Is it ever too early to start networking? College freshman here.
Hi,
I am currently a first year university student. My school isn't exactly a top school, but it is known, and ranks within the top forty schools in the United States, according to the USNWR. Additionally, I plan to major in finance.
In the past few months or so, I have been reading some blogs about the finance industry - more particularly, the investment banking business. I have read some more books on the subject, and I find investment banking to be a possibly palatable career choice for me in the future. That said, I am not exactly down for i-banking, but I do want to work in some capacity in finance somewhere - be it corporate finance, investment banking, etc.
So, my question is: Is it too early to start networking with alumni who are currently working in the finance industry? I haven't taken any courses in finance or accounting yet, and will not do so until my sophomore year. That said, I haven't been able to find any real finance internships for freshmen either.
I am not exactly begging for a job right now (I work 15 hours a week at a local supermarket, and it pays reasonably well), but I am wondering if starting early with the networking process might give me a leg up over my classmates when it comes to searching for internships junior year.
And also, if I do network with alumni - how should I start the conversation?
The earlier you start networking, the better. Join some clubs on campus (like the finance club), do informational interviews, look for internships, etc. You will be miles ahead of the game if you start doing this stuff as a freshman.
It is never....ever....to early to start networking. Just introduce yourself, be polite, and kindly ask them whatever you are wondering.
Agree 100% with econ.
Dude I didn't even know what investment banking was when I was a freshman. You have a major advantage, if you could get any finance related type of internship for the summer, it would be a great advantage for many reasons. You could get a sense of the professional world.... even if it simply the feeling of wearing a suit and getting up really early and talking to people that are older than you.. It is a great experience. And since you are only a freshman, if you get any type of finance experience now, it will put you in a extremely awesome advantage..
Good luck dude
Ok, cool. Should I do it by phone or email? I have a list of contacts from my university's alumni lists, particularly those who are currently in the finance industry.
I even see an MD at Goldman... But most of them seem to lower-level/mid-level people working at some obscure firms I haven't even heard of.
If you could contact all of them somehow, that would be good. You might not know of the obscure firms, but trust me the more you look into investment banking, trading and finance. Those firms start to sound familiar.
You can do it by phone if you would like, but it really comes down to what your comfortable with.. I think since you are younger, I say go with emailing them. Just introduce yourself, tell them that you are so and so and you are attending X college and you would like to speak with them about potential internships or even just info. Something like that would work.
As a freshman, I'd also start with lower level people and lower tier firms..not just for practice talking with bankers and making good impressions, but also because you are much more likely to get an ib internship from a local boutique than a BB as a freshman/sophomore. Even offer to work for free if they are open to it.
I would be cautious about using up the best ones this early.
You are never going to be worse at networking than you are right now (considering that you are just beginning), so I would start with ones that are a bit less appealing.
Good point. I don't see too many senior people on these alumni lists, but it seems that there are plenty of entry-level people (even some people from the Class of 2002!) working for small private equity firms/hedge funds that have no websites to speak of.
How should I approach these entry-level people? I don't want to sound as if I am looking for an internship, but I don't want to start up random conversations that go nowhere either.
just say ur interested in learning about careers in finance and go from there.
one of the great things about networking as a freshman is that no one expects you to be committed to anything. you can leverage the contacts you make to put you in touch with their friends who work in different areas (sales/trading, corporate finance, banking, etc.)
While I don't have much experience in networking, I'd be cautious of trying to network as a freshman. If you choose to go that route, make sure you've done your homework before reaching out to folks. It is frustrating to try to provide guidance to someone who hasn't taken the initiative to learn the business. Also, it is likely that as a freshman, you won't realy be eligible for a job for another 2-3 years. My guess is a lot of your networking contacts will give you some high level advice and then tell you to reach back out to them in a couple of years. Someone said it above, you definitely don't want to ruin your chance to network with alumni a few years down the road because you reached out to them too early.
Thanks for the tip. I'll be honest; I only have a vague inkling of what investment banks exactly do - so I have ordered a book on the technical side of investment banking off of Amazon. I presume that should be first step - learning about investment banking on a basic level, before contacting alumni. Got it.
Honestly, a good place to start would be to read the Wall Street Journal and try to find articles relating to investment banking. The problem with technical books is that they are too technical. What you need is a high level summary of the services provided by an investment bank. Besides reading this website, which is a great place to start, I suggest you also try to click around on the websites of some of the better known investment banks.
I would agree with what CompBanker said. Reading the WSJ is a great place to start and reaching out to alumni could be a good idea after at least understanding a little more about the industry. I wouldn't say that there is a time that is too early to start networking, but that being said, reaching out to an alumnus of your school and not having much to talk about or being able to contribute much to a conversation may not be the best idea. As someone mentioned above, having a little precursory knowledge of the industry is definitely helpful when speaking to someone in Banking.
You'd definitely also have to be willing to keep a relationship with someone you find as a mentor. The worst possible thing to do would be either to reach out with no knowledge of the industry or to find someone willing to act as a sort of mentor to you and then to let the relationship fall aside.
