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I'm just curious because I see about 70 percent of the posts of people wanting to do S&T or IB,

What I don't understand about S&T is that those jobs are slowly disappearing to algorithmic trading because 80 percent of volumes are from high frequency trading, which is done by computers. They just fired the ten traders we have and replaced them with programmers. Could anybody verify this?

With IB I don't understand why people think that if they can't become an IB, that they will have no future at all. IB does have some great exit ops, but even your first few years you aren't paid AMAZING for how many damn hours you have to work.

Even if I personally had the chance to be an analyst at an IB, I wouldn't do it because the hours are ridiculous and you don't really see the benefit until after 3 years (if you even make it that far).

Could anybody clarify any of this for me?

Comments (23)

  • oreos's picture

    troll?

    ""After you work on Wall Street it's a choice, would you rather work at McDonalds or on the sell-side? I would choose McDonalds over the sell-side." - David Tepper

  • deltemeplzihatethisite's picture
  • drizzle's picture

    cognitive dissonance: you can't get a FO position so your brain tries to find reasons why FO positions are bad.

  • 2x2Matrix's picture

    You make a couple of accurate observations, thromback, but do you have anything better to suggest? I'm not a banker or trader, so I have no skin in this game, but despite their flaws, most people would agree that within finance, there's no better first job than banking/trading. Yes, each has its flaws, and they're by no means the only first jobs that position you well for future success, but your first job won't be 100% perfect no matter what.

    Maybe you do banking and sacrifice three years of free time for the chance at your dream job down the road. Maybe you do consulting and risk making less money and getting made fun of by bankers for a couple of years for a chance at a slightly different dream job. Or maybe if the front office sounds shitty to you, you do something in the back office and sacrifice your future career options and earning potential for better quality of life between the ages of 22 and 25.

    One of those lights, slightly brighter than the rest, will be my wingtip passing over.

  • 2x2Matrix's picture

    Also I didn't mention - thromback makes a good point about trading. From friends who work at top BB trading desks, though, it sounds like market making/client-centered flow trading isn't going anywhere; prop trading might be another story, I don't know. If you're currently a student looking into trading, you should definitely try to make yourself marketable to algo places as well as purely human places, because nobody really knows what the future looks like and algo trading - like thromback notes - is definitely a significant part of the future.

    One of those lights, slightly brighter than the rest, will be my wingtip passing over.

  • snooki212's picture

    take a hit in your twenties and forget work life balance. also, not to be elitist but I would rather be surrounded by ppl from ivies/T20 schools because I can relate to the culture, humor, and work ethic more.

  • deltemeplzihatethisite's picture
  • deltemeplzihatethisite's picture

    Sorry to double post, but if any of you are really really really good at computers you should learn Q/KDB (it's a real-time tick database for trading/compliance). There's this guy at my work hes like 27 and makes $400,000 base doing Q programming. There's no competition with it, but there's very little documentation and it's extremely difficult to learn.

  • drizzle's picture

    $150,000 base + bonus with a 3.1 from Baruch in some IT role. That means you make more than 95% of all 1st year prop traders from what I understand.

    Check out: https://www.renfund.com/vm/data_programming.vm . You are telling me you make more than programmers at rentec and you got that job with a 3.1 from Baruch?

    Enlighten me bro

  • deltemeplzihatethisite's picture

    sorry for a triple post, but this guy just is an idiot

    According to Ren:

    Total expected first-year compensation will range between $125,000 and $250,000, depending on background and experience.

    And I got the job because I interned there over the summer. If you an IT major GPA is worthless, it's all about how good you are on the job.

  • drizzle's picture

    The job you posted is for a SENIOR programmer and requires experience (also doesnt mention bonus)...

    My point with rentec was that with your 150+bonus you would fit right into that range which I think is bullshit.

    I agree though that I don't understand all that IT stuff but what I do understand is that nobody in their right mind would pay 150k+ for a 3.1 from Baruch. Like you got C's and stuff in your classes?

  • In reply to drizzle
    Opi's picture

    drizzl:
    The job you posted is for a SENIOR programmer and requires experience (also doesnt mention bonus)...

    My point with rentec was that with your 150+bonus you would fit right into that range which I think is bullshit.

    I agree though that I don't understand all that IT stuff but what I do understand is that nobody in their right mind would pay 150k+ for a 3.1 from Baruch. Like you got C's and stuff in your classes?


    i really hope this is trolling lol

  • lindamas's picture

    *has no shot at banking*
    *posts on wso*
    *trolls hard*
    *brags about self*

    end thread/

  • deltemeplzihatethisite's picture

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  • In reply to lindamas
    Eric Stratton's picture

    ---------------------
    "Well, you can do whatever you want to us, but we're not going to sit here and listen to you badmouth the United States of America."

  • Beny23's picture
  • lasampdoria's picture

    "Those who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."- Benjamin Franklin