How diversified is your life?

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Hayek - Certified Professional
Rank: King Kong | banana points 1,153

Mod Note: Throwback Thursday: this post originally went up on 08/13/13

Reaching for that golden ring of career success, as most of the monkeys here are trying to do, can have significant costs. Some are obvious: preparing for interviews, networking, and getting top grades in college take time away from drinking and fornicating. And once you start working, you'll likely need to deal with unreasonable bosses combined with an expanding waistline from too much SeamlessWeb and not enough time in the gym.

There are also some more subtle costs that come from placing as much emphasis on your career as we tend to here. After all, what happens when you get your dream job...and 6-months in realize you despise it? What if you've done everything you can to transition from IB to PE but managed to fail miserably? A number of posts over the years have centered on these very questions as many monkeys begin to experience their first career troubles and late-20's existential crises.

I think that people that post on this board are uniquely susceptible to taking these sorts of job difficulties very personally. This is because we tend to be poorly diversified in terms of things that we derive intense satisfaction from. Our emotional portfolio is overweight in career advancement.
The great James Altucher has a wonderful post where he discusses how to diversify your life to be more creative and successful. I decided to adapt his basic concept to suggest 4 ways that you can more readily withstand the bumps that will inevitably come up on the road of your career:

1. Sustain your friendships and develop new ones.

It's generally not hard to find people to go drinking with after work, but it's usually more difficult to replicate the sort of close friendships that you develop in college. The best way to try and cultivate these sorts of close, post-college friendships is to find people with whom you share strong similar interests, or are working together with towards a common goal. Sports leagues (kickball doesn't count), volunteering, and church/religious organizations are some of the best ways to do this. It will require a larger investment of time and energy, but should pay greater dividends than relying on going drinking all the time. You may need to try a few things before finding something that sticks, but it will be worth it.
Don't forget to tend to and cultivate the friendships you do have. Trust me, they can whither away and die otherwise. Make an effort to visit people that live on the other side of the country, and stay in touch with acquaintances from college: you never know when your paths will cross.

2. Develop specialized skills outside of work.

It doesn't even need to be with the goal of developing a side income stream (though that's not a bad idea). But doing some combination of the following can increase your career "surface area" by exposing you to other people, problems, and ways or working. This in turn can lead to other opportunities down the road, as well as valuable connections.
First, you can look into pro-bono projects that utilize your technical skills: Taproot is one resource. Also: everyone uses Excel, but how many people use it as effectively as a typical consulting/finance monkey? Not many, I'd guess. There must be opportunities out there. A few years ago I was a volunteer tax preparer, helping to complete tax returns for low-income people. It was a great experience and also made me much more thankful for the advantages that I have in life.
Writing is great too. Good communication skills are needed everywhere, and not many people have them. Write for WSO (!), Seeking Alpha, or just start your own blog. Forcing yourself to come up with something every week can help to get your creative juices flowing.

3. Read widely.

Fiction, self-help, philosophy...you've probably read enough books about the financial crisis and things in the Liar's Poker / Monkey Business genre of finance books. Read as widely as possible, and you may be surprised to see what you learn about yourself.

4. Ask yourself what you would do if you lost your job now.

You'd probably bounce back sooner than you think.

I'll close with a quote from James Altucher, in his original article:

When properly diversfied, nobody can say "no" to you anymore. Disappointments and failures become a natural part of life that you learn from, in the same way you learn from success and opportunity. Intelligence springs forward from the additional creativity. Love comes from the most blossoming part of the social tree you build for yourself.

Monkeys, what do you say? Do you think that your job has sapped your creativity? Are you too dependent on it for your sense of fulfillment? What makes the rough parts easier to bear?

related discussion: http://www.forbes.com/sites/ehrlichfu/2013/08/15/w... by Thomas Ehrlich

Comments (112)

Aug 13, 2013

If I had a SB I'd give it to you.

#1 was key for me. I was so bad at it, and at a wedding all of my boys from highschool called me out. All of my close old friends are out of town and scattered throughout the world and my family grew up far away from relatives so long distance relationships were normal to me. It didn't feel natural to call another guy up every couple weeks and shoot the shit for a half hour. Anyhow, now I do that and honestly I'm a lot happier because of it.

    • 1
Aug 13, 2013

I have always said it is better to be a jack of all trades than a master of one. Of course, the only exception to this rule should come if you own your own business. In which case, you would want to be putting out the best product you could possibly put out in that field.

Also, to go back and reference your notes about your twenties: I am of the opinion that your twenties (read: 22-29) are the most difficult and challenging years you will face in your life.

    • 1
Dec 11, 2014
Nefarious-:

... Also, to go back and reference your notes about your twenties: I am of the opinion that your twenties (read: 22-29) are the most difficult and challenging years you will face in your life.

true... they are also the critical years that will make or break you..

Aug 13, 2013
Hayek:

Sports leagues (kickball doesn't count), volunteering, and church/religious organizations are some of the best ways to do this.

Just curious: Why doesn't kickball count?

Aug 13, 2013

SB'd, good stuff. Its tough to decide to spend time to 'diversify' when investing all your time doing things you hope will improve your focused career track, but it definitely has its benefits.

Aug 13, 2013

+1 SB. Great post.
One recommendation I have to keep in touch with old college/high school/former work colleagues is keep a running fantasy league with them together. Also, definitely do a live draft (for a number of reasons) but it at least forces you to get together once per year. If fantasy football isn't your thing, find some variation of that. My friends and I have people that are now spread all over the country but they still dial into the draft to hear the goings on and always makes for a great day to shoot the shit and catch up.

Aug 13, 2013

Man I hate titles like this one but all in all great post.

"Don't quit. Suffer now and live the rest of your life as a Champion" - Muhammad Ali

Aug 13, 2013

I remember this article from James, it was a great read! Midas Mulligan Magoo aggressively urged the monkeys of WSO to have a hobby (his was fingerpainting).

And mine, of course, is going to concerts and building Head of Metal!

Metal. Music. Life. www.headofmetal.com

    • 1
Aug 13, 2013

Great post, +1

I would agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

Aug 13, 2013
In The Flesh:

I remember this article from James, it was a great read! Midas Mulligan Magoo aggressively urged the monkeys of WSO to have a hobby (his was fingerpainting).

And mine, of course, is going to concerts and building Head of Metal!

Whatever happened to that guy?

Aug 13, 2013

No clue. I do wish he'd return though.

Metal. Music. Life. www.headofmetal.com

Sep 12, 2013
Nefarious-:
In The Flesh:

I remember this article from James, it was a great read! Midas Mulligan Magoo aggressively urged the monkeys of WSO to have a hobby (his was fingerpainting).

And mine, of course, is going to concerts and building Head of Metal!

Whatever happened to that guy?

He got really into the 60s and no one ever saw him again.

Follow the shit your fellow monkeys say @shitWSOsays

Life is hard, it's even harder when you're stupid - John Wayne

Aug 13, 2013

Great post! Really valid points, will definitely keep them in mind.

It's hip to be square!

Aug 13, 2013

Awesome post, and very timely as someone just getting into the work force.

Aug 13, 2013

Wish I could SB, 10 times.

Stop giving out such valuable advice, you're flattening the competitive landscape! :) :) :)

Aug 13, 2013

Great post! You do need something outside of your job or schoolwork. Not talking about something to do just for leisure but that one thing you are passionate about and really good at or want to be good at. It gives life a different color.

