Cannabis should be legal?

Angel Molester:

AVOCADO

Nicotine actually isn't harmful and is a heavy metal chelator as well as a hermetic stressor. I use nicotine gum and don't smoke. It's all the other shit they add to it, as well as the act of smoking, that is terrible for your health. I saw a study on farmers, who are exposed to massive levels of heavy metals. The smokers actually had lower all-cause mortality incidence because the heavy metal chelation effects outweighed the detriments of smoking in their cases.

Edit: Marijuana also very much is a good thing to use. All of the health benefits aside, what in the world is not good about something that relaxes you and enhances a lot of experiences? Personally, it helps my chronic back pain a lot. And I know of the plethora of health benefits, but I'm already healthy so I don't notice any acute effects from that.

andnad:

TL;DR Regardless of my opinion below, I think it should be legal because their is real benefit in the eventual commercialization of marijuana.

Now just because it's commonly used and 'accepted' doesn't mean it's good for you or us as a society/culture. I think most of the acceptance is just mob mentality; individualism is declining. Yes, alcohol, tobacco, and prescriptions are legal but it's because they are big rackets. Those 3 things are in need of SERIOUS reform. Plus, it's flawed and frankly defeatist logic to say that because we have some shitty things, it's okay to have more shitty things. Collectively, people are stupid and I don't trust them to react positively to anything.

That's just my 2 cents. I have a few more reasons why I dislike the culture of drug use/acceptance in our society but that's for another time. This isn't grounded in religion or prudish behavior either. I have used copious amounts of the stuff and think that I and others would have simply been better off just not using it or anything else. Sober people are better, happier people imo. Medical cases and legitimate needs are an exception to the rule, obviously.

+1. I agree the "culture" of people who smoke marijuana is pretty low. Most potheads I've met are losers with no ambitions, just a sad fact. I don't think we should speak highly about smoking but rather just let people do their thing and don't judge.

Agree but I've encountered many people in the industry who smoke after work or on the weekends to de-stress. I wouldn't include them in the "culture" but can definitely see where they come from.

They've started the process a few months ago.

I've sold retail containing medical marijuana dispensaries into CMBS. Didn't even underwrite the tenants as vacant!

I wouldn't expect financing on single-tenant industrial properties leased to pot farmers anytime soon, though.

An interesting article our Denver office sent about possible ramifications of financing CRE deals with pot-based tenants. http://www.cobizmag.com/articles/legalized-marijuana-and-the-real-estat…

My friend's been following these guys http://growlifeinc.com/ for a while and they seem to be trying to get into the interim financing biz: http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-12-16/growlifes-plan-to-cash-…

It's going to be super difficult for these organizations to get banking services. My bank turned down a $1 million deposit because the guy gave $650 to his nephew who was visiting family in Iran. FDIC insured banks don't mess around.

Thanks for the feedback. DCD I think that only contributes to the opportunity as it keeps people out of the market

Been wondering about this lately myself.

Circling back to provide an update 18 months later.

Last week California passed medical cannabis regulations through a series of three companion bills: AB266, AB243, and SB 643. It will take some time, 6-8 months, at least, to take effect but it has provided a beginning framework for companies to legally operate in the industry.

This represents an important milestone for two reasons. First, California represents almost half (5) of the overall cannabis market, which totaled $2.7 billion nationally in 2014 - and this market is expected to significantly grow post-legislation. The second reason is that the state has been the lobbying battleground since the Compassionate Use Act (CUA) of 1996, and where California goes in 2016, many states will follow. The CUA, also known as Prop 215, served as a crack in the dam for cultivators, manufacturers, and dispensers to operate in a free-for-all. Ostensibly this was to for "afflicted" individuals but as anyone in California will tell you, it is not a stringent process to receive a medicinal license.

From the Federal level, guidance from the White House and Department of Justice reinforced policies granted at each respective state (9) and has encouraged banks to accept cannabis-related business accounts. The recent legislature in California continues to delegate authority down the line. Individual Counties and Municipalities can decide their own stance on cannabis - San Francisco, for example, has permitted indoor growth facilities in the city (8).

