How to network with VPs and MDs??

Just to throw in some context, I am heading into my junior year at a Canadian target.. Since exams Ive been meeting with many analysts/associates, and conversations tend to be pretty relaxed and surrounding their experiences during recruitment, how they best positioned themselves, blah, blah..I have been given the names of some VPs that will be conducting first-round interviews for my school and want to begin reaching out to them hopefully a bit later in the summer.

Any advice on how I should try and structure my conversations with these guys? Should I try and do a bit more research about their group and try to impress them with my knowledge? Or do you reckon Im better suited asking them as many questions as I can, similar to the ones I have been asking juniors at these banks???

Any advice is appreciated!

 

Step 1: Realize you are not going to impress them with "your knowledge". They know much more than you. Step 2: Show genuine interest in who they are/ what they do. Have a natural conversation that doesn't make you seem like some robotic nerd. Focus more on actually trying to establish relationships with people rather than just talking to people for the sake of talking to people in hopes of getting a job.

 

Do some research on his background. Has he worked at a BB firm before? If so ask about the differences between BB and MM from a senior perspective. Ask about what his strategy is to maintain client relationships/create new relationships. Also ask "If a client isn't necessarily reading for M&A or a certain product, how do you maintain the relationship?" something along those lines

 

IB recruiting is getting pushed earlier and earlier. If you're at a target school, there a very good chance that come early fall, the MDs/VPs will be getting swamped with e-mails from kids reaching out after attending networking events on campus. Even if you're not at a target, many MDs/VPs will likely have some involvement in recruiting, either at their alma mater or otherwise, so its best to reach out now while they may be more available. If you make a connection now, it's also not going to come off as much like you're reaching out solely so they give you an interview, forward your resume, etc. Talking with them now, building a bit of a connection, and then sending a quicker follow up later down the timeline will be best. They will be more likely to respond to you rather than some random kid who emails them in September/October. Just make sure when you follow up, you send an email in the same email chain as when you first reached out - this will help them remember who you are/when you spoke with them.

 

What email are you sending that would require a response? If you applied you should have just sent him an email letting him know that you applied and if he liked you he would have put in a referral and that would be the end of it. He shouldn't be obligated to respond to you now and you probably didn't make the cut for the interview.

 

I think it might be more effective to search for other opportunities, however it could also be that he just hasn't had the time to get back to you. It would be very strange for a VP to recommend you apply and then completely ignore you afterward. I would definitely not email him again anytime soon, but rather wait it out and maybe over the summer or in a few months if you're feeling risky email him to talk about opportunities at the firm for your junior year.

 

This depends on the structure of the BB itself. For the most parts, ER works separately - and independently - of S&T (I assume equities here since you mentioned ER). In the given circumstances, I guess it's fair to say whatever pull the ER MD can offer would be very limited for a S&T role.

Then again, this depends very much on the BB. PM me with more details (ie. BB, nature of the role - summer/FT, etc) and I will feed you with more relevant info where possible.

 

My advice is not to directly request a position in ANY division until you have established a close enough relationship with him. You want to ask questions about the bank, his role, other roles, etc. This demonstrates interest in the field in general, and he can then refer you to other people he believes may be a good fit for your interests.

Note: Let the MD guide you and not the other way around. If the MD does ask for your preferences, I would mention ER and S&T - that way you can explore both and have more options when it comes to summer internships/full time.


Chase Us, Break In http://chasingconsultantsbreakingbankers.blogspot.com/

 

haha - did that bc someone discovered who i was by my old user name

some guy had john mack so i said why not take this one

cheese86:
Dude your screen name "Jamie Dimon" is creepy as hell. I go to school with and am friends with his daughter. Maybe change that. Unless of course it's really you and in that case, hey Mr. Dimon.

and this guy has been in ER since he graduated many yrs ago

thanks for the input so far

 

I would not assume the MD will be pulling any strings or helping you land anywhere off the bat. I would feel the meeting out, and just have a casual conversation. Let it go where it will - the more relaxed and enjoyable the conversation is, the more the other party will both remember you and be willing to extend some help/advice to you in the future. If he asks where you see yourself working say his group (ER) but also mention S&T, and ask if he has any experience with S&T (after talking about ER, of course) - if the conversation takes this path, then he will probably be willing to share any experience he may have, or anyone he may know in the group.