Aug 13, 2013

Awesome post. Gave you a SB. The first point regarding close-knit friends is on point. I can go out with work buddies and get drunk any given Friday or Saturday, but it doesn't compare to just hanging with old college buddies. Making high quality friends is considerably more difficult and much more time-consuming in the real world, especially in Consulting.

Aug 14, 2013
Nefarious-:
In The Flesh:

I remember this article from James, it was a great read! Midas Mulligan Magoo aggressively urged the monkeys of WSO to have a hobby (his was fingerpainting).

And mine, of course, is going to concerts and building Head of Metal!

Whatever happened to that guy?

Yeah, where did Midas go?

Aug 13, 2013

If you can see Midas Mulligan Magoo, he can see you. If you can't see Midas Mulligan Magoo, you may be only seconds away from death.

Metal. Music. Life. www.headofmetal.com

    • 1
Aug 14, 2013

I'm the worst at keeping in touch, and I have close friends throughout the country. When I talk to these friends it is usually the best day of the week though. Lately I've been trying to stay in better touch with them and my family, family is 1500 miles away. Life feel much better.

Aug 14, 2013
In The Flesh:

Midas Mulligan Magoo aggressively urged the monkeys of WSO to have a hobby (his was fingerpainting).

lol seriously?

WSO's COO (Chief Operating Orangutan) | My Linkedin

Aug 13, 2013

Yup, pretty sure it's still here if you search...

Metal. Music. Life. www.headofmetal.com

Best Response
Aug 15, 2013
Hayek:

I think that people that post on this board are uniquely susceptible to taking these sorts of job difficulties very personally. This is because we tend to be poorly diversified in terms of things that we derive intense satisfaction from. Our emotional portfolio is overweight in career advancement.

The great James Altucher has a wonderful post where he discusses how to diversify your life to be more creative and successful. I decided to adapt his basic concept to suggest 4 ways that you can more readily withstand the bumps that will inevitably come up on the road of your career:

1. Sustain your friendships and develop new ones.

2. Develop specialized skills outside of work.

3. Read widely.

4. Ask yourself what you would do if you lost your job now.

You'd probably bounce back sooner than you think.

I kept clicking on the light blue Bananas icon and it looks like I'm only allowed to give you 1 SB.

The paragraph I quoted could not have said it better -- most of us spent the majority of our free time outside classes/homework for recruiting at least for the latter half of our college careers, just to get the job.
It's only natural to continue the overweight focus on career advancement, and it is an absolutely MISERABLE experience to realize that the real world isn't so clear cut with the next steps like a recruiting season in school.

I really wish I had this post when I just came out of college years ago, and could not agree more with all 4 points above. Since I'm an old fart, I actually figured out myself to follow more or less the exact list, but after learning about their importance the hard way.

Wanted to elaborate on #1: I've worked for 3 years and met all kinds of people in the city... but you will rarely find close friends after college especially if you work in this industry. I never even worked IBD hours and I can say I havent made a single close friend out of the people I met after I moved to the city. I actually do a lot socially after year 1...
So MAKE TIME for your old friends. I don't care if it's facebook chat or skype or phone (i know it's weird especially for guys).. KEEP in touch somehow. The emptiness of your 'friendship' with your drinking/models/bottles buddies will become obvious just when you hit the rough patch bout 3mo-6mo into year one.. and it is NOT pretty if you are also losing old close friends on the other end. I made this mistake myself.
Remember everyone will 'understand' your long hours (as an excuse to not be there).. but your friends with 9-5 hours will go on to meet up without you. If you don't make yourself show up at least once in a while, you'll be left behind. A combination of feeling friendless and a rough patch at work is absolutely toxic.

    • 2
Aug 18, 2013

how do you guys manage to stay in touch with high school and college buddies when you work all over the country? i have a running facebook thread going with about 10 high school friends but it isnt really enough to keep in touch. do you plan a meetup somewhere (old high school or college) every few months or something?

Aug 15, 2013
ChrisHansen:

how do you guys manage to stay in touch with high school and college buddies when you work all over the country? i have a running facebook thread going with about 10 high school friends but it isnt really enough to keep in touch. do you plan a meetup somewhere (old high school or college) every few months or something?

i dont think most people i know do much more than a running fbook thread... when everyone goes home for the holidays, try to meet up for at least 1 night.. that helps a lot

Aug 25, 2013
ChrisHansen:

how do you guys manage to stay in touch with high school and college buddies when you work all over the country? i have a running facebook thread going with about 10 high school friends but it isnt really enough to keep in touch. do you plan a meetup somewhere (old high school or college) every few months or something?

Try to go home at least once a year and plan a dinner/drinks to catch up with them (especially if they're still located in your original city/town).

I also just send texts/emails.

Dec 11, 2014

our crew gets back together for music festivals a couple times a year. it allows you to travel new places, reunite with old friends and also meet new ones.

Aug 20, 2013

+1 SB. Good work.

Aug 27, 2013

In terms of keeping in touch with high school friends, I started a Fantasy Baseball league with 9 of my buddies from high school. We've had this league since 6th grade actually, and we've kept 7/10 original members in tact over the past 10 years. This is a great excuse to bring everyone together at least once a year, and we keep in touch for draft and various other baseball talk. It's been hugely beneficial to me and if you can get enough guys, becomes a great way to do it. We have plans to go to Vegas for a draft, and we did an Atlantic City trip last year and it was great.

Also, OP great post. Really enjoyed it. +1

Sep 12, 2013

+1 this stuff matters a lot

Sep 12, 2013

My hobby is painting. I kid you not. I do oil on canvas/wood. Was a little self-conscious about it since it's not that masculine .... but the chick I'm FWB with digs it!

Sep 12, 2013

Agree with the reading diverse materials. Avidly read finance books in college and now realize how one dimensional that is. The only reading I do in regards to finance is educational/instructional; onto bigger and better things in my spare time!

Sep 12, 2013

Great post and make you look back. Thanks for posting this!

Sep 13, 2013

Great post. Thanks.

Sep 13, 2013

Totally agree on all of this. SB to you. I still sometimes think about the money I've given up to pursue another option in same industry, but I don't regret it at all. I might not get close to those numbers for a long time, but I'm way happier and my personal life has reflected that. I've become more creative, more interesting and interested, and just a nicer and more present person all together.

Thought of continuing CFA and decided against it, better to focus on career and then spend your free time learning and actually doing all this other great stuff life has to offer. It's amazing the things you'll find interesting and like doing once you stop worrying so much about "finance" and career and learn to enjoy the process instead.

This ties into one of the bonus bananas articles where the founder of Samuel Adams said:
"I remind people getting rich is life's great booby prize. Any normal person would much rather be happy than rich." He also mentioned that rarely will an entreprenuerial venture make you rich, so it should be something that makes you happy (ie he had a passion for brewing beer).

All in all, my mindset has been shifting significantly to worry less about career and money and much more about being well rounded and appreciating everything else life has to offer...

Sep 15, 2013

Great post, thanks for this!

Sep 18, 2013

I wish you had posted this back during my college days. Great post! SB.

Sep 18, 2013

...

Sep 19, 2013

I personally recommend to participate in religious activities. You will learn how to live an invaluable life vs seeking pleasure lol

Sep 20, 2013

Good post, thanks.

Oct 5, 2013

thank you so much for posting this. i wish i had more nanners to give.

If we blame others for our failure then we should also give them credit for our successes.

Dec 31, 2013

Great post!

I'm bi-winning. I win here, and I win there.

Dec 11, 2014

Hi, good post, thank you.
But, what is the best website to learn excel ?

