How to Demonstrate Interest in Finance
I'm an undergraduate junior, double majoring in Pure Mathematics and Economics. I'm interested in finance now, though (and this is why I'm majoring in math and econ) interested in pursuing a PhD in Economics in the future.
I'm sure landing a finance-related internship this coming summer would be helfpul if I would like to land a job in finance (any subfield, except for IB which is not very appealing) upon graduating. Nonetheless, I will most likely spend this summer doing economics-related research. I have had multiple internships already, but they were limited to statistical analysis and market research.
So, what qualities, courses, etc should I stress to a potential employer to land a job in finance? Is studying for the CFA, maybe taking the L1 exam by the time I graduate, worth it for someone without a finance background? I will have significant calculus, probability, stats, measure theory and economics by the time I graduate - zero finance, however.
^ this
Also, I know you said you're spending this summer doing econ research, but that sort of demonstrates that you aren't interested in finance. Do something finance related this summer.
Definitely do not say that you're interested in getting a PhD in the future. That's like proposing to a girl and then telling her you want to see other people.
CFA L1 isn't really worth the time just to show interest, IMO.
Thank you, everyone, for the advice.
The great thing is that the research I'll be doing is mostly about the economics of mergers and acquisitions in certain industries, so I suppose that's relevant. But yes hahah I'll avoid mentioning PhD plans.
I think that I'll avoid the CFA for now unless it becomes more likely that I will not pursue a PhD, at least not for a while. Because you're right, 250 hours is a bit much. Plus, got to study for the GRE first.
Thanks again!
Potential Career Change from IB to VC - How to Demonstrate/Build/Grow Interest & Passion (Originally Posted: 04/11/2014)
Hi,
I'm currently a third year analyst at a boutique bank in NY. I guess it is considered an "elite" boutique and we focus on M&A and Restructuring. I'll be promoted to an associate after the summer, however, over the past year and a half have lost most of my passion for the job. I've recently come across Venture Capital and the idea of having a hand in the potential growth of exciting companies and market disrupting truly is of interest to me. I'm industry agnostic, but the tech/health care space is of interest to me.
My dissatisfaction with banking deserves a whole another post not appropriate for this forum, but I really feel I spent the last 3 years doing something I hate and had no passion for, trying to sound impressive because I worked at a top firm/made a lot of money - I've realized spending three years and forming your identity around something you hate really takes a toll on you.
I've taken a look at various presentations from some funds, and I KNOW this is an area that I could grow not just an interest, but a passion for. I'd like to move to a VC fund in the near future, the problem being that I have very little tech/start-up background. Part of the reason is that I've just had very little free time the last 2.5 years, but part of it is my fault for not spending the free time I did have to build my knowledge of the tech/VC space.
My question is - how do I demonstrate to potential companies and headhunters that I AM passionate about the space and would be a good fit? I understand I'm framing this question as if I just want any VC job that comes along my way (and I realize I've done a similar thing when I was trying to get a job in Investment Banking out of college) - but while true on the surface, I really feel I have 3 years of hindsight and experience to learn about myself and my career inclination. I guess one thing is that I'm willing to give up $250k in salary for roughly half or less of what I'm making now, but what are some ways that I could demonstrate genuine interest in the VC/Tech/Healthcare space?
The issue is that the time frame is relatively short - I'd like to land a new job in the summer. I don't want to be in a position where I'm promoted to associate and end up ditching the firm shortly after. I thought about investing some side money ~$20k in various start ups on Angel List by doing my own due diligence, market sizing/research, and obviously doing a TON of reading, which I've started on. Any other suggestions and plan of attack would be appreciated!
Apologies for the long post, but would love to hear others' thoughts.
Thank you
I don't work for a VC fund, but work with a VC backed company and have been researching the space for a while. My understanding is you should:
a) Blog about companies, investment thesis, or anything than interests you - Great VCs are a part of the community. Fred Wilson's USV recently posted a analyst job for which candidates were evaluated mostly by their online presence. b) Angel Investing now is a good idea - show passion and you are putting money where your mouth is c) Alternatively you could network into your startup community and help startups part time or volunteer with a non-profit start up.
Also, understand that being from an "elite" boutique or GS isn't going to help you much. This will be an all out career change. Yes some funds, especially later stage ones value modelers but for grunt work not check writing. Some groups like Bain Cap hire consultants but overwhelming industry experience or being a rich guy is the best way into the VC club.