Well, as a pilot test, I just sent an email out to a recent graduate who is currently working at a local botique bank as an analyst (it seems like he's just few years older than me - he graduated in 2009).
I don't know if he will ever respond, but I hope he does. If not, I'll send a follow up in a few days if he doesn't. He's probably pretty busy, being a first year analyst.
Honestly if I were you I would be worried about slaying chicks, and drinking beer.
Honestly if I were you I would be worried about slaying chicks, and drinking beer.
Also, guys, on the subject of unofficial unpaid internships for freshmen like me, should I bother cold-calling all the local botiques and hedge funds, express my interest in finance and offer to be an unpaid intern to get some exposure/experience? I have been reading some blogs on the subject - some say that cold calling does work, others say that it is better to contact alumni instead.
I feel as though I am wading in unknown waters... Never quite liked to rock the boat, but apparently the most successful people did rock the boat.
Networking early (Originally Posted: 08/16/2013)
Just wondering if you guys recommend to start networking early on in college (freshman and sophomore years). I am at a top 20 midwest school which is not classically considered a target school for the larger investment banks. Is it better to focus on school work, or should I dedicate time to building a book of contacts as well?
It's never too early IMO
This. I didn't stop cold emailing throughout the summer.
No, not too early. Any jump ahead on the competition helps...
you've got nothing to lose, go for it
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It's never too early to cold call or network...maybe you want to rather network though with the boutiques you plan on cold calling. You have the time.
bump so that someone could help answer my last question.
Once again thanks for the feedback everyone.
You should just look around Google or WSO for modeling files. I was able to learn what I was doing with models from pulling up a completed model and then trying to make my own going off it. Just make sure to pay attention to what the formulas mean and you'll be fine.
Networking: How early is too early (Originally Posted: 01/18/2013)
Currently 2.5 years away from graduation, this summer I will be interning in a MM regional midwestern buyside firm. Small shop that will give me a good deal of responsibility and build up a skill set and experience in the industry. From a state non-target, good grades and very good finance-relevant EC. Interned at a regional PWM last summer. Ideally looking to work in distressed debt/HY after graduation.
Basically I wanted to know how early is too early to reach out to people outside my alumni network in NY/Chi? Should I wait until halfway through/after the internship so I have tangible experiences to show and better demonstrate my interest?
I don't want to jump the gun and get ignored due to lack of experience, but I also want to get ahead of the competition and start networking early.
TL;DR should I start networking after recruiting is over for this cycle or should I wait until the end of the summer when I have internship experience and a small, but something tangible to talk about, skill set.
thanks in advance, longtime lurker and this website has been an amazing resource.
you're still in uni yet have "CFA" after your name? que?
Not my actual name. He's a quarterback that was a huge bust and is broke about 5 years after making a shitload of money. Probably not somebody that is going to be passing CFA exams any time soon.
Not exactly what Oreos meant...
Nit-picking aside, network now, do it in earnest, with commitment, and most importantly, with a desire to learn, not to get an internship.
It's never too early. Try to meet people who are 2 years your senior - those people will be 1st year analysts when you're a junior.
Start networking as soon as you get out of the womb. It can't hurt.
Is freshman year too early to start networking? (Originally Posted: 03/15/2015)
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My two cents. If you don't have the credentials to get a sophomore BB internship, it's not worth it to exhaust your contacts. It's also a waste of time. If you are a non-URM male and have no family connections or military experience, you have no shot. Instead, look for boutique/MM internships, and work on those grades and EC's.
well said
Thanks for your input. Anyone else have thoughts on this? Would it be better to reach out this early if I want to try to build an actual, organic relationship; or is that too unorthodox and likely to backfire?
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Sorry for the multiple posts; still getting the hang of posting here...
Double post sorry
What demographic do you fit in? M/F? Race? Current relationships? Etc.?
Way too early. Many would not even respond to something from a freshman
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What demographics do you fit in? I'm not asking to cause a problem - I'm asking because it makes a difference.
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Do you have an immediate family member/friend who's high-up at a BB? If not — like I said, it's a complete waste of time. I went through several BB sophomore interviews. None of the BB programs are for non-URM. While banks such as JPM and GS are rumored to take people on merit, that's not actually true. At best, you will get a phone interview (if you're very well qualified) and they'll keep you on their radar for junior year recruiting. At the end of the day, the closest they'll take to a non-URM are White/Asian females.
You can get a BB sophomore internship if and only if you start now. The only way to get it if you don't have any connections is by starting now. If you have any specific questions on what to do, PM me.
Edit: This doesn't mean you are guaranteed - far, far, far from it. I'm just saying you have a minute chance if you start now.
If you think you are mature enough to handle a conversation with a senior associate / VP, then sure, you should reach out to start networking early.
It is NEVER too late to network.
But if you are going to sound like an idiot, you definitely should wait.
