Which minor would make me most competitive for summer recruiting

math

doesnt matter

i would definitely say statistics since most of the brainteasers you get in trading interviews and especially prop firms will be statistics brainteasers
if the minor is called "advanced math" i would be raising eyebrows... seriously what school calls it that? you're sure to get the question, what courses compose advanced math, and if you mention calc 3, linear algebra (which are the minimum in quantitative trading roles), i don't think it will go well

Finance/Econ best combo :P

The advanced math minor also includes courses in probability theory, stochastic processes and numerical analysis. The statistics minor includes courses like regression & multivariate data analysis.

Do you really use any of this shit on the job or is it just something to put on your resume? So many people minor in math, it doesn't seem like it will give you a competitive advantage in the interview process. Contrast that with fluency in a really hot foreign language.

In trading, they say all you need to know (math-wise) is how to add in eighths. The mathematical models/programs used are made by the quant/risk management team, people with PHD's and Masters in mathematical finance.

Convince me. Why math over something more practical like a foreign language.

Do you think you will be fluent enough after minoring in arabic to work in Dubai? If its trading you want, minor in stat or math. Buy Rosetta Stone and learn arabic on your own time.

Yes, I think I can with enough dedication and a few months over there over the course of a summer. What you said is a possibility, but no one has shed light on the practicality of minoring in math. Is it the actual math content that is useful on the job or is it the skillset acquired through studying math, ie. attention to detail-not screwing up numbers on trades/making mistakes.

Will you be fluent enough in math after minoring in statistics/math to create some kind of a trading algorithm? That's the quant phd/masters job. The risk management quant team comes up with all the rocket science, the traders trade, that's my understanding.

Can any traders convince me why math (ie. Calc III and all that other stuff) is so important to their job? I thought you only needed to know how to add in eighths?

And its best to explain/illustrate your positions rather than outright say "do this, do that."

yeah i never quite saw the point of some advanced math courses if you just wanted to trade and not be a quant

e.g.

math: numerical solutions for PDEs, real/functional analysis
prob: stochastic processes
stat: time series analysis, advanced data analysis

but from previous threads some people have recommended these courses. so like the OP said, if anyone can explain how these classes are used outside of being a pricing/risk mgmt quant, it would be much appreciated.

(it's not like knowledge of stochastic processes is going to help you much on whatever probability brainteasers...is it? just look at the other thread by wutangfinancial)

I was under the impression that you didn't need to know Arabic to work in Dubai, but if you think you would be able to learn Arabic well enough to make it a notable asset on your resume with "dedication and a few months" then you have a big surprise coming to you.

Are you aware its one of the most difficult languages in the world? My Spanish prof has a degree in language acquisition and she was talking about how there are 4 different levels of difficulty. Arabic is a level 4, which means it takes about 8-10 years of (she may have said the word "intense" here, or maybe "continuous") study to become fluent.

You'd be lucky to string a few sentences together after a summer school language course... a good one to learn might be "I'm sorry, I only speak English."

I’m fully aware of what Arabic entails. When I said I would be able to learn it I meant at an intermediate/conversational level at best, not at full fluency, and, like you, I did not assume you needed to know Arabic to work in Dubai. And anyway, I have a friend that learned to speak the language at an intermediate level in 3 years, after taking courses, immersing himself into an arab country on a few vacations and practicing with his friends (native speakers).

I did not say I would learn it in a few months- I said I would visit an Arabic-speaking country for a few months which would help me learn the language faster.

Can anyone prove that upper-level math is relevant and practical to a trader's job, not a quant's?

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=187289

It sounds like you're really interested in learning Arabic, in which case you should do that. But doing that to make you more desirable for employment isn't quite worth it, I would agree that stats probably makes more sense. But if you're interested in the long term and really plan on Dubai then go for it, I just doubt it will make a difference in recruiting.

Props tho, I find language incredibly difficult.

LOL @ "top 5 undergraduate business school." Don't try to pull that shit on here. At first I didn't notice the word "business" in there, so for a second I thought you were at Harvard/Yale/Stanford/MIT/Caltech as an undergrad. Here's a hint: You're not in business school. It's an "undergraduate business program," and it's an abortion of the original purpose of an undergrad education, served up piping hot by the lower tiers of the academic community in order to attract more idiots like you.

___________________________________
http://www.drmarkklein.blogspot.com/

"LOL @ "top 5 undergraduate business school."

i think i can figure out what school the OP goes to.

anyway, why isn't a language minor viewed that highly? i'll be minoring in spanish so i'm hoping that being proficient in another language will give me an edge.

is Mark Klein suggesting that undergrads at schools like wharton, Cornell AEM and MIT Sloan are idiots?

Holy shit that was fucking awesome.

I come from the quant side, not the trader side, so my bias is pretty clear... but the math courses you listed will at least give you the tools to understand, to a degree, the models you'll be using. The better your understanding of what's going on inside the black box, the more likely you are to pick up on times when the results don't make sense, etc.

Stochastic processes is likely to help the most. Most sto pro courses these days are taught with plenty of finance applications. Something like numerical analysis, no help at all. Real analysis is a great course for learning to think abstractly. I'd rule out a stats minor -- don't think you'll be running regressions much.

My last pitch for math -- people tend to think that the way they themselves did things is best. If a lot of the people who'll be interviewing you have a strong math background, they'll think taking math is what smart people do. After all that's what they did, right?

But I know plenty of highly successful traders who know next to nothing about math. And you want to take Arabic. So take it and enjoy.

P.S. you asked whether the math courses you'd take would prepare you to come up with models on your own...highly unlikely.

Most BBs are willing to send you to the Gulf States only after you have earned your stripes in NYC. Stick to the math/statistics courses, but do yourself a favor and read Nassim Taleb's The Black Swan and Fooled by Randomness before you start accepting your professors' lessons as gospel.

DeltaHedged
www.deltahedged.com

"Since love and fear can hardly exist together, if we must choose between them, it is far safer to be feared than loved." - Niccolo Machiavelli

Wow. Look at the top 4:

1) University of Pennsylvania (Wharton)
2) MIT (Sloan)
3) University of California - Berkeley (Haas)
3) University of Michigan - Ann Arbor

Berkeley and Michigan are tied. I don't know the 5th school because I am not a subscriber. Mark, I don't think you can consider these "lower tiers of the academic community." They all seem to be solid schools to me. Please do explain your rationale.

where are your rankings based from?

That's USNWR if I'm not mistaken.