Can I PM you?

In reply to Will Hunting
6/1/11

just a fly on the wall,

If the glove don't fit, you must acquit!

6/1/11

Dude, have you tried consulting? You definitely have the requisite experiences and obviously a very good command of math and computer science. You could easily land something.

Try Boston. My grades/experiences are no where near as good as yours yet I have had some consulting job offers. You seem smart and from reading your posts you seem like you are way too intellectual to work at a bank. I think consulting would be great.

Also you may want to try some staffing firms.

I am not cocky, I am confident, and when you tell me I am the best it is a compliment.
-Styles P

6/1/11
6/1/11

eokpar02- I have tried consulting but no luck.

jimz - Hadn't heard of that site. I'll give it a shot. Thanks.

In reply to monkeysama
6/1/11
DealMaker1:

I work for a PE firm here in Chicago and we had a few interns who bailed on us for the summer. What do you need to make?

monkeysama:

DealMaker1 - I'm more or less financially settled thanks to wealthy relatives, but what I need most are friends and contacts. If you can promise me I might learn something and I won't just be getting coffee for people salary is negotiable.

Clearly the wrong answer, Monkey. How can you title a post "Need Job - Will Take Anything" and then answer this guy in that way? The correct answer would of been, "I'll get coffee, as long as you pay me $X" (which shouldn't be many multiples of a McDonald's employee, assuming you haven't been bullshitting us all along).

6/1/11

econ - take the answer for what you want. I need to be able to learn something in the job. If I'm going to be used as a valet and not learn anything then the job is comparable to a job at McDonalds. I'm indifferent to money - it's knowledge and experience I need.

6/1/11

If you're financially set to live for a couple of years as you said, why would you even contemplate working at McD? Are you so pessimistic on your chances that you'd work there? Take it from me, I worked in all sorts of crappy jobs when I was an undergrad. You get in and its hard to get out. Not saying McD will offer you massive benefits to keep you on or anything but the security of a job, even this job is the softest cushion known to man.

Some people have the drive and determination to break out of there but honestly, judging from your posts, you dont strike me as that someone with the drive or edge.

Completely agree with Econ, with the contradiction in your posts, I dont think I would hire you. PE firm offering to speak to you about an internship, jump at it.

I was offered a job at Credit Agricole, unpaid for several months before evaluation and I was considering it. That's before I was slapped with reality by WSO and jumped at it even though I dont live in London currently. I travel in every day. Its a nightmare but I do it. This is coming from an Oxford graduate, and I hold a master's from UCL, think ivy league in US.

And the issue with your resume, completely agree. Red flag to note your attempts at law school etc and not going ahead with it. I have the toughest time to explain why I quit my job at a law firm to change career directions so good luck explaining that.

Cut the crap and speak about the position at the PE firm. Good luck and let us know how you got on.

6/1/11

Hmph.

I distictly remember some guy on this forum audciously declaring that he would stand in front of the CBOT building and hand out resumes until he got a job or his balls froze off.

Where'd that guy go? I liked him: he had balls!

Now whoever's siezed control of the Monkeysama account is saying that he's had 12 interviews and has nothing.

Put another way, he has a list of 12 companies and 12 names and 12 email addresses and 12 telphone numbers of 12 contacts of people who will put you on their payroll *tonight*...

..But...

...Gosh, golly.....

...Darn...

....Gee wiz...

you can't think to figure out how to follow-up.

What, they hired some other guy and said no to you? So? People get fired, promoted, quit all the time. The employer has a choice of combing back through that 50,000 or so resumes that have piled up, or you could step in and drop 'em a line and hint that you could be the guy they're looking for, saving them the truoble.

Think about it: they fished your resume out of the 50,000 look-alike resumes thay have on file, they saw something they liked enough to clear their day and bring you in, they've interviewed you and were ready to pull the trigger, perhaps to you or to the other guy who maybe tied with you.

They went with another guy who was maybe tied with you.

And?

Give 'em another shot, perhaps this is the one...!