I'm in the same boat as you man. I'm a freshman and I personally feel that if you are mature enough to handle it go right ahead. I believe you gotta take every opportunity you get and never burn any bridges. Maybe try not to push too hard for an internship, unless you're well qualified, but at least get yourself on the radar.
Agree with the sentiment that it's impossible/not worth trying to get a sophomore IBD internship. However, I still think it could be worth sending a couple emails out as feelers to develop "organic" relationships. Just keep in mind that you shouldn't be pushy/annoying because juniors will have higher priority over you in the eyes of current employees. I think now would actually be a good time to email out because SA recruiting is over, so there's no big networking push and you're more likely to get a response. The best way to network early on is to ask for advice. Do a quick intro then say something like: "hey, I think I might be interested in IB, I know these internships are hard to get as a freshman, but do you have any advice on any relevant experiences I could pursue to get an idea of what IB is like?" If you send a follow up email once every ~3 months giving them an update on your progress and asking legitimate questions, you'll be well on your way to having a great network behind you for future SA jobs. Spacing your emails out by ~3 months should be long enough so you're not annoying, yet frequent enough so you're not completely forgotten. This is coming from the perspective of a graduating senior - I ended up doing fine and getting BB IB SA/FT offer, but that's what I would do if I could go back and do it over. Hope this helps!
How early is too early to start networking and making connections for junior internships next year? (Originally Posted: 05/23/2014)
I want plenty of time to network, meet lots of people, and hopefully form a few meaningful connections; however, I'm don't want to start too early so that people don't remember me when I reach out again for them to help me out come recruiting season. Do you guys think its too early for me to start reaching out to people this week?
In theory, it's never too early as long as you legitimately keep in contact with them until recruiting season. Most people struggle with the art of keeping in contact for an extended period of time. Therefore, it depends on if you think you can keep in contact with them regularly or not.
It's never too early, just keep in touch. Set reminders in your calendar to send them an email every few months with updates on your progress or do some research and ask a question. If they're in TMT M&A for example, look at recently closed or announced deals and come up with a few intelligent questions or comments about comcast or AT&T deals. Even better if their firm is working on them. If they're not advising T and are a MM shop do a little more digging in their space. Or say I'm going to be in NYC soon, can you spare 15 minutes to grab coffee. You don't need to pester them every few weeks and even if they don't reply, at least you're keeping your name in front of them. I work with a boutique debt firm that does a bang up job for the lower MM and they send out a monthly newsletter just to stay in touch. I read it sometimes when I have the time but I at least think about them monthly because I see their name.
Do I even need to network? (Originally Posted: 12/26/2012)
So I'm a freshman at a top 10 university in the U.S. and am going to maintain a steady 3.8 GPA. To me, "networking" sounds a lot like kissing ass and isn't something that I want to do unless it needs to be done. With my situation in mind, do I need to start actively networking in the near future or just hand in a resume when recruiters come to my school and send it around.
with such a stellar GPA at a prestigious university, I probably wouldn't even apply - they should just reach out to you
Lol
+1. See what your boss thinks about not doing any work unless it absolutely needs to be done.
^^ Actually they practically come from their office to your dorm room. All you gotta do is throw on some slippers and a robe, and head on down.
Lmfao
Man, if you want to bank, succeed in banking, move up in your company, be a rainmaker etc... you better learn to network.
It's more than kissing ass, it's knowing someone, or several someones at as many shops as you can. Step two, and what most people miss about having a network, is putting it to use, re: you know a trader at shop A that needs something. You know a guy from shop B can that can get it. You make the transaction happen, and you're now valuable to each one of them. If you just know a lot of people and all you do is ask for things, you're no fucking use to anyone.
Okay... after brushing off my initial annoyance w/ this post in all honesty to get an SA role you probably don't NEED to network. Would it increase the probability of landing an offer? Absolutely, b/c your peers at your school are doing it... so you might shine a little less brightly next to them. But, honestly target students for the most part are practically given all the opportunities in IBD, unless of course you've fucked up and have a crap GPA or no ECs etc. This is not a knock at target students all of you guys had to work hard to get where you are for sure, but for the most part opportunities are for you to lose.
Edit: After re-reading this post, seems like a troll post to start a shit-show between targets and non-targets.. hmm, well played.
You are a freshman? That explains it... You have a long way go champ. Your network could determine the differnce between an 70k IBD Generalist role and a 130k Prop Trading job. Don't kiss any ass. You want people to see you as a younger version of them. They need to see your potential and like you enough to help you maximize your potential.
Don't think of it as kissing ass for a job; You're making rich friends you can share private jets and split 8 balls with.
sad to hear that shit man, 70k IBD generalist or 130k prop trading job?
Nowadays engineers earn so much more than that with a fat tail of IPO lottery... But then I guess not everyone is good with math and science.
Always, always network. It is a life skill, and is more important than anything you learn in the classroom.
If your family/families friends arent in a position to get you a job, then I would have to agree with the other commenters who said that you will be competing against other people at your school who have comparable records who DID network. That said, I am not the biggest fan of it either.
I agree. You are, in fact, a freshman at a top 10 university in the U.S. Good day.
