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Can I still make it into banking? At what point do I give up? Please advise...

TheBlueCheese's picture
IB
(Baboon, 157
 
Points)
 on 5/16/13 at 8:23pm
giving up.jpg

Hi everyone,

I apologize in advance for how lengthy this post might end up. WSO has been very helpful to me the past several years in pursuing my passion for a career in finance, specifically investment banking at the analyst level. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to quite secure that FT offer following graduation (just graduated) and I was hoping to get some candid advice here.

Long story short: Complete non-target, but very good credentials all-around - graduated Magna Cum Laude, had an internship at the completion of every college year, including an IB internship during a winter and a boutique IB internship this past summer. I was heavily involved in school, and my resume screams leadership and passion for finance/IB, and demonstrated success wherever I've gone.

Passive Investment Ideas

kalga's picture
IB
 
Points)
 on 5/15/13 at 1:02am

After a year in IB, I've managed to save up about $75,000 (plus a little from when I worked in university). Eventually its going to go into a down payment for a house (after my analyst stint) but in the meantime, I'd like to invest it. Any good ideas outside the standard ETFs? Passive strategies are preferred given the limited amount of time I have to research companies.

Emerging Markets Investment Guide

Kato's picture
(Baboon, 161
 
Points)
 on 5/2/13 at 6:27am
1361904350_what-would-ben-graham-do-now-a-new-value-investing-playbook-for-a-global-age.jpg

Editor Note: This is meant to be a live and ongoing discussion and resource for anyone seriously considering investing abroad. Any questions whatsoever about living abroad, value investing, China, and cross-border private equity- shoot away.

Hi guys, I’m here today with a friend of mine, Dr. Jeff Towson. Dr. Towson currently runs the Towson Group, a boutique private equity group, and is also Professor of Investment at Peking University in China. Instead of working on Wall Street, he developed expertise in cross-border investing as head of Direct Investments for Prince Alwaleed of Saudi Arabia.

He has also published several books and articles on investing, the most recent being “What Would Ben Graham Do?”, an Amazon #1 best-selling book on emerging markets investing. He is currently writing another book on China with Jonathan Woetzel, of McKinsey’s Shanghai office. His writing can be found at www.jefftowson.com. In his own words:

Q1: I noticed Blackstone recently announced a $300 million scholarship for Tsinghua University and seems to have long-term ambitions win China. From your view, how well are foreign private equity firms doing in China?

Leaving Banking. Fold.

anonymousman's picture
IB
 
Points)
 on 4/28/13 at 7:08pm
Stephen Ridley Fold

When I was in banking, I lost nearly £17,000 spread betting on the Goldman Sachs SEC trial. I lost another gut wrenching chunk of money in Vegas playing poker with the big boys. Sucks right? But "life is long, I'll win it back".

And so I went on, and yes, from time to time I also made healthy profits spread betting and gambling, if ever there was a difference. From time to time, I still dabble. The truth is I'd been gambling all the way through my late teens and through university, in fact more than half the draw to banking was the 'make a fast buck' appeal of it. The rush of free money, of free surplus, of sudden rockstar freedom.

The Golden Rule? Thoughts on gold as an investment

Aswath Damodaran's picture
(Gorilla, 579
 
Points)
 on 4/23/13 at 10:30am
gold.jpg

Paraphrasing Winston Churchill, gold is a "riddle, wrapped up in a mystery inside an enigma", at least as far as I am concerned. I don't understand what moves the gold price and I have never held gold in my portfolio. That does not mean, however, that I am not fascinated by the price of gold and immune from its movements. That was brought home last week, when the price of gold dropped by 9% on April 15, 2013, the biggest one day drop in thirty years. Not only did the prices of other precious metals (silver dropped 12%) and industrial metals drop, but stock prices took a tumble as well. While the attention has focused on the price drop in recent days, gold has had a good run over the last decade.

Internship at brokerage firm beneficial?

wallstreetstudent's picture
(Chimp, 12
 
Points)
 on 4/1/13 at 10:14pm

I'm interested in investment banking and was wondering if an internship at an online brokerage company (relatively well known) would be beneficial for my post freshman, rising sophomore summer. Or would PWM be better?

What's your opinion WSO...

TheGuyWhoSignsIn's picture
(Chimp, 15
 
Points)
 on 3/29/13 at 3:16am

I've been ripping my hair out the past 6 months. I just started college in the fall 2012 and have been undecided between majoring in electrical/computer engineering vs majoring in finance. "But wait jon those are totally different" said everyone. I'm having problems deciding because well... I put myself in quite a pickle. Maybe I should start from the beginning here.

