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WSO, It Is Time To Talk
 

Nefarious-'s picture
CF
(Neanderthal, 2,216
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 1:45pm
wake-up.jpg

WSO, it is time to talk.

The new trend around here lately has been to post about how badly you hate your job (specifically in iBanking) and then act like a genius when you decide you want to leave. This needs to stop. It is not a shocking revelation that you don’t like working 100 hours a week, getting fat, having bad skin, becoming a pale, unattractive, grease ball for the sake of working a job that, on the surface, pays you the big bucks, but when you get right down to it, gives you a diluted hourly right just slightly above minimum wage.

A lot of you need to wake the f*ck up and realize two, very important things:

Number 1:

The shittiest time of your life, work wise, is the time between graduating college and becoming 30. I don’t care what anyone says about your 20s being a magical time in your life. Your early 20s are. The mid to late 20s are supposed to suck, bad. You come out of college, usually broke, with debt and start working at the bottom of the layer cake. You are a nobody, a nothing. The school you went to doesn’t mean shit anymore. You are, in fact, completely replaceable. Wake up and realize you are not entitled to anything at this point in your life and no one, not even your parents, have sympathy for you being over tired or overworked. You just spent four years getting drunk, doing drugs and not doing shit for society.

Number 2:

The 80s are gone and with it is the Wall Street mentality. No longer is the norm getting in with a company and staying there for 30 years. Really working hard for the man to become wealthy. We are living in a time where a shitty little camera app gets bought by a company for $1 billion (after be talked down from 2). The days of getting in with a company and staying there to work your way up to the top are gone. Today’s companies seek mobile employees. The people that have no problem moving from sector to sector, division to division, state to state, city to city and wearing multiple hats are the most valuable employees. You really need to get it out of your head that because you are an intermediate with excel and can do a DCF analysis, you are worth a shit. I can write a macro to do the work you do and have a chimpanzee insert the dumps to generate that report. You are not special.

Let’s face the facts. A lot of you are getting into an industry that is shrinking. Not dying, shrinking. Today alone, BofA announced they are cutting 2,000 jobs from their investment banking and wealth management divisions. The industry is changing and it is changing with the new world we live in.

Back to my original point. The self-pity, hippie bullshit needs to end. In the past week there have been five topics like this and I have read more about people writing in their journal and giving the “be what you want to be” speech than I care to. Realize that success takes hard work and a result of hard work is typically money. Money may not be what causes happiness, but all that shit you like to do that makes you happy (golf, sailing, wife) requires money. So STFU, buckle down for your mid to late 20s and get it done. See my signature for further morale boosting.

You're born, you take shit. You get out in the world, you take more shit. You climb a little higher, you take less shit. Till one day you're up in the rarefied atmosphere and you've forgotten what shit even looks like. Welcome to the layer cake, son.
Tags:
technoviking's picture

thank you!

O
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 9:18am

thank you!

pacman007's picture

embrace the corporate drone

(Gorilla, 668
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 9:28am

embrace the corporate drone lifestyle.

"Don't quit. Suffer now and live the rest of your life as a Champion" - Muhammad Ali

Edmundo Braverman's picture

LOL. Great post. I'll be

ST
(Human, 14,409
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 9:39am

LOL. Great post.

I'll be honest, I've enjoyed the string of "fuck banking" posts lately and you're right - the business is going through a major contraction that probably won't ease up for the next 40 years (if the last Wall Street extinction-level event is any indicator). Those who are trapped in banking already need to make the best of it, but those who aren't in the industry yet need to give some serious thought to doing something else. Hopefully these "fuck banking" posts are providing the necessary food for thought.

The fact is it used to be easy, guys. I'm no fucking genius. Back when I was slinging commodities the CPI was at an all-time low. Hell, crude oil was $11 a barrel. You'd have had to have been a fucking retard not to make money.

That just isn't the case anymore.

smalleights's picture

+1, truer words were never

IB
(Baboon, 147
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 9:42am

+1, truer words were never spoken.

All the best things in like are never easy to acquire, nor would I want them to be. Everyone that quits when they hit a bit of resistance is just a huge pussy and needs to sack up.