You need to learn the industry you want to interview for. No one is going to hire you for modeling skills or because you were a banker. The interviews will be very discussion based around individual sectors- they want to know that you know what you're talking about. For starters, definitely choose between tech or healthcare, because very few people do both (some firms do both, but you'll rarely, if ever, be hired to cover both). Another major point of interviews will be client interaction during your time in M&A and the ability to handle yourself in conversation with C-level folks.
Do you have any deal experience in tech or healthcare?
Thanks a lot for your replies, both are really helpful and constructive. A sense of entitlement is not what I want to portray, it's something definitely prevalent among young analysts in that people feel like top funds and companies will come at your feet to try to hire them away from their IB gigs. It's helpful for me to hear that the VC Funds care about your knowledge and passion for the industry, and nothing else.
@"FunnyReference", I'm going to take up all three of your suggestions - maintaining a blog sounds like an awesome idea, definitely a great way for me to build my knowledge and grow myself as a potential VC tech analyst. I have an ex colleague who is now working at one of these tech accelerator organizations, will try to reach out to see if I can get an inside look.
@"meph", I've worked on some tech pitches, but nothing has materialized. Working on various pitches/researching the mobile tech industry has been the extent of my experience in tech. But as I am part of a generalist program, I've not focused on tech more so than I have in, say, industrials/media/consumer/etc. Not go into such detail, but I do have an interest in the tech side of healthcare, particularly concerning the communication of data across every sub-sector of the healthcare system. I will try to disciplined when I research the different industries and try to build up as most knowledge as I can, most likely around healthcare as I at least have some interest already.
Appreciate the comments!
Don't get me wrong - they absolutely care about pedigree as well. VCs love the big name graduate business schools just as much as PE guys do (it sometimes appears they like it even more, given the more concentrated nature of VC... often seems like everyone went to Stanford or Harvard). It's just that when you're coming over from banking they won't hire a someone from Goldman that doesn't know the sectors they cover extremely well. No VC partner wants to sit around teaching a natural resources analyst from Goldman the difference between license and subscription models.
Edit: Also, mobility is huge these days so the pitches you did there could be very helpful. Definitely talk to those, and position it in a way that "you spend some time focused on that sector." Obviously back this up with additional research on your own into the space, but you don't have to have a closed deal in a sector to be knowledgeable on it. Has your firm been active in the tech space (outside of the deals you've been involved with)?
I recently made the switch from HealthCare banking to VC and there were a few things that I found the most helpful:
Have a specific sector / sub sector or two that you know very well and are able to talk about in depth. Tech / Healthcare aren't sectors. You want to be able to talk about something much more focused. IE I think the technology that connects doctors to patients is very exciting. Of particular interest to me are the companies that streamline patient check-in and allow doctors to charge patients at the point of sale. A few companies that do this are x, y, z. Z is particularly exciting because they already have a contract with HCA. This foothold in the largest hospital system in the country gives them a clear edge... from here you should be able to talk about how this company relates to their competitors, where it stands in the market, general tailwinds and all the other stuff you generally talk about when you're valuing a company. The important thing is to understand both the company and the five other companies out there that are doing the same thing.
I'm sure this is pretty obvious but talk to a lot of alumni if your school has any sort of network. Talk to the young guys because they've probably been in your shoes and the old guys because they can hire you.
For headhunters a lot will come to the initial interaction you had with them and if you came across as a competent candidate for a VC role. There is nothing you can to do change this but pinging headhunters to follow up, update your resume and re-express your interest is always helpful.
It's a pretty tough jump to make given the skills learned in banking don't really translate to VC so one thing to consider is trying to move to a growth equity firm where your modeling skills will be more appreciated. This will probably make more sense if you want to make a quick move but will probably be closer to banking than an early stage VC role would be. Another option would be to work for a portfolio company for a few years in a biz dev role and try and make the jump afterwards.
Not to discourage you but the stat I heard that really scared me is that within NYC there are ~100 junior VCs (Principle and below within all of Tech). Good luck and let me know if you have any questions.
When networking, should you bring up industry news to show your interest in a particular group? (Originally Posted: 06/28/2013)
I know it is good to show you read about deals and industry news, but how would you steer the conversation in this direction? Would it be weird to be talking about why you are interested in their group, then bring up examples of some of their deals? I just don't want to make it seem like I am forcing this into the convo.