If the conversation doesn't seem to get there, that's fine too. Send a follow-up thank you, plus email and get around to posing those sorts of questions to him there. Again, don't push for help, just some more information - show a strong interest in the firm and run with it from there. If you get some more positive response, then you can worry about the next steps - but for now, just take one meeting at a time, and focus on keeping a good conversation going, and getting on his memorable and good side. Best of luck.

IBanker www.BankonBanking.com Articles, News, Advice and More Break Into Investment Banking

 

Wait another week, then follow up. Don't end up being "that guy" who bothers the shit out of someone that is in the field.

After waiting for another week, follow up and ask if he minds having a phone convo (or if possible, take him to lunch or out for a beer, coffee) for 15 mins so you can learn more about the field, how it works and what the best path may be to enter IB.

And for the love of god, DO NOT ask for a job (you'd be surprised how many idiots will blatantly do so).

 

Don't be too pushy. He is obviously busy and the fact that he responded to your initial correspondence is a positive sign. He is being honest in saying that it is pretty difficult to help you out if you have been out of school 3 years and have no banking experience, but it doesn't hurt to keep in contact. You should begin to evaluate business school to see if that is a realistic option for you. Continue to broaden your network by targeting decision makers at various firms and if they happen to provide an opportunity, that's great, but you you will more than likely have to go back for an MBA.

[quote=Dirk Dirkenson]Shut up already. Your mindless, reflexive responses to any critical thought on this are tedious. You're also probably a woman, given the name and "xoxo" signoff, so maybe the lack of judgment is to be expected.[/quote]
 

Thanks a lot guys. My plan is to try and expand my network. I just ask them if they would be free to connect over the phone. I'm hoping even if they can't help, they know someone that can, and maybe that'll lead to an interview or job offer. I do plan on going back to B-School, I just wanted to have a few more years of work experience before I do so.

 
Khayembii:

Ask them for their phone number and a time on the day they give to call them at. Talk to them about them and their career for a while. Then tell them you're looking for an internship and ask them for their advice about how you can best go about finding one.

I had two phone calls today and both went pretty well. One forgot to call me so I called him on his cell and he was stuck in traffic and forgot to call, the MD at the BB talked my ear off for like 40min but had to go abruptly at the end. He basically tried to get me to stop considering banking, saying I need to go to a fancy school and I'll be working untill 4am every night. He just wanted to make sure that I was serious about considering IB I think. Didn't shake me though I'm going to shoot him an email to follow up and mention the internship / referral to someone else in another one of his banks groups.

Other phone call was to a VC MD who asked me to come on it and take a tour of the building, and was super helpful as with the other guy.

I feel kind of weird networking with random people but I was surprised how willing people are to help a genuine college kid who goes after his dreams. I'm going to keep networking though, I think I'll get better with it as time goes on. Not bad for a few days of cold emailing. Any suggestions on how to attack come recruiting season or should I taper it down since I'm just a sophomore atm

 

I go to a regional European "semi-target" (only 3 BBs recruit here, country outside the UK) but I've found a lot of success with networking with people where I find some sort of common connection. Right now I'm having a lot of success reaching out to bankers who are the same nationality as me who work in London. It creates a connection and a talking point even though they're not alums of the college I went to. After this I'll start cold mailing people. One of the bankers I was talking to encouraged reaching out to anyone, the worse case scenario is they wont respond and then you're still in the same position as you are without emailing them. As a VP put it to me, "No banker / firm is going to blacklist a kid for being proactive and genuinely trying to learn about the industry."

 

Explain your situation.