If you have any misgivings, feel free to give me that list of 12 companies and 12 names and 12 email addresses and 12 telphone numbers of 12 people that are actively interviewing and hiring people and I can auction it off and make a little extra coin. Why not? You ain't doing anything with them....!

6/1/11

While there are contradictions in your posts, I understand what you're looking for. You want a job/internship that will get you experience and give you connections that you can use to further your full-time job search.

The main problem I think your having is letting emotion get in the way of your job search. Can the job search be frustrating? Yes. Do you want to let others see your frustration? No. As soon as you let negativity creep into the search, it's the first thing a recruiter/HR person will pick up on. Thus why people were giving you hell for making your LinkedIn status or whatever what you made it.

You need an outlet for the frustration, pick up boxing, squash, tennis, etc. Just don't let the desperation or frustration get in the way of what you're trying to accomplish.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

6/1/11

DanceswithVols - 3 weeks getting drunk at all the trader bars. Going door to door to all the trading houses and giving my resume to reception. I handed out my resume at CBOT to people smoking outside. My failures are not for lack of trying. I'm not following your reasoning - they interviewed me and rejected me after speaking with me. How does this make them more likely to hire me in the future? They know as much as they can about a person before they hire them and they don't want me. Yes, they were hiring - for 1 position six months ago. So what?

FinancialNoviceII - Many people are reading a lot into very little that was actually said. I said that I was interested in learning and accomplishing something. How this is viewed as a bad thing is beyond me.

In reply to D M
6/1/11
D M:

While there are contradictions in your posts, I understand what you're looking for. You want a job/internship that will get you experience and give you connections that you can use to further your full-time job search.

Yes, thank you. You understand. As far as frustration goes I do what I can.

In reply to monkeysama
6/1/11
monkeysama:

I said that I was interested in learning and accomplishing something. How this is viewed as a bad thing is beyond me.

Yea, after you said 'Will take anything' which probably has people confused.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

In reply to happypantsmcgee
6/1/11
happypantsmcgee:
monkeysama:

I said that I was interested in learning and accomplishing something. How this is viewed as a bad thing is beyond me.

Yea, after you said 'Will take anything' which probably has people confused.

Oh, I see. If I would work for someone for free at a PE firm and I would get no marketable skills and not learn anything then I would be better off at a McDonalds job as I would be getting paid. I'm indifferent to money, I just don't want to be taken advantage of. I can see how this has some people confused.

6/1/11

"My failures are not for lack of trying. I'm not following your reasoning - they interviewed me and rejected me after speaking with me. How does this make them more likely to hire me in the future"

Really?

The first full-time job I ever got was a runner at the CME. I got the job *after* the guy they originally chose, quit after a week or two.

In other words, they interviewed me, rejected me and chose someone else. That guy quit. Then I got my shot.

As far as working for free, I worked for free then entire summer of 2004 just to get a shot at a trader position.
At first, I was offended ("How dare they? I have experience. I have a Master's.")

Then I read a NYT article about how students who wanted to work at the U.N. were required to work in a free internship first (and somehow afford to live in the most expensive city in the US at the same time). Those who didn't have the internship would not be selected, no matter where they got their degree.

That changed my mind and I was "F- yeah, I'll be an assistant trader at your desk for free for the summer! I'll be the best f'n assistant you ever had!"

Oh, yeah, the other 3 free interns were Masters and PhD kids from MIT (bond desk), UChicago (Eurodollar desk) and CalTech (ETF arbitrage group)...

Sometimes the free internship is the on-ramp (I just gave two examples) or it will be the barrier that will forever prevent you from getting what you're seeking.....

In reply to monkeysama
6/1/11
monkeysama:
happypantsmcgee:
monkeysama:

I said that I was interested in learning and accomplishing something. How this is viewed as a bad thing is beyond me.

Yea, after you said 'Will take anything' which probably has people confused.

Oh, I see. If I would work for someone for free at a PE firm and I would get no marketable skills and not learn anything then I would be better off at a McDonalds job as I would be getting paid. I'm indifferent to money, I just don't want to be taken advantage of. I can see how this has some people confused.

