Any success stories from non-top MSF programs?
Hello,
I was wondering if any of you had any major successes in MSF programs that are not necessarily considered top programs. By success I mean that you were able to make a complete turnaround, break into FO roles, be it in IB/AM/ER or whatever that you wanted to do. My problem is that for family related reasons I am applying only in cali (USC, UCSD, UCI, maybe Santa Clara), and besides USC my options aren't so great. I have been studying nonstop for 2.5 months to compensate my 3.0 gpa with a killer (750+) GMAT but you never know what might happen. I am currently 25 years old and by the time I finish a 2018 program I will be almost 27. I really don't want to wait another year to apply with a better resume. I have seen some people mention success stories from unknown MSF programs in these forums, but I wanted to get some opinions specifically for my scenario.
I have an ambitious 1.5 year plan wherever I go. I am sitting for CFA lvl 1 this summer, and lvl 2 next summer (assuming that I pass lvl 1). By the time the program starts I will use my CFA 1 to network to find any relevant internships (I believe this will be key since experience trumps everything else). I will try to get at least 2-3 internships throughout the year, network as much as possible, write ER reports/stock pitches. learn modeling, and continue reading finance books as I have for some time now. I want to build a career in AM/HF so I will consider myself successful if I am able to land either an ER, IB (not something I would like to do really), or anything in between by the end of all this.
I know money is what keeps most people away from such programs when they know that it will cost them another 60-80k, but for me prospects of success are priceless. I value my time and youth a lot more. So what do you think. Would it be possible to pull something off? Any relevant personal stories? I am very motivated going into the new year and wanted to hear some success stories. Thank you.
Happy New Years, Cheers!
Hi NeverOutOfTheFight, any of these topics helpful:
Maybe one of our professional members will share their wisdom: @Brillig" IBPEHFVC pmarchek
Fingers crossed that one of those helps you.
Anyone?
What have you been doing since undergrad?
Why MSF and not MBA? MBA is much better for IB and depending on what your work experience is why not target UCLA, USC, UCI, UCSD for an MBA?
I have been out of school for only 1.5 years working in the BO. I took an extra year to graduate since I switched majors and I've been a year behind ever since I moved here as an immigrant (so 2 years behind). That's why I'm eager to get things done as quick as possible. MBA is not only out of reach, but also does not appeal to me due to its length, cost, and lack of true education. I just need a quick re-brand, but I'm a little worried about MSF programs that are not top tier.
It is possible that this is my bias having just dedicated a lot of time and energy to MBA applications (and will soon dedicate a lot of money), but I don't have a lot of respect for MSF programs in general, so I doubt a second or third tier program would do you much good. MBAs are good for transitioning you from early career to management or management tracked, but MSFs (to me) are basically just a $60k recruiting season. I have never worked with or knowingly encountered a graduate of an MSF program in my 3 years of banking or 3 years of VC, whereas nearly everyone has an MBA. Take it with a grain of salt.
Extremely similar situation but have already finished MSF at non-target European School. Sat down with lot of MD's who gave me a lot of input on their thoughts on the MSF. PM for details
Would apply to MSF programs in Europe they're half the price and would defy get in with that sort of GMAT!!!!
I used an MSF to do a career change out of the Big 4 (tax). Graduating in May from the program and have signed for an analyst role at a mid market PE shop. I managed to find a PE internship during the school year at a shop that doesn't hire at the analyst level which was incredibly helpful.
If you don't mind me asking, which MSF did you attend (Don't need to be specific)? And how did you manage to get a PE internship? Were your grades/work experience sufficient or did you network? I will be aiming to do something similar, even if I have to sacrifice a little bit of my grades.
Went to a school in Texas for my MSF, I can PM you the exact University if you're interested. Ended up networking my way into the PE internship. I think my grades/work experience got me in the door, but having strong references from the guys at my fund definitely played a part in the offer as well.
I don’t have direct experience with your question, but I did get an MSF from a top 15 (semi-target) simultaneously with my MBA. Take the following with a grain of salt, YMMV.
