What fraternity are you part of?
And how did your fraternity helped you in your job search?
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I made the mistake of joining a business frat.
Laugh if you must.
On a serious note, it was actually detrimental to my job search (hence why I quit).
What fraternity where you part of?
It certainly helps a little bit but it's not make or break. If the guy looking through your resume is in your fraternity, then it's just another reason to give you an interview. I've also had interviewers in my house - that's a great way to lead into a conversation and establish something positive in common to joke about.
Alpha Kappa Psi
How did Alpha Kappa Psi helped you in your career?
It didn't. Here's what I think the problem is with fraternities in general: people that join homogenize their social networks. That is to say, if your chapter has 50 members, all 50 members will have the same friends - alumni members, potential/pledging/ex-members, other chapter members, etc.
In theory it could be beneficial if all the members and alumni are baller, but it doesn't always work out that way. And I agree with the post about people "seeing through your 'leadership' position".
I say join a legit club and gain influence there - you'll meet way more people, not lose your normal social life to a small network and gain the benefit of actual community organization.
In my experience, it's been detrimental more than helpful. If you have a brother that can land you an interview, go for it. Other than that, most people think you're a douche bag, hate your fraternity, or see right through your "leadership" position. If you're still in undergrad and considering joining a fraternity, I can tell you that your time is much better spent elsewhere. FWIW, I was in Tau Kappa Epsilon.
Tau Kappa Epsilon? Geez, you guys have a crazy alumni list : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Tau_Kappa_Epsilon_brothers
It is surprising that they couldn't help you.
You're right about TKE having a very extensive, accomplished list of alumni. They used a line during initiation about becoming Ronald Reagan's brother...it was all bullshit.
Sure, they could have helped me, but they didn't. They weren't really willing to help. They're more likely to help someone from their school than someone from their fraternity at a different school. That said, I wouldn't recommend it, even a fraternity like TKE with tons of accomplished alumni. Are you in a fraternity now?
Everyone who decides to join a fraternity claims that joining one can give you access to the nationwide members in that specific fraternity. My question is: would an xyz frat star at Yale decide to help out a xyz frat star at TCU over aYale alum just because they're in the same chapter? Someone explain.
Alpha Epsilon Pi BABY! Frat's are definitly helpful in most cases. Your experiences, both social and managerial, are invaluable in life. Also, here is a great Stat. I spent 20% of my total interview time across the board talking about my experiences in my fraternity. Note that I had two previous I-banking internships. If you can, try and find out if there are bankers who recently graduated that were in the fraternity during RUSH. Just a thought
.
I'm in a sorority, but I didn't join for the network or the "leadership" position. That's... not a great reason to join the greek system.
That being said, I think it helps my resume for now. Someone looking at my resume sees that I'm a math major, but they also see that I'm in a sorority, play a varsity sport, and work for a nonprofit. Will I keep it on my resume after college? Probably not.
I was also a math major in undergrad. My biggest challenge during recruiting was showing a commitment to finance. With that said, your time in greek life could be spent with a finance club, doing an in-semester internship, etc. I understand your view on putting greek life on a resume, but it can honestly hurt you, and I don't think it's worth that risk.
A sorority probably helps more than a frat. Which is a bit sad but the way it is.
This is not the case in most places.
Eh.. I don't think that is 'the way it is'. At all.
my frat was detrimental to my career, cause it made me party, drink and bang more chics than i could have. I could have stayed in and got better grades which would have made my life a lot easier.
What made you join in the frat then? What was your first impression when you first joined the frat? just curious....
the lure of hot young chics willing to throw their inhibitions to the wind at the drop of hat(or in this case, a bottle) and parties, and good friendship, and gaining real life skills, and helping in the community.
Overall good experience wouldnt trade it for the world, but my grades did suffer as a result. such is life
I go to a target that doesn't have a finance/business major, and I've honestly had no trouble getting interviews vs. econ majors. That being said, I've also participated in the finance clubs my school offers, but they take up significantly less time than my other commitments. I've also had relevant internships every summer.
