Operations Exit Opps.
I'm interviewing at a hedge fund for an operations role ('Portfolio Analyst')...I don't have any modeling experience so I understand why I can't fill a real analyst role in IBD..
however, everyone seems to claim that operations is a dead end and I have a hard time believing that committing to a job at 22 years old should signal anything close to a dead end...i believe that ops is a great way to learn the business and progress in a few years..
when asked "where do you see yourself in 5 years" in an operations interview at a hedge fund, what are some good responses?
in a previous thread, someone said any response indicating a preference to advance or make it out of ops would be looked down upon...does the learning that takes place in an ops role really not prepare you for any other position?





If they ask where you see
If they ask where you see yourself in 5 years, say doing your boss's job. Interviewing 101. There're plenty of ops jobs across the street, so I guess you could move to a different ops job. Plus there's always the b-school reset button. I'm not sure how many people move from ops to FO, but it doesn't seem all that common. In my entire analyst class of 150 or so, 1 kid did his junior summer in ops and moved to banking.
You will be considered/viewed
You will be considered/viewed as a clerical and administrative employee. The longer you stay in operations the harder it will be to break out. Depending on your responsibilities, you may have some basic exposure to the actual business you're supporting and you might learn something if you're lucky.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into SWANSONS.
Here's the truth: Most people
Here's the truth:
Most people in ops stay in ops, even if they don't want to. Most ops jobs are very manual, very basic, and could be done by someone with a high school degree - and at some firms are.
The ops career path goes a few ways:
1) You work in ops for a few years, learn the back end of the business, go to b-school and make a career shift.
2) You work in a group that deals with products, has exposure to investment management, get lucky, and a front office type takes you on.
3) You work in ops for the next few decades, make a decent but not amazing living, have easier hours, and sit at the bottom of the food chain with no real opportunities to move anywhere but another ops role in another group/firm.
You, like many people who want finance but did not do the requisite work to get the good jobs, want to believe #2 is the most likely outcome for you. It's not, period. Odds are you'll fall into 1 or 3, and 1 is not always a hit because admissions folks know that ops isn't looked upon favorably by FO and it makes you harder to place.
Ops is easier to get into than any other role at a finance firm. So, people think "hey, if I can get into ops I can show them how good I really am and they'll promote me!" It's like backdooring into an Ivy. Some people do it, sure, but most can't and end up staying at Evergreen State.
NE nailed it.
NE nailed it.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into SWANSONS.
what is the scope of
what is the scope of questioning done in an operations interview?? are they going to ask me what the dow is trading at? about interest rates?
also...at a prestigious fund, what is a portfolio analyst's salary?
Nope. They will stick to fit
Nope. They will stick to fit questions and your experience. Why this firm? Why this group? What are your career goals? Why does your experience as whatever make you a good leader? etc.
also..couldn't being stuck in
also..couldn't being stuck in operations be corrected by networking? i have relationships with a lot of people in finance, a fraternity with a huge alumni base in nyc, a cousin at a top recruiting firm in nyc, and a lot of friends in the business...i guess im just a little skeptical of being "typecasted" because as northeastidiot said, high-school grads have the capacity to perform these job functions, and while I didn't go to an ivy league school, I do think i am around that level of intellect
StoudeMelo wrote: what is the
what is the scope of questioning done in an operations interview?? are they going to ask me what the dow is trading at? about interest rates?
also...at a prestigious fund, what is a portfolio analyst's salary?
It's pretty basic stuff. Just show you have interest in the markets - read the WSJ from now until the interview, learn EVERYTHING you can about the fund itself, try to get an idea of what they do.
It will be less of a technical interview and more of a behavioral interview. They need to make sure you can work hard, have attention to detail, be good with deadlines, the same clerical stuff needed for other clerical jobs.
$45-55k is generally the starting salary for most of these jobs with 5-15% bonus. Some firms pay more for their ops people but most pay in that range from what I've seen.
StoudeMelo
also..couldn't being stuck in operations be corrected by networking? i have relationships with a lot of people in finance, a fraternity with a huge alumni base in nyc, a cousin at a top recruiting firm in nyc, and a lot of friends in the business...i guess im just a little skeptical of being "typecasted" because as northeastidiot said, high-school grads have the capacity to perform these job functions, and while I didn't go to an ivy league school, I do think i am around that level of intellect
So, to be frank, why aren't you using the networking to get a good job now?
I have been using everything
I have been using everything it just I didn't go to an ivy, my gpa wasn't stellar and everyone I have talked to is stressing a bad job market...it also has to do with a lack of certainty in what i want to do...every now and then i also question whether its worth all the hours and then daydream of what else i could do with my life...
what is the bonus based off of...the year's performance?
Ops isn't a platform to get
Ops isn't a platform to get into good finance. That's all you need to know. I worked in ops for a few years at a top firm, I went to an Ivy, had a great GPA, and killed it in my firm. I was still shot down over and over by FO positions. Why? Because I was branded as ops. Now i'm finishing up B-School and still running into the same stuff. I'm just lucky enough to have gotten into a FO summer analyst role at a big fund through massive networking and some good fortune.
If you are a fund manager why hire an ops guy when you can hire a target school person who followed a path similar to you? You'll think of the ops guy as someone who couldn't cut it, isn't smart enough, and isn't going to be as successful as the Columbia Econ major, which happens to be your alma mater, interviewing with you later in the afternoon.
Bonus for ops is generally a small pool assigned to the ops group which is based on overall firm performance. Your own specific bonus is based on how well your boss thought you did.
StoudeMelo
also..couldn't being stuck in operations be corrected by networking? i have relationships with a lot of people in finance, a fraternity with a huge alumni base in nyc, a cousin at a top recruiting firm in nyc, and a lot of friends in the business...i guess im just a little skeptical of being "typecasted" because as northeastidiot said, high-school grads have the capacity to perform these job functions, and while I didn't go to an ivy league school, I do think i am around that level of intellect
You think you're around that level of intellect? Based on what? Pretty modest there.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into SWANSONS.
what if my goal is to get
what if my goal is to get into consulting? or other, more creative type positions than those that require modeling and desire genius level iq's....i don't necessarily know that I want to be in i-banking at 30...its just ive always wanted a career in finance and my opportunities as of now are few and far between.
Flake wrote: StoudeMelo
also..couldn't being stuck in operations be corrected by networking? i have relationships with a lot of people in finance, a fraternity with a huge alumni base in nyc, a cousin at a top recruiting firm in nyc, and a lot of friends in the business...i guess im just a little skeptical of being "typecasted" because as northeastidiot said, high-school grads have the capacity to perform these job functions, and while I didn't go to an ivy league school, I do think i am around that level of intellect
You think you're around that level of intellect? Based on what? Pretty modest there.
well based on my parent's, my siblings....I know I am smart...and I've interacted with ivy league caliber people some of which are clearly smarter but i've never felt totally inferior
Wow I'm sold. You pass the
Wow I'm sold. You pass the smart test.
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into SWANSONS.
StoudeMelo wrote: what if my
Network, bust your ass, and
I did it. I can name at least
Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into SWANSONS.
also think luck plays a big
Just fyi, most FO guys don't
BigHedgeHog wrote: Just fyi,
@stoudmelo.....i was all
"A man travels the world over in search of what he needs and returns home to find it." ~George Moore
I did a BO SA gig at JPM the
rothyman wrote: BigHedgeHog
BigHedgeHog wrote: rothyman
rothyman wrote: BigHedgeHog
You're right. I forgot this