That isn't to say there aren't skeptics. Banks, lenders, and the majority of HNW individuals (3) are staying clear of the cannabis vertical, and the Drug Enforcement Agency still categorizes marijuana as a Schedule 1 controlled substance, on the same level as heroin and LSD. There are a few small investors, lenders, and now VCs (6) but access to capital is relatively limited, providing market inefficiencies. Privateer Holdings, who invests in various cannabis platforms and brands, is now valued at $400+ million (7).

The list of states allowing full Adult Use (recreational) now include Colorado, Washington, Oregon, Alaska, and the District of Columbia. States permitting Medical Use have increased to 24 with Maryland, New York, and Minnesota passing new Medical Use laws in 2014 (10). Where medicinal cannabis is already allowed, growth is accelerating - Arizona's Medical Use market grew 5x from $35 million in 2013 to $155 million in 2014. As an update on Colorado - the revenue collected from taxes has doubled (1) and now exceeds tax on alcohol (2).

So where are the future opportunities? Right now, groups are successfully growing platforms from other industries. For example:

Yelp - www.leafly.com Zillow - www.herbfront.com YCombinator / Biz Dev - http://www.canopyboulder.com/ Insurance - http://www.cannassure.com/

Various groups are competing for delivery, point-of-sale / enterprise software, and so on. I'm personally interested in what value can be unlocked for real estate. Will continue doing research and report back... unless I find something too valuable.

GP

(1) http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/sep/21/colorado-marijuana-tax-r… (2) http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/09/16/colorado-marijuana-tax-revenue_… (3) http://blog.sfgate.com/smellthetruth/2015/09/09/morgan-stanley-rich-inv… (5) ArcView Market Research Report (6) http://www.geekwire.com/2015/seattle-marijuana-investment-firm-privatee… (7) http://www.geekwire.com/2015/were-not-smoking-something-this-marijuana-… (8) http://www.sfweekly.com/sanfrancisco/chem-tales-indoor-grow-houses-mari… (9) http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2015/06/03/house-votes-to-ban-some-… (10) http://medicalmarijuana.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=000881

The upside is apparent, however so is the downside. Not just getting your property seized by the DEA but even more so what happens to rents when this hyper over inflated market implodes as new inventory comes online in the form of additional legalization from other states? That's what is going to really bite investors hoping to cash in on the CRE market. The problem is there is really no way to accurately model these things with any degree of accuracy. Think how many times California has had legalization on the ballot and it was expected to pass? I can think of at least 3.

Pot is already legal. If you think college educated, employed people are going to jail for smoking or having pot you are wrong. All of these laws are on the book to create a slave class of people for corporate run jails and disenfranchise people.

Just look at the demographics of people being busted for drugs and you will understand what the laws truly do.

Everyone needs to watch this documentary on Weed: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9077214414651731007.

Shows the hypocrisy behind the government's stance on drugs (We used to encourage hemp production) and explains the motives of some parties to keep it illegal (For profit prisons, pharmaceutical companies, etc.).

It is seriously a fascinating movie. I showed it to my parents who are extremely conservative and anti-drug and it completely changed their worldview on it. This is actually how I got my mom to start supporting Ron Paul.

It should be legal. It's legalized already in a lot of states for medical reasons, which is a great start.

Well, remove welfare checks before you legalize pot. ty.

Fine, remove welfare checks. Jeez

so hippies have something to talk about

I can see why there's an argument against legalizing weed (even thought it's a HORRIBLE one).

But the fact that there are people out there that are completely against medical marijuana is a fucking embarrassment to the human race. Mitt Romney knows more about the benefits of medical marijuana than doctors? Who fucking knew! lets listen to him. It's so god damned frustrating that we're trying to take away medicine from sick people for what reason? what good reason?????? Vicodin, Xanax, Morphine, Oxycontin are all waaaaaay worse for you than marijuana.

I need to stop here before I go on and on and on, and believe me I can. Just look at marijuana and alcohol side by side, look at the facts, then tell me that alcohol should be legal but marijuana shouldn't... and don't give me the gateway drug crap, that's about the stupidest shirt I've ever heard.

