Being a father and a workaholic

Yeah, sometimes shit happens and I’m going to be father at my early 20’s. Even though I’ve never intended to have kids, I know that I have to provide education and be present in this kid life.

I’m not so worried about the challenges of being a father, but in terms of my professional goals. I do have workaholic tendencies and I’m willing to dedicate as much hours needed in order to reach my objectives. I'm young and I still have a whole world to conquer, and no, I’m not interested in working less hours, thanks. The only question is: How the fuck do you manage a 100+ work week and raise a fucking child?

I know that I'll probably won't be the father of the year, but I do care about raising this kid and I don’t wanna be a douche with him.

Anyway, I'm interested in hear your thoughts/experiences on being a father and a workaholic.

 

I don't think it will be an immediate issue unless you became a father during your analyst years (not something I've seen often but it certainly does happen). Even in Banking, the lifestyle becomes reasonably manageable and predictable (up to an extent of course. You're never fully in control of your schedule in client service), as the job changes from analysis/execution to origination and relationship building.

I imagine that life in PE is commensurate, though perhaps with a comparatively better control. This definitely sounds a bit idealistic, but I think most folks should be able to be in a demanding field and still have a great family. It just requires a clear layout of expectations ahead of time, good time management, and knowing the times where spending time with your family takes precedence over work . You might not be able to go to your child's recital/play/sports event all the time, but perhaps you can occasionally. As long as you are proactive about it and really want to make it work, I'm sure you'll find a way to do so :)

But jeez...it will require some tremendous effort to get to the top. Not for the faint of heart in any case

There's a closer meaning to my user name. Try reading it quickly. Perhaps you will then understand ;P
 

Well, i'll become a father during undergrad, so yes, i'll have to work it out somehow during my analyst years. I'm expecting a rough road on the next years, but I think it is manageable.

I know it will require some tremendous effort and luck to get to the top, but committing 100% is the only way I get joy for doing something. Before receiving the news, I was willing to sacrifice almost anything for accomplishing my goals. Now I’m not so sure. Anyway, I still thinking about it.

Cheers

 

Ah I see. In this case I still think you can make it work, though it will take buy in from your significant other (if applicable). This makes your life a world more manageable. A situation where you are working odd and unpredictable hours going up to 100+ makes raising a child almost untenable.

It will be a difficult journey, but in all cases should be quite a fruitful one. Congratulations and all the best to your future fatherhood :)

There's a closer meaning to my user name. Try reading it quickly. Perhaps you will then understand ;P
 
Best Response
Hedgehog2017:
Yeah, sometimes shit happens and I’m going to be father

Describing the beginning of fatherhood as 'shit happens' is not a great start.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
 

Didn't pull out.*** Lol. Man the chick got a good deal on you & is cashing in your IB pay-check. Child support is a MFer (my friend pays child support for 2).

Work hard, work clean, & most of all do not give up.
 

"How the fuck do you manage a 100+ work week and raise a fucking child?"

We can only provide so much insight given that we don't know the entire scenario. Are you going to live together? Are you simply sharing custody or are you staying/getting "together"? Does she work at all? What does she expect from you? Etc....

Short answer to your question: You won't be raising the kid, she will be.

Monkey see. Monkey Doo [Doo].
 

Agreed there are many pieces to the puzzle, but the real short answer to "How the fuck do you manage a 100+ work week and raise a fucking child?" is that you dont.

You may financially support the child and/or mother, but you will not be raising the child or even really a father figure if this is truly how you plan to operate. Kids sleep..... alot. Even my 4.5 year old still goes to bed at 730. If the kid is sleeping when you get home and sleeping when you leave, not a lot of room for "raising" the child.

My suspicion is that you'll either lose the hard ass attitude or the girl and kid in the foreseeable future.

Note: you can work hard with a kid. I did and still do at times, but 100 hours/week in a client facing role with that attitude while trying to be a dad is no bueno. If you have any heart, you'll soften up once you see your son/daughter born - most do.

twitter: @CorpFin_Guy
 
accountingbyday:
If you have any heart, you'll soften up once you see your son/daughter born - most do.

Yeah, i'm pretty sure i'll soften up, even tough there's a part of me who still wants to conquer the world hahahaha.

Do you have any tips about managing working hard and being a father?

 

I spend the morning hours with my family and work past their bedtime. I also try to block off the weekend as much as possible for them. It's still incredibly hard.

It all depends on your wife, if she's staying at home then go ahead and work 100 hours a week, just know that she's raising the child. If she's working, then you both really owe it to the child to try and find a work life balance that makes sense. Good luck.