Dec 11, 2014

Definitely like the idea of broader reading. I've been working on that lately as well. Currently reading Crime and Punishment (Dostoyevsky) rather than my usual investing books.

Dec 13, 2014

Sadly this is all so true. I'm in the process of getting married, and realized I don't really have anyone who I would consider a best man anymore....a big depressing really.

I'm talking about liquid. Rich enough to have your own jet. Rich enough not to waste time. Fifty, a hundred million dollars, buddy. A player. Or nothing.

Dec 13, 2014

This is a great article, and what makes it even more powerful is that even though the aim is to do the above mentioned things to help you deal with difficulties in our professional lives, doing the same things will actually make you much more successful on the professional front as well.

Because this board is concentrated with people at the junior level who tend to lack client-facing/business development responsibilities at their current role, the posters here often don't know that being a real "rainmaker" requires people skills that are entirely different from the the technical skills needed to succeed when first starting out.

Think about it, who will an executive at a prospective company rather talk to? The MD who's got funny stories from the weekend trip he just had with his buddies, or the MD who spends all of his time talking markets and little else? Not only that, the more involved you are with extracurricular activities (sports, church, social organization, etc.), the more likely you'll encounter those "chance" occurrences where you run into/are introduced to someone who needs your skills to solve a problem.

I'll leave everyone with a quote from Siegmund Warburg, a co-founder of S.G. Warburg and the individual responsible for the establishment of the EuroBond market, "'First make a person your friend and then become his banker."

Dec 14, 2014

Well-laid out points. Good post!

Dec 17, 2014

Enjoyed the post! However, with the long working hours and required flexibility I suspect getting real face-time with friends can be difficult.

Dec 17, 2014

Enjoyed the post! However, with the long working hours and required flexibility I suspect getting real face-time with friends can be difficult.

Dec 11, 2014

Thanks for the kind words everyone...I don't read WSO too often these days but recently logged in and was surprised to see my alerts/"silver bananas" blowing up...happy new year to you all, glad that so many of you found this useful.

Dec 26, 2014

Indians/Asians aren't considered minorities in the affirmative action sense. From what I know it's only blacks/latinos/native americans.

Dec 26, 2014

Promoting diversity is racism. Allowing diversity is the only right thing to do;

I feel sorry for the competent minorities who earned their jobs, as their perceived status will be dragged down by the bunch of undeserving minorities that will be hired as a result of this.

I'm also more and more fed up with the entire diversity culture - I refuse to feel guilty for being a white, educated, ambitious and anarcho-capitalistic individual with a low time preference and a sound understanding of economic and political philosophy.

Why aren't Asians minorities? They suffered too you know. Maybe it's because they have a culture that promotes honesty and hard work and couldn't care less about bling bling and being the coolest kid in town?

Dec 26, 2014

Oh, I see. Well, then I suppose certain minorities (Asian/Indian/Mid Eastern) must be pretty overrepresented. It seems like a lot of the associates/analyst profiles online feature an Asian or Indian person. I haven't worked on the Street, but I would guess that quotas would hit them the hardest. By the way, for anyone that's in the know, I'd be curious what the demographics of a typical analyst/associate pool would look like. I've seen women put at 10-20%, but I've never seen any type of ethnic breakdown.

For Indians, I know a lot of them come from overseas and attend Ivy League MBA programs. So that may account for some level of overrepresentation. For Asians, lots of them at the undergrad level if good b schools and also, to a lesser extent, MBA programs..

Dec 26, 2014

Diversity programs are poison.

I know several Black/ Hispanic analysts who are all-stars. I also know diversity hires who are an embarrassment and were only hired for the color of their skin. Diversity analysts ruin it for ethnic analysts.

"Diversity" is crap, there is only merit which i blind to any color.

Dec 26, 2014

well to be fair, most of the financial institutions already have "quotas" and promote "diversity"- they just place minorities (the dumb ones who are just being hired b/c of their race, not merit) in crappy back office jobs where they can't break anything.

Dec 26, 2014
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:

well to be fair, most of the financial institutions already have "quotas" and promote "diversity"- they just place minorities (the dumb ones who are just being hired b/c of their race, not merit) in crappy back office jobs where they can't break anything.

+1

Dec 26, 2014

deleted for double post

Dec 26, 2014

Diversity in theory is great...

But in reality from what I've seen it's not that great at all

I grew up in a part of the country that's considered by many to be very "diverse"
So statistically it looked diverse, in reality what I ended up seeing in the cafeteria was that all the people of an ethnic group would generally sit with one another.

So you had your black table, your asian table, your hispanic table, etc. So yes my high school was "diverse" but the actual amount of interaction and intermingling between the different ethnic groups was relatively minimal.

Wall Street already has programs aiming for diversity hiring, bringing in underrepresented minorities to positions that may not be otherwise available to them. SEO is an example of this.

I am all up for diversity if it actually works. Who wouldn't benefit from being able to work with and interact with people with a different background from themselves? But the way it's implemented in reality unfortunately doesn't necessarily allow this to happen.

Dec 26, 2014

"Diversity" is such bullshit. I didn't get any "equal opportunity" to tryout for NCAA basketball. Nor was there any diversity in open auditions for Hollywood movies. Why the fuck are the few industries where Asians have an advantage due to their cultural background the ones that have quotas being set?

Dec 26, 2014

. double post

Dec 26, 2014

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_group
"A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society."

That definition fits Indian and Asians just as much as Black and Mexicans.

You know what I think is racist? Telling people who come from very poor countries (India and China), who cross an ocean and come to a country to make a better life, who study hard because it is their ticket out of poverty, who are model citizens, contributing to this wonderful country, becoming doctors and engineers, and saying to them that they are not minorities. Minorities in this country are just people with a significant bitching factor who this country has to continually help and benefit with no discernible change in fundamental behavior or class status.

Oh, thats right, I am white and I was born to oppress and deny people of color a good life. Let me clarify though because apparently I only oppress one color and not Indian brown or Asian yellow. I am basically a terminator, programmed to keep one specific color in poverty even though they have been citizens of this country and free for a long time now. Pretty funny how brown Indians can come over on a boat and be here for a year and be doing better than other people who have enjoyed the benefits and freedom of America forever now.

Yawn. You know why no one discusses the topic of race in this country? It is because no one gives a shit. I do me and you do you. Every company has "diversity" requirements. Every college has affirmative action. We are doing everything possible to make things equal.

My solution. Could we just fire 20% of the white people, evict them from their houses, take their cars and give them to minorities. I will happily live in a box for a couple weeks if that means I never have to hear anymore pissing and fucking moaning. My two year old niece doesn't bitch and moan as much as full grown adults.

Wait, I forgot, the CIA invented AIDS and crack cocaine. My bad.

Dec 26, 2014
Anthony .:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_group
"A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society."

That definition fits Indian and Asians just as much as Black and Mexicans.

You know what I think is racist? Telling people who come from very poor countries (India and China), who cross an ocean and come to a country to make a better life, who study hard because it is their ticket out of poverty, who are model citizens, contributing to this wonderful country, becoming doctors and engineers, and saying to them that they are not minorities. Minorities in this country are just people with a significant bitching factor who this country has to continually help and benefit with no discernible change in fundamental behavior or class status.

Oh, thats right, I am white and I was born to oppress and deny people of color a good life. Let me clarify though because apparently I only oppress one color and not Indian brown or Asian yellow. I am basically a terminator, programmed to keep one specific color in poverty even though they have been citizens of this country and free for a long time now. Pretty funny how brown Indians can come over on a boat and be here for a year and be doing better than other people who have enjoyed the benefits and freedom of America forever now.