Networking can be overrated. Most of my friends who went through my top-10 school's OCR ended up with jobs that did not come from networking, but instead came from strong resumes and good interviewing skills.
I didn't "network" in the traditional sense (I hate what word) - but I made lifelong friends in the process. Very happy I did.
If you don't like kissing ass now, wait till you start working. It's a daily dick suck.
Yes, networking is like talking to people and showing them you're a nice person. Pretty much what you have to do every day at work. So it's good thing to get used to it as early as possible. Just let people get to know you. If you're a shy type you won't last in IBD long. To me networking just means making sure I know plenty of people in the industry I want to work with. I don't have to be best friends with them, just make sure they know who I am and they have a good opinion of me. It will come in handy sooner or later.
would still network, these days a GPA at a top school doesn't always guarantee a look from top banks. also, since it sounds like you are an ultra competitive candidate, may be good to network for the most competitive positions that WILL require networking (BX PE Analyst, Citadel, Soros, TPG PE Analyst, Bain Capital PE Analyst, etc)
OP here, I think I need to clarify where I am coming from. I love talking to people, but simply getting to know someone because they might be able to help you get a job seems like you are almost using them. I would rather focus on stuff I like doing at the moment rather then having to calculatedly talk to people. I feel like my time could be better spent studying, among other things.
And no I am not a troll.
You don't have to network solely for the sake of networking. Actually had this discussion with my parents and younger brother (he didn't want to network, just go have fun at a holiday party).
The thing is, going out, meeting people, and having fun IS networking. Talk to people about what you do and what you want to do. You don't have to "target" people for networking, just remember that anyone COULD be your potential next in to your dream job.
Oh, and networking isn't just to get a good job. You have to network if you expect to go anywhere in the finance world. They don't give a shit about how great your model building skills are, you are a salesperson and they want you bringing in business after the associate level. If you don't want to hang around an investment bank or whatever firm that long, keep in mind that "networking" is an easy way to find your next job opportunity.
Newsflash: a ton of kids attend a "top 10" university and will be competing with you for top jobs. Tons of kids also have 3.8+ GPAs. And, tons of these kids are already hard at work networking. So, yes, you need to network.
You might not NEED to network to get the job (though it would certainly help....and you'll need it to get the best job) but you won't go much further in your career if you don't get good at it.
90% of analysts/consultants/shit kickers have the technical skills to make MD/Partner/PM/Chief Monkey.....the ones that make it are the ones that build the personal relationships and sales skills to get there. It's not ass kissing....it's just life.
I don't understand how you can claim that you "will maintain a steady 3.8 GPA" when you are just a freshman. Are you certain that the next 4 semesters will be exactly like the one you just finished?
As far as networking, go to info sessions and all that jazz, but I wouldn't spend hours emailing alums, etc. Better to back that GPA claim up and just go to info sessions than to tank your classes because you emailed a ton of people.
90% of the job is getting stuff done.
10% is marketing.
You need to market yourself. That may be networking or it may be building your reputation or it may be something different.
I have also had a dim view of networking, but it has its place. The trick is knowing when it's selling yourself and your abilities and when it's kissing ass.
Hubris makes people weak and vulnerable, remember that.
Is a 3.8 suppose to really impress anyone?
Show maybe a 4.0, top 3% of your class and a rhodes applicant. Then yes you probably do not need to network. A 3.8 is like what these days, top 15% of your class?
OP is proof that being at a top uni, and having a 3.8, doesn't disqualify you from being an idiot.
Good job kid.
PS, The following pic is for you op. :)
Also I get the sense that some (not all) people posting responses don't have a great deal of industry experience.
I can only speak to the quant roles. In the quant roles, networking doesn't get you the job. Brilliance, social skills, and a decent soft sell get you the job. We don't kiss ass, and if we wanted a job that treated us like kings, we'd go to Google or academia. We come to banking because we genuinely enjoy finance.
There is something to be said for networking. Let me rephrase that- Wall Street is a small place and it's good to have friends. There is also something to be said for standing on your own two feet. Both are extremely important. Someone who will have a successful career will be able to do both, but in the long run it's better to be excellent at your job and good at networking than to be excellent at networking and good at your job. There is no substitute for producing value.
OP, get a PhD and do a startup first. Create something of actual value. Then tell all of us "networking" schmucks to go to hell when we find ourselves needing to "network" you.
Again, I take a dim view of networking. It is a necessary evil. Like hiring salespeople. It produces nothing of substance, yet it is a requirement.
Most of the OCR positions at my school have anywhere from 7 to 20~ interview slots. I'm willing to bet there are at least a couple dozen kids applying to those roles who look at least as good, if not better, than me on paper. I really think networking is still important.
Give me you're email address. You're hired! No need for resume check or superday! Pls we really want to sign you before the other top banks get you. Im going to send you your offer letter now!!!! Congrats
So what is this other obsession on WSO with Rhodes Scholars, HBS grads, and dare I say students from certain MFin programs just walking into jobs and getting hired? One cannot be both obsessed with networking and with prestige.