My point is... don't think of a greek organization as an activity that works towards your career aspirations. Greek life definitely has its benefits elsewhere. That being said, I have it on the last line of my otherwise pretty nerdy resume, and I truly think that it's helped me with my job search. I actually bonded over greek life with my mentor this summer.
Lamda Alpda Delta. Got me everywhere I am today.
Lamda Alpha Delta. Got me everywhere I am today.
I've gotten interviews through fraternity alumni
Those who say that fraternity alumni relations are detrimental/didn't help did not use the resources available to them properly.
I got an excel database with all of my chapter's alumni and emailed/called every single one in financial services. Some didn't answer, but some did. It was the equivalent of calling your uni alumni, except your list is much much smaller and you have a huge talking point from the get go aside from "finance" talk
Phi Sigma Kappa
One thing about being greek is that I will usually think at least this person is probably decent enough to get a beer with and has some social skills. It could be wrong but if you give me 2 people with the same resume except 1 has a greek affiliation I'll prob go with them.
frats are for fags that can't make friends or get girls on their own. you will be better off in life if you don't join one and just focus on your school work.
Actually, no. I would never ever ever want to be a part of a social fraternity. The houses are disgusting and the people are lowlife alcoholics. I am perfectly content with my life and would never need that pussy brofest to bring happiness to my college life.
As for business frats, I was begged my a few people to join both DSP and AKPsi. I was even told that I didn't have to go to any of the networking/meet and greet sessions and that all I had to do was interview with the other people that were selected. I said no.
So actually, you are completely wrong on both accounts. Nice try though.
I wouldn't necessarily condone the way he put it, but it is partially true. .01% of people join fraternity for the "alumni network", that might be #15 on their list of reasons why they joined. Most people who do join came from somewhere far away, came to a school where they didn't know anybody, and an easy quick fix would be to go Greek. It's a shortcut way to the top of the social ladder and usually does NOT help you in the long run.
Both of my roommates are greek and it's pathetic to see what they've become. They went from making 3.6s in engineering to making 2.8s (they rushed as sophomores) and both have beer bellies and have to wake up at 4am most days to clean up their house after their parties. It takes up all their time and they wind up missing a lot of class for it. Not necessarily a productive way of life.
Anybody who really thinks it will hugely benefit their worklife and network are honestly kidding themselves. If you have the ability to juggle both frat life, schoolwork, and worklife, then by all means go and have fun. But if not (and most of you can't) then fraternity's CAN be detrimental.
haha, what a massive chip on your shoulder
What are you trying to say, that I paid for my friends? Spoken like a true GDI.
And just to clarify I actually paid to live in a $10M castle that throws parties geeds like you can't get into.
Listen guy, you have a 3.2 gpa going for a "business administration" degree at a state school. You prove my point to the fullest extent possible. Thanks for playing though.
Wow... what a stuck up Frat Douche. Cut the fucking attitude man and don't take the holier than thou approach. It's shit like that which pisses me off about being Greek. It's a bullshit GDI vs. Greek/Us vs. Them mentality. Some of my best friends in college were not Greek and I prefer them to some of my fraternity brothers. I went to a school where at least 75% of the school was not Greek and Greek life, although a presence on campus, was not a major focus on things (and any Penn Stater can attest that Greek life, while present, was not the only thing that people could do for fun and was not the sole source of a social life).
What I am saying is that you wasted money to explicitly pay for the privilege to act like a douchebag on top of just coming off as one. I'm also saying that you strike me as the type of person whose core friends came from being Greek and not from other avenues.
skull and bones.
priceless value
You join a fraternity for to have fun in college, not to further your career. That being said I did put it on my resume and it probably helped a little. It helped more when I started hitting bars w/ co-workers. Stories, memories, and an experienced liver are priceless.
Will, clearly you're being quite judgmental here. Although I am not disagreeing with the idea behind your assessment, as it depends on which fraternity on which campus you are at, you will find members of social fraternities who are lowlife alcoholics and drug users. At the same time, you will find people who are 4.0 students that drink and smoke the night away in social fraternities. This standard holds true for non-Greeks too. I know kids who were the biggest booze hounds and pulled 4.0s. I know kids that stayed damn well clear of having a Greek-related social life, didn't drink or party and still didn't take the top spots in their class. Clearly, you think that you are above Greek life in general, and I totally get that. It's not for you, but don't be a judgmental bastard saying it has no place in anyone's life and that they would be better off without having joined.