Yawn. You know why no one discusses the topic of race in this country? It is because no one gives a shit. I do me and you do you. Every company has "diversity" requirements. Every college has affirmative action. We are doing everything possible to make things equal.

My solution. Could we just fire 20% of the white people, evict them from their houses, take their cars and give them to minorities. I will happily live in a box for a couple weeks if that means I never have to hear anymore pissing and fucking moaning. My two year old niece doesn't bitch and moan as much as full grown adults.

Wait, I forgot, the CIA invented AIDS and crack cocaine. My bad.

yo mamma so fat she wore a X on her t shirt and a helicopter tried to land on her

Dec 26, 2014
Anthony .:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_group
"A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society."

That definition fits Indian and Asians just as much as Black and Mexicans.

You know what I think is racist? Telling people who come from very poor countries (India and China), who cross an ocean and come to a country to make a better life, who study hard because it is their ticket out of poverty, who are model citizens, contributing to this wonderful country, becoming doctors and engineers, and saying to them that they are not minorities. Minorities in this country are just people with a significant bitching factor who this country has to continually help and benefit with no discernible change in fundamental behavior or class status.

Oh, thats right, I am white and I was born to oppress and deny people of color a good life. Let me clarify though because apparently I only oppress one color and not Indian brown or Asian yellow. I am basically a terminator, programmed to keep one specific color in poverty even though they have been citizens of this country and free for a long time now. Pretty funny how brown Indians can come over on a boat and be here for a year and be doing better than other people who have enjoyed the benefits and freedom of America forever now.

Yawn. You know why no one discusses the topic of race in this country? It is because no one gives a shit. I do me and you do you. Every company has "diversity" requirements. Every college has affirmative action. We are doing everything possible to make things equal.

My solution. Could we just fire 20% of the white people, evict them from their houses, take their cars and give them to minorities. I will happily live in a box for a couple weeks if that means I never have to hear anymore pissing and fucking moaning. My two year old niece doesn't bitch and moan as much as full grown adults.

Wait, I forgot, the CIA invented AIDS and crack cocaine. My bad.

You do realize that most of the Indians and Asians who come to the USA to study or work are from their respective countries' upper classes right? just b/c they look brown doesn't mean they were bathing in the river Ganges and eating cockroaches for supper back in India, fairly confident that no one from the "untouchable" caste is making it over here.

Furthermore, Asians and Indians for the very most part don't live under the poverty line in the USA, unlike the majority of blacks and hispanics. In fact, I would wager that the average Asian/Indian family in the USA earns more than the average white family. This is the reason that Asians/Indians are not treated as minorities for educational and employment purposes.

Finally, regarding standardized tests- inner city blacks and hispanics receive hands-down the worst education in the country. They have the worst teachers and the worst resources- not to mention the fact that their home life is inevitably unstable and full of drugs/violence/negative peer pressure. Do you think that if you had grown up in such an environment you would have been prepared to do well on the SAT? Wouldn't you think that 99 times out of a 100, the white/asian/indian middle-upper class kid is going to do better than you because he/she went to a good high school and his/her parents paid for an SAT tutor?

I'm not supporting affirmative action or making any statements, I'm just trying to point out that it is fairly silly to:
1)put asians/indians in the same group as blacks/hispanics for educational/employment purposes
2)think that blacks/hispanics don't have significant disadvantages concerning standardized testing

Dec 26, 2014
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:

You do realize that most of the Indians and Asians who come to the USA to study or work are from their respective countries' upper classes right? just b/c they look brown doesn't mean they were bathing in the river Ganges and eating cockroaches for supper back in India, fairly confident that no one from the "untouchable" caste is making it over here.

Furthermore, Asians and Indians for the very most part don't live under the poverty line in the USA, unlike the majority of blacks and hispanics. In fact, I would wager that the average Asian/Indian family in the USA earns more than the average white family. This is the reason that Asians/Indians are not treated as minorities for educational and employment purposes.

Finally, regarding standardized tests- inner city blacks and hispanics receive hands-down the worst education in the country. They have the worst teachers and the worst resources- not to mention the fact that their home life is inevitably unstable and full of drugs/violence/negative peer pressure. Do you think that if you had grown up in such an environment you would have been prepared to do well on the SAT? Wouldn't you think that 99 times out of a 100, the white/asian/indian middle-upper class kid is going to do better than you because he/she went to a good high school and his/her parents paid for an SAT tutor?

I'm not supporting affirmative action or making any statements, I'm just trying to point out that it is fairly silly to:
1)put asians/indians in the same group as blacks/hispanics for educational/employment purposes
2)think that blacks/hispanics don't have significant disadvantages concerning standardized testing

By the same vein, you do realize that those who benefit from affirmative action are not the African Americans from South Central LA or East Oakland, right? Think about it. When Harvard has to fill that 10% black quota in order to appear "diverse" do you think you would rather take that poor kid who will probably fail and will cost the university thousands in grants, or would they hire the kid from a middle class background who recently immigrated from Nigeria?

You are right to say that the successful Asians are from well do to backgrounds, but that is also true from the Africans that immigrated here in the past 30 years. They have the same cultural drive to do well at school, the same emphasis on education. The only difference is that with bullshit affirmative action policies, they get the "diversity" advantage which was meant to help kids from poor inner city schools. If you don't believe me, look at the following link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_immigration_t...
African immigrants have the highest educational level of all immigrants. Even higher than Indians and Asians. This is why I will never be in favor of any sort of "equality" measures

Dec 26, 2014
accountspayable:
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:

You do realize that most of the Indians and Asians who come to the USA to study or work are from their respective countries' upper classes right? just b/c they look brown doesn't mean they were bathing in the river Ganges and eating cockroaches for supper back in India, fairly confident that no one from the "untouchable" caste is making it over here.

Furthermore, Asians and Indians for the very most part don't live under the poverty line in the USA, unlike the majority of blacks and hispanics. In fact, I would wager that the average Asian/Indian family in the USA earns more than the average white family. This is the reason that Asians/Indians are not treated as minorities for educational and employment purposes.

Finally, regarding standardized tests- inner city blacks and hispanics receive hands-down the worst education in the country. They have the worst teachers and the worst resources- not to mention the fact that their home life is inevitably unstable and full of drugs/violence/negative peer pressure. Do you think that if you had grown up in such an environment you would have been prepared to do well on the SAT? Wouldn't you think that 99 times out of a 100, the white/asian/indian middle-upper class kid is going to do better than you because he/she went to a good high school and his/her parents paid for an SAT tutor?

I'm not supporting affirmative action or making any statements, I'm just trying to point out that it is fairly silly to:
1)put asians/indians in the same group as blacks/hispanics for educational/employment purposes
2)think that blacks/hispanics don't have significant disadvantages concerning standardized testing

By the same vein, you do realize that those who benefit from affirmative action are not the African Americans from South Central LA or East Oakland, right? Think about it. When Harvard has to fill that 10% black quota in order to appear "diverse" do you think you would rather take that poor kid who will probably fail and will cost the university thousands in grants, or would they hire the kid from a middle class background who recently immigrated from Nigeria?

You are right to say that the successful Asians are from well do to backgrounds, but that is also true from the Africans that immigrated here in the past 30 years. They have the same cultural drive to do well at school, the same emphasis on education. The only difference is that with bullshit affirmative action policies, they get the "diversity" advantage which was meant to help kids from poor inner city schools. If you don't believe me, look at the following link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_immigration_t...
African immigrants have the highest educational level of all immigrants. Even higher than Indians and Asians. This is why I will never be in favor of any sort of "equality" measures

interesting read about african immigration

i guess a counter argument could be that africans/blacks are historically/still under-represented at university, especially relative to indians/asians/whites, and therefore any initiative, even if not based on income, that is getting more blacks into top universities is a good thing. I guess the system has entirely given up on the blacks that grew up here lol- starting fresh with some new ones!

