What are some reputable groups at UBS? What are some good questions to ask for networking?

Hi,

I recently accepted an offer to work at UBS for the Investment Banking summer analyst program, and I was wondering what is the general feeling about the different groups at UBS? I am a Information Systems & Computer Science major so I am looking for a more quantitative group with exposure to finance (which is not one of my strengths). Also, what are some good questions to ask the groups when I network with them either via phone call or email? Any help would be greatly appreciated, Thanks!

Also, does anyone have any suggestions on how to get up to speed on Modeling / IBD (either online resources or textbooks?)

 
stonejuggy:
What are some good questions to ask groups? What is the best way to network into a group in terms of group selection?
Talk to HR, tell HR you'd like to talk to people in the groups you're interested in, talk to them, talk to more people, go to the sell-day, ???, profit.

The best groups - as stated before - are going to be Sponsors or Leveraged Finance (still operate pretty closely) if you want a shot at megafund PE and M&A if you want a broader set of exit opps. Should be obvious, but avoid ECM and Private Funds Group (you would almost be better off quitting).

 

Stonejuggy,

If you are looking for some really good material I would suggest "Investment Banking: Valuation, Leveraged Buyouts, and Mergers and Acquisitions" (Wiley Finance) [ http://www.Amazon.com/Investment-Banking-Valuation-Leveraged-Acquisitions/dp/0470442204 ]. I would pretty much guarantee that if you asked someone at UBS what you could read to hit the ground running they would suggest this book.

What UBS location will you be interning at? If it is a location where I've made contacts I can give you better information.

 

Thanks everyone for your comments they've really pointed me in the right direction.

@God of Wine, I will be interning in the New York Office.

I guess my main concern is that since Finance isn't my strongest attribute, It would be hard to get into the competitive groups such as Leveraged Finance and M&A. I am from a semi-target school, so Alumni contacts and leveraging the University will also be difficult given there aren't that many alumni in these groups.

So if I know my 'application' to these groups isn't as strong as other finance majors - would you recommend me to just network and network and try my best, and rank one of the competitive groups first? By ranking a group first, I lose competitiveness in my 2nd choice, 3rd choice etc. What would be a group that is not as competitive, but would provide a strong experience with exposure to Finance and would fit my background?

 
stonejuggy:
Thanks everyone for your comments they've really pointed me in the right direction.

@God of Wine, I will be interning in the New York Office.

I guess my main concern is that since Finance isn't my strongest attribute, It would be hard to get into the competitive groups such as Leveraged Finance and M&A. I am from a semi-target school, so Alumni contacts and leveraging the University will also be difficult given there aren't that many alumni in these groups.

So if I know my 'application' to these groups isn't as strong as other finance majors - would you recommend me to just network and network and try my best, and rank one of the competitive groups first? By ranking a group first, I lose competitiveness in my 2nd choice, 3rd choice etc. What would be a group that is not as competitive, but would provide a strong experience with exposure to Finance and would fit my background?

At the end of the day, if you're likeable and you put in a sincere effort to better understand what these groups do and to express your interest in these groups to the analysts you talk to, that will probably be adequate.

No one expects you to be able to build a full credit, LBO or accretion/dilution model on day one. A good number of summer analysts in M&A go the whole summer without putting together an accretion/dilution model. No one really gives a shit whether or not you came from Harvard/Yale/Princeton/Stanford/Wharton either. What people do care about is that you're a person they can work with, hang with and teach for 9 weeks.

So long as you do what I said and rank your preferences honestly (based on your interactions and what you think would be best for your development going forward), you probably won't get into a group outside of your top 3.

 

Hey no homo - Thanks a lot for your comments, this feedback is really useful! I was wondering if anyone had any advice on what are some good questions to ask groups? Or what is a good way to network? (Just put yourself out there and bother them a lot? or ask for conference calls, etc.)

Thanks!

 
GoldenMonkey:
At this point aim for HR

Someone has never dealt with UBS' HR dept.

"After you work on Wall Street it’s a choice, would you rather work at McDonalds or on the sell-side? I would choose McDonalds over the sell-side.” - David Tepper
 

f**k all of you idiots on this website. get a college degree then talk to me.