Ok I understand your argument but you are basically explaining the exception argument. Every single thing in life has exceptions to it so your points are null. What I am saying is, FOR THE MOST PART, people in frats tend to do worse in school and the benefit they receive from being in it professionally is so much less.
Someone who stayed away from greek life would probably do better than someone who is a part of it. Yes, there are exceptions as I mentioned above, but this is usually the case.
I have about 10 friends who rushed frats their sophomore years and their gpa's dropped SIGNIFICANTLY. Every single one of them saw a drop in gpa, in fact. And when we compared test scores they would always say, if i wasn't rushing or doing xxx in my frat then I would have done better.
Will, then your friends have poor time management skills. As to your friends who rushed as Sophomores, I've seen the reverse of it. Since becoming a brother, in the 6 pledge classes that I saw during my undergraduate career, we had 4 with at least one student who was older (sophomore/junior/senior) and I remember one in particular where we had 2 juniors who were both in ROTC. Yeah, so as I said, your friends have no time management skills. The two kids that were ROTC pulled a 3.7 and a 3.3 respectively that semester. You are blaming Greek life for their own inability to manage their affairs.
And I'm not explaining the exception, I'm clearly stating that there is no rule. You can do whatever the hell you want and it's up to you to make sure you get the 4.0. When I pledged, when I wasn't in class or doing pledging relating activities, I found time to do everything I wanted to do. I would study, do work and get my time in to party and keep up with the Greek life because it was drilled into our heads at day one that good time management was the secret to life. I spent 12 hours a week of mandatory time in the library - that's 3 hours a day, 4 days a week - because Penn State has a mandatory requirement that time be set aside for pledges to be in the library and study. We had no social functions on Monday, Tuesday and either Wednesday or Thursday, so there was more time to dedicate to it. My weekends were spent being involved in Greek life, but I still had time to do my work. When I graduated, the average graduating GPA of everyone who was roasted alongside of me was a 3.5. This was for a group of 20 people, of which some were academic all stars and others were just barely able to pull a 2.5. And yes, as I said before, this is a matter of where you go and what house you end up pledging at.
You want me to point you in the direction of someone I knew who stayed away from Greek life and it went either way? I can do that to. My first year roommate and his collection of friends are great for that. They were not academic all stars. They weren't involved in Greek life and they partied all the time with friends they knew from high school. They drank, they smoked, they did a shit ton of drugs. My ex-roommate failed out with a 1.3 GPA. His buddy, a pretty smart guy when you spoke to him, had a 2.0 and decided college wasn't for him after a year. There was a guy on my floor who failed out his first semester because he didn't study and spent all his free time playing video games. These guys didn't go near Greek Life at all because they thought it would be bad for their ability to study and get things done yet still failed anyway.
I have an friend and some mutual acquaintances who are the total opposite of that. My friend graduated in 5 years as an engineer with a double minor and a 3.7 GPA, was an RA for two years and was heavily involved in THON. Of our mutual acquaintances, one graduated in 6 years, changed majors 3 times and just barely pulled a 3.0 on graduation. He also started pledging a house and dropped after a week because he realized Greek life wasn't for him. One graduated in 5 years, changed his major twice, didn't drink, do drugs, did not have a very social life and ended up with a 2.9 and a third graduated in 4 years with a degree in actuarial science, had a 3.8 GPA and went out every Wednesday to Sunday. Mind you, I went to a school with 35,000 students at the main campus and less than 15% of the students were Greek. I'm more than certain that examples can be found across the board of independents doing poorly in school.
Look, your entire argument is that you will be better off without it and shouldn't consider it at all. It's the argument of someone who is anti-greek, and that's a fine thing to be, but, and this is what I've said to every prospective rush that I met, "Find the right guys to hang out with and make sure you like the people first and foremost. If you don't like who you are socializing with, then it's not worth it at all. If you like the guys and feel comfortable around them, then you have a choice to make. If you want to do it, pledge because you want to and no other reason". It's a personal preference and choice. The people who realize it's not for them go inactive and the ones that love it stay active. It's how it always is. It's the nature of Greek life. Just let them make the decision instead of being dismissive over it.