Dec 26, 2014
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:

i guess a counter argument could be that africans/blacks are historically/still under-represented at university, especially relative to indians/asians/whites, and therefore any initiative, even if not based on income, that is getting more blacks into top universities is a good thing.

I don't understand your argument here. If the historical African American kids looked up to the immigrants who came here with more opportunities and a culture of educational excellence as something they aspire to become through hard work, then yes, providing them benefits can help the overall black population. What we have in America is a perversion of this idolization. Instead of trying to emulate African immigrants, historical african americans are trying to integrate them into black culture.

The most obvious example of this is Barack Obama. There have been many polls posted where blacks are overwhelmingly in support of him no matter what wrong he has caused. At the same time, blacks don't take the correct message from his election. Rather than realizing the years of hard work and unique opportunities (a la affirmative action) that led to where Obama is, the NAACP like to present it as a story where a victim of dominant white oppression is able to rise up and take over. Rather than becoming integrated into the system, black would rather paint themselves as hopeless victims who others take advantage of.

Take the example of a bad inner city school. By having people place the causation of the failure of students on the institution, kids will never take any responsibility for their failures. No matter if they forgot to study or didn't write an essay on time, the source of the problem will be their upbringing, preventing any internal motivation to succeed. Until this victimization mindset will change, blacks will never be equally represented in the workplace by their own merits.

Dec 26, 2014
accountspayable:
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:

You do realize that most of the Indians and Asians who come to the USA to study or work are from their respective countries' upper classes right? just b/c they look brown doesn't mean they were bathing in the river Ganges and eating cockroaches for supper back in India, fairly confident that no one from the "untouchable" caste is making it over here.

Furthermore, Asians and Indians for the very most part don't live under the poverty line in the USA, unlike the majority of blacks and hispanics. In fact, I would wager that the average Asian/Indian family in the USA earns more than the average white family. This is the reason that Asians/Indians are not treated as minorities for educational and employment purposes.

Finally, regarding standardized tests- inner city blacks and hispanics receive hands-down the worst education in the country. They have the worst teachers and the worst resources- not to mention the fact that their home life is inevitably unstable and full of drugs/violence/negative peer pressure. Do you think that if you had grown up in such an environment you would have been prepared to do well on the SAT? Wouldn't you think that 99 times out of a 100, the white/asian/indian middle-upper class kid is going to do better than you because he/she went to a good high school and his/her parents paid for an SAT tutor?

I'm not supporting affirmative action or making any statements, I'm just trying to point out that it is fairly silly to:
1)put asians/indians in the same group as blacks/hispanics for educational/employment purposes
2)think that blacks/hispanics don't have significant disadvantages concerning standardized testing

By the same vein, you do realize that those who benefit from affirmative action are not the African Americans from South Central LA or East Oakland, right? Think about it. When Harvard has to fill that 10% black quota in order to appear "diverse" do you think you would rather take that poor kid who will probably fail and will cost the university thousands in grants, or would they hire the kid from a middle class background who recently immigrated from Nigeria?

You are right to say that the successful Asians are from well do to backgrounds, but that is also true from the Africans that immigrated here in the past 30 years. They have the same cultural drive to do well at school, the same emphasis on education. The only difference is that with bullshit affirmative action policies, they get the "diversity" advantage which was meant to help kids from poor inner city schools. If you don't believe me, look at the following link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_immigration_t...
African immigrants have the highest educational level of all immigrants. Even higher than Indians and Asians. This is why I will never be in favor of any sort of "equality" measures

You could not have said it any better, I am an immigrant from Nigeria and I am often selected before my African American friends are considered.

Dec 26, 2014
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:
Anthony .:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_group
"A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society."

That definition fits Indian and Asians just as much as Black and Mexicans.

You know what I think is racist? Telling people who come from very poor countries (India and China), who cross an ocean and come to a country to make a better life, who study hard because it is their ticket out of poverty, who are model citizens, contributing to this wonderful country, becoming doctors and engineers, and saying to them that they are not minorities. Minorities in this country are just people with a significant bitching factor who this country has to continually help and benefit with no discernible change in fundamental behavior or class status.

Oh, thats right, I am white and I was born to oppress and deny people of color a good life. Let me clarify though because apparently I only oppress one color and not Indian brown or Asian yellow. I am basically a terminator, programmed to keep one specific color in poverty even though they have been citizens of this country and free for a long time now. Pretty funny how brown Indians can come over on a boat and be here for a year and be doing better than other people who have enjoyed the benefits and freedom of America forever now.

Yawn. You know why no one discusses the topic of race in this country? It is because no one gives a shit. I do me and you do you. Every company has "diversity" requirements. Every college has affirmative action. We are doing everything possible to make things equal.

My solution. Could we just fire 20% of the white people, evict them from their houses, take their cars and give them to minorities. I will happily live in a box for a couple weeks if that means I never have to hear anymore pissing and fucking moaning. My two year old niece doesn't bitch and moan as much as full grown adults.

Wait, I forgot, the CIA invented AIDS and crack cocaine. My bad.

You do realize that most of the Indians and Asians who come to the USA to study or work are from their respective countries' upper classes right?

You have no idea what you are talking about. Stop talking out of your ass.

Dec 26, 2014
fhurricane:
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:
Anthony .:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_group
"A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society."

That definition fits Indian and Asians just as much as Black and Mexicans.

You know what I think is racist? Telling people who come from very poor countries (India and China), who cross an ocean and come to a country to make a better life, who study hard because it is their ticket out of poverty, who are model citizens, contributing to this wonderful country, becoming doctors and engineers, and saying to them that they are not minorities. Minorities in this country are just people with a significant bitching factor who this country has to continually help and benefit with no discernible change in fundamental behavior or class status.

Oh, thats right, I am white and I was born to oppress and deny people of color a good life. Let me clarify though because apparently I only oppress one color and not Indian brown or Asian yellow. I am basically a terminator, programmed to keep one specific color in poverty even though they have been citizens of this country and free for a long time now. Pretty funny how brown Indians can come over on a boat and be here for a year and be doing better than other people who have enjoyed the benefits and freedom of America forever now.

Yawn. You know why no one discusses the topic of race in this country? It is because no one gives a shit. I do me and you do you. Every company has "diversity" requirements. Every college has affirmative action. We are doing everything possible to make things equal.

My solution. Could we just fire 20% of the white people, evict them from their houses, take their cars and give them to minorities. I will happily live in a box for a couple weeks if that means I never have to hear anymore pissing and fucking moaning. My two year old niece doesn't bitch and moan as much as full grown adults.

Wait, I forgot, the CIA invented AIDS and crack cocaine. My bad.

You do realize that most of the Indians and Asians who come to the USA to study or work are from their respective countries' upper classes right?

You have no idea what you are talking about. Stop talking out of your ass.

I'm sorry am I wrong? I don't think I'm wrong.

Dec 26, 2014
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:
fhurricane:
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:
Anthony .:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_group
"A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society."

That definition fits Indian and Asians just as much as Black and Mexicans.