Are you serious? I'm sure Fed Reserve ---> Unpaid PE intern (with BS experience) is better than Fed Reserve -->McDonalds Fry Cook. Especially if your "indifferent to money"

6/1/11

Who said you're 'not getting paid' though? The guy asked 'what you need to make' not 'we're looking for UNPAID interns'. I think it's fine that you want to gain something out the experience - in fact, it's important that you try and find a job that will allow you to build marketable skills to let you gain ground for future opps. But I think what has rubbed other posters the wrong way is the way you answered the guy.

You should have said - I'd be very interested to learn more about the firm, can we talk via PM? And then ask him more about the position (e.g. tell me about the firm, what kind of investments do you look at, what kind of work do interns get to do... etc.) And THEN if he tells you you're just making cold calls and photocopies, THEN you can politely decline, if you so choose. The way you answered might give people the impression of entitlement...

Even if we assumed the job wouldn't give you much in the form of marketable skills, it's still good to have on your outdated resume. It only gets harder and harder to find work with a large unemployment time gap. Having it at least gives other employers (assuming the PE shop doesn't hire FT from internship pools) some assurance that you haven't been 'dicking around' this last year (you haven't - but having something on the resume is better proof of that than your word) or that you are indeed employable. People tend to think 'is there a reason why he hasn't gotten something' - and this definitely came across in this thread since you do seem to come from a decent school and background.

If I were in your shoes (and I was at one point) I would have jumped all over that post. And especially given you're not financially strapped, I would care a lot more about having the momentum (getting something credible on my resume) than the cash. And it's a PE shop - even if you're doing a lot of coffee runs, if you're smart, you'd take any free time you have to learn on your own - flip through some investment memos, ask questions, volunteer to do things, try to look through models yourself and MAKE THEM realize you're good so they'll give you work.

6/1/11

Kanon - I hear what you're saying. I think I managed to rub people the wrong way with how I responded to him, and I am interested in learning more about the opportunity and didn't mean any disrespect. I don't have any entitlement or ego left at this point if that's what people think.

6/1/11

^ That's good to hear. Hopefully you're talking to him about the opportunity because it sounds like a good one. Good luck and let us know how it goes.

6/2/11

If he wont take the opportunity because as I have said multiple times now he seems like a rich stuck up entitled kid, I will gladly take te guy up on the internship position!

The one who does not fall, does not stand up

6/2/11

monkeysama, if you look at this situation in a positive light, I think you just learned what your weakness might be, and what you could/should work on to end up landing a job.

Good luck!

In reply to monkeysama
6/2/11
monkeysama:

econ - take the answer for what you want. I need to be able to learn something in the job. If I'm going to be used as a valet and not learn anything then the job is comparable to a job at McDonalds. I'm indifferent to money - it's knowledge and experience I need.

Except for the fact that it will be much easier to leverage PE experience, even if you are just snagging coffee. At a minimum, you should be able to convince people in the office that you're smart, hungry/driven, and have a strong work ethic (assuming you have these things in the first place), which can lead to an offer there. Even under a worse case scenario where the internship was literally comparable to McDonald's (just snagging coffee with zero chance of learning anything, making connections, or leading to a job there - notice this is ridiculous presumption) it would still be better than McDonald's because the pay is better. You might say, "But how? I'm indifferent to money!" Well, for one thing, why on earth would you be indifferent to money? I thought you said you were interested in trading. Don't you realize that every dollar above a McDonald's salary, is a dollar that you can invest in yourself and your trading strategies? Nobody is indifferent to money, even someone like you who claims he cares about "knowledge and experience" -- money can "buy" knowledge and experience. The more money you make as a PE intern, the more options you have otherwise (whether it be taking some time of to sit around and read, trading, doing an unpaid internship, going back to school, or a million other things). Lastly, you don't even have a job offer at McDonald's yet. You know what they say, one in the hand is worth two in the bush. Anyway, all this proves to me is that you don't want a job "that bad" -- you just kinda want it. I hope the guy who initially gave you that offer is watching all this and having second thoughts, as your replies smack of a bad attitude, lack of drive, or both.