Some big bro-haters up in WSO
My fraternity helped me tremendously. Networking and socializing (while managing responsibilities) is how you truly become successful; solid grades just make hiring you look good.
Well said Frieds.
For the record, I was as anti-Greek as possible my first two years at school. I hated it. Then I realized it wasn't the idea of it that I hated, it was some bad apples that ruined my perception of it. I rushed, pledged, and initiated.
I never put it on my resume. I never needed to. It filled a spot in my life that was peculiar to my individual circumstances at the time. My GPA every semester during and after pledging was higher than before. Being Greek doesn't mean you're a boozehound or a womanizer, an academic all-star or drop-out. Being Greek is simply another facet of who you are as a person, and frankly, I wasn't mature enough to recognize that early on.
Will, the simple fact that you use the word 'fag' as an insult shows your maturity.
i joined Alpha Kappa Psi at my school (non-target in southern California). some chick (one of my "bros") got me my first analyst internship at an insurance company where she was working in HR. in my opinion, this was just dumb luck and the benefits of AKPsi (the national organization) was pretty marginal, at least career-wise.
the social aspect was a different story. my chapter had this extremely intense pledgeship process that involved some serious mental and physical hazing (i actually popped a blood vessel doing push-ups). this experience was unlike anything i've done in my life and i wouldn't trade it in for anything... made some real friends along the way. unfortunately, AKPsi nationals and my University caught onto our pledgeship process and our chapter was suspended in my senior year.
my opinion: AKPsi is a garbage national organization, but some of the chapters have their own rules and traditions that make them very cool and worth it.
I will say this, I attend a private university in the south and decided to join Greek life because my father told me about all the positives it contributed to his college career. There is a Fraternity on campus that has a stronger alumni base and a lot more wealthy connections than the Fraternity that I joined, however at the time that was not as important to me as the group of gentlemen I would be spending my next four years and life with.
Without even thinking about it, my first two internships were achieved by Fraternity brothers and Fraternity alumni who referred me as well as connected me to firms. My third internship I earned from networking and applying on my own.
When it came time for me to apply/interview for full time positions just a few months ago, the Fraternity network was extremely helpful in connecting me to individuals within Investment Banking. There were a few groups that I interviewed with that had numerous alumni from my Fraternity throughout their hierarchy, however I was not extended an offer.
I did end up getting a FT offer from a MM IBD and am extremely happy as they were my first choice. My Fraternity alumni and brothers were helpful in getting me some interviews, but not at the firm I ultimately chose in the end.
Joining a Fraternity/Sorority can't hurt: it gives you an entire different network other than your university and high school.
Ladies and gentlemen, this is in fact a Southern Gentleman.
Unfortunately, he's a Pike.
LOL. Because I think social fraternities are worthless garbage to universities I get monkey shit. haha
Well, Frieds, I respect your argument and gave you an SB for it. However, the other butt hurt pansies in this thread should go reconsider their existence.
I never said that people should not EVER consider it because I know there are people that can't make friends on their own and would be miserable with no friends in school. Also, being able to get girls without being overly intoxicated is hard for some people so they join frats.
I said, people who think joining a frat will help them improve their chances of breaking in or furthering their career are delusional and should not consider it. There is statistical proof at my school that being in a fraternity decreases your GPA and inhibits your involvement in extracurriculars.
Yes, there are outliers that can go against the grain but it is commonly known that being in a frat is going to cause you to drink more/party more.
Anyway, I rest my case...if some people on here don't agree then they are strictly in denial. Time management is a problem for 99% of college students so that argument is not a good one. Joining a frat just further exacerbates that problem for many people.
Friend 1: 3.80-->3.1 (Asked to copy my work 24/7 after he was initiated) Friend 2: 3.65-->2.92 (Completely stopped going to class) Friend 3: 4.0-->3.78
These are just 3 cases that I am outlining. I know of 10-20 people who saw the same thing happened and thats just people I know. I have also noticed that some people maintain the same GPA but it's because of massive cheating and copying of other brothers work.