You know what I think is racist? Telling people who come from very poor countries (India and China), who cross an ocean and come to a country to make a better life, who study hard because it is their ticket out of poverty, who are model citizens, contributing to this wonderful country, becoming doctors and engineers, and saying to them that they are not minorities. Minorities in this country are just people with a significant bitching factor who this country has to continually help and benefit with no discernible change in fundamental behavior or class status.

Oh, thats right, I am white and I was born to oppress and deny people of color a good life. Let me clarify though because apparently I only oppress one color and not Indian brown or Asian yellow. I am basically a terminator, programmed to keep one specific color in poverty even though they have been citizens of this country and free for a long time now. Pretty funny how brown Indians can come over on a boat and be here for a year and be doing better than other people who have enjoyed the benefits and freedom of America forever now.

Yawn. You know why no one discusses the topic of race in this country? It is because no one gives a shit. I do me and you do you. Every company has "diversity" requirements. Every college has affirmative action. We are doing everything possible to make things equal.

My solution. Could we just fire 20% of the white people, evict them from their houses, take their cars and give them to minorities. I will happily live in a box for a couple weeks if that means I never have to hear anymore pissing and fucking moaning. My two year old niece doesn't bitch and moan as much as full grown adults.

Wait, I forgot, the CIA invented AIDS and crack cocaine. My bad.

You do realize that most of the Indians and Asians who come to the USA to study or work are from their respective countries' upper classes right?

You have no idea what you are talking about. Stop talking out of your ass.

I'm sorry am I wrong? I don't think I'm wrong.

You probably are wrong in this instance. I am Indian and my parents came here with $25 dollars in their pockets and 2 suitcases. I know plenty of Indian people who came to this country with damn near nothing and worked lower-middle class type jobs (i.e. working in textile factories, laundromats, etc.). There are a decent chunk that come here nowadays that are upper-middle class in India but a large percentage of Indians that come here came from small villages with no electricity or running water. They make it because of a strong desire to get out of a shitty situation and make life easier for their future children.

Dec 26, 2014
mortonsseasalt:
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:
fhurricane:
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:
Anthony .:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_group
"A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society."

That definition fits Indian and Asians just as much as Black and Mexicans.

You know what I think is racist? Telling people who come from very poor countries (India and China), who cross an ocean and come to a country to make a better life, who study hard because it is their ticket out of poverty, who are model citizens, contributing to this wonderful country, becoming doctors and engineers, and saying to them that they are not minorities. Minorities in this country are just people with a significant bitching factor who this country has to continually help and benefit with no discernible change in fundamental behavior or class status.

Oh, thats right, I am white and I was born to oppress and deny people of color a good life. Let me clarify though because apparently I only oppress one color and not Indian brown or Asian yellow. I am basically a terminator, programmed to keep one specific color in poverty even though they have been citizens of this country and free for a long time now. Pretty funny how brown Indians can come over on a boat and be here for a year and be doing better than other people who have enjoyed the benefits and freedom of America forever now.

Yawn. You know why no one discusses the topic of race in this country? It is because no one gives a shit. I do me and you do you. Every company has "diversity" requirements. Every college has affirmative action. We are doing everything possible to make things equal.

My solution. Could we just fire 20% of the white people, evict them from their houses, take their cars and give them to minorities. I will happily live in a box for a couple weeks if that means I never have to hear anymore pissing and fucking moaning. My two year old niece doesn't bitch and moan as much as full grown adults.

Wait, I forgot, the CIA invented AIDS and crack cocaine. My bad.

You do realize that most of the Indians and Asians who come to the USA to study or work are from their respective countries' upper classes right?

You have no idea what you are talking about. Stop talking out of your ass.

I'm sorry am I wrong? I don't think I'm wrong.

You probably are wrong in this instance. I am Indian and my parents came here with $25 dollars in their pockets and 2 suitcases. I know plenty of Indian people who came to this country with damn near nothing and worked lower-middle class type jobs (i.e. working in textile factories, laundromats, etc.). There are a decent chunk that come here nowadays that are upper-middle class in India but a large percentage of Indians that come here came from small villages with no electricity or running water. They make it because of a strong desire to get out of a shitty situation and make life easier for their future children.

Similar story for my parents

Here is an interesting article on the subject.
http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/43824/20100817/asi...

Dec 26, 2014

I've been on my own since I was 17, I was poor and or homeless during a chunk of my college years and was not eligible for food stamps or welfare. The remainder of those years, I worked general labor between classes to put a roof over my head and food on the table, tutored other poor minority kids for free, took care of old people, fed the homeless, and still graduated with an above average gpa (nothing writing and acing your final exam with cement under your fingernails while wearing mud-soaked boots). Whoever thinks I don't deserve this "diversity" benefit can eat the dirt crusts off my nuts.

Dec 26, 2014
Incog:

I've been on my own since I was 17, I was poor and or homeless during a chunk of my college years and was not eligible for food stamps or welfare. The remainder of those years, I worked general labor between classes to put a roof over my head and food on the table, tutored other poor minority kids for free, took care of old people, fed the homeless, and still graduated with an above average gpa (nothing writing and acing your final exam with cement under your fingernails while wearing mud-soaked boots). Whoever thinks I don't deserve this "diversity" benefit can eat the dirt crusts off my nuts.

I, without hesitation, believe every word you've written as gospel and as if Jesus Christ, himself, wrote it.

Dec 26, 2014
trackstar2k2:
Incog:

I've been on my own since I was 17, I was poor and or homeless during a chunk of my college years and was not eligible for food stamps or welfare. The remainder of those years, I worked general labor between classes to put a roof over my head and food on the table, tutored other poor minority kids for free, took care of old people, fed the homeless, and still graduated with an above average gpa (nothing writing and acing your final exam with cement under your fingernails while wearing mud-soaked boots). Whoever thinks I don't deserve this "diversity" benefit can eat the dirt crusts off my nuts.

I, without hesitation, believe every word you've written as gospel and as if Jesus Christ, himself, wrote it.

Thanks, Juno. Now why don't you bring two nice, cold glasses of water upstairs. Your mom and I are parched.

Dec 26, 2014
Incog:
trackstar2k2:
Incog:

I've been on my own since I was 17, I was poor and or homeless during a chunk of my college years and was not eligible for food stamps or welfare. The remainder of those years, I worked general labor between classes to put a roof over my head and food on the table, tutored other poor minority kids for free, took care of old people, fed the homeless, and still graduated with an above average gpa (nothing writing and acing your final exam with cement under your fingernails while wearing mud-soaked boots). Whoever thinks I don't deserve this "diversity" benefit can eat the dirt crusts off my nuts.

I, without hesitation, believe every word you've written as gospel and as if Jesus Christ, himself, wrote it.

Thanks, Juno. Now why don't you bring two nice, cold glasses of water upstairs. Your mom and I are parched.

Nicee, your mom jokes, haven't heard them since 8th grade. Very creative and original.

Dec 26, 2014
trackstar2k2:
Incog:
trackstar2k2:
Incog:

I've been on my own since I was 17, I was poor and or homeless during a chunk of my college years and was not eligible for food stamps or welfare. The remainder of those years, I worked general labor between classes to put a roof over my head and food on the table, tutored other poor minority kids for free, took care of old people, fed the homeless, and still graduated with an above average gpa (nothing writing and acing your final exam with cement under your fingernails while wearing mud-soaked boots). Whoever thinks I don't deserve this "diversity" benefit can eat the dirt crusts off my nuts.

I, without hesitation, believe every word you've written as gospel and as if Jesus Christ, himself, wrote it.

Thanks, Juno. Now why don't you bring two nice, cold glasses of water upstairs. Your mom and I are parched.