Tell him you know what you want to do. You have the work experience to go to b-school and will submit a statement of purpose telling admissions your plan to switch careers...You would much rather try and get into IBD now and you feel as though you can handle the work load of an associate. Problem is how are you going to show that you can be an associate without any internship experience, any experience in IBD, and no finance/accounting knowledge? I think you should deff apply and keep options open.

Do you want to start as an analyst? I don't know if that's possible at this point...you might need B-school, grad school, or experience to start as associate. People on WSO might have some insight into this I am not familiar with IBD. There are plenty of people with high gpa's and finance/accounting degrees who have experience in boutiques and want to move into BB IBD. What makes you better?

You might want to look into the Duke MMS or a MFIN. If you can get in and you think you will be able to network interviews, ace them, and land the job. That will save you a year from B-school. Still, I think most MMS graduates start as analysts so you might get stuck in a 2-3 year program and never get moved up. Then you have to go get your MBA after you basically got a lite version doing the MMS, but you have for the most part secured a career in IBD assuming a top B-school.

May I ask why you want to change careers? Aerospace engineering sounds bad ass and challenging..if I had the background I would deff be interested.

 

Is he a front-office MD? There are MDs in the back office, as well. Also, many older people came up in a time when career paths in finance were much more fluid and "pulling yourself up by the bootstraps from the mailroom" was common; he may not view giving you a trade settlement or risk analytics job as disadvantaging you.

There have been many great comebacks throughout history. Jesus was dead but then came back as an all-powerful God-Zombie.
 

Bubba, I'd be looking to get in as an analyst, that's not a problem for me. Maybe it would be for the bank? I dunno, I might as well try.

I got into a top 5 MFin program last year, but decided it wouldn't be the best decision for me. Going to 1 year program with no relevant internships or grades would make fall recruiting a disaster. Plus I'm looking to get away from hardcore engineering type stuff. A 2 year MBA program, with a good internship, sets me up well.

Aerospace is cool and all, working on 'secret' stuff is fun... but it's a slow moving train. Things take 10 years to develop.

Kenny, you're spot on. He is definitely front office, but he's been with the firm 20+ years and worked his way up. I don't think he understands the realities nowadays that getting branded as back office is a problem.

Any ideas on how to tactfully tell him that I'm not willing to mess up my 'b-school story' for a back office gig? Thanks for the responses.

 
Best Response

A few things come to mind:

I'd personally just let the conversation flow, and if he likes you (and vice versa), it shouldn't be too difficult to end the coffee with "keep in touch." I'd end the follow up email with "talk soon" or something similar, as well. That's simple stuff - easy enough to do.

What I also usually do is end the coffee more candidly: "Do you mind if we keep in touch?" This usually works, although in my current situation I've been looking for a job, and the MD would have realized that - little bit different situation than you're in.

Finally, something I've realized really works if used properly: if, in an appropriate amount of time, you see an article/read a book etc. about something that you guys discussed, send him an email about it. People love this if you do it right. For example, I've sent a couple L/S investment ideas I found online to guys who I know are interviewing for HFs. Some of these guys I had only spoken with once, but it allows us to build a connection.

Tl;dr find common ground, be candid about your situation if appropriate, and let the conversation flow.

Maximum effort.
 
  1. Why is this in the Ibanking forum, and "it gets more traffic" is not an acceptable answer. Put it in get a job, or consulting cabaret

  2. Why would you think a VP is thinking about FT recruiting in April. They don't even have their summer interns yet to bang around.

So, yes go ahead and write the VP five months before recruiting starts. Make sure you tell him that you got the courage to ask by reading about IBanking online.

--There are stupid questions, so think first.
 

I would say that you should be honest discuss your interests. State how you would like to work for them next summer. Be honest about it. Also make sure to get them on LinkedIn after you have had your meetings. Mention why you feel that you would work well in their department, don't overstate your qualifications. Explain why you are legitimately interested in their department. You have to find a happy medium making it clear that you want to work for them without coming on too strong. Mention how you are uniquely qualified and more importantly demonstrate. People who usually go up in rank aren't all style and no substance. Work like an animal and become competent. Learn as much as you can. That's the way to impress them.

