Pages

  • Sharebar

Hi - need your advice about a problem I'm facing.

I summered at a mm investment bank and now I'm working there full-time. When I applied for the summer, they requested unofficial copys of my transcript, copied and pasted into a word document. I changed some of my grades from a B to an A from my freshman year and they never checked when I worked there over the summer. Now I'm working there full-time and a month into the job, HR is asking for official transcripts to confirm that I've graduated (I'm not even sure if they still have my application from two years ago on hand or if they're going to compare it). Should I:

1) Tell HR about it.
2) Forge a copy of my official transcript.
3) Quit and find another job to save myself from the embarssment.

Thanks.

1 3

The WSO Advantage - Land Your Dream Job

Financial Modeling Training

IB Templates, M&A, LBO, Valuation. Learn More.

Wall St. Interview Secrets Revealed

30,000+ sold & REAL questions. Learn More.

Resume Help from Finance Pros

Land More Interviews. Learn More.

Find Your Mentor

Realistic Mock Interviews. Learn More.

Comments (122)

  • duffmt6's picture

    1. You're an idiot.
    2. Just send them your official transcript and see what happens.

    "For I am a sinner in the hands of an angry God. Bloody Mary full of vodka, blessed are you among cocktails. Pray for me now and at the hour of my death, which I hope is soon. Amen."

  • Kanon's picture

    You're an asshat. Send them your official transcript or if you can, try and find another opportunity in this dreadful recruiting season with your offer.

    If you admit it to HR - unless all the MDs loved you and you were a superstar intern - you're as good as gone. And Do NOT forge another transcript - you'll be lower than scum. Your word and reputation will be pretty tarnished even before you start your career, and if the senior people at your Chicago MM bank have some serious connections and want to ruin your life, you'll be joining the ranks of Aleksey Vayner and Jeffrey Chiang.

  • user_'s picture

    Can't you just give them your diploma and see what happens?

  • Vectors225's picture

    Rofl...you got some balls man

    But in all seriousness, I doubt HR will go over your transcript and double check the grades. They'll just verify that you didn't fuck up and failed to graduate.
    Don't do this shit ever again tho

  • Vectors225's picture

    Also, the fact that you're even considering to forge the official transcript is alarming as fuck. You know this can lead to some serious jeffrey chiang/etc shit, right?

  • N.R.G.'s picture

    I'll pick 2) Forge a copy of my official transcript.
    Is that the correct answer?
    And you should start looking for another job just in case they find out soon and fire you.
    I would never pick 1) as 3) is a superior option to it in all cases.

    To be honest, I think there's a lot of potential in you to get to the top, especially in finance. I agree that this particular move was a bit stupid though - next time, lie about something that cannot be easily verified and you'll be fine.

  • Flake's picture

    You're a piece of shit.

    Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into SWANSONS.

  • Angelus99's picture

    wow....dont hold back how you feel ok?

    Beast

  • ivoteforthatguy's picture

    Let's give the boy a break here.

    Banking is absolutely crawling with slimy, lying, cheating cocksuckers and you all know it.

    Since he fessed up and admitted he is a lying sack of shit, let's see what we can do for him. Don't tell HR. That's like going to traffic court and pleading guilty. You're only a month in so it is too early to quit. That leaves you some options:

    1. Keep putting off HR about the transcripts
    2. See if your school can validate your graduation without a transcript
    3. Say that you are contesting a grade in one of your courses (this is technically true) and that is holding up release of transcript but offer option 2

    note none of these involve forgery or more outright lying. your firm cannot legally get your transcripts: they can, however, verify graduation and major indepndent of you.

    obviously, you dumb bunny, you have not been following the news of many high-profile CV-fakers over the past few years, so every firm does an anal-probe caliber background check now. if you had been reading the papers instead of fucking up your classes you might know this.

    good luck!

  • UFOinsider's picture

    lol

    hahahahaha

    HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaH

    BWAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    Get busy living

  • Monkey_Guru54's picture

    Fuck, i Should never have done it, and I regret doing, I should have applied and if I got an interview, told them why I fucked up those courses, but I know that I wouldn't even gotten an interview if I did that - which doesn't excuse it. I'm never going to do something like this again, cause every since I started, I've been thinking about it.

    I think the best option for me is to quit (not sure what reason I'm going to provide yet), and look for another job somewhere else in another finance stream, but I'm not sure how tough this will be given the job market. They'll probably ask why I didn't go back to the firm, etc. But I think my reputation is pretty important starting off.

  • blastoise's picture

    I don't see what the big deal is.

    The best thing to do was to say" oh wow it was definitely a typo, must have gotten confused are there any other issues with it?"

    Then ask to see the original copy you made vs the official and say oh wow I got three of em wrong, hopefully this won't happen in any of my work, is there any other issues that you(HR) found?