Here's my view:
Spend most of your four years in school learning how to create value. Be it as a programmer or as a quant or as a a trader, banker, or research guy. As a trader or quant, you can develop a portfolio of strategies.
Learn to use Bloomberg, Compustat, and the other market data databases. Learn how to do a legitimate backtest and run legitimate analytics.
Spend some of the rest of your time making friends. Genuine friends are infinitely more valuable than fake friends, but it's ok to lean a little more towards friends in industries you want to work in.
Also, never forget that there are thousands of UC Berkeley, UMich, and UVA alumns who are probably smarter than you.
Finally it's always best to be hired for your competence than for your networking or prestige. Let's be clear- sales ability can be a form of competence; my point is that it's WAAY better to be in a job you're excellent at than to be in a job you're just ok at.
Mitt Romney networked his ass off and he didn't get the job he wanted. No one is too good for networking
Part of political competence is empathy. Neither candidate had very good empathy for the median voter, but Obama had it better. I say this as a Republican.
Networking is important, but competence trumps networking in the end. And prestige is the least important of the three.
I can't believe this thread has gotten so many responses!
Yes, network. It's not hard and important. Done.
Networking can be as simple as asking seniors as your school about their summer experiences. During recruiting time, just tell them to keep an eye out for you. I agree that for certain schools the networking aspect is grossly overrated. I know kids in my school that entered third year without knowledge of what banking is and have a SA offer in hand 5-6 months later. Yes that does happen, and no he/she was not connected.
Disregard most of the responses on here. They're simply blowing off steam because networking is critical for some people. Still, you gotta network some dude. Networking can never hurt (unless you're an idiot) and can definitely help in some cases. At the bare minimum, do what westsidewolf suggested and attend the information sessions (you can do this junior year), but don't spend too much time randomly emailing people if you don't feel it's necessary (and it's not if you do well at a target). This advice assumes you keep that 3.8 GPA.
For someone in a similar situation (top school, 3.7-3.8 GPA, econ/cs major), how DO you network?
Do you all simply mean make friends with my class mates, which is fine by me, or do you mean get to know people already on Wall Street, i.e analysts, associates, etc? The latter seems much more mysterious to me, as in I don't really know how to do it (though I absolutely understand it's valuable). Do I just send friendly emails to people at banks asking questions? How would I "use" this network later to land a job? Or am I missing the point of this?
I apologize if these questions seems naive... they don't teach you how to get a job in high school/college. And yes, I understand that going to a "top school" means practically nothing - that's why I am asking, because I don't want to be unemployed in 2 and 1/2 years!
Thanks!
Do you even lift?
You say that now.
Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
For what it's worth, when I was in school I saw some people with such ridiculous resumes that they were basically going around just scooping up job offer after job offer and half the time they didn't even know what they were applying for! So if your resume is really that ridiculous (and the bar is set pretty high there) then you probably don't need to do much "networking". It probably won't hurt though, unless you have the EQ of a chihuahua (like me). Even then, just talk to the people that come to the info sessions and make them remember you. I remember doing that to get interviews for jobs I was not competitive for.
Yea. Don't network. I don't see 675743 resumes from top ten university students with 3.8gpas. I'd rather hire the driven kid from a no name school with a 3.2 than someone with a 3.8 who thinks he/she is gods gift to man.
Technicals are easy in this biz, learning the "ropes" through networking will help with being likable and ultimately that is THE deciding factor. No one hires someone they dislike working with.
Sometimes I have a hard time believing what I read here.
Wow this thread has really taken off! I'm still unsure exactly what I'm supposed to do though. Should I just apply for positions when the time comes, or do I contact people in the relevant company before hand so that my name gets looked at a little more closely? I guess that is how I am viewing networking at the moment.
i would probably just withdraw from school if i were you in order to avoid heart-breaking disappointment
Have you grown any pub hair yet?
To answer the question, it's tricky. Go to the recruiting events and go for the soft sell.
Just show up to the recruiting events. No need for more. - Top target grad now at top BB
mafurious -- you're a freshman so right now your priorities are to keep up your GPA, take your econ courses, belong to the investment club, try not to blackout more than necessary, etc. all the basics.
re networking -- it may seem goofy now but once you're in the business you'll naturally click with some folks and respect others, etc. so you'll grow your own network just by being yourself... don't doubt the importance of meeting folks since they could introduce you to the next best opportunity, become a great friend / mentor / teacher, etc.... there's a lot of socializing that goes on in S+T and even IBD in the senior positions... embrace the idea of talking to someone and learning from them. it's important.
the easiest* path is to lockdown a junior-senior summer internship -- and lockdown a job from that internship... your GPA and school sound great, but you may be a dime a dozen if you're not also someone a person wants to sit next to 24/7, grab drinks with, count on during high stress situations, crack jokes with, etc... having a friend in the institutions can definitely help... either way, stay humble, stay hungry, and be yourself.
if you want to be proactive now i'd recommend applying anywhere that will take freshman-sophomores... and if you have a family member or family friend that would actually hook you up, then work it... otherwise i'd recommend you work on getting a summer grant to study abroad, etc.... you'll be an adult working 24/7 soon enough... enjoy college.
good luck
How much would a networking event benefit a freshman? (Originally Posted: 10/16/2014)
Obviously a stupid question as it can never hurt... however I'm looking for some feedback from those that have experience under their wing in regards to what goes on at these events. As a freshman, would it be likely that the ones you meet stay in touch with you years down the road? This is a trip organized every year by the club I'm in, so its highly likely that the opportunity would arise again.
