Who you got?
Michael Jordan
Kobe Bryant
Lionel Messi
Zinedine Zidane
Tiger Woods
Tim Duncan
Sachin Tendulkar
Roger Federer
Manny Pacquiao
Floyd Mayweather
Lance Armstrong
Michael Phelps
Usain Bolt
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tendulkar hell yea
Takeru Kobayashi?
jk, I think your list is good. Before I clicked on the link, I was gonna put votes down for: -Michael Jordan -Michael Phelps -Tiger Woods -Manny Pacquiao -Roger Federer
but you seem to have all those bases covered.
I think Jerry Rice should also be on the list.
(What about Takeru Kobayashi!?)
Good point, LeBron's only been active a quarter of the time period in question and has just as many rings as MJ, Kobe, or Duncan. This choice makes perfect sense.
(Agree on Gretzky though.)
I think I mentioned him because he's dominant in the sport. I suppose rings will come but his dominance is apparent now.
Iker Casillas
When you hear Iker Casillas, do you really say, 'there goes a dominant sportsman'?
MJ hands down
+1
Come to think of it, I actually think Shaq should get a nod as well.
Yeah Kobe should not be on that list because he wasn't even the most dominant player on his team.
My top 3 are MJ, Lance, and Tiger. Tiger may be my top pick because he has defied his own sport - you're not supposed to win that frequently in golf.
Alan Francis
The New York Times wrote that he may be "the most dominant athlete in any sport in the country"
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/21/sports/21horseshoe.html
BOLT SHOULD BE HIGHER zidane? why
1 is Barry Bonds. Period. End of story. The best baseball player ever.
This is true. Why he isn't on this list I do not understand at all. There were a few seasons in his prime where you couldn't even pitch to the guy.
I hate Barry Bonds too. He's a terrible human being with a miserable attitude and a cheater who perjured himself. Having said that, check out all the MVP's and Gold Gloves to go along with the incredible hitting stats:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/b/bondsba01.shtml
So if you're going to include the steroid users, I think I'd say Bonds/Jordan/Gretzky win (all three were the best player ever in their respective sports)
I was gonna add him but thought of potential backlash over his steroid use and recent bad publicity kinda taints his records.
It really has to be Michael Schumacher.
Michael Jordan no question. How is this even a debate?
MK, TW, RF
Terrible list.
How can you list PBF or Pac? A lot of other great players on the level of Zidane over the same period... tough to go there.
I don't think Tim Duncan or Kobe belong on the list as they aren't on the MJ level yet.
All the rest are a wash--all exceptional, once in a generation types for their sports.
You dont think PBF and Pac are once in a generation fighters?
Cant name a lot of players on Zidane's level, let alone win everything like he did. That claim is always made for MJ so should apply everywhere else.
Every NBA finals from 2000 has had either LA or the Spurs in it bar one. Seems like dominance.
If there are players in the same sport who are undisputedly better, I can't see them on the list. Kobe and Duncan are all-time greats.... but not Jordan.
Zidane, also great, but there are others in his generation who have had similar success, perhaps more important to their teams, etc.
PBF/Pac haven't fought each other. Neither have had a career defining fight yet. Not to mention, boxing is a joke right now anyway.
Michael Jordan, though what Tiger has done for golf rivals MJ (even though the athleticism required for golf is not in the same league at all)
I'm surprised there is so little love for the Olympic/pure performance sports.... Lance/Phelps/Bolt are/were all on different planets from their competition.
And where in the hell is FloJo??? I guess just outside the 20yr range, but close enough if we're including Jordan, whose best years were pre-90s anyway. Her records probably won't be touched for another 50-100 years, if ever. They are unfathomable.
Jordan's best years were pre-90s? This is news to me, I guess the 6 championships he won in the 90s were not his best years.
Yeah, Jordan for sure. Iker Casillas? Not sure about that man, can't think of a better keeper at the moment though.
They guy's won everything there is to win
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iker_Casillas#Honours
And he goes out with her
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&biw=1280&bih=923&site=search&tbm=i…
And he is actually respectfull on the pitch
Oliver Kahn >> Iker Casillas
only goalkeeper in the history of football to win the FIFA World Cup Golden Ball
You should have put Ronaldo in place of Zidane... 42 goals in 48 games? jesus fking christ
That was one season. Zidane has won every trophy there is to win and is widely regarded as the finest footballer of his generation.
Kobe isn't even in a league with Jordan. Kobe can only win when he has bigs like Shaq, Gasol..etc. He is nowhere near Jordan's level. Jordan transcended the sport and he made everyone better (unlike Kobe).