Also, generally try to chill your attitude out. Now's your chance to make good on the promise you made to yourself when you were younger that you would do better than your dad. Be a man. Be a real dad.

Be excellent to each other, and party on, dudes.
 

From what you said, you don't seem to spend a lot of time with your family (I’m not judging you, btw). I’m interested in hear how you manage that. Is it about quality time spent together?

 

You hit the nail on the head, it is all about quality time. 1-2 hours in the morning (you have to wake up at 6), protect as much weekend time as possible and enjoy every second, take the pressure off your wife.

All things considered, it's actually not bad. If I worked 9-5, I would have 2 more hours in the evening (child goes to sleep around 7-8) but I do get that time in the morning. It's not as if I would have 5x more time if I worked a normal job because all of the evening hours, child is asleep anyway. The weekends are the key. You might want to laze around and play video games or watch football, but need to engage with your child - and that becomes very rewarding in its own right.

Be excellent to each other, and party on, dudes.
 

I work 80+ hours often, and I don't have time for a relationship. But hey, my boss at least let me attend VSFW, so there's that.

But how the fuck do you have time for a child and a 100+ workweek? No, you don't.

GoldenCinderblock: "I keep spending all my money on exotic fish so my armor sucks. Is it possible to romance multiple females? I got with the blue chick so far but I am also interested in the electronic chick and the face mask chick."
 

Not a father myself, but my dad was exactly like this...worked liked a maniac for most of my childhood. I would see him for 15 minutes per day if at all and that was not quality time. It was him eating something before he went to pass out from exhaustion.

Thankfully, I didn't grow up to be a screw up or anything, but I essentially had to figure out everything in this world by myself as I basically had an absentee father. He taught me how to shave and that's about it. No father/son talks about anything ever.

Looking back, I understand why he did what he did, but at the same time, I don't get why he had to work 80 - 100 hours. Why not work 60 to 70 hour work weeks and at least have a little time for your family.

If you really plan on working 100+ hours per week, I don't think that there is a scenario where your kids won't have some resentment in the future, especially if you're only doing it to get more money that you don't need or to boost your own personal self-esteem through a "successful career".

My advice: put in a few years of really hard work at first and then find out longer term how to work a little less. But if you love that next bonus more than your family, then don't of course.

 

That is most likely what I am about to do. There is no easy escape to the ib hours in the first analyst/associate years, but the road get a lot of smoother through de years.

 

I think OP might be trolling. But regardless...

I worked with a guy in Biglaw who was a midlevel associate with two young daughters and a stay at home wife. He worked 80-100 a week and was absolutely crushed. He would leave at 4 AM every day for months on end, and be back in by 10. I was the junior on his team, and he would confess to me that he felt like a "fake father". His wife tried to be helpful, but really could not understand the demands he faced at work, which didn't make it any easier on him.

This guy had to leave our firm and go in-house for a few months before being able to come back and renegotiate with our partners about being able to work from home on fridays, in order to see his kids more. He's had varying degrees of success actually being able to take those fridays.

Basically your whole life will be work, and trying to squeeze your kids in on the side. Forget about working out, having hobbies, etc, you're just going to be too beat for that.

Array
 

So when you say "sometimes shit happens" does this mean you knocked up a one night stand, or a girl you've been dating casually or a long term girlfriend who you've known for quite a while? Not judging at all, I ask this because those situations are completely different and it can either be a nightmare or an ok situation depending on what the deal is.

 

Yep, a one night stand. It was really an accident. To make things even worse, the girl is not exactly intelligent, so I do not expect any financial stability provided by her. I’m basically on my own in providing financial stability. At least I study Engineering at the best university in my continent, so I might have some good professional opportunities.

It is a lot close to a nightmare, but I’ll have to pull that off. I’m only interested in finance, so I guess I won’t have a choice of not working like a maniac during my first years.

 

I hate to be an asshole but did you really think you'd work 100+ hours and have financial support from her......I feel obligated to ask: did you bang Wonder Woman?

Assuming you aren't in some financial engineering program, is it common for engineering students to get hired for finance roles out of school where you live?

Having a bit more clarity on your situation, I hope you recognize the significance of this woman's ability to influence how the kid perceives you. If you aren't physically in this kids life (not showing up to events, not living with them, etc.) and are only providing financial stability, she wields incredible power in how this kid will view you. If you truly don't want to be some dead beat, POS dad in this kid's eyes and want to have a career where you "conquer the world", I hope you treat this woman like a f'in goddess.

Monkey see. Monkey Doo [Doo].
 

Actually a blessing in disguise as she will stay home and take care of the child. If she were intelligent and career-motivated, you would have to balance the business of both of your schedules, and that's even more difficult.