Main reason why I'm being hesitant is I don't really have "business-formal" attire, and this trip is in a week so I don't really have time to buy one and renting one IMO isn't worth the money(as a freshman at least). Description of the event below:
Building your network on Bay Street; setting the stage for future success. Western Capital Markets invites you to join us on our annual trip to Toronto's Bay Street Conference!
Host firms include: CIBC, Morgan Stanley, ONCAP, and Canaccord Genuity.
Buy a decent suit, regardless of whether or not you go on the trip. You'll need one for countless reasons throughout college (formals, interviews, networking, classy drinking night).
I was definitely planning on purchasing one in the near future, however I feel like this deadline is too soon for me to meet. Anyone have a ballpark figure on how much I should spend for my first suit? Also if anyone has any suggestions for inexpensive canadian retailers I'd really appreciate it.
Too Early for Networking? (Originally Posted: 11/06/2014)
Hey,
I have a FT BB credit analyst offer in corporate banking lined up in May 2015. From what I can tell, there isn't much interaction between IBD and CB in my bank. Currently, my goal is to work 1 year in corporate banking and transition to investment banking.
I was wondering if it would be possible to begin networking/cold-emailing people from my own bank even though I haven't worked a day in the office yet. From my point-of-view, it seems difficult reaching out to other divisions without them wondering if I'm actually interested in sticking around with the corporate banking department. Banking is a small world, and I'm sure that my future CB managers would find out even if I tried reaching out to IBD discreetly. I fear that this could potentially start me off on the wrong foot with my CB managers.
Alternatively, would it be a good idea to let HR know about my investment banking interests this early? It's a fairly structured program and they told me I can go "anywhere" after the program is over (I'm sure they say the same thing to the people in BO leadership/operations/internal auditing programs, so I'm going to stay skeptical).
Or should I be ballsy and just straight-up tell my CB manager that I'm interested in IBD? but when?
I want to network EARLY, but not at the risk of pissing some people off.
Probably too early. Remember the saying "a bird in hand is worth two in the bush"? It applies here too. Congrats on your CB offer - I'd work at it diligently for some time to get the hang of it and make good impressions on your colleagues, and who knows? Maybe you'll really like it - I have a buddy in corporate banking who has no intention of leaving anytime soon.
Also, if you try to start networking now, people may wonder what your level of commitment/sincerity is.
Later on, if you do decide to go IBD anyway, I wouldn't limit myself to networking internally at the bank - talk to headhunters and alumni at other banks too.
I agree that it's a bit early. If you're in the area though, then absolutely contact your soon-to-be boss and ask if you can bring in coffee or get a tour or meet a few of the folks. That's going through proper channels so you'll be safe.
If the firm isn't too far from you, or you're able to be in the area, then just say you'll be in the area on x days and would like to stop in for _____. If they don't bite then later on after some time passes touch base again and say you'll be in the area on y days. So what if you aren't really planning on being there --- you can always make the trip if the answer is "yes, happy to see you and introduce you around early".
In one form or another life is about networking / selling...and having fun. Always be closing!
Networking as a Rising Freshman (Originally Posted: 07/02/2017)
Hey WSO,
I'm a rising freshman at a semi-target/possibly non-target in Boston. Although I don't have any internships for this summer going into my freshman year, I have a lot of free time on my hands and have been using that to try and build a base for my network. Neither of my parents are in finance, so I'm pretty much building it from the ground up. Would you suggest I focus my efforts more on contacting smaller, local firms in my area since they may have a higher response rate? Also, is it worth it to spend a significant amount of time this summer networking? I really want to meet and network with some people and definitely want to have an internship for the summer of 2018.
I'm from MA by the way
Thanks
Network your balls off by starting as soon as you can and focus on getting good grades your freshman year. Could also consider reaching out to the elite finance clubs from your University ahead of time so that you are prepared to participate when the semester begins.
Thanks @hightheta01 I'm really trying to position myself for a great 2018 summer internship. I'm going to Northeastern, and we start co-ops sophomore year. I want to gain some valuable experience in a firm to leverage myself for competitive co-ops. How would I best position myself for something like this?
Networking as an incoming undergrad freshman? (Originally Posted: 07/04/2017)
So, I'm going to be an undergrad freshman in the fall and want to eventually get into private equity of some sort and/or venture capital.
I want to start making connections and growing my network as early as possible so that I might have a better chance of getting better internships when it comes time for that as I'm coming from a state school.
