2012 IBD Bonus Tracking
Andy note: this was originally posted in July '12
Hey gang,
It's that time of the year, just had my performance review. I am probably a week or two ahead of schedule judging by previous years, but might as well kick it off anyway. I'm at a MM, so not sure how helpful my figure is to the group though.
Firm: MM
Team: M&A
Region: NY
Current Level: 1st year analyst
Rank: top bucket
New base: 80k (from 70k)
Bonus: 60k
Good luck to my fellow monkeys, see you at the yacht store! :)
Was wondering when this would pop up...my sources have been indicating a crappy bonus season, but $60k for a first year is perfectly fine, so hopefully it's a sign of things to come...staying tuned (I don't think we'll get our numbers for a few more weeks still)
60k feels high to me, but I really hope this is legit
I AM A REAL PERSON :)
Like I said, I'm at a MM and from my understanding MM only weakly tracks the BB market. I asked a 2nd year at the firm and he said last year top was 55k, meaning it's gone up even though BB is supposed to track down. But from what I hear this year was quite good for us compared to last.
Let's wait for a few more numbers and I think it'll be more apparent where the overall market is going.
wow.. i was hearing rumors of 35k - 45k for first years and some MMs were supposedly enacting salary freezes.
maybe these MM's im thinking of are more boutique-ish.. its fine, congrats tho.
Yeah, I was hearing that analyst bonuses would proportionally match what happened to associates/VPs earlier this year...which is to say, they're going to royally suck. I'd love to be proven wrong though.
i heard 35k - 45k for first years also
We gave ours a "blob"...but had to get rid of it..too many distractions
http://www.youtube.com/embed/Las6RXJKTLE
The number is more like 40k top, at the best places. Don't get your hopes up kids.
This is completely wrong. That would mean that bonuses fell around 40-50% y-o-y, not happening.
I could be wrong but that's the number I've been hearing. Where were 1st years getting 80k bonuses last year, or am I that off my IBD game?
I would have said the same thing six months ago. Then I saw second year associates get
aw don't be a poor sport lol, get their loins stirring by posting Centerview and Qatalyst #s
What was your old base? 70?
Please post in the Company Database
1st year analyst getting 140k in this economy? And not at a BB?
GTFO hahaha
Are you dumb? Obviously it wouldn't be a BB. BBs are bleeding right now.
Boutiques are doing better (on a relative basis).
I know one of the boutiques was paying 70-75k last yr for top.
Perhaps I am mistaken but why would a BB be better off than a boutique right now? BB's are currently financially unsound, have a host of problems, and should be pinching pennies to survive what might happen.
It's possible although you shouldn't associate two separate divisions of a company. Just because one trader lost 9B for JPM does not mean that other divisions of the company aren't making $.
Anyway these are fantasy numbers for a 1st year analyst. Curious why the OP registered to this site to just post this. Even in the remote chance that it's true then this is an outlier result and individuals should not infer much from it.
Please provide detailed assumptions why you think BBs are better given their historically low ROEs, and the fact that they are being regulated the shit out of them. Many of the elite boutiques (who are private and can do whatever the fuck they want) paid above the street last year both in terms of base and bonuses. What did the BBs do differently this year? Please also provide your school and major. I want to judge you. You are obviously stupid.
mb666 was comparing a BB to a MM, not a BB to an elite boutique. It's commonly accepted that many elite boutiques pay above Street, but one can't make the same claim about most MM.
Lower ROE? How about larger and more deal flow?
A ~$70k base is plausible for a top-tier 1st year analyst, however, the $60k bonus is where you know it's bullsh!t. No one is going to pay someone fresh out of college and who's likely more in a training mode to take $60k as a bonus. How does a 1st year analysis add value besides crunching numbers... something that can be done by many other individuals? What expertise does he have to warrant such a bonus? The only way it's possible is to receive a minuscule piece of equity somewhere and see that investment explode.