  • blastoise's picture

    Don't quit these people are idiots

  • rls's picture

    Assuming this isn't a hilarious troll:

    First, I probably don't need to tell you that you did something incredibly disgraceful- to the point that I don't even feel I should be helping you. However, in the spirit of forgiveness, a possible solution is to give HR a confirmation of graduation, alternatively called "Enrollment Verification". This is a document that shows the number of hours you took each semester, the date of graduation, and the degree earned. It will be notarized and mailed directly to HR, not you, as a security mechanism (much in the same way letters of recommendation are delivered)- the last thing you need is more temptation to forge that you earned 3 Ph.D's. This document should satisfy them- it is likely they asked for an official transcript to confirm your graduation because they don't know the precise name of this form. I would also recommend that you confess at some time in the future- clear the air. This lie will become an albatross at some point.

    Bene qui latuit, bene vixit- Ovid

The WSO Advantage - Land Your Dream Job

Financial Modeling Training

IB Templates, M&A, LBO, Valuation. Learn More.

Wall St. Interview Secrets Revealed

30,000+ sold & REAL questions. Learn More.

Resume Help from Finance Pros

Land More Interviews. Learn More.

Find Your Mentor

Realistic Mock Interviews. Learn More.

  • In reply to blastoise
    UFOinsider's picture

    blastoise:
    The best thing to do was to say" oh wow it was definitely a typo, must have gotten confused are there any other issues with it?"

    Very likely. MMs really don't have very thorough HR. Honestly, they're liable to hire that loose monkey in Ohio, I wouldn't worry about it if your group wants you.

    BUT NEVER FUCKING DO SHIT LIKE THAT AGAIN. IN THE REAL WORLD, PERJURY IS A JAILABLE OFFENCE. DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND THAT THE FINANCIAL INDUSTRY HIT THE SHITTER BECAUSE OF DISHONEST PEOPLE???

    Ok, I'm done yelling at you. As a guy who had lousy grades and found a job HONESTLY, I'd admonish you to check yourself before you wreck yourself...there's no need to lie, it's a personality flaw that you'd best deal with young in life before you lie to the wrong person. For what it's worth though, take the job, do honest work, and donate some money to charity to offset the damage you did to your soul.

    Oh, and I was serious about HR hiring baboons, chimps, and monekys....they're not too bright.

    Get busy living

  • manbearpig's picture

    Let me tell you a story that will scare the shit out of you. I know a person who did this at my university. They forged transcripts and got a job out of it. When the employers received the official transcripts and noticed the deviation between the forged transcript and official transcript, they not only fired the guy, but also reported it to the university. The university then retracted this guy's degree. Moral of the story: getting caught can cost you much more than this job. Do with that what you will.

    -MBP

  • Nefarious-'s picture

    At this point in the game, you are fucked. I suggest coming to work on Monday with a gun and start taking some hostages so you have leverage for further negotiations.

    You're born, you take shit. You get out in the world, you take more shit. You climb a little higher, you take less shit. Till one day you're up in the rarefied atmosphere and you've forgotten what shit even looks like. Welcome to the layer cake, son.

  • In reply to manbearpig
    Kanon's picture

    manbearpig:
    Let me tell you a story that will scare the shit out of you. I know a person who did this at my university. They forged transcripts and got a job out of it. When the employers received the official transcripts and noticed the deviation between the forged transcript and official transcript, they not only fired the guy, but also reported it to the university. The university then retracted this guy's degree. Moral of the story: getting caught can cost you much more than this job. Do with that what you will.

    Wow, UofT doesn't dick around. As well they shouldn't! Actually Aleksey Vayner lied the shit out of his resume (including false claims of the status/rating of a supposed charity he started). Some people (like the committee of the charity regulation org.) called for his expulsion but Yale didn't do jack. And I don't recall Jeffrey Chiang getting disciplined by Univ of Texas either.

  • Edmundo Braverman's picture

    The fucking balls on these colleges, I swear to God.

    Kid, you've got what it takes to go far in this business. Deal with HR the way you'd deal with a woman who caught you cheating: Deny, Deny, Deny, Accuse. Deny the charges three times and then accuse HR of some sort of harassment and threaten to sue. Problem solved.

  • In reply to ivoteforthatguy
    Dr Joe's picture

    ivoteforthatguy:
    ^ at my UG there was a guy there at the 60th reunion who bragged about cheating on a history exam. they withdrew his BA.

    This may be stupider than what the OP did...

  • bears1208's picture

    Fuck why didn't I think of this

  • pacman22's picture

    Ok, Don't quit and don't tell HR about it. After grades went out in University, I've had teachers change my grades from B's to A's, and I've had some change it the other way after they realized they made a mistake.