Nicee, your mom jokes, haven't heard them since 8th grade. Very creative and original.

your mom goes to college.

Dec 26, 2014
Anthony .:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minority_group
"A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society."

That definition fits Indian and Asians just as much as Black and Mexicans.

You know what I think is racist? Telling people who come from very poor countries (India and China), who cross an ocean and come to a country to make a better life, who study hard because it is their ticket out of poverty, who are model citizens, contributing to this wonderful country, becoming doctors and engineers, and saying to them that they are not minorities. Minorities in this country are just people with a significant bitching factor who this country has to continually help and benefit with no discernible change in fundamental behavior or class status.

Oh, thats right, I am white and I was born to oppress and deny people of color a good life. Let me clarify though because apparently I only oppress one color and not Indian brown or Asian yellow. I am basically a terminator, programmed to keep one specific color in poverty even though they have been citizens of this country and free for a long time now. Pretty funny how brown Indians can come over on a boat and be here for a year and be doing better than other people who have enjoyed the benefits and freedom of America forever now.

Yawn. You know why no one discusses the topic of race in this country? It is because no one gives a shit. I do me and you do you. Every company has "diversity" requirements. Every college has affirmative action. We are doing everything possible to make things equal.

My solution. Could we just fire 20% of the white people, evict them from their houses, take their cars and give them to minorities. I will happily live in a box for a couple weeks if that means I never have to hear anymore pissing and fucking moaning. My two year old niece doesn't bitch and moan as much as full grown adults.

Wait, I forgot, the CIA invented AIDS and crack cocaine. My bad.

Amen to that. Asians/Indians work hard and succeed so they aren't minorities. WTF???

Dec 26, 2014

A little history lesson for everyone:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coolie
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_American_history
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_American_int...
I don't know, being used as replacement slave labor, anti immigration sentiments, interned during WW2, nuked twice, yet nothing, not even a complaint. Take a look at any college campus and tell me if you see a defeated or oppressed people.

I am not saying that there is not a disparity or possibly biased opinions, but the idea there is some mass racist conspiracy that only is directed towards one race is retarded.

Standardized tests are biased towards one group over another? That is probably the most racist thing I have ever heard.

http://news.medill.northwestern.edu/chicago/news.a...
I know it is just a blog, but read it and see what it says. It says because certain minorities answer questions correctly at a lower percentage than others the tests are culturally biased.

No, they are biased towards having a basic education. I completely agree that inner city schools need more funding and we need to do more to promote education and college in inner city communities, but the plain fact is I cannot go into someones house and turn off the TV and force them to read. I cannot prevent single family households. I cannot tell people to idolize and strive to be doctors, lawyers, business men, etc.

Standardized tests favor people who have a solid foundation in math, reading, writing, etc. The answer is not to call the tests racist or give certain groups a higher score. The answer is to try and teach whatever group that is falling below the standards the necessary skills to succeed.

Math, english, science, history, all color blind. Learn the equation, remember certain dates, I before E, except after C, on and on. Learn the basics, build on them and you will be fine.

Dec 26, 2014

Although all three of these cases have to do with affirmative action in university admissions as opposed to the workplace, the discussion and opinions in these cases are an interesting read:

Gratz v. Bollinger

Grutter v. Bollinger

Regents of the University of California v. Bakke

Dec 26, 2014

LOL

Dec 26, 2014

I'd like to see a Wall Street CEO bring up the fact that Asians/Indians are overrepresented on WS just to see how the politicians respond. My guess is they don't care because those groups don't form a significant vote bank in the U.S.

I have and always will vote Republican because of BS like this.

Dec 26, 2014

On the SAT they removed the analogies portion of the literacy section, because men scored better than women. Somehow, there is a gender gap with logical thinking.

Dec 26, 2014
soitwouldseem:

On the SAT they removed the analogies portion of the literacy section, because men scored better than women. Somehow, there is a gender gap with logical thinking.

LOL. Screw Affirmative Action, Hire Men!

Look Away, It's Now Diamonds

Dec 26, 2014

Without thread hijacking, have any of you tried explaining to women how horrible diamonds are. You can tell a woman about kids dying, losing body parts, how diamonds are not really worth what people pay, how they aren't really that precious and when it is all said and done, "I still want one" comes out of their mouth.

Cubic Zirc FTW

Oh, always get a prenup also

Dec 26, 2014
Anthony .:

Without thread hijacking, have any of you tried explaining to women how horrible diamonds are. You can tell a woman about kids dying, losing body parts, how diamonds are not really worth what people pay, how they aren't really that precious and when it is all said and done, "I still want one" comes out of their mouth.

Cubic Zirc FTW

Oh, always get a prenup also

In case you haven't already, watch the movie "Blood Diamond". To say it's intense is an understatement.

That's why some jewelers sell legit conflict-free diamonds.
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/kanyewest/diamondsf...

Look Away, It's Now Diamonds

Dec 26, 2014
Anthony .:

Without thread hijacking, have any of you tried explaining to women how horrible diamonds are. You can tell a woman about kids dying, losing body parts, how diamonds are not really worth what people pay, how they aren't really that precious and when it is all said and done, "I still want one" comes out of their mouth.

Cubic Zirc FTW

Also, Never get married.

Fixed that for you.

What's even more amazing is that no matter how dumb she is she can tell the real from the fake.

Dec 26, 2014
Anthony .:

Without thread hijacking, have any of you tried explaining to women how horrible diamonds are. You can tell a woman about kids dying, losing body parts, how diamonds are not really worth what people pay, how they aren't really that precious and when it is all said and done, "I still want one" comes out of their mouth.

Cubic Zirc FTW

Oh, always get a prenup also

"Blood Diamonds" are nothing more than an elaborate PR campaign by DeBeers to maintain their monopoly of the diamond business and set exorbitant prices for worthless pieces of rock.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100014240527487035...
And for those of you smart enough to believe the bullshit "blood diamond" documentaries and that overdramatic movie with Leonardl diCaprio, here is a film that is much more informative and unbiased:
The Secret World of the Diamond Empire

Dec 26, 2014

Yeah, whats so funny is no matter how often I am told that they can tell it is a real diamond I still don't care haha.

I have zero issue with buying a ruby, emerald, whatever. I have no problem with gold, titanium, platinum. I have issue with DeBeers telling girls who break my balls that I HAVE to buy a diamond and it has to be at least 2 months salary.

Last time I checked I only HAVE to pay taxes and die. If more men would simply stand up to this lunacy and bullshit we would all be better off.

Dec 26, 2014

http://www.amnestyusa.org/business-and-human-right...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_diamond
Demand for diamonds increase prices, increased prices increase the demand to mine diamonds. Unsavory countries that have diamond deposits use cheap labor (children) to mine them (they have small hands and can fit in places adults cannot). Not saying that you can track a blood diamond, but I am saying that the demand for them and high price spur unintended consequences.

Kind of like the Ivory trade.

Diamonds are just like home ownership, having children and getting married.Lies perpetuated by society based off old social norms that people take as if they were gospel

Dec 26, 2014
Anthony .:

http://www.amnestyusa.org/business-and-human-right...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_diamond
Demand for diamonds increase prices, increased prices increase the demand to mine diamonds. Unsavory countries that have diamond deposits use cheap labor (children) to mine them (they have small hands and can fit in places adults cannot). Not saying that you can track a blood diamond, but I am saying that the demand for them and high price spur unintended consequences.

Kind of like the Ivory trade.