I'm not going to argue about the legitimacy of the OPs claim anymore. Of course anything is possible but it is highly, highly unlikely. I just want to inform people that want to get into this industry that these numbers are bs, otherwise you guys are going to set some really unrealistic goals for yourselves. As the economy stands now you should be content making something like $55k base and $5k bonus. Also, entry-level salaries are insignificant... it's where you'll be in 10 years. A lot of trading assistant, small IB, etc role pay peanuts when you start but if the firm succeeds you'll eventually receive a huge payday. Accountants start with a high salary but are capped rather quickly in their careers unless they start working for themselves in some way.
Look, the OP has 4 posts and essentially registered for this site to post a thread about his income. What incentive does someone have to do so? He's either trying to boost or troll us. Considering the details I am claiming the latter. There is not even any advice about working in the industry, how he got such position, etc... that would result in such an exorbitant compensation package as a 1st year analyst. That's why I'm calling bs.
are any of you idiots embarrassed about all the shit you said now that all the names are public?
140k 1st year at an MM?
Lol. Riiiiight.
Team: Industry Group Region: NYC Current Level: 1st year analyst Rank: Top Bucket New base: 80k Bonus: 45k
Was told in review that bonuses are down YoY on the street. I know for a fact that this is down 10% YoY at my firm.
All going into savings. Might buy a new watch. Considering I am looking at over 225k in PE after this im not too worried ...
This is more around what I'd expect. Are you at a BB?
Middle Market Firm
I don't usually post but really dude? You bragging doggie? 225k? I am going to be an ahole just because I can't believe you said that. You're getting paid the same as a 3rd year top bucket analyst buddy. Go for a megafund/top tier pe shop. 300k and carried interest and bschool placement.
Hey buddy, not everyone wants to keep working 100 hours a week until they're 40 for an incremental 30% comp....225k at age 24 is a freaking lot of money, kid's doing well for himself, be happy for him
My god...
Which bank pays 3rd year analysts $225k? Which megafund offers carry at the pre-MBA level?
You think banks are paying out a $135k bonus to 3rd year analysts these days?
Where do people come up with this shit?
You're an idiot. 3rd year top bucket is not getting 225 in this environment. they are maybe getting 200 all-in if they crush it, and that's likely at an elite boutique. Also, what you are aren't factoring in is the fact that his hours are likely improving, and I bet he gets more vacation time and possibly other perks.
Very few shops give carry to pre-MBA Associates... it isn't a common thing. It sounds like you don't know what you are talking about and don't understand buyside comp. You kids all make it sound like getting a 300k a year PE job is easy as shit. There are only about 400 or so PE jobs out there each year. The Mega Funds aren't taking a lot of associates... for a firm like KKR think like 5, from all the good banks out there.
You're a bit off base here, so don't go talking shit on someone. 225k is a great number, you just sound like a complete asshole when you try to hate on that.
Good thing you dont usually post. Probably saves a lot of headaches.
But to clarify for ppl that are curious ... 200% more vacation (paid), it is not in NYC (closer to my friends from home / less taxes) and I have the ability to make more based on performance of fund.
buysideglory
you are a MM and your base is 80K? Most first years at BBs get a base of 72K
Where the hell did that extra 2k come from?
My all in comp for 2012 is $0. The breakdown is as follows:
Base-$0 Bonus-$0
Down 0% Y-o-Y
Interesting that everyone that posts their bonus on WSO is top bucket. Seems statistically unlikely.
People like to brag.
Think for 2 seconds.
Who has the highest incentive to brag by posting ? Top bucket or bottom bucket that got sacked for 5k bonus ?
There i a sample bias.
I don't know where all these numbers are coming from. Has anyone heard from BMO? They announced last week of June last year and seem to be a pretty good indication of what BB bonuses are going to be.
BMO announced Tuesday and I heard they were "alright" although I don't have numbers. What's with these numbers though? I pray to god I'm nowhere near them as last year we stubbed out the numbers people are throwing around on here..
Why are people that do not work in the industry throwing speculative base and bonus numbers out there? Who the fuck pays 72k? Goes 70/80/90 guys and gals
Maybe he included sign on bonus
Wait a second, we get bonuses?