For me, passing CFA Level 1 seemed to generate a better improvement to my interview hit-rate than either MBA or MSF. Could be because I was also going for “entry-level” jobs, so MBA/MSF was “overeducated.” After CFA Level 1, I led with that and didn’t mention school until later in the conversation (sometimes not at all, just let them see it when I sent my resume). So, in my opinion, especially since you’re already in BO, it may be possible to shift to FO at your same bank or similar just by doing CFA Level 1. There are a number of success stories on WSO of BO to FO transitions...
On the other hand, if any of the programs your looking at have a demonstrated history of bringing good banks in for recruiting events and actually placing candidates, it may be worth the $60k for the networking. But, if I could go back and do it again, I would skip the masters program and use CFA to try and break in off my irrelevant undergrad degree + CFA and then try for MBA business schools">M7 MBA later to advance careers.
Edited for spelling.
I have been trying to avoid an MSF all along since I'm already older and behind, but I realized that the company that I work at doesn't have any decent FO roles. From the job openings that I have seen for the past year, only FP&A appealed to me. Given my lack of relevant experience and a low nontarget grades, it's going to take time to find other relevant jobs outside of my current company. So the way I rationalize it is that an MSF with a CFA would be better than a year of FP&A (with a CFA) - and that's only if I do qualify for that job.
You did not mention your grades or work experience, so maybe in your situation the CFA by itself was good enough. From what I've seen on these forums, level 1 CFA is not a game changer. I'm not too sure what an MBA/MSF is, but for me it's too early for an MBA.
Thanks for your input.
MBA/MSF: my MBA school (Kelley) allows for MBA students to do an MSF concurrently since there are so many overlapping courses.
My work experience was totally irrelevant (telecom sales). GMAT: 720 uGPA: 3.8, MBA GPA: 3.9.
What was your undergrad major? IMHO, unless your major was really unrelated, you could save the cost of an MSF by networking into FO on your own rather than paying 60k for the use of the schools network — unless the schools you’re looking at have really fantastic MSF recruiting and career services. I’ve “caught up” now to my education, but it took ~2.5 years of working below my education level in order to get there. If I could go back, I’d probably just do a certificate or CFA level 1 and save the pursuing a masters degree until after I had a couple years finance experience.
The big difference between the top programs and secondary programs is the focus they place on career services. The programs you mention will have plenty of alumni in your area and you'll receive a fine education, but career services will be largely focused on undergraduate students and F500 type employers.
The key to success from these programs is networking, hustle, unpaid internships and preparation so you execute on the interviews you get.
You should also think incrementally. Maybe you don't get BB IBD right from Santa Clara. You can definitely get corporate banking, valuation, Big 4 TAS, credit analyst, etc.
From there, it is up to you to keep networking, move up, switch to banking, whatever.
As for the generic, shit advice of "just get a top 10 MBA", easier said than done.
1) MBA admissions is a function of UG GPA (in your case low) 2) Post UG work experience (it seems yours isn't great) 3) GMAT 4) EC's and Story
So if you went to a weak UG school, got a shitty GPA and have weak post UG experience, you can't "just get into a top MBA". You need something to bridge the gap. And in many cases, this is the MSF/MiM/MAcc/MFE, etc.
As far as MBA vs MSF, the MBA wins because it is older, more known and the best schools offer the brand. The material you learn in an MBA is a joke and the MSF is ACADEMICALLY far superior (as any specialized focused masters will be). The material you are taught in an MBA program is based on the lowest common denominator while the MSF should start much higher as all will have a similar finance background.
I know a large number of success stories from lower ranked programs. I also know a lot of people who didn't do much with their degrees. The deciding factor is are you going to hustle, network and do the things necessary to stand out. You need to get a great GPA, take full advantage of all the opportunities the school provides, and put yourself out there.
If not, it will be a wasted year and a lot of money.
Thanks for the reply. The only questionable thing that you mentioned is that these schools have plenty of alumni in the area. All these schools are relatively new so their alumni base is probably mediocre and limited, so when networking with firms in the area I would most likely be working with non-alumni's. Not too familiar with Santa Clara, but I know UCI and UCSD both have respectable alumni in other fields (mostly science related) so people working in finance in that area are probably not from these schools. They are all in very good locations though, so I am hoping that some ruthless hustling can pay off.
I completely agree with you on the MBA advice. I might consider it in the future, but at the moment it won't be possible.
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