We need to let you go

Hey guys,

I was announced on Friday that it wasn’t going to work out at my current firm and that I would need to start looking to transition somewhere else. I need some advice.

The situation now is that they are letting me stick around for a few months to finish the deals I’m staffed on and they are willing to help me transition to a new job and give references. I have already started leveraging my network and I have a few interviews setup already.. but how should I be spinning this?

Do I say I am looking to change firm? Do I say that I was let go? Do I ask my firm to give me a reference? (isn’t that weird since they are letting me go?)

Thanks guys,

 

Take the reference (albeit from a verified source in the company). If they truly didn't like you, they wouldn't have offered to provide a reference in the first place. It seems like a peaceful "things didn't work out, but we wish the best for you" situation.

Having been a manager at a larger company, we would either provide a positive reference or not give one. Negative references are very litigation prone if the party you prevented you from seeking employment elsewhere finds out... they can sue for slander. This is because job under-performance is hard to prove in court and really comes down to hearsay. (Unless it's a clear cut case like you tested positive for drugs or there's a police report of you laying a giant mud snake on your boss's desk).

You seem like a smart (enough) guy, get creative and come up with a transition story. You really liked PE, but early stage companies are were where your true interests are.

"A man can convince anyone he's somebody else, but never himself."
 
Keyser Söze 123:

Take the reference (albeit from a verified source in the company). If they truly didn't like you, they wouldn't have offered to provide a reference in the first place. It seems like a peaceful "things didn't work out, but we wish the best for you" situation.

Having been a manager at a larger company, we would either provide a positive reference or not give one. Negative references are very litigation prone if the party you prevented you from seeking employment elsewhere finds out... they can sue for slander. This is because job under-performance is hard to prove in court and really comes down to hearsay. (Unless it's a clear cut case like you tested positive for drugs or there's a police report of you laying a giant mud snake on your boss's desk).

You seem like a smart (enough) guy, get creative and come up with a transition story. You really liked PE, but early stage companies are were where your true interests are.

Thanks this is helpful!

 
<span itemprop=name>thebrofessor</span>:
  1. ask for a reference
  2. tough one, I would say something like "part of the reason was the fund didn't raise enough capital to keep me on"
  3. def keep fucking that girl...also I'm still waiting for you to PM me her instagram handle, I won't tell a soul.

Thanks for advice. I get to stick around at the firm until I find another gig... once I am out, I will consider sharing IG.

 

All of the above and look outside of finance as well. Big4 might have a use for you in TAS/consulting. Consulting shops might want you, as well as other banks. Now might also be a good time to jump on grad school? Just throwing ideas out.

Get busy living
 

Hi,

Just wanted to say it happens to everyone. I have been laid off before (luckily only for once). I still remember it like yesterday. Being called into the HR office and I was escorted out of the building (was not even allowed to return to my desk). It's tough. Use all your contacts. Don't be shy.

Some of my friends have been fired more than once. I think the advice would depend on what level/stage you are at. There were guys who used to be VP at reputable companies and let go and had to apply for associate positions (which are normally open only to MBAs). They ended up in boutiques (as you can imagine).

It's tough. I'd probably spend a week just composing myself (I think you have earned it - hang out with your friends, see your family etc.) and start calling people from next week.

Good luck.

 
j-phone:

Hi,

Just wanted to say it happens to everyone. I have been laid off before (luckily only for once). I still remember it like yesterday. Being called into the HR office and I was escorted out of the building (was not even allowed to return to my desk). It's tough. Use all your contacts. Don't be shy.

Some of my friends have been fired more than once. I think the advice would depend on what level/stage you are at. There were guys who used to be VP at reputable companies and let go and had to apply for associate positions (which are normally open only to MBAs). They ended up in boutiques (as you can imagine).

It's tough. I'd probably spend a week just composing myself (I think you have earned it - hang out with your friends, see your family etc.) and start calling people from next week.

Good luck.

Spot-on.

Since this was OP's first job post-college, this will be tough, especially because he was in BO/MO. Are there any specific recruiters that cater to BO/MO roles?

OP, what's your financial situation look like? Would you be open to taking on an internship (possibly unpaid) just to get the experience and fill out the gap?

 

If, they threaten to not allow you to return to your desk you can threaten to sue them in small claims court. You will win in that because they wont bother dealing with it. In most states it is illegal for them to not allow you to retrieve your personal belongings.

Follow the shit your fellow monkeys say @shitWSOsays Life is hard, it's even harder when you're stupid - John Wayne
 
heister:

If, they threaten to not allow you to return to your desk you can threaten to sue them in small claims court. You will win in that because they wont bother dealing with it. In most states it is illegal for them to not allow you to retrieve your personal belongings.

I already retrieved everything in my desk. Thanks for the heads up, though.

 
Ezio Auditore:

Sorry to hear that OP. Just curious though, in a situation when you are let go due to downsizing, do you receive any sort of severance package?

Update: No severance package. Luckily, I saved ~75% of my paychecks.