I'm guessing it will go about like this:
$50k top bucket- keep them happy enough to stay without overpaying
$30-40k middle bucket- not that far below recent years, so nobody goes apeshit
$0-15k bottom bucket- this guy knows it's time to leave, they're just helping him by pissing him off
What do you mean by "new base"? Is that your 2nd year analyst base?
I assume that was with a $60k or $65k base?
Regards
I call BS on OP
New base as in the base I am getting 2012-13, cleared it up in the edit.
Regarding why everyone is top tier, I have a few hunches: 1. Either people are lying. 2. People on WSO are "better than average", which is not a crazy idea. People here are more informed and at the very least want to succeed at their job and put in the effort to reach that goal. 3. "Top tier" isn't always the same-- I asked someone in my class today and they actually received less than I did but they still told me they were top tier. No idea if it is just something my bank does or what.
Regarding whether or not my figures are real, believe me or not, it's obviously your decision, this is the internet and I won't be offended either way (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f8/Internet_dog.jpg). That said, I only posted my info because WSO helped me get my job and I wanted to contribute to the community. I gave the disclaimer upfront that I am at a MM and was told we did particularly well this year.
Cheers, looking forward to hearing how it shook out for everyone else.
OP is bullshitting there is no way
at a prop trading firm doing etf market making, started mid 2010, first year scraps...last year comp was 75k salary 80k bonus as a ta transitioning to a trader, this year, salary unchanged, but bonus probably north of 150k =)
Well this went well
Don't listen to these 8 post kids talking about all the 140k packages that were handed out last year. Also, don't trust M&I's bonus numbers with what you should hope/expect to get. Don't even trust me, but polling the 7 guys from banking backgrounds in my office - and I'm assuming they have a good idea about what bonuses actually were last year - the number for BB is probably averaging around 50k. The one Blackstone guy in the office thinks their top 1st years were getting 60k though so it's not unheard of. So I'd guess that you should be happy with your all-in comp as a 1st year IBD if you're getting 110-120k, ecstatic if you're getting 130k, and probably can't complain with 100k.
It will likely be down this year, but I speak from firsthand knowledge that top 1st years definitely got 130-140k last year. I'm not an "8 post kid" and think my post history should make it pretty clear that I work in banking (though hopefully doesn't give away much more than that)
@mb666:
I don't know what industry/firm you work for. You obviously don't know what you are talking about. 1) your argument about BBs having larger deal flow. Yes that's true. They also have more people to share that. IBD is not a scalable business. Therefore ROE normalizes different sizes and BBs now are having single digit ROEs. Do you know what that means? Means investors won't be happy. Therefore comps won't go higher than 50% of revenue for an extended period of time. Therefore your reply that BBs OBVIOUSLY triumph all other MMs and boutiques is BS. 2) Content with 55K+5K? That's just HAHAHAHAHA..... Yes juniors bring nothing to the table. Nor does anyone else except for MDs/partners who actually bring business to the firm. So what? That's just the industry's standard pay given the amount of fees collected for every deal, in proportion to the work/headcount on that deal.
In any case, there is no point arguing with you about the legitimacy of OP. You think his numbers are BS. I KNOW that's entirely possible based at least on last year's numbers. Who cares if he just registered? Granted that's not what you expect from every firm, but top bucket BBs and elite boutiques definitely paid that last year. I'm just sad that you are apparently being paid shit and still think you have the best job on the street for no good reasons. There are people who make more money on the street than you do. Live with it.
@mb666:
I don't know what industry/firm you work for. You obviously don't know what you are talking about. 1) your argument about BBs having larger deal flow. Yes that's true. They also have more people to share that. IBD is not a scalable business. Therefore ROE normalizes different sizes and BBs now are having single digit ROEs. Do you know what that means? Means investors won't be happy. Therefore comps won't go higher than 50% of revenue for an extended period of time. Therefore your reply that BBs OBVIOUSLY triumph all other MMs and boutiques is BS. 2) Content with 55K+5K? That's just HAHAHAHAHA..... Yes juniors bring nothing to the table. Nor does anyone else except for MDs/partners who actually bring business to the firm. So what? That's just the industry's standard pay given the amount of fees collected for every deal, in proportion to the work/headcount on that deal. And the fact that you work 100hrs a week.