Human's picture

Great post. Finally from

PE
(King Kong, 1,891
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 9:59am

Great post. Finally from someone who has worked his way up in the industry. Not from someone in their early 20s who wants to join the hipster crowd. And I am definitely not interested in the "street-musician" route.

"I am the hero of the story. I don't need to be saved."

UFOinsider's picture

Welcome to the machine. All

O
(Human, 10,349
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 10:08am

Welcome to the machine. All my life I hear people saying "these are supposed to be the best years of our lives". In 8th grade, then high school, then college, then 20's...listen, life isn't a fucking party. It's hard, REALLY HARD. Fucking get over it. I'm sick of entitled little rich punks whining about having to hold a fucking job. Get to work and shut the fuck up about it.

On another note: I'm glad you made the distinction between the industry DYING and SHRINKING. One number that I just saw said +/- 21,000 jobs. HOLY FUCKING SHIT. Personally, I see things picking up much sooner than 40 years...I give it a decade, and I forsee companies hiring more starting in 2013. I'm timing my exit from MBA for 2016, just to be safe. But we still won't see anything like the 80's until we're all close to retirement.

As for the posts, the first dude can choke on it...one year??? STFU. The other posts are pretty legit though: one guy just got tired of this and the other is leaving to start his own company (my ultimate goal as well). I'm going to encourage these posts because finance is a short term move for 95% of the people rolling through the doors of a bank....it's good to have your eye on the prize, and these posts illustrate exactly what that prize can be.

As for hating on hippies: dude, do you even know any? OWS aren't hippies, they're anarchists. Aside from the work thing, hippies are chill as hell. Hipsters, not so much, but hippies are ok in my book.

YOU JUST GOT TROLLED
http://www.troll.me/images/red-foreman322/dont-you...

happypantsmcgee's picture

Well said.

O
(Almost Human, 9,621
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 10:08am

Well said.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

Edmundo Braverman's picture

UFOinsider: As for hating on

ST
(Human, 14,409
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 10:13am
UFOinsider:

As for hating on hippies: dude, do you even know any? OWS aren't hippies, they're anarchists. Aside from the work thing, hippies are chill as hell. Hipsters, not so much, but hippies are ok in my book.

You see, this is why labels don't work. I'm an anarchist, and the fuckwads throwing bricks through the windows at Starbucks during a G-8 meeting are just losers looking for a handout.

streetwannabe's picture

+1! haha, Loved the part

AM
(King Kong, 1,338
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 10:25am

+1! haha, Loved the part about the macro monkey.

"History doesn't repeat itself, but it does rhyme."

NewGuy's picture

Awesome post brother. I agree

HF
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 10:36am

Awesome post brother. I agree with you 100%.

RagnarDanneskjold's picture

+SB, I was thinking the same

HF
(King Kong, 1,031
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 10:59am

+SB, I was thinking the same thing. This is WSO, if you don't like finance, that's fine. There are plenty of other boards out there. Personally, I like my job - for the record.

BTbanker's picture

edit

IB
 
Points)
 on 10/9/12 at 9:49pm

edit

"A man generally has two reasons for doing anything. One that sounds good, and the real one." - J.P. Morgan

jec's picture

I know at least one of them

 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:17pm

I know at least one of them is a troll.

Assets's picture

Amen, well said...

 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 1:43pm

Amen, well said...

rufiolove's picture

Human: Great post. Finally

IB
(Neanderthal, 3,412
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 1:53pm
Human:

Great post. Finally from someone who has worked his way up in the industry. Not from someone in their early 20s who wants to join the hipster crowd. And I am definitely not interested in the "street-musician" route.

I'm not really sure what you're referring to... at least 2 of the posts were from mid-level VPs, they've seen way more shit and have more right to comment on reality of banking currently, than an outsider who works in Corporate Finance for a F500 firm. None of these were "fuck banking" posts, and people who are viewing them that way are getting incredibly defensive, which is just further evidence that it is challenging some of their core beliefs. The fact that such innocent, self-reflective posts are triggering such a defensive, confrontational response "nut the fuck up" etc, is merely evidence that people feel the need to substantiate what they are doing, which to me alludes to insecurity.