Back on the horse next week. Thanks for the tips, WSO brethren.

 
GoldenCinderblock:

Can't you use your school's career site as an alum? Spam your resume out.

I've definitely been spamming my resume out. Unsurprisingly, some of these positions are babysitter positions. The pitfalls of having gone to a non-target.

 

^ I'm searching for any BO/MO recruiters I can find, just to maximize my chances.

My financial situation is not too bad. No debt, currently living at home. I'd consider an unpaid internship if it adds relevant experience.

Any other advice/recommendations? Thanks, folks. It's only the 2nd day of unemployment and it already sucks.

 

You're living at home so this is not an urgent crisis. You can still be a little picky about your next job, but If you are still unemployed three months from now it looks bad and then it will be even harder to find a good job. Adjust your expectations as you go but I think right now you should not be looking for a major downgrade just to stay employed. Consider temp work while you are looking for ft to take the pressure off.

 

Like I mentioned in our discussion earlier (if you are who I assume you are, haha), this is a great time to work on any of those entrepreneurial endeavours you have. Fills out the resume and keeps your mind active. Of course still network and send out resumes like hell, but in the downtime where you're restless and need to do something - seriously, work on a side project. It will make you feel so much better.

Currently: future neurologist, current psychotherapist Previously: investor relations (top consulting firm), M&A consulting (Big 4), M&A banking (MM)
 

What @chicandtoughness said. I did that too during my time between jobs to great effect. Side projects can be your "break" when you're tired of staring at OneWire, LinkedIn, etc.

Metal. Music. Life. www.headofmetal.com
 

Condolences friend.

Mind if I ask what BO/MO work you were involved in? I would look at F500 FDLP-rotational positions. They are usually for graduates but often also take in recent graduates with some experience, and offer a really good way to add some breadth to your resume.

I am assuming that you were let go due to internal shenanigans and not due to your performance, so if you had a decent GPA (mid-to-high 3 and up) and some extracurriculars during school, combined with your experience at your former position, you would probably make an attractive candidate for Treasury or some sort of FP&A in an higher F500.

At 22, you would be the same age as your peers and you would probably excel much faster due to your previous experience. Many F500 have rolling hires for their FDLP classes and you might still get into one for 2014. I was hired in Fall of 2013 for a F500 FDLP after graduating at age 23 and don't even start until July... other members of my FDLP class don't have their first day until Fall.

We are here to drink beer. We are here to kill war. We are here to laugh at the odds and live our lives so well that Death will tremble to take us. - Charles Bukowski
 

It's been about 2 months and nothing in the pipeline except for many calls/meetings.

Some industry folks suggested that I shouldn't take on an internship considering I'm already out of college. Any thoughts/recommendations from WSO?

Thanks.

 
MerinoDraped:

It's been about 2 months and nothing in the pipeline except for many calls/meetings.

Some industry folks suggested that I shouldn't take on an internship considering I'm already out of college. Any thoughts/recommendations from WSO?

Thanks.

Would the internship be paid or unpaid? Do you have any leads on internships or just throwing out ideas? How have things been going with you headhunters?

Sucks dude. Im in a similar boat recently becoming officially unempoyed. I graduated a couple weeks ago and moved back home, been looking for FO jobs since before FT recruiting season. Keep getting shafted after superdays.

Keep you nose to the grindstone and hopefully things will turn around for both of us.

 
<span itemprop=name>takenotes08</span>:
The Stranger:

I probably would have a few years back when I was single... My real reason for commenting was to express disbelief that someone working at a PE shop would 1) get this excited about banging an 8.5-9.0 or 2) would rather risk their job (even at a low % probability) for a sure lay rather than just manning up and hitting on some chicks.

1) Who would not get this excited about banging a really hot chick? Wtf man

2) I broke in out of undergrad so it wasn't as long of a grind as most to get into PE. Also, once you break in and get a few deals under your belt it becomes way less stressful to lose your job because you have a pretty solid skill set and knowledge of deals/industries that other PE firms value. This might not be accurate, but I feel like its not too hard to find another gig once you have done a PE gig, so I am not too stressed out. Also the chances of getting fired for this are pretty fucking slim imo, as per other comments in the thread.

^Seems like you've already got this figured out homie.

Life's is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
 
<span itemprop=name>The Stranger</span>:
takenotes08:

The Stranger:I probably would have a few years back when I was single... My real reason for commenting was to express disbelief that someone working at a PE shop would 1) get this excited about banging an 8.5-9.0 or 2) would rather risk their job (even at a low % probability) for a sure lay rather than just manning up and hitting on some chicks.

1) Who would not get this excited about banging a really hot chick? Wtf man

2) I broke in out of undergrad so it wasn't as long of a grind as most to get into PE. Also, once you break in and get a few deals under your belt it becomes way less stressful to lose your job because you have a pretty solid skill set and knowledge of deals/industries that other PE firms value. This might not be accurate, but I feel like its not too hard to find another gig once you have done a PE gig, so I am not too stressed out. Also the chances of getting fired for this are pretty fucking slim imo, as per other comments in the thread.

