Long term, I feel like CA will be a less attractive place for RE investors. High taxes, anti-business laws, strict zoning, social instability, homelessness, extreme leftist politics, etc. are all slowly killing the state's future. It's pretty much become a playground for the ultra rich or unaffordable hellhole for the lower income population. Not to mention the inability to insure more than $10m worth of property damage against earthquakes. The mass exodus of young families and tech co's to NV, TX, AZ, CO is testament to this.
If your firm has business in CA, what are you doing to combat the state's degeneration? Where else are you looking to invest?
Overall tax burden (not just income tax but property tax, sales tax, excise tax etc), CA is not in the top 10 highest states, it is pretty much average. Only income tax rates are often conveniently emphasized and overall tax burden is ignored because that paints a particular narrative.
Per FBI data, California also has 10 cities in the top 50 safest cities in the country (minimum population size of 100K), when you look at violent crime rate and property crimes. I also grew up and went to school in the city that has been the safest city in the country (minimum population size of 100K) for 14 consecutive years. After living in several cities across the country, I moved back few years ago. I laugh at the anarchy narrative on fox news because this is the city where 7 cops showed up few weeks ago in 3 minutes after a bunch of bees started attacking a college student. I am not joking, this is not hyperbole, the cops are so bored here given there is little to no crime. Of course, it is not utopia though and every state has its worst parts and there is crime like there would be anywhere else in the world.
I love the weather (cannot put a price on it and cannot quantify this in an excel spreadsheet, it is like putting a price on your mental health), live 20 minutes from the beach, have a 15 minute commute when I am not working from home, great public schools in the city I live in, cuisines ranging from Michelin starred restaurants to food trucks, enjoy the outdoor activities, weekend trips to Palm Springs, Tahoe, Catalina, etc. I am a middle/low end of upper middle class individual and having a blast. Yes, there is a high cost of living but at least it is not NYC or SF (the entire state is not SF, that is its own little bubble) and for what am I getting in return in terms of personal and professional opportunities, I cannot complain.
I personally know at least a dozen people who have been working remotely here for the past 5 years, they could have left to cheaper cost of living areas a long time ago, nobody is holding them hostage, they choose to remain here and are happy. It is anecdotal but all of us here can only only provide anecdotal info based on our lived experiences. The high salaries are also of course a major attraction. Look at the salaries for a UI engineer for a non FAANG company-I recently stumbled upon this on blind. https://www.teamblind.com/post/Splunk-vs-Atlassian-MyFsQNoJ 180k base with 260k in RSUs and 20k annual bonus
Could WFH mean mass migration? I dont know, dont have a crystal ball, but I imagine some would want to leave to cheaper cost of living areas. It will be interesting to see whether companies still pay similar salaries given Zuckerberg is vehemently against paying California salaries when employees move. And if people move or dont come here, even better for me :)
Going forward, I see a lot of good things happening, I hope to see more affordable housing being built, public transit being improved, it will be exciting to see at least how SoCal is by the time the Olympics happen in 2028. I will continue to live my life and be happy here. I am not moving anywhere else, but I hope people can be happy wherever they choose to be :)
Very specific lol. Otherwise enjoyed your post and appreciate the perspective
You’re already anonymous, can you not share which California city you’re in?
Delete delete delete delete delete
Sounds like Orange County, specifically Irvine/Newport Beach.
Has to be Irvine
Yep, has to be Irvine. Consistently ranks the safest or one of the safest cities in the US above 100,000 in population.
get back to us when you have 3 kids and need something larger than 2500 square feet that isn't buttressed against a highway, and with good schools that aren't overrun with illegal immigrants.
I have one kid, might have one more in the future not sure yet, definitely not insane to have 3 kids haha. We are doing just fine. Again, as I mentioned in my post, live in a city with great public schools (people move here specifically for the public schools) and love my home (that is away from the freeways) in a quiet suburban area. Hope life gets better for you, you deserve happiness wherever you live.