Anyone else see the stupidity of his "stats"? A 3.78 gpa is awesome. Also most people pledge their freshman year...so if they had a 3.80 after two semesters that's not reflective of their future academic performance...someone who stops going to class would've found some other way to wreck his gpa if having pledged.
Don't wreck yourself buddy just because you didn't get laid in school...pow right in the kisser
You my friend are, without a doubt, the most retarded person I have exchanged posts with on this site. Your argument is utter trash and I feel bad for the people you interact with on a daily basis.
The no sex diss is sooo old and terrible that I cannot believe it. I have had a gf for 3 years and have had 100x more sex than you in that time span. And you know what?...it never gets old because she is fucking amazing so any comeback relating to the same vagina argument is also null.
You must have had alot of fun taking it up the ass from your fraternity brothers and gargling their balls in your mouth. I'm glad that made your college experience worthwhile and now you are so eager to defend them.
If you want to have a fun college experience and have a pack mentality then joining a frat is right for you. For those of you that are promoting frats because they taught you social skills, that is absolutely absurd. If you need to join a frat to learn how to socialize then you are completely moronic. Having a conversation over beers isn't a skill and its not hard... for most people. Someone on here said they would pick the resume with the fraternity rather than the one without the fraternity. I suppose this makes sense if the resumes are EXACTLY the same. If you are indeed evaluating resumes and using fraternity memberships as an important criteria, you need to either grow up or gain more life experience. It isn't an indication of social skill.
Will, well said. Thank you for the SB, so I dropped a few your way in kind.
I understand why some people here are so anti-fraternity. "It's for losers who can't make friends on their own", or "joining a social frat hurts your grades"... I've heard these arguments a million times and I used to make them myself before joining. The thing is you will rarely ever see these arguments made by someone who was in a Greek Letter organization.
The problem here is that you guys who are bashing the whole fraternity thing have never actually been through the process of rushing and pledging. I think the greatest benefit of joining a fraternity is the actual pledging, especially if it's rigorous and involves hazing. Unless they were in the military or a street gang, very few college students have had an experience like an intense pledgeship.
IMHO, having this experience creates a bond that is more intense than the friendships you make with people in your dorms or with people you randomly meet in class.
Couldn't agree more. The parties and all are great and it's a great social outlet, but (some) pledgeships have very similar experiences that teach you quite a bit about yourself that is very hard to learn elsewhere. It is successful at breaking you down, building you back up, and giving you a renewed and more accurate sense of confidence, as well as a better awareness of your abilities, and the means to improve them.
Phi Alpha.
Met my best friends through the fraternity I joined and will have made memories that will last me a lifetime. Sure, it may have cost me a few tenths on my GPA, but the fun I've had was worth way more than a 3.5 instead of a 3.2.
I joined Akpsi to help at recruiting, but it didnt help My chapter in a socal nontarget did not have any notable alumni so that may have been why
Got some cool lifetime friends though
At the end of the day, Greek life isn't for everyone. There are positives and negatives, but really its what you make of it. If you join a Fraternity and use the network, utilize the opportunity for leadership positions, and have some good clean fun with your brothers/sisters then I see no downside.
That being said, if its not for you thats fine. Different schools have more important/involved Greek life than others and chapters are different at each school. If Fraternity life affects your grades, health, and life so detrimentally...thats your fault for letting it.
TKE certainly helped out!
i'm usually slow to fire, so i ended up having to eat a lot of the crackers during pledge semester. the experience hardened me for my first year in IBD where i had to eat the stuff in a more figurative sense.
I would imagine Alpha Pi Epsilon would be the most benefitial when looking for a job in the financial services industry..
You mean AEPi?
ya thats what i meant. my bad.
Conclusion from THIS thread. (Not trying to offend anyone)
Pro Greek = Non target Anti Greek = Target
I guess Targets don't need fraternities because they have access to a successful alumni network?
I'm at a target and am pro-greek.