In any case, there is no point arguing with you about the legitimacy of OP. You think his numbers are BS. I KNOW that's entirely possible based at least on last year's numbers. Who cares if he just registered? Granted that's not what you expect from every firm, but top bucket BBs and elite boutiques definitely paid that last year. I'm just sad that you are apparently being paid shit and still think you have the best job on the street for no good reasons. There are people who make more money on the street than you do. Live with it.
So a bunch of members with a post count in the range of 1 - 40 are defending the OPs outlandish numbers?
Just because 1st year analysts work consistent 80 hour weeks they think that they are entitled to six figures lol? 150k comp is a 1st year associate # and not a 1st year analyst. The salary is possible but the bonus is exaggerated.
first year associates get around ~110k base salary (excluding bonus) at my bank. First year analysts, top bucket, made about 130k total comp last year. Don't know where you're getting these numbers...
Just stop. 1st year associate base at my bank is $125k.
Last summer 1st year analysts were at $70k base and top bucket bonus was $60-70k.
Again, you do not know what you are talking about.
I have more than 40 posts. The numbers aren't outlandish. You are wrong.
GET EM!
This is a ridiculous argument. Last year, most first years got something like $50k or $55k at my bulge bracket. A few top got $60k or $65k.
I think one of the many important things that hasn't been said is that, while a 2006 or 2007 1st year analyst was getting 140 or 150ish, his rent was probably 25-30% cheaper. So in real terms, analyst compensation has probably taken a haircut of at least 30% in Manhattan since the crisis. Rent is utterly ridiculous these days and comp is NOT tracking. Also, how much did college cost from 03-07 compared to 07-11, and what kind of dent are those loans making on your paycheck every month? (Hint: it's likely appreciably higher than it was). Granted this excludes the rest of the analyst consumption basket, mostly booze & food, but that too has definitely creeped up since '07 as well (maybe not as much as rent).
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/22/realestate/manhattan-the-city-of-sky-…
The argument "pay hasn't come down enough since the crisis" is a testament to the power companies have to bring down wages without changing the nominal figures that much. Aren't we supposed to be most financially astute ones?
W2 pic on a public forum or gtfo lol
The salary numbers for top tier firms, as suggested, are possible. The bonuses for 1st year analysts on the other hand are right tail numbers.... bs or anomalies.
The comp numbers for associates are possibly underestimated. I know someone that broke $250k in total comp. Then again this isn't someone fresh out of undergrad with just "impressive summer internships" but rather an individual with a lot more significant deal experience as well as an NYU MBA.
Look I'm not trying to hate on the OP as much as trying to provide a more reasonable scenario. Otherwise you younger guys may set some ridiculous expectations from these #s. After 2 years of experience the sky is the limit but 1st year analysts aren't getting 150k year. If so they are outliers or at top PE shops such as Blackstone.
Thanks for conceding you are not from this industry. So now you know "some associates" get 250k. You can shut up now.
The fact that you have 612 points on WSO yet are spewing this unadulterated shit about a topic you obviously know next to nothing about blows my mind.
threads like this just devalue wso.
too many people with no idea about the industry posting on here...
op is fos fwiw.
Where did all of these 1 - 35 post members come from haha
This has to be some brilliant trolling, otherwise I'm literally speechless.
If you've gotten your numbers, post them, if not, stfu you're defeating the purpose of the thread.
BB coverage group First year Rank: 3/10 Salary: Bumped to 80k from 70k as of July 1 Bonus: 45k (prorated) I lateraled here in April (took a step back from being a 2nd year at an MM after getting laid off) so I'm only getting 11.25k (3 month stub). There were only two buckets. The bottom half got $40k. Last year it was $55k and $60k for first years in this group. This was pretty much in line with peoples' (negative) expectations.
Sounds pretty rough. This is the lowest total comp in quite a while I guess.
I don't understand. $70k base and $60k bonus sound like very reasonable top or middle bucket numbers to me, depending on the firm. FWIW I'm at a BB and got $58k last year.