This thread isn't about arbitrary company rankings. Scamper back to the IB forum and take your political hot takes with you.
Shoot me a PM if you don't mind. I have a couple questions.
Middle class, population over 100k, pretty safe, probably Irvine. Irvine sucks but that’s neither here nor there.
For me personally no f*ing way would I ever leave the westside of LA. Ever. Period. Nothing comes close caveat being that small starter homes on quarter acre lots cost $3 mil. Reason being so many people want to live here. There were a lot of $1-$2 million houses north of sunset 20-30 years ago. Today a lot of those houses are worth $10-$15 million. Few other places saw that much appreciation during that time.
How do you afford a place to live with a family? Currently looking to make the jump to LA and shit's so damm expensive. Just have to rent/live in smaller homes?
Same, coming from EU back to the US and I had frequented LA for business and would like to continue in real estate there, but as I am recently married I hesitate whether I would ever be able to support a family of 2-3 kids and own a house there.
Like anything, depends on what you are looking for in an RE investment. I view major california markets as safe, low-return markets, vs higher growth markets in more business-friendly areas of the world.
Along with what previous posters have said there is a major draw not going anywhere for a long time - the port of LA/LB. Combined it continues to be top 10 in worldwide activity, has invested/started construction on ability to receive the next gen of mega cargo ships as well as automation. This fact means there will always be businesses that need to locate near a port to allow for 1-2 trips per day from port to warehouse. Socal industrial look sto continue to be solid.
Used to live in SoCal, now live in one of the other states you mentioned. I think places like Chicago are far worse positioned than CA. If anything, I could see more SF people moving south within the state if tech stock comp ever slows/declines. While still expensive on an absolute basis, LA is not too terrible from a cost perspective when compared to other major coastal cities like NY, SF, or Boston. There is nothing in the other 4 states you mentioned that can compete on weather (unless you love the winter and need to live within an hour of skiable mountains).
Edit - Not meant to be a reply to this comment
I live here, have my entire life, and I love it. I'll probably never leave. But I'd like to highlight that most on this forum are likely part of the upper middle class, without dependents, or higher income, which precludes them from experiencing most of the negatives that the working population within our state feels on a daily basis.
I've lived just about every major city you'd want to live in this state and a few places you wouldn't.. Trust me, in places like Riverside and San Bernardino County, South San Jose, Oakland, Sac, East San Diego County, etc.. the cops AREN'T bored. Housing affordability, income disparity, etc. are all major issues here. Homelessness has only been getting worse throughout my life time and business are leaving the state at a rate we've never seen before.
CA is an amazing place to live, again won't be leaving anytime soon, but if it weren't for the weather, this place wouldn't be nearly as attractive.
In my opinion, by far the biggest issues are housing affordability and infrastructure, and they tend to sort of exacerbate one another and add to environmental issues that you can literally see when flying into LA. Housing is so expensive that most are willing to spend 1-2 hours commuting each way from the suburbs to their offices. This is done primarily via automobile, because efficient public transit is basically non existent. Increasing income disparity and housing affordability are problems that have plagued generations of lower income families for decades here and they aren't getting any better.
If you're living comfortably in CA and believe this place to be a paradise, I encourage you to drive out to an unfamiliar part of town and see how the other side lives. Spend an afternoon in Hyde Park or a similar neighborhood in South LA, I bet you'll be heading back to Costa Mesa/South Bay/Santa Monica sooner than you thought.
Development is so difficult to get done here that premium projects are the only ones that will pencil. For this reason, most development in the state has been Class A MF or Mixed Use projects within core markets, which only adds to the affordability issue.
Until development costs come down and/or NIMBYism isn't as prevalent, the infrastructure and housing problems will not get fixed and the inequities will continue to widen.
Look at whats being pushed in Prop 21 and the very draconian measures being implemented as a response to COVID. These measures won't attract development capital that is so desperately needed to revitalize the neighborhoods that are hurting the most.
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