Any advice on how I should approach networking? Who should I try to reach out to and how?
Thanks
I think you should focus on getting an investment banking offer first. I don't think people at PE will take you seriously as a freshman unless it's a firm that specifically has a summer analyst program for undergrads (like Silver Lake or Audax)
Hello my fellow future competition for 2020 BB SA recruiting. Hope ya hitting the ground running on campus loading up on your technicals, finance clubs, and networking bud! Already doing an internship rn should set me up for PWM BB atleast for freshmen summer. Hope you're in a target btw because you and the rest of my peers will be destroyed. The BO is wide open for the slackers hehe!
P.S the fact that I'm writing this on the night of the Fourth of July is a testament to my determination to destroy my competition! Good luck ya gonna need it!!
Easy place to start is go on linkedin and have a decent profile setup. Be genuine and message up some connections with alumni from your school who went in banking/VC/PE. Hopefully some will offer to have a phone call or coffee chat
Thanks, that sounds like a good way to get started. Is there anything specifically that you think we be beneficial to have on my linkedin profile?
Can you cold call/network too early? (Originally Posted: 03/30/2011)
So I'm currently at an internship right now (small PE firm), and went to a superday at a BB but didn't get it (they said i'm a really strong candidate, and would rather me apply for FT SA, or next summer 'whatever'). I'm a freak and have decided to start cold calling BB's in LA (where I want to work) and get contacts/shoot my resume out. Am I doing this too early though? Should I wait until fall?
What year are you
it doesn't hurt to start building relationships at any point in time
Ending my sophomore year.
I'd also like to point out I may be transferring universities this year, which may require me an extra semester. Thus, If I do end up transferring, next summer will not be my FINAL summer of college. could this hurt or help me you guys think?
Not too early. Keep calling.
damn. you're a beast. GOOD JOB MAN!
i dont think so
You could never start too early. Maintaining is a whole different ball game.
deleted
Thanks guys. I moved from LA to NYC to be able to learn about finance/investing and bring it back to cali upon graduation. My biggest fear is all these cold winters and lack of family events will go in vein.
Lastly, do you all recommend I use linkedin professional (the paid subscription, which is like $30 a month)? I am able to get access to names and try and figure out their email address ([email protected]), but I'm assuming this may be easier if I have a full blown account. any input?
Thanks guys!
call when you are born, it is NEVER too early
Networking too early? -- Networking while on a fixed contract (Originally Posted: 09/25/2017)
Hi Everyone,
I'm currently on a fixed contract/ internship for the next year before returning back to undergrad for my final year.
I have been networking since my start, and often those that I am speaking with are surprised that I'm networking so early. I'm not sure whether they are surprised and impressed, or surprised and annoyed as I am over a year out from actual recruiting, (thereby making this "early" encounter a waste of their time).
I was wondering if I should hold off on networking until i am 4- 6 months out from recruiting so that I would fall more in line with normal undergrad recruiting season, or if I should keep going as is and just reconnect with those I've chatted with at a later time.
Thanks!
The earlier the better dude. Just means you have plenty of time to solidify those relationships
Too early to network for buyside? (Originally Posted: 04/28/2008)
Some background: I will be working full time come summer at a BB doing investment banking.
Question: Is it strange to contact alums who are working at large PE funds (Blackstone, KKR, TPG, etc) without even having started? In the email I would simply state who I am, what I will be doing for the next two years, and my extreme interest in working at that firm in the future.
Is this the art of networking or is it too early to start doing this because of my lack of experience?
Any thoughts?
although i'd ask them more for advice, as opposed to just telling them who you are, and trying to "network" with them. i mean, that is more useful too, and you are reaching out to them for a reason, as opposed to just telling them who you are and what you're doing. i'm sure this is obvious, but just thought it's worth iterating
You're too late to the game. You need to start contacting alums as soon as you get accepted to college. I think you might be able to lateral after an MBA though. Try contacting some HBS alums.
True that he's too late, but he really should have started networking when he was attending one of the elite private grade schools. What, you didn't go to one? I guess your parents should have networked better when you were in the cradle...
...you don't even REALLY know if you're going to enjoy finance yet. Work hard, learn as much as you can, and figure out if this is REALLY what you want to do with your life.....then you can worry about PE/HF/"insert masturbatory finance term here." Networking is important, but settle down. Enjoy your summer of freedom (you'll never have it again) and be ready to work hard.
How early is too early for networking? (Originally Posted: 11/06/2011)
Hey all,
I'm starting as a 1st year analyst next summer and was bored/interested the other day so I started looking through alumni to find contacts at private equity firms, since you guys said you trusted referrals more than headhunters. When would be too early to reach out to them? I don't want to seem like I'm not interested in banking at all or anything like that, I just want to plant some seeds and hear what they think I should focus on when I start working.
Thanks.
Never too early.
This is by far the easiest question ever on this...never too early. One trick though is to make sure you follow up periodically and make it a point to get personal with them. I always ask about any plans/vacations coming up, how's the weather etc and get what kind of hobbies they're into and always reference them. If you don't give a shit they will notice, and return the favor.