Middle market shop
2009: 30k (flat all years) 2010: 48k (1st year) 2011: 80k (2nd year) 2012: 100k (3rd year)
wow that sounds really high, guess you guys did great this year.
new york? or regional office?
These posts are hilarious.
Confirmed top bucket bonus numbers. MM non-NYC bank:
1st yr - $65k 2nd yr - $85k 3rd yr - $105k
Don't know why everyone is hating on the OP. There are plenty of MM banks that will pay above street because they are having a good year.
Confirmed 3rd Year HF Analyst Summer Bonus Numbers:
Top Bucket: $0 Middle Bucket: $0 Bottom Bucket: $350k severence pay, he got fired.
I wanna get fired.
I'm guessing this came with a healthy non-compete?
Or, probably more importantly, an iron-clad NDA?
what's the most you've made in a year?
http://www.youtube.com/embed/nTL0sn2O76Y
Any BB banks indicate when they will release Analyst numbers? Personally my bank is always one of the last to pay out.
yeah, its between end of july through beginning of august..
Didn't read the rest of this thread so apologies if this is a repeat, but I just found out that BMO paid 45k for first year top bucket. When I questioned this low number my friend went on to tell me that her office head said that this was the number that the market consultants were expecting across the board. Pretty shitty and can only hope that this is not indicative of the rest of the major banks
...just saying
BMO generally pays above the street so if this is true, it's a truly terrible year on the street. Wouldn't be surprised to see a lot of Analysts bail, the job is not worth that type of money.
Heard RBC was coming in around 85k for second years.
MM 1st year..45k prorated
340 base 180 bonus 4 weeks vacation
fuckin shit train rolled through page 1, lol
lol yeah, someone wasnt happy with their bonus..
1st year friend at a european bank said top bucket for them was $50k, though that's not what he got so don't know how good the info is.
MM CH Top bucket bonus $55k Base raised to $80k
BB/Top Tier MM: $45k for middle bucket and $55k for top bucket for 1st year bonuses. New base of $80k
nothing new this week?
Can we get the Barclays bottom bucket confirmed please?
BWhahahaha!!! Now I really don't feel like IB
I got my hands on a report which broke down salaries and bonuses for IBD analysts in London. Heres goes...
Mean Base (£000), Mean Bonus (£000), Total Mean Comp (£000): Analyst 1: 45 + 20 = 65 Analyst 2: 51 + 32 = 83 Analyst 3: 58 + 46 = 104
Breakdown by bank (base in £000, mean bonus in £000, total mean comp £000) for Analyst 1: BAML: 45 + 20 = 65 BarCap: 45 + 28 = 73 Citi: 45 + 16 = 61 Credit Suisse: 45 + 29 = 74 Deutsche: 45 + 18 = 63 Goldman Sachs: 45 + 20 = 65 JPM: 45 + 22 = 67 Morgan Stanley: 45 + 24 = 69 Nomura: 45 + 22 = 67 Rothschild: 45 + 12 = 57 UBS: 45 + 21 = 66
Breakdown by bank (base in £000, mean bonus in £000, total mean comp £000) for Analyst 2: BAML: 50 + 35 = 85 BarCap: 50 + 32 = 82 Citi: 50 + 33 = 83 Credit Suisse: 51 + 35 = 86 Deutsche: 50 + 33 = 83 Goldman Sachs: 50 + 34 = 84 JPM: 50 + 37 = 87 Morgan Stanley: 50 + 40 = 90 Nomura: 52 + 31 = 83 Rothschild: 55 + 26 = 81 UBS: 50 + 27 = 77
Breakdown by bank (base in £000, mean bonus in £000, total mean comp £000) for Analyst 3: BAML: 55 + 46 = 101 BarCap: 57 + 54 = 111 Citi: 57 + 49 = 106 Credit Suisse: 55 + 49 = 104 Deutsche: 57 + 52 = 109 Goldman Sachs: 57 + 44 = 101 JPM: 57 + 49 = 106 Morgan Stanley: 57 + 54 = 111 Nomura: 60 + 39 = 99 Rothschild: 62.5 + 38 = 100.5 UBS: 57 + 39 = 96
Enjoy!
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