Nefarious, I'm not sure of all the details of your background, but I'm assuming that you didn't work in banking, thus it's very difficult for me to assign a lot of credibility to your critique of honest self-reflection with respect to posts by Tier2Sta and TechBanking, they have just as much (likely much more) experience as you do, and have dealt with more than their fair share of shit. I can give you a slight benefit of doubt on providing some critique to the Stephen Ridley post, but even then it is mainly based on experience, but not necessarily wisdom.

It's just very difficult for someone who is currently working in the industry to lend a lot of credence to what you're saying. Sure, people theoretically know what they are getting into when they sign up to work in banking, but they don't really. Your criticism is a bit myopic and short sighted. TechBanking is leaving to work on what sounds to be a fantastic opportunity. You simply don't understand the industry quite as well as you think you do. You are an external observer judging based on peripheral anecdotes and truisms that no longer hold as much weight as they used to. The game has changed, as you mentioned and people frequently allude to, but with that, the benefits have changed, and in many cases are borderline nonexistant. People are simply upholding economic maxims by weighing the opportunity costs associated with their situations and choosing to make an INFORMED decision that it is time for the next chapter. These aren't "grass is greener" stories (with the exception of maybe the Ridley case, but even then it wasn't a 'fuck banking' everyone should leave), and to paint them as such does a massive disservice to the impressionable college contingent that makes up the majority of this forum.

Don't be so quick to view others' choices to seek happiness as an indictment of the financial services industry as a whole. I agree with you that times are tough and you have to put your head down and work when the occasion calls for it, but I disagree with you on other points. People are getting worked harder than they were before for less pay and the opportunities for alternatives are shrinking as well. I wouldn't be so critical of people who are choosing to seek a happier, more content lifestyle. Keep in mind that even though you may not think anything of an analyst from a bank that does 2-3 years, but putting in 2-3 years at a bank is like working 2-3x that in any other corporate setting, a fact which you are remiss to acknowledge.

The wise on the board know that life is about trade-offs and they are choosing now as the time to trade-off. If you understand anything about the current comp structure at many firms, you would almost be crazy to stay as a VP, as in many cases as much as 75-80% of their comp can be locked up for 3 years and in some cases as much as 8... but I'm sure it makes them stupid that they don't want to stick around another 8 years in a tumultuous industry in which their development as already plateaued, merely to have even more of their future comp deferred. They're called Golden Handcuffs for a reason, let's not get to preachy.

To the kids out there who are hungry to take the world by storm, I support it fully and still view my decision as a fruitful and prudent one. Just don't be surprised when you get here and realize that it's tougher than it was, and that a lot of what people were SB'd for advising you doesn't necessarily translate as well into your new reality as you thought it would.

1/2 of the WSO Bash Brothers
"Licensed to Ill It"
We all know Bro J did it...

M Friedman's picture

As Bruce Wasserstein said

(King Kong, 1,007
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 1:44pm

See my WSO blogs here.

rufiolove's picture

smalleights: +1, truer words

IB
(Neanderthal, 3,412
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 1:47pm

1/2 of the WSO Bash Brothers
"Licensed to Ill It"
We all know Bro J did it...

go.with.the.flow's picture

What the fuck are you guys

EN
(King Kong, 1,109
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 1:56pm

|| But feeling good and enjoying life are prerequisites to success, not by products of it- Midas Mulligan Magoo ||

GoodBread's picture

Great post.

AM
(Neanderthal, 3,604
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 1:59pm

Financial Modeling Training
Guide to Finance Interviews

IlliniProgrammer's picture

+1 to everything rufio and

ST
(Almost Human, 9,244
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:07pm

Work hard, play hard.

metrovestments's picture

DAAAAAMN

VC
(Baboon, 109
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:11pm

Life is not a "brief candle." It is a splendid torch that I want to make burn as brightly as possible before handing it on to future generations

MBAApply's picture

I don't see any of this

EN
(King Kong, 1,008
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:17pm

Alex Chu
www.mbaapply.com

Anacott_CEO's picture

Perfectly said.