Who made it a comparison? The aim was to make a list of players who at one time were the best, the most successful, etc. If we want to compare, I agree MJ was superior but I hate the fact that people downplay Kobe's achievements because he isnt Jordan. I know he wants to be, the media wants him to be but lets respect the man for being Kobe.
It's pretty stupid to list one player as the most dominant in a team sport. MJ is undoubtedly the GOAT in basketball, but he had a lot of help from his team and coach, without which he would not have been as successful. This automatically disqualifies anyone that plays a team sport. I would have to go with Roger Federer. His record in his prime years was just unbelievable. He dominated tennis much more than tiger dominated golf. Bolt and Phelps are also insanely dominant in their sports, but since no one gives a shit about sprinting or swimming outside of the olympics, they're out too. It's definitely Federer.
Clearly the team helps but the aim was to establish a list of sportsman that defined the sport or had great success within the sport.
Agree on Fed though.
Agree with every word, couldn't have said it better. People don't realize how utterly dominant he was/is...it was insane, way beyond anything Tiger did.
I was gonna leave Olympians out but having mentioned them, two more:
Sir Steve Redgrave Ian Thorpe
Gretzky.
I had this debate the other day with a co-worker. Yes, MJ was great and well above the rest in bball, but you need to compare how big the "gap" was between MJ and the rest of the league. Its big...but not as big as the gap was between Gretzky and his respective league. Gretzky holds an insane amount of records even to this day, some of which no one is even close to surpassing anytime soon. He has also scored 200 points in a SINGLE season...the only player EVER to accomplish that...and he did that for 4 seasons. Anyone who knows anything about hockey knows that is absolutely insane. All his other stats are also ridic.
No doubt, MJ was good, but Gretzky was soo much better.
If you've played sports, coaches will always tell you that stats are for losers. MJ has rings. Gretsky has stats. Both were great, but MJ has rings. I guess it's dependent on if you call players great because of championships/rings/medals etc., or statistics. I would argue that it's harder to get rings than stats my friend.
It's only 6-4 for championships, Jordan and Gretzky respectively. I don't think that is a big enough difference to say that all the stats/records that Gretzky has (many of which will NEVER be broken) can be discarded.
Disclaimer, I do play hockey so maybe there is some bias but holy cow Gretzky was an animal.
Stats tell a much different story though bud.
Anyways, both were great. Would love to see another of either in my generation.
Well it says the most dominant sportsman right? Jordan and his team was the most feared and dominant. Federer is up there too. Bolt is inconsistent.
Lionel Messi - You ought to have your IP banned for this one. I can give you 5 Brazilian soccer players better than this dude in our time. Tim Duncan (shouldnt' be on the list; great player, but not dominating) Kobe Bryant (shouldn't be on the list / too early) Sachin Tendulkar - cricket is not even more popular than soccer; america's 5th/6th/7th favorite sport...
Brazilian better than Lionel Messi?! Comparable at a stretch but better, come on!!
Duncan is dominant as winning is dominant.
Same for Kobe plus he took that terrible Lakers team to the playoffs in 2006
As for Sachin, it doesnt matter how popular the sport. His achievement of 100 international centuries is amazing. Granted he wont get appreciated for it as cricket isnt that popular but I recognise it.
Happy Gilmore?
Nice list. I would remove Kobe and Tim Duncan.
I would replace Zidane with Ronaldo.
Don't forget about hockey. Gretzky and Lemeiux.
Also, don't want to sound like a redneck, but I read an article on ESPN - they said that Jimmie Johnson three peating in NASCAR was far more impressive than a three peat in other sports.
And MJ takes the cake.
WSO, please lock this thread. People are classifying NASCAR as a sport and I think this type of language is derogatory, it is offensive and highly inappropriate.
My bad on Gretzky. I'm not a big hockey guy and I assumed most of his accomplishments were pre 20 year benchmark.
Johnson's current streak is at 5 seaons. Im not Kobe fan but you all need to get your heads straight on this one. Jordan won 6 rings in 15 seasons, his 6th being in season 15, if Kobe wins this year it will be 6 in 15 as well. Call me crazy but I actually believe that Kobe is a better player than Jordan. Jordan entered basketball at a time when the sport needed a mega superstar to save it, Kobe entered the sport when it was stocked with superstars. The only real difference between the two is the time at which they played in and that MJ had a mega marketing machine behind him that propelled him to epic levels. With that being said. I think this list is more accurate in terms of total sport domination.
These are some of the most dominating players to ever come into their respective sports.