^Seems like you've already got this figured out homie.

Touché

However, I still believe what I said to be true.. I already have a few interviews lined up. I just need to figure out how to spin this the correct way.

 

I'm actually interested in what others have to say. Personally I feel like I could make the case for "tell them and be upfront" as easily as I could make the case of "don't say anything."

Also, even if "tell them" is the right answer, and honestly I think it is, there's the matter of when.

Do they have any proof that your performance dropped or do you have any proof that it didn't? If they don't (or if you do) I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility to tell the people you're interviewing with that you were bascially fired for interviewing.

Commercial Real Estate Developer
 

I wouldn't offer up that information to future employers. If they ask, then say yes, you were recently let go because they suspected you of interviewing for other jobs. If they don't ask, no need to disclose. Not lying, just not offering up information that could ruin your prospects.

Currently: future neurologist, current psychotherapist Previously: investor relations (top consulting firm), M&A consulting (Big 4), M&A banking (MM)
 

Same as above. Do not volunteer negative information, but be truthful if confronted. In this case, avoid the performance issue & tell them they thought you were interviewing around.

All the world's indeed a stage, And we are merely players, Performers and portrayers, Each another's audience, Outside the gilded cage - Limelight (1981)
 

This is a particularly tough one; was dealing with the same thing a year ago but wasn't in the interview process. If you worked for a bigger firm they will be very hesitant to say more than they need to (They cant even disclose your salary unless you give them permission to do so). Basically they'll say dexter91 was employed here from date x to date y as an analyst, what have you.

If you say more than you need to the interviewer/prospective employer will pry everything they can out of you. Be very vague if this conversation arises and speak to the positives that have come of it.

I'm on the pursuit of happiness and I know everything that shine ain't always gonna be gold. I'll be fine once I get it
 

Your best bet is lined up here on these posts.

  1. No mention until offer is in hand
  2. If you're asked if you were let go, then you you must answer this and your response is "you were caught interviewing around" (as the above stated let go for suspicion of interviewing etc.).
  3. Never disclose your pay/bonus etc

Never answer with "I was let go for performance related reasons" that is going to kill your interview no matter who you are interviewing with.

 

I was in a similar position with my first job out of undergrad. When I transitioned out, I was fairly honest about some struggles early on, but then spun it that I learned the necessary skills to transition to my current industry in a preferred city (I actually wanted to relocate anyway). Don't sweat it, this stuff is often a blessing in disguise.

EDIT: Similar position in that I parted ways after a year and change. Can't say I was slamming the office EA.

 
<span itemprop=name>qbison</span>:

I was in a similar position with my first job out of undergrad. When I transitioned out, I was fairly honest about some struggles early on, but then spun it that I learned the necessary skills to transition to my current industry in a preferred city (I actually wanted to relocate anyway). Don't sweat it, this stuff is often a blessing in disguise.

EDIT: Similar position in that I parted ways after a year and change. Can't say I was slamming the office EA.

Thanks for advice. Relocating could actually work pretty well.. I still get to stay at the firm for two months, so I can always just say that I am looking to changes city.

 

Hey man, sorry to hear that. I can't say that I've been through such a tough situation as yours before, but I can provide some thoughts as an outside party who might be able to help you figure out a plan.

  1. Your brother needs to get a job. He needs to be able to support himself, or at least contribute, because you're not going to be paying for anything for him anymore until you get a new job.

  2. I think you're wrong on the unemployment benefits non-qualification. I don't know your specific situation, but I did a little general googling and this result seems to imply otherwise: http://www.edd.ca.gov/unemployment/faq_-_eligibility.htm#CanindividualswhoarenotUScitizenscollectUIbenefits

  3. Talk to headhunters and recruiters. Seems like your experience is relatively specialized, so I don't know who the right contacts would be, but Google usually helps with this. Since your old firm is covering for you (in terms of still be employed), you can frame the meeting as you transitioning into a new role because of xyz reasons. Also, check out your school's careers website. There are often jobs posted targeted at people who have already graduated.

  4. While acknowledging that your firm was very specialized, no firm operates in a vacuum (or a complete monopoly - even the NFL has the CFL and AFL). Ask yourself a couple of questions: Who were my firm's competitors? What other firms did I work with at my old job? Did you ever pitch anything to a potential client that ended up not choosing your firm to advise on a project? Basically just leverage all potential connections. Think about the broader landscape in terms of firms that do work that is close to your skills.

  5. Given your situation, I would cast a wide net. VC firms may be a good place to start looking for a job, but don't restrict yourself. Know that VC firms run lean, because each incremental hire is money that is directly taken out of the partners' pockets.

Good luck, and I hope things get better for you.

 

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GoldenCinderblock: "I keep spending all my money on exotic fish so my armor sucks. Is it possible to romance multiple females? I got with the blue chick so far but I am also interested in the electronic chick and the face mask chick."

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