CF
(King Kong, 1,259
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:26pm
Nefarious-'s picture

IlliniProgrammer: I think

CF
(Neanderthal, 2,216
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:29pm

You're born, you take shit. You get out in the world, you take more shit. You climb a little higher, you take less shit. Till one day you're up in the rarefied atmosphere and you've forgotten what shit even looks like. Welcome to the layer cake, son.

West Coast rainmaker's picture

Good points. The reasons you

ER
(Neanderthal, 2,092
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:30pm
IlliniProgrammer's picture

Nefarious-: IlliniProgramme

ST
(Almost Human, 9,244
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:35pm

Work hard, play hard.

justin88's picture

IlliniProgrammer: the

HF
(Gorilla, 585
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:45pm
TechBanking's picture

Maybe this is less aimed at

EN
(King Kong, 1,120
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:48pm
yhp2009's picture

I don't see why there is so

 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:53pm
Human's picture

TechBanking: I was hoping to

PE
(King Kong, 1,891
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:54pm

"I am the hero of the story. I don't need to be saved."

IlliniProgrammer's picture

dabanobo: Looking at Gini on

ST
(Almost Human, 9,244
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:55pm

Work hard, play hard.

TechBanking's picture

rufiolove: ...when you miss a

EN
(King Kong, 1,120
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 2:55pm
bulge_bracket's picture

IlliniProgrammer: We'll all

(Orangutan, 258
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:01pm
swagon's picture

Nefarious-: WSO, it is time

EN
(Neanderthal, 2,973
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:19pm
djfiii's picture

swagon: Nefarious-: WSO, it

 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:28pm
Nefarious-'s picture

swagon: My record label is

CF
(Neanderthal, 2,216
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:29pm

You're born, you take shit. You get out in the world, you take more shit. You climb a little higher, you take less shit. Till one day you're up in the rarefied atmosphere and you've forgotten what shit even looks like. Welcome to the layer cake, son.

Faddy's picture

that's not at all the point

(Baboon, 112
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:32pm
justin88's picture

IlliniProgrammer: Sure, but

HF
(Gorilla, 585
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:37pm
swagon's picture

Faddy: If you are miserable

EN
(Neanderthal, 2,973
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:40pm
rufiolove's picture

TechBanking: rufiolove: ...

IB
(Neanderthal, 3,412
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:43pm

1/2 of the WSO Bash Brothers
"Licensed to Ill It"
We all know Bro J did it...

bulge_bracket's picture

Faddy: that's not at all the

(Orangutan, 258
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:49pm
SonnyZH's picture

Amazing post. + SB.

HF
(King Kong, 1,003
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 3:52pm

The HBS guys have MAD SWAGGER. They frequently wear their class jackets to boston bars, strutting and acting like they own the joint. They just ooze success, confidence, swagger, basically attributes of alpha males.

Human's picture

I understand that investment

PE
(King Kong, 1,891
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 4:14pm

"I am the hero of the story. I don't need to be saved."

IlliniProgrammer's picture

dabanobo: If that has any

ST
(Almost Human, 9,244
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 4:43pm

Work hard, play hard.

Kenny_Powers_CFA's picture

*Golf clap*

HF
(Neanderthal, 2,194
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 5:32pm

There have been many great comebacks throughout history. Jesus was dead but then came back as an all-powerful God-Zombie.

kmess024's picture

+1

EN
(Orangutan, 312
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 6:50pm

The Four E's of investment
"The greatest Enemies of the Equity investor are Expenses and Emotions."- Warren Buffet

melvvvar's picture

Nefarious-: IlliniProgramme

(King Kong, 1,693
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 7:31pm
MoneyTalksMonkeysWalk's picture

your mid to late 20s are

(Monkey, 43
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 7:44pm
analyst-therapist's picture

So you don't work in "high

IB
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 8:11pm
jpmoranmonkeysachs's picture

Ok guys calm the F down.

(Baboon, 149
 
Points)
 on 5/1/12 at 8:27pm

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