Megastar to save it? Um, they still had Bird, Magic, Isiah so I dont buy that argument. I love Kobe, but he's not better than MJ.
Retarded. Get your chromosomes checked.
Whats everyones issue with Zidane?
The mans amazing.
And no, I'm not basing his inclusion on the basis of one goal.
Football - Favre Soccer - Ronaldo Basketball - MJ/Kobe Baseball - Barry Bonds Hockey - Gretzky Golf - Tiger Woods Olympics - Phelps/Bolt Cycling - Armstrong Tennis - Federer NASCAR - Johnson F1 - Schumaker
These guys epitomized their sports in the past 20 years. Comparing across sports is stupid...
I like your list, except I'd swap out Favre for Brady but it's close
I'll have to take Peyton over Favre, but Brady should be above both... Sports is such a results oriented game where your success and acceptance from general fan base is literally measured by number of championships.
Baseball I would have to say Jeter... Hurts me to say this but can't deny it.
What about Shaun White? This guy single handedly changed the whole game and keeps setting new standards every year.
I see typical responses, NFL/NBA/MLB/Golf are all over the plays. Unfortunately, outside of the US those sports mean nothing. As competitive as NFL is, it's much harder to become a starting player for Manchester United/Arsenal/Chelsea/Real Madrid/other top soccer clubs.
If by Ronaldo you mean Ronaldo Luís Nazário de Lima, then I am cool. But if you refer to Cristiano Ronaldo, then your list loses its legitimacy. He dives like a little bitch:
I think this guy is by far the most dominant sportsman in the past 20 years: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleksandr_Karelin "He went undefeated in international competition (spanning from 1987 to 2000) until an upset loss to American Rulon Gardner in the gold-medal match at the Sydney Olympics. Karelin went the last six years of his unbeaten streak without giving up a point. He was revered for his extraordinary strength and unprecedented success in international competition. He is universally considered to be the greatest Greco-Roman wrestler of all time."
He truly dominated in one of the hardest and most demanding sports. Many say that he lost 2000 Olympics for ridiculous amount of $$$
I also 2nd anyone who mentioned Zidane. One of the classiest players soccer has ever had (except for the very last game that he played).
Measured how?
And with the NBA you do have a solid international presence these days. Not to mention, there are significantly fewer spots in the NBA (since there's only 30-some teams and only like 15 guys on each team).
MJ and Gretzky are probably the most dominant all-time in their respective sports. Zidane is fair when considering the past 20 years. Was the centerpiece of several of the greatest teams of all-time.
Tiger Woods is my role model.
How Casillas is in this discussion I don't know. Manuel Neuer is probably as good as he is right now, and Kahn in his prime was way more dominant that Casillas ever has been. Messi, while great, never really "dominates." He is inconsistent, and his international form alone really has to remove him from consideration. Zidane, Ronaldo and Kahn are probably the only footballers who can be considered dominant in the last twenty years.
I hate Bonds, but the man could practically be put in the dictionary under "dominant." You could make a case that Randy Johnson belongs in that discussion with him.
Schumaker definitely belongs on the list.
If you're willing to expand the definition of sportsman to include women, FloJo and the Williams sisters belong on the list.
How do you include Usain Bolt and not Michael Johnson? That's just silly
My bad on Michael Johnson. Must have overlooked him.
Agree on most of your other points. I realise Casillas has pedigree in winning but this list is about sportsman who dominated their game. No way can you say that about Casillas or in fact any goalkeeper.
Inconsistent?! Messi has 52 goals this season! 52 in 51 games. Talk about consistency. a lot of player went through unfulfilled at international level. Talk about Thierry Henry, Gabriel Batistuta, etc. Great player in football anyway carve out their legacy during club competitions. I still expect Messi to perform come the next World Cup. He's only 23.
I don't know how you can say a goalkeeper can't dominate the game. Kahn took Germany to the '02 World Cup final basically single-handedly, and Schmeical essentially won Euro '92 for Denmark.
I'm not saying Messi isn't amazing, but it is rare to see him simply take over a game and decide it. Granted, playing for Barca, he rarely has to, but that is the more reason to judge him by his comprehensive body of work, not merely his club form. In 10 years, we might say that he is one of the most dominant ever, but his body of work is still too small to judge. There was a point where you might have made similar arguments in favour of Michael Owen or Ronaldinho, yet the subsequent form of both has been mediocre. Messi might well end his career as the greatest ever, but is certainly not there yet. Christiano Ronaldo has 42 goals in 50 matches this year, and his prior body of work is certainly more comprehensive than Messi's.