I can introduce you to a couple people that can make claims about the benefits of certain drugs over doctors. I still think 90% of people (in California at least), that have club cards are using it specifically for abuse. And I am pretty sure that the $150 cash you pay for your special doctor visit isn't going so he can give you a proper diagnosis of illness. Both of these things are well known secrets, that potheads laugh about and understand to be abuses. It's just when confronted with the truth to an opposing side they aren't willing to admit it. I am not taking either which way, I'm just pointing out a truth.

tiger90:

I can introduce you to a couple people that can make claims about the benefits of certain drugs over doctors. I still think 90% of people (in California at least), that have club cards are using it specifically for abuse. And I am pretty sure that the $150 cash you pay for your special doctor visit isn't going so he can give you a proper diagnosis of illness. Both of these things are well known secrets, that potheads laugh about and understand to be abuses. It's just when confronted with the truth to an opposing side they aren't willing to admit it. I am not taking either which way, I'm just pointing out a truth.

It's true, but your 90% guess is pure speculation. And you know what? I'd rather have 90% of the people with their cards be "abusing" it while the other 10% have their medicine than the other way around.

Other thing is: the citizens of California/Michigan/etc. voted on these laws and they want medical marijuana, why the hell is the government so infatuated with stopping these states from doing something that the majority of the citizens want? Michigan lawmakers are trying to change around laws to screw over med card holders, even trying to make it illegal to get a ccw if you have a medical card.

I guess even with the legitimate points you've made, I still can't wrap my head around it considering how nonsensical it is that I can go to the store and buy a lethal amount of alcohol for less than $13, but the only way I can die from smoking weed is if it's through too much smoke inhalation (a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooot more money than $13 for that amount of weed)

tiger90:

I can introduce you to a couple people that can make claims about the benefits of certain drugs over doctors. I still think 90% of people (in California at least), that have club cards are using it specifically for abuse. And I am pretty sure that the $150 cash you pay for your special doctor visit isn't going so he can give you a proper diagnosis of illness. Both of these things are well known secrets, that potheads laugh about and understand to be abuses. It's just when confronted with the truth to an opposing side they aren't willing to admit it. I am not taking either which way, I'm just pointing out a truth.

I think most of the people who are "abusing their medical cards" would definitely admit they're blazing mainly for recreation, whether talking to people for/against legalization. They just don't see it as an abuse. The case for criminalizing weed is ridiculous regardless.

weed is for pussies, do a real drug like beer coffee or smack

Real men do 'roids bro.

I won't lie, I inhaled once in my life. California tried to pass a law to legalize marijuana entirely in 2010, it didn't pass. I have no problem giving people with very serious diseases that are living in excruciating pain an alternative to an opiate addiction for the rest of their lives (which I think is the only rational use for it in a medical sense). But I think the terms of this thread, and pretty much everyone out there is not really talking about medicinal purposes. They are trying to use that as an excuse to bring it to the front page. But I think that this is an addictive drug that radically changes the dimensions of personality within a person. And as such, I only have to say, I have no issue with the legalization and taxation of it. Just please remove government subsidies from people who choose to utilize it for purposes other than living in chronic pain (from MS, severe back problems, etc).

Being a Libertarian of sorts. (or perhaps just a moderate Republican), I don't care what people do in the privacy of their homes, on their own time. It is none of my business. Where it becomes my business, is when either the value of my income, or the taxes that are incurred upon me are benefiting their lives in a disproportionate manner, IE taking special income from the government. In that case, I disagree with the Supreme Court, I think drug tests should be mandatory if they want money from the Federal government to aid in their lives, again, disproportionately from me.

I can respect that. Just one thing though, marijuana is only mentally addictive, meaning that you can get addicted to it like you can get addicted to TV, or Video games, or porno... not physically addicted like you can with alcohol, vicodin, morphine, oxycontin, crack, nicotine, heroin, meth, etc.

Fun fact: I'm sure most people already know this, but you can actually die from alcohol withdrawals in rare cases if you were a big ass boozehound (k, not-so-fun fact)

Swagzz, but seriously, I do understand that the physical withdrawal is not deadly, but the mental aspect is a huge social stratifying addiction. You have never heard of lazy people who became potheads suddenly becoming more productive people. They may claim that selling pot has been entrepreneurial, but most of those cases are just break even status. Not baller IB status bosses.

For a good time, Vicodin, alcohol and blow should suffice for the mediocre man.