UBS is an amazing bank. any group will teach you a lot about investment banking, set you up with incredible exit opps, and pay you pretty damn well. personally, i would stick with m&a or LevFin.

seriously, it's a great place. don't forget, the fact that you have an SA offer puts you in the top 1% of all summer internships in the nation. congrats!

 

f**k all of you idiots on this website. get a college degree then talk to me.

UBS is an amazing bank. any group will teach you a lot about investment banking, set you up with incredible exit opps, and pay you pretty damn well. personally, i would stick with m&a or LevFin.

seriously, it's a great place. don't forget, the fact that you have an SA offer puts you in the top 1% of all summer internships in the nation. congrats!

 
Best Response

lol... I was going to make a joke, but it really is stupid...

This board equates UBS & Barclays with like Mississippi Southern Junior College and Northern Arizona Vocational University.... the reality is that while UBS, Barclays, etc, are in the lower side of the top, they're still part of the chosen few. A better analogy would be UBS & Barclays = Cornell, Penn or Brown. Yes, it's not HYP, but it's still in the fucking ivy league son. The hating really does need to stop, not just because it's not funny (lord knows, it's hysterical), but because I fear some dumbass college kid is going to reject and offer from UBS because he doesn't want his resume to be tainted forever... as if it were like --- Accenture---- or something.

 

Haha, that's a good analogy. Kids who snob over lower-tier BB firms need a reality check; getting an offer anywhere in the BB will place you in the top 1% of college graduates across the nation in terms of job placement.

I am permanently behind on PMs, it's not personal.
 

So true, offers within the BBs have a certain element of randomness to them, and any offer in a BB for FO is worth its weight in gold.

It will never stop though, just because there are always relative comparisons, and in a world such as WSO where lower tier BB's are considered to be near the bottom of the totem pole, Piper bashing is inevitable.

 

I'll echo the comments in favor of Lev Fin and Sponsors (fka FSLF). Not only are FSLF two strong groups at UBS that have made a decent number of lateral hires, but the guys are very down to earth. I'm not sure what their demand is for interns, but I think it would be a great group to join.

 
boutiquebank4life:
this bank hasn't sent anyone to a good shop in 2 years. energy and power is dead bro, read the news.

really? what do you consider a good shop? like uhm... mega only?

 

I also have a summer offer with UBS for banking. I've sort of narrowed it down to M&A, LF, Real Estate. If I plan on going back to campus and pursuing full time elsewhere, should I be worried about the rank of M&A relative to other banks' M&A groups? I really like the Real Estate guys, but will I get stuck in that industry forever?

Also, are there other groups besides these at UBS that are worth considering?

 

Sponsors should be pretty good, a friend works in that group and I've heard good things about culture/ops/etc. M&A was a good pick but has been going through some internal changes and I'm not sure how set in stone the future of the group is, but should still be a top pick for the summer afaik. Other than that somewhat unsure- would appreciate someone who knows UBS better chiming in

 
barf:

TMT group there is basically gone isn't it? Think Lev Fin / Sponsors and Industrials are the good ones left.

No. TMT is still there and they do fairly well. I would say besides Lev/Fin Sponsors, M&A group is very solid. As others noted above, Industrials is one of the better coverage groups. I have heard healthcare is a good group there too, but I don't know too much about it to add any more insight
 

I found this to be very much the opposite during my time at UBS. Basically LevFin, FIG, Healthcare and M&A were the only groups that actually ran the models during deals. Healthcare and M&A were probably the best two groups but worked the most hours. FIG was also one of the best until Sarkozy left for Carlyle but known to work crazy hours. The product groups, especially consumer, had the best work-life balance (all relative of course)

 

I know UBS has been trying to recruit a 2nd Yr Analyst for their Private Funds Group - Secondaries Advisory (not sure if they filled the position but i know they want to hire/start immediately). In terms of "best" group, I would rank this as below some (or most) of the other groups for 2 reasons: 1) limited exit opps; 2) Evercore has raided UBS' secondaries team.