Rafael Nadal. Kid's only 24 - with way more Grand Slam titles than Fed had at his age and a higher win % in singles (82.64%). I'm sure he'll surpass Fed for all time Grand Slam titles.
So, that's an argument that he WILL be the most dominant sportsman of the NEXT twenty years. If we want to engage in hypotheticals, this is the most dominant footballer of all time:
www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3550643/Club-signs-future-star-aged-…
12 Grand slams? Are you kidding me? He has 9 already and he has a good ~6-8 years left. He wins the French every year (ok 5/6 years), and he won three grand slams last year. Yeah he gets injured sometimes and his style of play is physically demanding but saying he's only going to win 3 more is ridiculous.
I'd say he retires with 18 grand slams, esp with Federer on the way out.
+1 Great player that he is, completely agree.
I'm on the Nadal train. Watch him destroy bitches the next few years
I knew eventually the soccer geeks would start to go crazy about soccer not getting enough cred in this thread. Soccer people have a huge chip on their shoulder because no one in the US cares about it. The only reason it's so popular internationally is because it's cheap to play. If every country could afford NFL football they would have it because it's far more entertaining and exciting. Soccer will never be a major US sport, you need to get over it.
The argument that "soccer is only popular internationally because it's cheap to play" is patently retarded. It suffers from several logical fallacies. Firstly, you seem to assume that everyone outside of the US is poor. I assume that the reason no one plays baseball in Western Europe because they can't afford the bats, and no one in Southeast Asia plays American football because there are no open spaces. Secondly, even if the rest of the world were poorer than the US, it doesn't explain why basketball, extremely cheap to play, is not more popular internationally, or why sports like baseball are popular in impoverished Latin American countries, and Russian parents manage to find the funds for hockey gear and ice time.
I am sure that the oil sheiks and Russian oligarchs who are snapping up Premiership teams wish that they had the money to afford to play American football in Europe. Firstly, soccer will be a major US sport; the MLS, which is a pretty shitty product, is already the fourth most popular league in the US, ahead of the NHL. Far more kids grow up today playing soccer than any other sport in America, and I doubt they will suddenly start to hate the game as they age. Finally, even if soccer is never a major sport in the US, no one cares. It is the most popular sport throughout the world by a massive margin, and your navel gazing does not trouble the rest of the world one iota.
For the first 14 MLS games televised by ESPN2 this season, the average viewing audience is 251,000. And these are for games that are shown during mostly prime-time hours. The TV ratings are so bad that the WNBA has better ratings on ESPN2. Yes, the WNBA.
http://www.majorleaguesoccertalk.com/major-league-soccer-is-losing-the-…
The sport is irrelevant in the US, get over it... also a soccer crusader would use the expression "navel gazing", yikes dude
Sachin Tendulkar. Because when he is batting, he can cause a significant decrease in the productivity of a country of a billion people. I doubt any other sportsman has the capability to enthral such numbers.
second that..has the most amount of pressure from fans than any sportsman in history, a cricket mad nation with a billion people who all adore him and who want him to do well...despite that pressure he has continually performed for 20 years in different countries and conditions..holds all the records possible in the game + the World Cup...
however comparing across different sports is not logical..
Football: Ronaldo American Football: Brady Rugby union: Jonah Lomu Tennis: Federer F1: Schumacher
and now that we talk about football, here is for the german fans:
In my childhood: Michael Jordan.
Cael Sanderson.
Cael Norman Sanderson (born June 20, 1979, in Salt Lake City, Utah), (pronounced "kale") is considered one of the greatest American amateur wrestlers of all time. A 2004 Olympic champion in Athens, Greece, he went undefeated in four years of college wrestling at Iowa State University (159–0), winning four consecutive NCAA titles (1999–2002). He and Marcus LeVesseur are the only wrestlers in NCAA history to go undefeated with more than 100 wins. Sports Illustrated named his college career as the second most impressive college sports feat behind the setting of four world records by Jesse Owens in a single hour at the 1935 Big Ten track and field conference championship meet.1
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleksandr_Karelin
Great call dude, I forgot all about this guy and he's an absolute beast. I even own a pair of black Asic Cael 2.0's that I wear to the gym everyday. Thanks for not letting us forget this sport dominator.
I saw the guy with the horseshoes, that's pretty impressive. Federer deserves a lot of respect because he was the "best" in his individual sport (greatest of all time by definition of how many grand slams he won), and he's still going.
Completely agree. It has to be Rodger Federer hands down. I have tons of respect for MJ as he is arguably the best basketball player - arguably. However, Federer is by definition the best.