I think that people thrive both in and out of the greek system. Some people are more suited to it than others. In terms of how it affects the job search, some people gain a network and others lose motivation in school.
I don't think the greek system will necessarily lower your GPA. It might for some people who weren't very motivated in the first place, but many people are able to balance having fun with getting work done. Greek organizations offer more than superficial "academic support." Personally, I had great friends my freshman year, but my sorority has really given me a home on campus with other girls who share the same values that I do. My sorority has really made my college experience- more than just by providing a full social calendar. And for what it's worth, I just calculated my GPA and my non-greek semesters average a 3.3, while my greek semesters average a 3.8.
For what it's worth, I matriculated to a target. Pro-greek. If anything, targets tend to be very Greek-heavy. It just doesn't absolutely run shit like it does at public schools or the large private schools down south. The Yale fratstars partied way harder than kids at Vandy and Tulane, but they weren't the apex of the social scene; fratting in the South is a way of life.
The Greek vs. geed flaming is great ... definitely my favorite thing on a finance forum.
Contrary to the popular opinion about AKPsi presented here, I am a member at a non-target. Our chapter is one of the largest in the country, and no that that simple fact means much of anything, but it's certainly a starting point. Yes, most of our members don't go into finance, but in my experience, the ones that do are actually at the top of their respective classes. Additionally, I was in a SuperDay with a BB in NYC and during the final round interview, I was fortunate enough to be interviewed by two brothers from Cornell. After they commented on my membership in AKPsi, the rest of the interview was a breeze... conversation and jokes the whole time. I consequently got the offer and credit it mostly to the fact that I was interviewed by brothers.
I believe there is an important delineation to be made between business and social fraternities. While social fraternities are definitely more polarizing, credit should be given to business fraternities that are run well. I can honestly say that I've developed some incredible friendships and connections since joining and my GPA has remained exactly the same. Partying two or more nights a week has not led to a decrease in my academic performance (and just to pre-empt the haters, I'm a math and econ major, no liberal arts BS). So to credit those claiming poor time management skills, I think you're correct. That said, I am a definite believer in the potential positive impact joining a fraternity can have. It is by no means the biggest benefit during an interview, but it is an excellent way to diversify the college experience, have a lot of fun, and make great friends.
I recognize that mine is a somewhat unique experience and I likely just got lucky, but hey, anecdotal evidence is all we really have here, eh?
Will,
What is the minimum investment for your fund? I am very interested. Ping me.
Seriously though, you sound like a bigger nerd with every post. Go outside an play some ultimate frisbee in the quad to burn off some stress and stop hating on people who got after it in college.
oh, and this:
http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/market-operations-summer-intern
Look, Will. If it isn't for you, leave it at that. It's so simple. If you aren't a fan of it, you don't need to go so far as to scream and blackball it on a forum where you can change no one's opinion of anything except your maturity.
The argument transcended from "frat life and helpfulness" to ad hominem attacks questioning my knowledge so I responded. I could care less about his opinion about the issue...just don't question mine or make false accusations.
8==GDI==D
8==BRO==D
It's close....keep measuring
Definitely stands out on a resume if you were the president of your fraternity, and provides a good answer for the what you do with your time? interview question(ie manage a budget, spend a lot of time with the administration, organize philanthropy/community service events)
At the end of the day, if you are a leader and put a lot of time into the fraternity, it can help you a ton during an interview. Alumni of any fraternity will realize the work that the officers put in.
Speaking from personal experience, the alumni connections aren't exactly great for getting interviews directly, but are a go-to contact when you want advice about a certain industry or recruitment process - nobody likes the kid that comes up and says, "Hey, can you get me an interview?", but I've found some my alumni very helpful in helping prep for interviews and providing industry/firm specific insight that comes in handy during recruitment
make sure you are joining a real fraternity, not one of those "community service fraternities" which are about as useful as an asshole on your forehead.
This.
Wish I could give Will an SB for those posts
dude is relentless lol
Pi Kappa Alpha
"You say I pay for friends. I say you pay $10 at the door. TFM."