Well actually it can sometimes be too early... I have heard this before because people on the street join and leave jobs in 2-3 years if u network with people from your target shop and they leave then that was pointless because he is out of the firm. I know somebody who started networking with an alum from GS and the GS guy went to MBA before he could help him out.
I would say If u are networking early then maybe try networking with more so associates + now than analysts because they could leave and you would not be able to leverage it.
I personally would prefer to have a relationship with the guy who's been through it and moved on than the guy who just moved up. Also networking isn't mutually exlusive by rank, so I suggest both are worthwhile which ultimately means it is never too early. The guy in MBA program will most likely still know some good introductions or will have a better job than analyst waiting for you...
Never too early. Always a good idea to know more and do more.
^^^ this is a valid point, and actually you are not that early so yea I would say that you could start because like the above poster said an analyst prolly still knows an associate at the firm ( since he is prolly trying to get in the firm after MBA) even if he is doing his MBA.
Thanks guys. My only reservation was showing that I was looking to leave banking before even getting into it really, and that can sometimes reflect poorly. I guess they know they way things work though?
Yeah, and just give off the vibe of "At this stage I'm just trying to learn as much as I can about the industry, what's out there, etc, so would be great to chat" - don't make it sound like you're tactically planning your escape at this stage
Always be networking. Always
Too Soon to Network? (Originally Posted: 07/03/2013)
Probably a dumb question.
But I was looking through my Fraternity's LinkedIn group and there are a couple of guys that are Managing Directors and some other people that are pretty high up in several different Investment Banks.
I want to reach out a start newtorking for a possible internship next summer. I'm only going to be a sophomore this coming year and I'm coming from a non-target but I've got great grades.
So is it too soon to start messaging these people and building a relationship or should I wait a couple of months?
Thanks.
as a quote from someone else, "it is never/always too late to start networking"
That's kinda what I figured.
Hows this for a general template?
Hey Mr. XXX
I found you while searching the FRATERNITY group here on LinkedIn and I saw that you worked at XXX.
I'm currently a sophomore at XXX and I want to talk to you about IB. I'm really interested in getting a head-start and I would appreciate it if we could talk for 10 to 15 minutes in the next week or two.
Regards,
John
.
Don't say anything about wanting to get a head start. Mention that you're interested in the industry and would like to speak with him and hear about his experience.
Better?
Hello XXXX,
I found your profile while browsing the XXXXX Fraternity group and I noticed that you work at XXXX.
Right now I'm a sophomore at the XXXX and I'm really interested in investment banking sector. I'd appreciate it if I could talk to you on the phone for 10 to 15 minutes in the next week or two about your experience in the industry.
In Hoc Signo Vinces,
John Kirby Email: XXXXX
The e-mail does not matter. As long as it is professional, short, and to the point, it does not matter. Just do not curse or anything :)
I actually just started to network with my fraternity. So far I have had a 100% success rate although I am mostly targeting associate/AVP level people right now. Although 80% of what they say can be found here (day to day work, career path, network, follow the markets), the other 20% is very useful and it is always good to know the person is very qualified.
Sigma Chi ...
Gotta problem?
If some non-target kid from my fraternity solicited me on LinkedIn, my advice for breaking into IB would be transfer out
I'm not a Sigma Chi, but they do admittedly have a lot of guys on the street.
One thing I have found while networking while leveraging my fraternity is that chapters of the same fraternity differ so vastly from region to region, and even within the state. You'll get some very close-minded guys that will probably never respond. Focus on the guys that still care about the "Sigma Chi" bond.
Sig here as well and to echo some of the posters above, I've had more success at getting a response from associates/VP level people than MDs. I'm not saying don't even bother messaging them, but from experience not a lot of them have given me the time of day. Also, I've found that if I took out the part of my message saying I wanted to set up a phone call with them, I've gotten more responses. Just say you want to hear more about their experiences and perspective on the industry and if they want to set up a phone call, they will let you know but usually it's more convenient for them to email since you're not taking time out of their day.
My advice is to start networking as early as you can and to as many people as you can in your target field. For me, I am both in the Air Force ROTC and Sigma Chi so the possible connections I can make are twice as many as to someone in just one group, so join more organizations/clubs etc. if you can to widen your reach. I just recently started and I wish I did it much earlier (I'm a rising senior now).
IH
Well it's been a while...
But I've been able to secure a phone interview with a MD, who is also a Sig, at a pretty large bank.
So hopefully that'll go well and I can leverage it into something down the road.
Too early to network for next summer? (Originally Posted: 05/17/2012)
Hello guys. I'm a rising junior ( just finished my sophomore year) and I am set to begin an internship in a couple of weeks in DC. Currently, I am just sitting around my house not doing anything, waiting to move to DC for the summer. What should I be doing from now until then? Do you think I should be contacting alumni just to talk and maybe position myself better for a position next summer? Advice is appreciated.
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