Do people generally even talk about deals in a phone "informational"?
not weird at all and easy/normal to bring up. don't however go too far and talk about the multiples and stuff like that in just an informational/informal talk.
if im talking with someone for the first time i will feign a bit of ignorance and ask them to tell me more about their group. somehow i always end up meeting people in a sponsors group so i always end up asking (like i dont know anything) "do you have a lev fin group and how often do you all work with them?" Almost always, I will know at least one deal their bank/group has done and if not I will at least know a big transaction in their space. so you end up ultimately just stating "i saw that X just got bought out by Y or that Z is going public in a few weeks" and they can talk about that deal as much as they want. if they give you a longer answer you can probe more and get a bit technical, if they give you a very quick answer then you should just focus on talking about more casual/fun topics.
dont force it though - if you dont get a chance to talk about deals/news its okay. it helps them to know that you keep up but you'd rather come across as an easy parson to talk with than a guy who asks stuff out of nowhere and is trying too hard.
hope that helps .sorry im tired so the organization is this post is pitiful
Keep it to high-level stuff (don't be dropping multiples or anything) and make sure you know your shit about the deal before bringing it up.
The Commonest and Worst Way to Show Interest (Originally Posted: 06/28/2010)
Q: For interviews and cover letters, I've heard that the best way to show interest in a firm is to give historical facts (founding date, important deals) or logistics (number of employees). How often should we work these in?
Yikes, what bad advice. That is the last thing I want to hear. When I am reading your cover letter, I do want to know that your letter has been written specifically to answer my job description, and that it is not a form letter. Likewise, when I am assessing you in both your cover letter (and resume) and during your interview, I am looking for evidence that you would want to work for me and my firm.
But, regurgitated facts are not the way to show it.
Experiences and skills that are aligned with what I do are much more relevant to me. I am never going to leave an interview thinking, “Wow, she was able to name all three of our founders and cited what their birthday’s were!” But you will be heading towards an offer if I am thinking “Wow, that research project she worked on covered exactly the type of problems we deal with every day!”
Dazzle me with your skills and evidence of interest in my industry; don’t bore me with memorized facts about my firm.
Completely agree - thanks for the sound advice.
So what if my experience aren't aligned with the job I am seeking? For instance, if I want a job in IBD, but my internships have been in buy-side PE and public finance.
Depending on what you did in each, you can spin each experience to be aligned with IBD at some level.
For example: "My private equity experience has prepared me well for a career in investment banking. I was exposed to the transaction process, and developed an understand for what a buyer seeks in an acquisition. Furthermore, the experience provided a venue to hone my financial modeling and valuation skills."
You get the idea, just take the time to dress something like that up. You can do something similar for pub. fin. (stress financial modeling, research, presentation building, client-focused teamwork, etc.). Just strip down your experiences until they sound similar to what you are seeking.
Throwing in facts about the company is somewhat of a copout when you are having a hard time aligning your skills with the job description (not a good sign). Guilty as charged.
Transfer nontarget. show interest in finance? (Originally Posted: 05/08/2011)
I'm going to be a freshman at a nontarget this coming fall and was wondering that if I wanted to transfer to a school with a finance program (or economic w/ fin courses), how would I show my interest in finance? I mean, sure, I can join some clubs, but how else? I read the economist and the wsj, but I can't just put that.
Remember the school doesn't need finance classes for it to be a target. The best way to get into a target school is to get really good grades freshman year and be able to effectively communicate how the school you're transferring too will help you achieve your future goals.
Wouldn't it be shallow to tell them that their school has a better alumni network?
Thats why you lie. Might as well learn this now, to get ahead you have to be able to bull shit and talk in terms of the other persons interests. You say things like they have a major not available at your current school, you love the college community, etc.
Just keep your GPA high (while taking relatively challenging courses) and get involved. Make sure to take math and econ classes. I'm also transferring from a non-target to either Vandy or Northwestern (accepted by Vandy, awaiting a decision from NU). PM me if you want more advice.
get 4.0 GPA with decent classes - that's all
^You don't need a 4.0 although it helps obviously. A 3.7+ should keep you competitive for most top schools, assuming you have a stellar HS record and solid test scores.
Do some business stuff (selling ads) for the school newspaper, do model UN or smth - that should suffice
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