  • In reply to Edmundo Braverman
    Nefarious-'s picture

    Edmundo Braverman:

    Kid, you've got what it takes to go far in this business. Deal with HR the way you'd deal with a woman who caught you cheating: Deny, Deny, Deny, Accuse. Deny the charges three times and then accuse HR of some sort of harassment and threaten to sue. Problem solved.

    This is awesome. If I had a twitter, I would follow you. But I don't have a twitter, because I am not gay.

    You're born, you take shit. You get out in the world, you take more shit. You climb a little higher, you take less shit. Till one day you're up in the rarefied atmosphere and you've forgotten what shit even looks like. Welcome to the layer cake, son.

  • Nefarious-'s picture

    In all seriousness, this is not a big deal. If you simply input your transcript into word and only changed three B's to A's (which over a four year transcript isn't going to change an overall GPA by THAT much) you need to just claim some sort of typo or technological during the transition.

    Nevertheless, don't admit anything.

    You're born, you take shit. You get out in the world, you take more shit. You climb a little higher, you take less shit. Till one day you're up in the rarefied atmosphere and you've forgotten what shit even looks like. Welcome to the layer cake, son.

  • In reply to manbearpig
    UFOinsider's picture

    manbearpig:
    Let me tell you a story that will scare the shit out of you. I know a person who did this at my university. They forged transcripts and got a job out of it. When the employers received the official transcripts and noticed the deviation between the forged transcript and official transcript, they not only fired the guy, but also reported it to the university. The university then retracted this guy's degree. Moral of the story: getting caught can cost you much more than this job. Do with that what you will.

    Why did this guy get shit??? Meanwhile, OP didn't???
    http://www.solarfeeds.com/wp-content/uploads/dude-...

    Get busy living

  • In reply to Nefarious-
    Edmundo Braverman's picture

    Nefarious-:
    Edmundo Braverman:

    Kid, you've got what it takes to go far in this business. Deal with HR the way you'd deal with a woman who caught you cheating: Deny, Deny, Deny, Accuse. Deny the charges three times and then accuse HR of some sort of harassment and threaten to sue. Problem solved.

    This is awesome. If I had a twitter, I would follow you. But I don't have a twitter, because I am not gay.

    HAHA! You just made my wife laugh out loud (she hates Twitter).

  • arguewithatree's picture

    not true at all. jeffrey chiang did get disciplined from UT. actually, not UT specifically but McCombs I'm 99% sure didn't allow him to graduate with a bba. he graduated with only a ba in economics

  • In reply to arguewithatree
    Kanon's picture

    arguewithatree:
    not true at all. jeffrey chiang did get disciplined from UT. actually, not UT specifically but McCombs I'm 99% sure didn't allow him to graduate with a bba. he graduated with only a ba in economics

    He still graduated though.

  • Jack Campbell's picture

    Well there is a big long string of advice on here (and it arrived pretty darn quick too)...at the least you owe us all an update next week/whenever/whatever happens.

    But dude, you said the city the bank is in (see above)...yes, there are tons of MMs, but I'm in that city and I have a pretty good idea of the one or two banks that actually might check transcripts...

    If any IBD HR person sees this string, don't think they don't talk...you might want to edit your city naming...thats why I didn't use it above.

    You have earned the grief and anguish you now feel.

  • In reply to Jack Campbell
    Nefarious-'s picture

    Jack Campbell:
    Well there is a big long string of advice on here (and it arrived pretty darn quick too)...at the least you owe us all an update next week/whenever/whatever happens.

    But dude, you said the city the bank is in (see above)...yes, there are tons of MMs, but I'm in that city and I have a pretty good idea of the one or two banks that actually might check transcripts...

    If any IBD HR person sees this string, don't think they don't talk...you might want to edit your city naming...thats why I didn't use it above.

    You have earned the grief and anguish you now feel.

    Or maybe he is just so on top of his game, he just said Chicago so you wouldn't look at NYC.

    You're born, you take shit. You get out in the world, you take more shit. You climb a little higher, you take less shit. Till one day you're up in the rarefied atmosphere and you've forgotten what shit even looks like. Welcome to the layer cake, son.

  • In reply to Kanon
    UFOinsider's picture

    Kanon:
    arguewithatree:
    not true at all. jeffrey chiang did get disciplined from UT. actually, not UT specifically but McCombs I'm 99% sure didn't allow him to graduate with a bba. he graduated with only a ba in economics

    He still graduated though.


    .....and does not currently work in finance. Nor is it likely that he ever will.

    Get busy living

  • In reply to UFOinsider
    Kanon's picture

    UFOinsider:
    Kanon:
    arguewithatree:
    not true at all. jeffrey chiang did get disciplined from UT. actually, not UT specifically but McCombs I'm 99% sure didn't allow him to graduate with a bba. he graduated with only a ba in economics

    He still graduated though.