Yeah, the mental aspect can be a huge factor. I still believe that we should educate people TRUTHFULLY about the dangers of these drugs and let them make the choice though... no D.A.R.E. bullshit, there's no need to exaggerate the hell out of everything. If anything, once the kid grows up and realizes that weed really isn't as bad as people made it out to be, they're gonna have less faith in what the people who grossly exaggerated things said (happened with me and DARE).

You've never heard of lazy people becoming alcoholics and suddenly becoming more productive people either.

I don't know what your entrepreneurial point is getting at.

True that about lazy ppl and alcoholics. My point was that weed doesn't enhance people's capabilities, which doesn't necessarily mean that that should be a reason it should be illegitamized, but it was a negative point I was trying to make.

I personally believe it is illegal still (despite the indeed ridiculous reasons it originally began) because of the further imposition upon society that addicts would create. It does not twist people quite like cocaine or heroin does, but I do think that perhaps if the Supreme Court hadn't ruled against drug testing for Federal benefits, there could have been more of a backbone for its legitimization.

I am still of the opinion that the 4th Amendment was not intended towards people living off of government aid (since there was none at the time of inception), and as such I think the government totally has the right to impose restrictions upon the lives of people who benefit from it.

Otherwise, I believe free use of whatever is fair, but people should be prepared to either reap the punishment of the decisions they make as a result of the influence of drugs, and/or receive no "disproportionate" benefit from the government. (I put it in quotes this time, but its intent is the government programs, money for anything, etc. that taxpayers have to support.)

I think you have the wrong idea about marijuana "addicts"... those ones that sit in their mom's basement until they're 35 doing nothing but playing video games? They were gonna be losers with or without out.

Given the opportunity perhaps I could have done the same, but I like chicks :/ I think that >0 of those people you speak of would have done more in their lives if they didn't smoke a few bowls a day.

But that is beside the point. I really don't care what people do on their own time and whatnot, if a dude can live in his moms basement, more power to him. The issue I have are the people that live and survive off of the good graces of society. And there is a huge proportional amount of people living off of the welfare of the state that fall into this category.

drugs are bad mkay...

if we're gonna legalize pot, we might as well legalize heroin (black tar..Brown tar is just silly)

but seriously..pot should be legalized and regulated like booze and cigs

Legalize it, don't criticize it

http://www.youtube.com/embed/ABc8ciT5QLs

I'm a bit cautious about drugs. I feel pot makes you somewhat.... slow, makes you lose your fire, makes you lose your drive.

I also suggest that the argument claiming alcohol is more dangerous than pot is as much a call to ban alcohol as it is to legalize pot.

In the end, I'm with Tiger - if you take my cash, it's for food, housing and education. NOT for recreational herbs.

This testing should also be extended to include alcohol and tobacco, wtf!

just heard about this on the radio today, pretty awesome: http://news.yahoo.com/granny-drug-kingpin-busted-oklahoma-142202216.html

If you think weed makes you dumber or more lazy you're retarded. You would need to smoke 5 blunts a day for it to cause a neurological change in your brain and thus your personality. Lazy, stupid people smoke weed, but weed didn't make them that way. Like someone said before, that guy that's 35 and lives in his mom's basement and smokes weed all day would be in the same situation whether or not weed existed.

Correlation, not causation.

And it was time to legalize marujuana when Juarez, Mexico became the most dangerous city on earth.

Lol, being sober now and reading the responses, I realized how much I don't care about people who want to be potheads. Smoke up brothas!

That's the spirit!

Weird how you're more against it when you're inebriated though? lol

Lol, I'll argue anything when I'm hammered. Wouldn't have been surprised if I tried to argue Keynsian economics against Abdel heh.

Friends don't let friends get taxed.

I think it's gonna take quite a bit of weed to have a noticeable impact in your IQ/memory for even 3 months afterwards... alcohol kills more brain cells than weed. I know, this whole "compare alcohol to weed in this aspect" thing is the easy way out... but that's exactly my point ha.

I know everything I need to know about pot from the historically accurate film "Reefer Madness."

http://www.youtube.com/embed/54xWo7ITFbg?rel=0

Prohibition always works.

Arguments against legalizing pot: I read somewhere once I think that pot affects your memory, seriously, I read it

Practical arguments against legalizing pot: non-existent

I'm sure you could've done a simple Google search before posing your argument. Also, I was kidding around.

I still don't think that it's a legitimate argument against legalization considering cigarettes and alcohol are legal.