Diamonds are just like home ownership, having children and getting married.Lies perpetuated by society based off old social norms that people take as if they were gospel

This reply is for all your past posts and all the diamond haters...food for thought :

I believe that diamond gained its importance because of its sparkle and eventually, as its prices hiked it became a part of rings to symbolize the importance of the woman in man's life and how precious she is for him.

However, some woman (including me) would definitely feel special if the ring is adorned with one of the rarest and precious gems. Its a matter of awareness. If people think that diamond is expensive then please have a look at the cost of the gems that I am about to mention. A few of these gems would definitely cost more than your 2months of salary and a lot of time to find. So, the choice is yours diamond vs rare/precious gems.

Rare/Precious gems: SERENDIBITE,PAINITE, JEREMEJEVITE,BENITOITE,TAAFFEITE
My personal favorites: SERENDIBITE and DIAMOND

Dec 26, 2014

This pisses me off so much. JP Morgan, I shit you not (and I'm sure everyone here may already know) has so many god damn diversity internships, it's ridiculous. They have positions for blacks, womens, and gays. They also don't require you to even be a business major to be in the internship. So basically, if you're white and a finance major, you're at somewhat of a disadvantage. Pretty respectable. Maybe part of the reason certain events happened a couple years ago is because we have a shakespeare major drawing up financial tools.

Don't get me wrong, I don't mind blacks, womens, and gays to have jobs on wall street. In fact, I encourage it. But to reserve so many spots just for them is absurd. When does Obama have time to come up with this shit? Between his family being in Spain, and him shooting hoops with the dream team, where does he say "You know what we should do? Increase diversity on Wall Street." Considering blacks have the highest ratio of debt defaults, I really don't think we should promote such a thing, you incompetent arrogant son of a bitch.

Dec 26, 2014
brooksbrotha:

This pisses me off so much. JP Morgan, I shit you not (and I'm sure everyone here may already know) has so many god damn diversity internships, it's ridiculous. They have positions for blacks, womens, and gays. They also don't require you to even be a business major to be in the internship. So basically, if you're white and a finance major, you're at somewhat of a disadvantage. Pretty respectable. Maybe part of the reason certain events happened a couple years ago is because we have a shakespeare major drawing up financial tools.

Don't get me wrong, I don't mind blacks, womens, and gays to have jobs on wall street. In fact, I encourage it. But to reserve so many spots just for them is absurd. When does Obama have time to come up with this shit? Between his family being in Spain, and him shooting hoops with the dream team, where does he say "You know what we should do? Increase diversity on Wall Street." Considering blacks have the highest ratio of debt defaults, I really don't think we should promote such a thing, you incompetent arrogant son of a bitch.

Buddy calm down. There are enough white spots resevered for you lol. Just because you couldn't get an internship at JP Morgan shouldn't mean you have to throw a hissy fit.

Dec 26, 2014
LBJ:
brooksbrotha:

This pisses me off so much. JP Morgan, I shit you not (and I'm sure everyone here may already know) has so many god damn diversity internships, it's ridiculous. They have positions for blacks, womens, and gays. They also don't require you to even be a business major to be in the internship. So basically, if you're white and a finance major, you're at somewhat of a disadvantage. Pretty respectable. Maybe part of the reason certain events happened a couple years ago is because we have a shakespeare major drawing up financial tools.

Don't get me wrong, I don't mind blacks, womens, and gays to have jobs on wall street. In fact, I encourage it. But to reserve so many spots just for them is absurd. When does Obama have time to come up with this shit? Between his family being in Spain, and him shooting hoops with the dream team, where does he say "You know what we should do? Increase diversity on Wall Street." Considering blacks have the highest ratio of debt defaults, I really don't think we should promote such a thing, you incompetent arrogant son of a bitch.

Buddy calm down. There are enough white spots resevered for you lol. Just because you couldn't get an internship at JP Morgan shouldn't mean you have to throw a hissy fit.

Actually my GPA was .1 less than what they were requiring. A communications major had met minimal requirements and was a different skin color and got in. That person also has no EC activities. I run 2 organizations, participate on an executive board for SGA, work part time, and did a ML internship (albeit it was GWM but still). Blow it out your ass LBJ

Dec 26, 2014

well be happy you don't have to do recruiting in Europe, specifically London. (though maybe you do BrooksBrotha, I think I remember something about you and DB Europe) The online questionnaires not only ask what race you are, but also what your sexual orientation is and what your religion is...lol

Dec 26, 2014
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:

well be happy you don't have to do recruiting in Europe, specifically London. (though maybe you do BrooksBrotha, I think I remember something about you and DB Europe) The online questionnaires not only ask what race you are, but also what your sexual orientation is and what your religion is...lol

Really? Unless there's an option where you can keep that information private, that's very personal information and in general, that doesn't need to be known when deciding to hire someone.

Look Away, It's Now Diamonds

Dec 26, 2014
naprison:
Affirmative_Action_Walrus:

well be happy you don't have to do recruiting in Europe, specifically London. (though maybe you do BrooksBrotha, I think I remember something about you and DB Europe) The online questionnaires not only ask what race you are, but also what your sexual orientation is and what your religion is...lol

Really? Unless there's an option where you can keep that information private, that's very personal information and in general, that doesn't need to be known when deciding to hire someone.

that's the thing, there is a "I choose not to disclose" option but I have heard from friends/colleagues that HR sometimes gets ticked off when they see too many "i choose not to disclose" boxes selected. clearly, this is information that I want to keep private, but at the same time I feel a little worried about not answering... anyone have any thoughts on this?

Dec 26, 2014

I am the other brown(hispanic) and been working since I was 12... I did not get help or a job because of my skin color.... i feel i should compete with people heads up...however and you can flame me for this but being hisp/black and from the usa has helped a lot in mba admissions.. is that bad as well?

Dec 26, 2014
monty09:

I am the other brown(hispanic) and been working since I was 12... I did not get help or a job because of my skin color.... i feel i should compete with people heads up...however and you can flame me for this but being hisp/black and from the usa has helped a lot in mba admissions.. is that bad as well?

Its even better for law school admissions, and its a pretty solid advantage for someone trying to get into graduate school for math/physics. I think it is bad, because when I see a minority with a degree from Harvard I really dont have the same respect as I would have for a white male with the same degree (not that I have much respect for it to begin with). Also, I feel that my peers dont belong in the same league as I do, and they are just there because of their skin color, gender, etc.

Dec 26, 2014

Of course someone with the username DABA responds with something like that ^

Dec 26, 2014

I am glad that some with username trackstar2k2 had time to read it and respond so quick.

Dec 26, 2014

*someone

Dec 26, 2014

http://www.curiousnotions.com/gemstones/
DABA strikes again. I would rather buy something that actually is rare and hasn't been forced down my throat by main stream media than piss money away on a diamond.

Dec 26, 2014

Diversity / affirmative action makes me sick to the stomach. It's a tool used to promote laziness in visible minorities (less: Asians/Indians) and keep them oppressed as long as possible. Racism at its finest.

Dec 26, 2014
jrotmensen:

Diversity / affirmative action makes me sick to the stomach. It's a tool used to promote laziness in visible minorities (less: Asians/Indians) and keep them oppressed as long as possible. Racism at its finest.

Aren't you asian? lol.

I win here, I win there...

Dec 26, 2014

http://www.tnr.com/book/review/what-hope
Pretty interesting review. I want to read this book.

Dec 26, 2014

Look Away, It's Now Diamonds

Dec 26, 2014
Dec 26, 2014
Dec 26, 2014
Dec 26, 2014

I don't want to be a product of the environment, i want the environment to be a product of me

Dec 26, 2014