    .....and does not currently work in finance. Nor is it likely that he ever will.

    I wonder if he's changed his name and moved out of the US to try his hand elsewhere.

  • copia22's picture

    Forge it and move on, nothing will happen and after you get your bonus revive the thread and tell each one of these asshats to blow you.

  • IMSOSMOOVE's picture

    Here's some advice "integrity first and always". Now here's some reality. If I started digging through these peoples background on here to see what crap popped up most would be fired within the next hour. especially the ones that are shitting on you with no advice. Do this send in the official transcript and say nothing. If you get fired, you get fired. Chalk that up to a heavy lesson learned. So be looking for that next job just in case. You seem like a fairly honest guy otherwise you would have never thought about it again.

    Pray you don't get pinched!

  • TheKing's picture

    Just submit it, they aren't going to check every grade because they won't care at all and it would take an unnecessary amount of effort. You can always play dumb.

    Further, no one gives a shit wht you got in some undergrad class if you can do a good job (which it sounds like you've been doing.)

  • happypantsmcgee's picture

    They won't compare them.

    If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

  • manbearpig's picture

    Woah, thanks for the monkey shits assholes.

    Also to the guy who said changing three Bs to As won't make a big difference in the overall GPA, your overall GPA gets a 0.15 boost by doing this. If you don't think recruiters will notice that, you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

    -MBP

  • In reply to manbearpig
    Nefarious-'s picture

    manbearpig:
    Woah, thanks for the monkey shits assholes.

    Also to the guy who said changing three Bs to As won't make a big difference in the overall GPA, your overall GPA gets a 0.15 boost by doing this. If you don't think recruiters will notice that, you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

    It was me.

    I am not really sure how in the hell you came up with this number as you have no idea what the rest of his grades were, how many hours he actually had upon graduation, which classes these were in (some classes are more than three hours and some are less, which can weigh in on the average). There are too many variables for you take make an assumption like that.

    You're born, you take shit. You get out in the world, you take more shit. You climb a little higher, you take less shit. Till one day you're up in the rarefied atmosphere and you've forgotten what shit even looks like. Welcome to the layer cake, son.

  • Nouveau Richie's picture

    I think this is blown out of proportion entirely.

    Though there's a severe downside here, it's a very low probability event. You vastly overestimate the competency of your HR reps, the overwhelmingly likely outcome is that they check to see you graduated and move-on. Just submit your resume and try your luck.

    If you're still freaking-out, I think rls and Eddie have given the best advice so far...

  • Vectors225's picture

    someone who knows what HR actually does need to chime in here...I really doubt they're diligent enough to go over your grades, seriously.

  • In reply to Vectors225
    UFOinsider's picture

    Vectors225:
    someone who knows what HR actually does need to chime in here...I really doubt they're diligent enough to go over your grades, seriously.

    HR's job:
    http://www.tvparty.com/bgifs3/romper%20roomVA-ad4-...

    As explained to me by very high level HR / recruiting personnel.

    Get busy living

  • In reply to ivoteforthatguy
    WalMartShopper's picture

    I disagree, this method sounds like a sure-fire way to subject yourself to greater scrutiny.

    ivoteforthatguy:
    Let's give the boy a break here.

    Banking is absolutely crawling with slimy, lying, cheating cocksuckers and you all know it.

    Since he fessed up and admitted he is a lying sack of shit, let's see what we can do for him. Don't tell HR. That's like going to traffic court and pleading guilty. You're only a month in so it is too early to quit. That leaves you some options:

    1. Keep putting off HR about the transcripts
    2. See if your school can validate your graduation without a transcript
    3. Say that you are contesting a grade in one of your courses (this is technically true) and that is holding up release of transcript but offer option 2

    note none of these involve forgery or more outright lying. your firm cannot legally get your transcripts: they can, however, verify graduation and major indepndent of you.

    obviously, you dumb bunny, you have not been following the news of many high-profile CV-fakers over the past few years, so every firm does an anal-probe caliber background check now. if you had been reading the papers instead of fucking up your classes you might know this.

    good luck!

    If the glove don't fit, you must acquit!

  • Vectors225's picture

    Trying to present a diploma or anything else instead of official transcript will only raise more suspicion.
    I'm not going to say that my advice is the best among here, but just send in the official transcript without tampering it. That's all you can, and all you SHOULD do.

  • In reply to Vectors225
    IHAVEABIGHEART's picture

    Vectors225:
    Trying to present a diploma or anything else instead of official transcript will only raise more suspicion.
    I'm not going to say that my advice is the best among here, but just send in the official transcript without tampering it. That's all you can, and all you SHOULD do.

    this

Pages