Interview with 'That Analyst that Joked about Starting His Own Fund'... and Actually Did It

tt1254's picture
HF
(Orangutan, 294
 
Points)
 on 4/1/13 at 3:30pm
fund.jpg

The following is an interview with tt1254, an analyst who quit and started his own fund. He is also available to answer your questions, ask away.

Are you a professional and want to do an interview? View our interview template here and then email me your responses to [email protected]

  1. Tell us a little bit about yourself:

    2. Recent graduate from undergrad who started an equity fund after a year or so in s&t at a bb. Was ultimate goal since second year of undergrad and having interned in m&a, s&t, pe, realized investing in public markets best fit. First stock buy was VV (same as SPY) on Sept 1st, 2008.

  2. What experience/class in school best prepared you to start your own fund?

    3. Econ 101 – less about supply/demand curves and more about incentives that drive human behavior. Psych 101 is a close second.

.

koopatroopa's picture
(Monkey, 33
 
Points)
 on 2/6/13 at 3:06am

.

I can't tell if this MD is "helping me" or not. Anyone?

TheBlueCheese's picture
IB
(Baboon, 157
 
Points)
 on 1/16/13 at 5:38pm

Hi guys,

Non-target junior here looking for a BB IB SA who has an influential connection at a BAML/DB/UBS/BARCAP with a title like Head of M&A / Global Head of XXX Group, etc. Needless to say, he's a big shot at the firm's investment bank.

Anyways, I contacted him today to just check in and to see if he's heard any news or updates on the recruiting front. He asked me for my resume about a month ago so I figure it's a good time to check in. He tells me that interviews will be tight for the summer and that I should hear back whether I got selected later this month. And then he asks me if I applied online and if I cast my net wide on other banks too.

**

JacquelineWann's picture
(Chimp, 5
 
Points)
 on 1/11/13 at 11:48am
panda

Hi monkeys

Funniest Stories - The Analyst Years

SanityCheck's picture
PE
(Gorilla, 633
 
Points)
 on 12/6/12 at 11:30pm
poo

Although working as an investment banking analyst was a living hell at the time, I now look back at my years with nostalgia. Luckily, as time passes, the 100 hour weeks just blend together and the pain has gone away. Of course, I'm still irrationally uncomfortable and nervous whenever I see a red blinking light (Blackberry email) but other than that, all I remember now are the fun times. The 5am nights when you finally get the pitch books binded and shipped to the MD's house and as you're waiting for the driver to call you and confirm that he delivered it, you're joking around with your associate/VP and realize that they're actually human beings too.

However, the best parts were the office gossip and hilarious stories that were shared among the analyst class. The best stories always came from the summer interns, which made sense because 20-21 year olds know absolutely nothing about anything (including common sense).

One of my favorite stories was a summer intern who had a bad case of diarrhea. Unfortunately for him, my BB was proud of their latest technology upgrade for the entire bullpen, the wireless headset (which of course is about 10 years behind the technology of any normal corporation).

Armed with this technology, he was able to piss off an entire deal team and probably single-handedly kill a deal.

Freshman Resume Work Experience and a situation...

xxkdjxx's picture
 
Points)
 on 11/26/12 at 8:39pm

Hi there :)

I'm currently a Freshman working on my resume because many firms in my area require it as well as some boot camps I am applying to.

However, I really don't have any relevant work experience to place on my resume. :(

I am currently involved in Finance related clubs like the Student Investment Club at my school, etc..

Could I include the clubs instead of work expericene, since I have none?

Also, I cold-called a PE firm in my hometown, and they said to call back in January, because they haven't started searching for interns as of yet. Is this possible? I thought firms started recruting earlier this month. Is this their way of telling me to fuck-off?

Thank you,
xxkdjxx.

So You Made It to Banking, Now What?

SanityCheck's picture
PE
(Gorilla, 633
 
Points)
 on 12/7/12 at 1:30pm
now what.jpg

Congratulations!!! You made it into investment banking. Of course early on you're excited and just want to spend 100+ hours in the office to impress everyone and get that top bucket bonus, but how do you really get the most mileage out of your 2 year stint in banking? For most, it's about exit ops and this is becoming more and more true as we see bonuses go down the shitter. Heck, a lot of my friends got paid less in their 2nd year than they did in their 1st year!