Will, no shit he does. He's the poster boy for idiots in Greek Life, and trust me on that one, I've had to deal with them before. This is why 90% of the people who have made Greek vs. GDI comments, I've ignored for the most part. They lack any reasonable sense and actual argument besides Greek Good, GDI Bad.
A Possee Ad Esse, tell me about it. That advice I posted earlier that I gave, that comes from having been fortunate to have been in a house where I liked everyone and no one was really a douche or a typical frat bro.
i see we have some acacia men here
Vote, I'm not acacia. Not in the lease bit.
A Posse, it happens no matter where you are.
I rushed, pledged, and initiated my first semester of freshman year. I did it mostly because I wanted to meet people, and also I was the only person from my high school to go to this school. And I did, I met a ton of people and had a blast these past three years. I wouldn't trade those experiences/memories for a higher GPA...
Greek life/fraternities are really different in each university you go to...can't really judge a person based on their frat/greek affiliation...
Will for someone so outspoken about the negative impacts of the fratlife..how do you know if it will negatively impact your OCR potential? According to your profile (i.e. belongs to the group class of 2013), you haven't even done OCR
But to the OP its gonna depend on what you wanna do...i'd argue being in a fraternity is a positive when interviewing for an S&T position...probably a negative in banking since youd sit in your cubicle for 12 hours and occasionally interact with fellow workers.
Not to go all "frat douche" on you, but i'm just gonna toss out some stats from schools that post GPA comparison information.
This isn't a solid sample, I just google searched "greek vs non greek gpa" but take it for what it's worth. The difference in GPA for the total populations are negligible. You may say that finance people tend to be towards the top of the curve, and so have further to fall, but across the board, the difference is rather non-existent.
http://www.uihome.uidaho.edu/default.aspx?pid=101927
http://www.alumni.rpi.edu/services/affinity/AIGC/Resources/IRBrief_Rete…
http://greeks.unc.edu/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=89&Item…
http://activities.richmond.edu/greek-life/statistics.html
[quote=Logger54]Not to go all "frat douche" on you, but i'm just gonna toss out some stats from schools that post GPA comparison information.
This isn't a solid sample, I just google searched "greek vs non greek gpa" but take it for what it's worth. The difference in GPA for the total populations are negligible. You may say that finance people tend to be towards the top of the curve, and so have further to fall, but across the board, the difference is rather non-existent.
http://www.uihome.uidaho.edu/default.aspx?pid=101927
http://www.alumni.rpi.edu/services/affinity/AIGC/Resources/IRBrief_Rete…
http://greeks.unc.edu/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=89&Item…
http://activities.richmond.edu/greek-life/statistics.html[/quote]
That data tells me nothing. From my experience, greeks generally have easier majors. You generally see greeks majoring in biz, communications, psych, easy shit. Not as many chem, engineering, architecture majors.
I guess trying to take things out of the "From my experience" perspective, didn't work for you. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that from my experience the distribution is pretty similar to the non-greek community.
Sigma Alpha Epsilon
I went to school in the South where greek life is a lot different than in other parts of the country. I had a great time in school, made good grades, and have a lot of life-long friends because of my experiences in school.
I find the idea of fraternities as you Americans call them fascinating. Are you aware of their uniqueness? Are they really as they are portrayed in the films?
btw i went to one of those schools you mentioned and was greek...
They were just examples of a trend. I wasn't singling them out as my model schools. I think there is general misunderstanding of the greek community and there are some "social houses", which cause this. I know at my school, getting below a 3.0 put you on probation with the fraternity, we had mandated study hours for the freshmen, quiet hours in the house. Most people don't realize also that there is a GPA standard for even being able to rush some fraternities.
Join a frat because you want to join one and you feel the people there are a good fit for your social life and will be good influences.
Don't join a frat because you think you will make automatic friends, bang chicks all day, or have crazy parties.
I know some excellent students in fraternities, some terrible ones, some stuck up jerks in fraternities, and some really cool people. It's a personal decision.
Sigma Chi, but never came across alumni and didn't leverage any type of network.
Also a Sig...best damn fraternity on earth.
Phi Sigma Kappa.
I find that a lot of people who talk down on joining a fraternity either A) Never experienced the benefits of one or B) Had a negative experience with a bad group of individuals.