In reply to monkeysama
6/2/11
monkeysama:
D M:

While there are contradictions in your posts, I understand what you're looking for. You want a job/internship that will get you experience and give you connections that you can use to further your full-time job search.

Yes, thank you. You understand. As far as frustration goes I do what I can.

I think I finally understand why you made this post... You respond positively to the posts that "feel for you" and negative (or, in some cases, neutral) to the ones offering you constructive criticism. I don't think you started this because you're mainly looking for a job, but rather to feel sorry for yourself and feel justified by hearing from those who commiserate for (and with) you.

6/2/11

monkeysama,

I am a little concerned by your posts, and I hope that this is just a misunderstanding rather than your actual attitude when you approach interviews, job opportunities, etc.

Here is some advice (take it or leave it, not bashing you just trying giving you my advice based on the information I have at hand):

I believe that you are going into interviews with the wrong attitude. One of your previous posts writes:

"I don't know if I want to go through all of it, but I've had hedge funds want me to tell them what monetary policy was going to be before hand (real classy), boutique IB firms that were writing memos on how Bernanke is crazy and ruining the economy (and use me as some sort of analyst/evidence of the fact), transfer pricing firms that were very shady (I don't want to help companies avoid taxes - it's dirty). I could tell you stories."

I understand if you don't want to participate in unethical work, but first of all transfer pricing is not helping companies avoid taxes, it is actually there to help companies follow the law while making as much money as possible. It is the same thing as any other profession. You want to be a trader, well you probably want as much of an advantage as possible without breaking the law, right?

There seem to be a lot of excuses or reasons as to why things don't work out. My first point of advice would be to take responsibility and don't assign blame to others.

Another post (regarding an interview with Bridgewater) you take a condescending tone about how they had you take the Myers-Briggs. Quoted here:

"They made me take a briggs-meyer and another personality test. It's kind of endearing actually, like the little kid who tries to buy something with monopoly money.

I mean they really believe that they publicly espouse a kind of anarcho-capitalist survivalist philosophy and they DON"T expect me to make my personality test reflect that. It's not exactly rocket science to be less than honest on these things. So in the end they self select for people willing to tell them what they want to hear.

I haven't even interviewed with them yet and I already don't really trust them."

Again, this is just off of the information I have, but if you walked into an interview room with this attitude, or even a hint of this attitude you will not get the job. I think that your comment regarding the PE position was another attitude issue.

I'm hoping that these are just miscommunications, but if not I think that working on a positive attitude and a "I'll work hard and do anything it takes to make this work" attitude will help you out. Just my advice, again I don't even know you, all I know about you are the few posts I've read.

6/2/11

I think now with this bit of an attitude adjustment you'll get a job...now go kill it.

The answer to your question is 1) network 2) get involved 3) beef up your resume 4) repeat -happypantsmcgee

WSO is not your personal search function.

In reply to econ
6/2/11
econ:
monkeysama:
D M:

While there are contradictions in your posts, I understand what you're looking for. You want a job/internship that will get you experience and give you connections that you can use to further your full-time job search.

Yes, thank you. You understand. As far as frustration goes I do what I can.

I think I finally understand why you made this post... You respond positively to the posts that "feel for you" and negative (or, in some cases, neutral) to the ones offering you constructive criticism. I don't think you started this because you're mainly looking for a job, but rather to feel sorry for yourself and feel justified by hearing from those who commiserate for (and with) you.

econ - That is wrong. I respond tit for tat. If someone is nice to me I respond positively, if someone is negative I respond negatively. The same as any other human being on the planet.

Constructive criticism is one thing. So far in this thread I have been called directionless, spoiled, stuck up, uncommitted, and now you think I have a bad attitude and don't want a job "that bad". None of this is true in the least and none of it helps me find a job. It's just shallow name calling.

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