Now if you're looking to stay for the long haul, this post might not be so helpful. In that case, there really is no secret trick or tips. You simply need to be good, which means a strong work ethic, good technical/modeling skills, and a legitimate interest in chasing deals and closing them.

For the rest of you, there are some ways to set yourself up for an exit while not necessarily suffering the most. So here are some tips from a fellow ex-BB IBD analyst that you won't find in most employee handbooks:

1. Plan your exit ahead of time.

Why UBS Will Die

G.M.Trevelyan's picture
(Orangutan, 351
 
Points)
 on 11/8/12 at 5:30am
UBS_Bank3.jpg

One common criticism I hear on the street is UBS, the U've Been Sacked bank, or Ultra Bullshit Shit bank has a poor reputation. Either through routinely failing institutional clients by wiring money incorrectly to a counter-party while they're in the middle of a lawsuit. Or finding their contracts don't mean very much when the words 'capped-fees' is just there to charm, it's misnomer in Swiss-German that means it's uncapped; a kind of screw you get out clause.

But the bank is also known for the billions they've put into R&D in dark pools, brokerage, the sheer numbers of starts-up in their rather activist, but also interesting, long-term investment strategy.

PwC WFP Advisory vs. Wells Fargo Abbot Downing

FirstTimeMonkey's picture
(Monkey, 33
 
Points)
 on 10/31/12 at 10:49pm

I was wondering if anyone could comment on the following positions:

PwC - WFP Advisory

Wells Fargo Abbot Downing - Investment Analyst

I am a senior and I am in between these two positions. My goal is M7 MBA school so I guess I am asking which position will better set me up for that? I have great leadership experience and a 4.0 GPA. So really it comes down to which position will enhance my MBA chances.

I was thinking PwC, but then again Abbot Downing is the elite arm of Wells Fargo so I am really stuck here.

These are my only two options as my school has poor recruiting. Any comment is appreciated.

First gig in REPE, need advice

CatWithaHat's picture
PE
(Monkey, 35
 
Points)
 on 10/30/12 at 7:51pm

Hi everybody,

Just started in PE

Do you guys know Private Equity Intelligence (which unfortunately is costly)? And are there any quality source that is just great to learn and get the pulse of the industry, blogs etc?

Any word of advice on my current situation would be really appreciated!

Charles

How do transfer from banking (retail) to consulting

Peeather's picture
AM
(Monkey, 53
 
Points)
 on 10/22/12 at 7:23pm
Consulting

Hey guys,

Long time lurker, first time poster.I am having an interview tomorrow regarding a consulting position and was wondering what would be the best way to sell myself and convince the people in consulting that this is what I want to do as a career. I know they will try and break me and tell me banking should be a promising career as well..

All i can think of are the generic questions: get hands on experience by working on special projects, work with highly intelligent and motivated people...

I dont think its gonna cut it..

Any helpers?

Cheers,

Best Investing Resources and Tips

elijahhampton38's picture
IA
(Chimp, 2
 
Points)
 on 10/20/12 at 6:10am

So where can you go and who can you talk to without getting caught in a hidden agenda? Well here’s a list of a few resources I’ve uncovered through the years that have helped in my financial understanding.

General Information

For starters, if you’re looking for basic information on stocks and bonds, you’ll find it hard to get a better resource than Investopedia. This site has a wealth of information that’s all free and available to the public. Since the site is very robust, it’s likely it can answer almost any financial investing questions you might have.

Simulation Investing

How can I get into IBanking

FirstTimeMonkey's picture
(Monkey, 33
 
Points)
 on 10/3/12 at 1:33pm

I have spent about 30 hours on this site and I have seen plenty of discussions about how to get into ibanking and how to be a superstar at target schools etc.

I am starting this thread and asking this question because I haven't seen people like me get a decent answer from anyone on this forum. This is a more personalized question and I think people who are in my situation will like learning about what they can do to improve.

Yes I've used the search function: Any banks still hiring?

TheBlueCheese's picture
IB
(Baboon, 157
 
Points)
 on 9/27/12 at 1:00am
banks hiring.jpg

Non target senior here- very strong resume and a strong network. I've had my resume passed on to HR by VPs and Associates of BBs and MMs but I haven't had much luck... my contacts (who aren't really involved with recruiting) are telling me that HR is giving them mixed signals.