All a fraternity is is a 'group' of friends. Yeah, there are rituals that give it more legitimate feel, but in the end it is all about the friendships you build.
In my opinion it can be one of the most rewarding things you can do early on in life. Without a doubt I would not be the same person I am now (socially, professionally, and in terms of loyalty) without the experience of fraternity.
Whoever said something along the lines that a 'target' wouldn't help about a 'non-target' in the same fraternity is simply bullshit. If anything, the target guys are more inclined to help out those who may not have all the connections that us non-targets may have. In fact, my first job in finance was through a fellow brother who attended a different school than I did. Even more, I corresponded with an individual in our fraternity who has been on the board of Coca-Cola for 20+ years. So yes, in a lot of cases they will go out of their way to reach out to those who have been through similar experiences.
a
Alpha Iota Delta Sigma
United States Army here. For some reason killing people adds a ton of credibility to your resume.
Regards
I knew someone was going to pull the military card on being in a frat.
Haha. We roll pretty deep too, lol.
Regards
Pike here, also never come across alumni (although I was not a die hard member of my frat) and thus didn't leverage my network....but hell fun times in college.
DKE.
Here is a little bit of satire my friend wrote to fuel the frat stertotype and get Will Hunting's panties in a bunch:
The public calls us “frat-boys”, we prefer “fraternity men”. However, regardless of the nomenclature, we are the hardest partying, most fun-having, and fucking coolest people you will ever meet on a college campus. Now, sit back, relax and allow me to explain to you why we are better than everyone else. It all starts with the wardrobe. To play the part, you have to dress the part. I’m adorned with more animals than a zoo. It’s a status thing. I’ve got everything from whales to horses with a few fish, crabs, and black labs thrown in for good measure. I might as well be a walking billboard for affluence as it is now apparent to everyone that my dad is part of the 1% and my mom has never worked a day in her life. Almost as important as the embroidered fauna flashing my economic well-being are the colors which accompany them. My closet has so many pastels it would make the Easter Bunny jealous and it practically looks like Spring puked on my button downs. In all honesty I could probably convince you that rainbows hide in my closet until they’re needed elsewhere. However, while the shirt is the center piece its really the accessories that make the man. The frat-straps are a must have, preferably with your letters on them, but in the end Croakies are Croakies when attached to a pair of Costa Del Mars. A classy hat can always help a guy out and yes by classy I mean Vineyard Vines or Polo. Jeans, shorts below the knee, and anything with cargo pockets are a serious breach of protocol unless you’re trying to impersonate a GDI (God Damn Independent for those not in the know) in a satirical manner, in which case, more power to you. I usually will go with a nice pair of Polo seven-inch chinos if the weather permits, otherwise, you can’t go wrong with a freshly pressed pair of khakis. In either case a Vineyard Vines D-Ring belt ought to provide ample support for the awesomeness that is draping off of the lower half of your body. Now, let’s address footwear. Obviously any sort of Sperry is acceptable and has indeed become the official footwear of fraternities everywhere, though a nice pair of Rainbow sandals will suffice in the summer months. Lastly, top the whole thing off with a Natural Light wrapped in a Southern Tide Koozie. You are now a fraternity man, and officially better than 99% of your peers.
Hate all you want. We don't fucking care.
lol
come on, the sons of dentists in flyover country acting like they are mayflower family scions
white nigga pleeez!!!!
depends on how hot your sorority has a reputations for being and how bored the analyst reading resumes is
Only helps w/r/t job search if you can talk about something substantive and/or skills you learned that compliment the position
However, adding a finance club membership will help to demonstrate interest, but this would not overcome extreme deficiencies on your resume/app
I can count on one hand the number of times I've heard of someone's frat getting them preference over someone else on the buyside... but I can't count on all my hands and toes the number of times I've heard of it working out for banking. Particularly at Penn.
Alpha Kappa Psi didn't do anything for me, biggest waste of $50. Would not recommend.
hahahahahahaha only $50?
I don't understand why people are posting business fraternities and honors fraternities - I thought everyone knew that those don't count.
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