 

straight up ask them if they have time at some point to grab a coffee, cause you wanted to learn what they do, and what their team/desk does. I'm sure they'll say yes, but then the ball is in your court.

Make sure to email them and press upon it.

I eat success for breakfast...with skim milk
 

It is a great idea to just be direct. Beating around the bush is useless especially VPs/MDs in IB. What I would do first is go onto your alma mater's alumni directory and search for alums in IB, PE, HF, AM, etc...thats a good place to start. If you are an alum as well, theres a better chance they will respond and want to help.

Here is a short cold/warm e-mail formula I used when I was going through FT IB recruiting. I had a really great response from most alumni that I contacted. I had a lot of informational interviews, but by the time FT recruitment began, I went back to those who I networked with and they helped get my name and resume passed along in the process.

Short, 5-6 sentence e-mail 1) Introduce yourself: Ex: My name is John Monkey, i'm currently a ____ analyst at _____. 2) How you came across their contact info: Ex: I found your information on the alumni directory 3) Briefly touch on your background/Why you want to talk to them: Ex: While i've had experience in _____ and _____, I'm most interested in moving into investment banking. 4) Ask them to meet with you: If you have some time in the next week or two, I would love to sit down for lunch or coffee to learn more about your experiences in investment banking 5) Thank them in advance: Ex: Thank you in advance for your help

I followed that pretty closely and just altered the e-mail a little bit with each person I contacted.

You just need to be outgoing, put yourself out there, and don't beat around the bush. They know why you want to meet with them, so as long as you are polite and take the time to get to know them (IN PERSON IS BEST), the better your chances of them going to bat for you. Hope this helps.

XX
 

Thanks for the responses. Started looking at my alumni directory, and while some information is outdated, there are plenty of alumni in interesting roles I'd like to talk to.

And I agree with Pike on meeting in person. I've had a few phone interviews/informational interviews and much prefer in person because you can see the other person's reactions and expressions and it seems to make for a more casual and interesting conversation.

 

All good points above. My two cents as connecting w/ senior folks is crucial and a way different beast than networking with jr folks.

IMHO, the best approach is to brief, to the point and at the same time make a logical and easy to digest request to SPEAK / MEET. I all caps the later because it's always better to more considerate than forward with senior folks (e.g. I typically don't attach my resume on first email. Some sr. guys don't care but some may not like it for whatever reason even though they know you're emailing about a job), and most of the time they'll be willing to take some time to speak with you or maybe grab a quick coffee if they're free. Meeting with them before pushing for an interview always seems to be a good move, and it seems they're typically open to it.

Obviously the more senior person you can connect with and subsequently get in your corner the better. However a MD co-global head has a lot of shit on her / his plate, and will likely forget you w/ 10 mins of you meeting. Moreover analysts / associates are mainly a nuisance to really sr. guys. The only time an analyst is of a concern to them is when they fuck up a book and make them look like a retard in a client meeting, if you nail it they go about their day and on to other things. The point of all that is that VP is probably the most impactful connection to make. Likely they are the yay / nay sayers on the pool of candidates, and the onus is on them from sr. guys to not fuck up hiring retards that won't screw up the offices P&L by bringing them on. So most of the time VP's have the pressure on them to hire the right people. That said connecting with a VP and making a good impression can be your ticket. Plus they're around the office more than MD's and easier to hop on the phone with / grab a quick coffee with. Feel free to PM me if you'd like any other (more than likely shitty) pointers on effective IB networking.

Ace all your PE interview questions with the WSO Private Equity Prep Pack: http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/guide/private-equity-interview-prep-questions
 

Don't overthink this...just simply walk up, introduce yourself, say you are new to the industry and was wondering their thoughts on the presentation you just heard. If they give you some good feedback then tell them you appreciate their insight and then ask them for a business card. From there follow up with him/her in about a week by email, thank them once again for taking time to speak with you and then ask if it would be possible to get together for coffee at some point to ask for some career advice. Some will blow you off but you will be surprised by how many are willing to take the time and help.

 

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