Does anyone who are involved in recruiting and/or actually work at these firms know if companies are still looking to fill spots? I know (or pretty sure I know) that JPM, BAML, and DB are completely full; Houlihan Lokey, William Blair, Piper Jaffray, Oppenheimer, Raymond James, etc - pretty much all full.

I'm hoping I have some luck with say, a Credit Suisse or Barclays....anyone know?

Racism at Banks

Upenn99's picture
 
Points)
 on 9/25/12 at 12:00am

I was recently interviewing for an entry level analyst position through on-campus recruiting and felt like couple firms were profiling due to my race. As i digged a little deeper, i realized that some of the boutiques (Greenhill, GCA Savvian, Evercore, and Moelis) hardly had any blacks, indians and asians. Is this a common theme for the firms mentioned above?

National Bank - Rotational Program

pitbul13's picture
 
Points)
 on 9/21/12 at 9:12pm

Anyone here get a first round interview for National Bank of Canada rotational program? Did you make it to second round in Toronto?

Calls were supposed to go out today...

BAML Accelerated Superday September 7th - Anyone hear back yet?

DCmoney's picture
(Monkey, 46
 
Points)
 on 9/16/12 at 7:54pm

Has anyone who attended the accelerated superday on Friday, September 7th heard back yet? HR told us we'd hear back this week but I have no news...

I know most outsiders will assume that if people don't hear back within 48hrs it means rejection. But I don't see that being the exact case here...

Anyways, anyone hear back yet? Acceptance / Rejection / On-Hold / Anything?

Assessing Performance…again

prashantkhorana's picture
CF
(Baboon, 146
 
Points)
 on 9/9/12 at 7:00pm
performance.jpg

What are the key metrics for assessing performance for investing?
• A record spanning a large number of years
• A window that includes a good, bad, average year
• A benchmark against which success can be measured
Let’s quickly look at Penn’s endowment fund and a few lessons learned from its management. This is a little outdated, but still relevant. As Mark Twain said –‘history doesn’t repeat itself, but it sure does rhyme’.
John Neff led Penn’s endowment for roughly two decades starting late 1970’s and he was a respected investor of that era and was known for his adherence to value investing. The fund outperformed for the most part of his tenure.
But during the 1995-1997 era, the fund lagged most of its peers and during the 2000 era, the fund lagged even more because of its non-exposure to tech / venture capital.

Answering technicals in interview: Confidence / Humble?

TheBlueCheese's picture
IB
(Baboon, 157
 
Points)
 on 9/2/12 at 2:14pm
question-mark-clip-art-010.jpg

I think most people on this forum will say to answer questions confidently in your interviews. But let's say the interviewer asks "do you know this XXX accounting/finance concept?"

What's the best approach to handle this kind of situation? You want to sound confident you know your stuff but not so confident that they feel they can start grilling you. How do you keep calm and cool while maintaining confidence but admitting you probably don't know everything (does that show 'lack of confidence')??

What can I invest in with just £600........

Gold_man_zak's picture
 
Points)
 on 7/28/12 at 12:44pm

Thanks...I'm 19 ...going to second year of university

What's it like in the South? Culture wise?

TheBlueCheese's picture
IB
(Baboon, 157
 
Points)
 on 7/15/12 at 8:47pm

I'm currently an SA at a boutique IB firm who's summered in NYC the past two summers; lived in NJ for a long time before settling in different a suburb of a metropolitan area the past 10 yrs or so (permanent home).

I've always had this idea NYC or bust, and while I still have that for the couple few years after finishing school I've started having different outlooks. I met some true southern people over the summer and it got me thinking again what if I moved to somewhere in the south in the future? Somewhere like a Texas?

Besides the obvious stereotypes, what is your opinion on the Southern parts of the US? I've lived in the east coast, well developed parts all my life. What drastic changes might I face? Also, will me being non-Caucasian hurt me in some ways? (serious question)

Lots of applications, absolutely no interviews.

SymphonyBanker's picture
(Baboon, 113
 
Points)
 on 6/29/12 at 10:26am

Hey everyone,

I'm a recent graduate from a semi-target (BBs recuit for back office here... sometimes.) My biggest weakness is a lack of an IB internship while in college. I've been networking as much as I can for half a year now and applying online. I’ve had a LOT of networking calls, all through alumni and referrals, but most have concluded with one of three things:

1. “This is an awful time for the industry.”
2. "I’m not really sure what to tell you, we mostly hire from interns”
3. “You’re doing all the right things… just keep talking to people.”