You get a ton of exposure to PE and build useful connections but the lack of modeling/technical work in that job would put you "behind" someone (if you're trying to get into PE). I think the second point is self explanatory. There's a thread about PFG that was posted earlier. PM me if you have any other questions

 

Healthcare is a deal machine. Sponsors/Lev Fin does well. M&A is also strong. Media is a rising franchise. Consumer Retail is still moving, despite Blair Effron's deaparture. UBS LA is probably the premier location, with several old DLJ guys who are now Global Heads sitting out there - but recruiting is handled separately.

 

even though HC is deal machine, you'll not sleep for 2 years working in that group......it's probably the biggest sweatshop/worst hours on the street...i know 2nd year associates in that group who are continuously pulling 19 hours days for weeks and months....imagine life as an analyst.

 

Recruiting does go through UBS NY. I don't know what you are talking about. They have their own target schools but the same HR contact in New York does the filtering. If you are a top candidate at a good school you can get referred to UBS LA.

UBS LA is by far the best group at UBS - Healthcare exits are not great.

Consumer is good, FSLF and Restructuring are improving steadily, Gaming / Real Estate is ok compared to the street, Consumer is excellent, M&A obviously is good as well and places spectacularly.

 

Top groups on the street don't always place well and PE recruiting has a very specific niche of places they look to. UBS Healthcare has a history of moving down one space work responsibilities. Ie. an analyst does bitch work, associate does analyst work, vp does associate work etc.

Therefore, a lot of the core technical skills arent developed and the analysts dont place tremendously well - that being said they do ok. Just they aren't in teh same league as say a UBS LA, GS TMT, MS M&A type scenario or for that matter a UBS M&A, JPM M&A perspecctive.

Placement is also relative, I am talking specifically about general PE and HF recruiting. Healtcare guys do well in the niche jobs (if you are interested in that). That all being said, M&A would be my top choice in NYC followed by FSLF & Restructuring. If I HAD to work at UBS I would work at UBS LA by far, it wouldn't be a decision i'd take more than 2 minutes to ponder (unless I absolutely hated LA)

Hope that helps.

 

On my sell day @ UBS NY, I had a sit-down with a couple Healthcare analysts -- yes, they took pride in their jobs...but they chiefly took pride in the fact they they pulled 3 1/2 consecutive all-nighters to prepare for their annual Healthcare conference...

...the idea that Westcoasting is talking about with regard to Healthcare...people within the bank refer to as "push-down..."

...of course, my top two are M&A and Sponsors...LA wasn't given to me as an option -- apparently they do their own recruiting.

 

is very strong if you desire to be there....it houses worldwide industrials/some consumer/some media / and m&A as well....about 50 bankers and few senior people within the firm.....

i know that in class of 2007 analysts (7-8, Michigan was highest represented, followed by NW)

for associates, 3 are from michigan and 1 from Chicago....great group of guys as my good buddy works there.

 

How are the exit opportunities from the Chicago offices (assuming it is a good office like CS or UBS)?

Are analysts able to get interviews at big name PE shops in NY and the West Coast or do they end up just working in smaller Chicago shops?

Essentially, how "prestigious" are the Chicago offices?

 
scottydoesntknow:
How are the exit opportunities from the Chicago offices (assuming it is a good office like CS or UBS)?

Are analysts able to get interviews at big name PE shops in NY and the West Coast or do they end up just working in smaller Chicago shops?

Essentially, how "prestigious" are the Chicago offices?

They aren't top PE shop feeders, but guys have placed into MDP, GTCR and have interviewed at TPG, KKR, Carlyle.

Banking in Chicago isn't that prestigious, but people who matter know that CS/UBS are top shops there.

 

Moelis is a top tier banker and has established UBS LA as a powerhouse...Harrah's, Univision were both done out of LA. However, by doing banking in LA you're essentially on an island. You'll get a NYC experience on the West Coast without all the banker groupies, blackcars, after hours night life, and a bunch of good looking actor types unable to understand what it is you actually do. Also, battling traffic after two all nighters is the most miserable feeling ever.

 

why do you say that it's not prestiguous. I can understand it not being as highly-looked upon as NYC, but how does it compare to west coast banking? I guess people can say that SF is better since most tech companies are based there, but what about LA?