Either there are a lot more women on WSO than I thought or a boatload of Federer fans just came out of the closet.
Don't forget Valentino Rossi.
either way you feel about it, Kobe for a length of time made it normal to score 40+ per game. When it comes to Basketball it is definitely MJ and Kobe.
jordan
Jerry Rice in FB. Second place in his position isn't even close.
QB driven league.
who would you take between Jerry Rice and Ray Lewis?
Yes, but for "most dominant" it's JR in FB. There is no QB that is significantly more dominant than the next best. The dominant ones are from 20+ years ago. JR didn't win NFLs #1 all time for nothing, so definitely going JR > RL. Cooler guy too.
If we're talking having played at any point in the last twenty years, then LT for the NFL. But Jerry Rice probably fits the bill better as he was in his prime for a good part of the last twenty years.
Btw, a lot of the arguments on why to exclude Messi sound irrelevant now.
I'm just going to leave this here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Records_held_by_Roger_Federer
[quote=obscenity]I'm just going to leave this here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Records_held_by_Roger_Federer[/quote]
Since tennis is a much more important sport than squash, I completely agree that Federer should get the title of greatest athlete ever. But there is another athlete that was even more dominant in his own sport.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jahangir_Khan He won 555 consecutive games and was undefeated for 5 years. That's equivalent to never dropping a set in tennis for five years or 555 sets played. Simply astonishing.
wow.
Ah, but Federer is not even the most dominant player in tennis:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esther_Vergeer
Derek Jeter breaking the all-time hits record in 5 years is pretty impressive to me.
What the hell are you talking about dude?
Correction- Within the next 5 years.
Side note: Jeter played like complete shit in the field v the Sox last weekend
I'd go with Tiger if we're talking just most dominant over the past 20 years. The guy literally couldn't be touched for a long, long time. Lance would have been right up there but with the doping/PED stuff I gotta leave him out. Phelps is dominant but obviously not anymore and didn't do it long enough for me to give him the nod, but he's kinda disadvantaged simply because the Olympics are only once every 4 years.
Others to consider: Jerry Rice - all time points leader (non kicker obviously) was a WR, but let's not forget how dominant his quarterback for much of that time was (Joe Montana, the greatest QB to ever play the game). I don't believe in naming dominant players from obscure sports or time periods, so the Greek wrestler who won like 1500 matches doesn't fucking count nor does any of that cricket bullshit (flame away, Indians/Brits/whatevers). Federer for a long time but not quite as much as Tiger, though I'll admit a case can be made for him.
Oh hey guys, wait... this whole conversation is a waste of time because I forgot to mention the two greatest athletes of all time in their respective sports: Michael Jordan and Wayne Gretzky. And considering a case can be made against MJ but not against The Great One, I'm going with Wayne as the most dominant player of the past two decades. Retirement speech still gets me every time.
Let me quickly frame what Gretzky did in his career: He has about 100 more goals than anybody else in history, SEVEN HUNDRED more assists, is the only player in history to break the 200 points barrier in a season... and did that 4 times. Hell, if Gretzky never scored a SINGLE goal he would still have the most career points in hockey history. This guy was absolutely the definition of dominant. Guys like Michael Jordan and even Tiger Woods can't say the same. There's still Nicklaus, there's still Kareem and Kobe and Wilt... but in hockey, there was Wayne Gretzky and then everybody else.
You know by pretty much any measure cricket is a bigger sport than american football, baseball or basketball, right? I struggle to understand how that is obscure, unless this topic is entirely devoted to the US perspective.
Probably Federer. It's hard to judge all these guys (often apples and oranges), but in terms of a combination of records, completeness as a player, and dominance, Federer probably takes the cake.
Eldrick
Tiger Woods, Shaq, Michael Jordan, Roger Federer, Michael Schumacher. Take your pick!
I would like to add Royce Gracie and Fedor Emelianenko.
I'll echo the nominations for Aleksandr Karelin and Cael Sanderson.
I'll also throw in one that most people have never heard of...
John Brzenk
He's a beast.
Regards
Cael Sanderson is the man
Royce was revolutionary but not dominant. Once people started paying more attention to BJJ we never really saw the kind of awesomeness we did from the early UFC tournaments where he was putting kids to sleep 3-4 times a night. Once it caught up to him a year or two down the road and after not being able to stop Shamrock, he was just an average fighter. Given the Matt Hughes fight was like 12 years after the first UFC, seeing him get wrecked in that fight showed how quickly everyone caught up once they realized BJJ was the most important part of the game. And testing positive for roids was kind of felt like his way of saying he could no longer keep up.
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