Would you say it's better to go a JPM/Citi/DB in NYC vs. CS/UBS in Chicago?

 

When I was referring to "prestige," I was referring to overall "sexiness." If an analyst was given a choice, most would choose NYC >West Coast> Midwest banking. West coast banking, to a lot of people, is just sexier than Midwest banking for the same reason that Google is sexier than CAT.

I would def go Chicago over those firms you mentioned in NYC, but then again I chose Chicago over MS NY.

 
WizardofOz:
When I was referring to "prestige," I was referring to overall "sexiness." If an analyst was given a choice, most would choose NYC >West Coast> Midwest banking. West coast banking, to a lot of people, is just sexier than Midwest banking for the same reason that Google is sexier than CAT.

I would def go Chicago over those firms you mentioned in NYC, but then again I chose Chicago over MS NY.

wizardofoz - do you work for either CS or UBS?

Also, the UBS tech group is gaining momentum but you want to be in SF since thats where the HQ for tech is.

 
scotttwibell:
if you're 2nd year, are you going to PE next year????>...i've heard that decent number of analysts stay for 3rd year in chicago?

I'll be sticking around for one more year. Roughly 2 analysts per class stick around for a third year.

 

Say I plan to go to B-school after banking... would one group be better than another? I heard HC is really good at UBS, how abt their Lev Fin/Sponsors and M&A?

 

i don't work in banking but i think bschools aren't that concerned with one ib group vs another...i know someone from UBS h-care who got into a top 5 bschool. likewise someone from their industrials...etc

 

just out of curiosity, how are the different groups in UBS viewed across the street?

Apart from HC, which one provides better learning opportunities or exposure to live deals?

 

I'm not sure how common it is for the senior bankers to write recommendations. The group itself won't matter (unless it is a universally recognized top group: e.g MS M&A) as much as how well you perform and how strong of a recommendation senior guys can write for you.

For example, the Associate Director of admissions at HBS did 2 years of banking- but it is highly unlikely the people reading your app will care what group you came from.

 
gekko44:
are top groups

both top 5

HC and Industrials are good as well but their analysts get raped daily

Is this the world where everyone is above average? UBS M&A is a good group, and seems to be on the rise (not an unimportant fact). But I take issue with characterizing them as a "Top 5" M&A group.

Do me a favor: go to your Bloomberg, or SDC. Run the league tables for the past 10 years (pick any year). Cut it however you want: number of deals, US volume, global volume. That's your answer, and it's not UBS.

I'm not trying to tar them. Like I said, it's a very good group at a firm that has done very well and continues to build momentum. But as a banker I categorically dislike statements that run counter to basic reality.

 

London has a really strong M&A Group with bankers from Warburg leftover, Chicago has a stellar industrials group that places into MDP well and other quality PE shops. Los Angeles is obviously by far the best group at UBS and has been discussed enough.

FS and M&A place the best by a wide margin in NY. Silverlake, Carlyle were all featured in the past few classes there. Healthcare is the worst culture in the world - I would never work there especially because it's exit opps are sub par at best.

 

The bank is going to hire a certain number of summer analysts and some of those will go back to their group and some will elect to go into the generalist pool. Your best bet is to pick a group that is in a sector you're actually interested in becausee otherwise you're probably making a bad decision and it will cost you on the intangibles this summer.

 

A genuine question - Why is their HC group so good if they missed out on the two biggest (so far) HC deals ( Roche - Genentech, and Pfizer-Wyeth)of the year?


Just my 2c.

__________ Just my 2c.
 

I remember reading about how UBS ran the hostile defence for Alcan during the Alcoa bid. UBS also pops up on a bunch of the global mining and materials highlights on Thomson.

http://www.reuters.com/article/companyNewsAndPR/idUSL1958434420070516

This talk of Sarkozy and FIG is legit. The recent NYT Dealbook "Facebook" of young superstars featured an extra-large picture of his head at the top left. He did ABN AMRO, MBNA, Sallie Mae, Wachovia/Southtrust, National Commerce/SunTrust.

 

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