Be excellent to each other, and party on, dudes.
 

This is not an either or situation. Work is on a spectrum. There are only 168 hours in a week. You still need to eat and shower and commute and of course sleep. Trust me when I say sleep is very important and has a direct impact on your ability to perform at work and be an effective parent.

So let's say you are sleep deprived and only get 6 hours / night. You're not at your best but you are surviving and it's somewhat sustainable (vs getting 5 or less). That's 42 hours a week. That only leaves 26 hours for the rest of your life including a child, who's schedule isn't going to just magically match yours. 100 hour work weeks simply won't work.

My advice is take on a career that is finance related (if you insist since you're studying engineering), but not a finance career with banking hours. You can work 60 hours a week and have a solid career, and still be a good father. You need time in quantity for it to be quality, it's a myth to think you can have quality time in extremely short bursts. I think even 60 hours is pushing it a bit, but it's doable with remote working options and working a bit after kid goes to sleep etc.

Your work life is a marathon over 30-40 years and if you plan longer term you can still become rich and have a solid career without sacrificing some of he best years of your kids' life. You don't get it back and you potentially ruin your chance at a good relationship with your child (the first years are so key to this).

I had to take a slower route and it was difficult at first. In hindsight, it was totally worth it. I missed a few years of good upside and career progression while my peers are further ahead. But I'm comparing myself to absolute rock stars who came up during boom times. Compared to the average I'm doing incredibly well. But my kids are older now and I've been able to see a path forward to much bigger career advancements and associated pay. Best of all, I have a great relationship with my kids. As difficult as it was convincing myself during that time, in hindsight I would not trade it for anything in the world.

Bottom line, you're gonna go through a lot of emotions early on. You need to focus on the bigger picture and be clear headed about the trade-offs you need to make and when you need to make them if you want both. And that will mean taking your career slightly slower earlier on. If you can think long term, you'll be fine. So the real bottom line is, don't be stupid. We all know kids and family is more important, we just don't want to admit it because we get our kicks competing in the work place. But that's a pretty dumb life strategy. So figure out how you can have both over the long term and just decide that your kids will be higher priority. If you're smart and you're good at what you do, you'll still find a way to make money...it just takes a bit longer, not a big deal.

 

I may not expressed well, but I know that 100-hour workweek isn’t sustainable. I already worked that amount of time in some projects through some months of my life, but I know that it is impossible to work like that for years, especially after my early 30’s. In general, I feel comfortable dedicating an insane amount of time for a task and I would not care to work really long hours through small periods (like some months) if necessary.

Anyway, this is one of the best career/life advice I’ve ever received. Most of advices that I received is both of extremes: either go for the mediocre life and be a good father or go for the professional goals. I have no idea what a good slower route to me would be, but I’ll definitely think about it.

Since I only learn through my own mistakes, I’m almost sure that I’m going to pursue an IB career anyway, but I will always think about an Plan B if I see that not able to attend my kid needs. It’s really difficult for me to get convinced. Nonetheless, you gave me a lot of food for thought. Thank you.

 

I almost got a panic attack when I read this and it isn't even remotely connected to me. Too late for you but for the others out there, if you don't want to knock someone up you need to be VERY fucking careful. If you are near blackout drunk, I don't care how hot she is, don't take her home. You need to be sober so that you "don't be a fool, make sure to wrap your tool" and even while doing that "when in doubt, pull out!" This happening to me would be a nightmare of epic proportions. But, since you've entered the Niagra rapids on a canoe and the waterfall is coming up fast, you need to accept your fate. A lot of how you handle it will depend on whether you are getting married or just writing checks every month and seeing the kid at holidays. Bottom line is that you are going to be a dad. Do your best to not half ass it for the first few years while your schedule is hectic and likely all will be well. Good luck to you.

"I'm talking about liquid. Rich enough to have your own jet. Rich enough not to waste time. Fifty, a hundred million dollars, buddy. A player. Or nothing. " -GG
 

You panic at the first moment, but after some months, you calm down. Of course, this is a life changer, but it’s no different than something like losing your parents. You definitely survive.

I wasn’t near blackout drunk, but I was definitely drunk lol. And yeah, this is not a mistake you make twice. To all of you folks, do not make a habit of fucking girls after drinking a lot. Eventually shit happens.

 

You'll do fine. My uncle got a kid at 24 while working as a junior banker in NY. It was pretty shocking to him too, but he got through it and handled it like a pro. You will too.

If anything, the child actually turned out to be the big driving force in my uncle's career... He was hungry to provide big for his family, and second to get himself out of the house as much as possible lol

First thing he did when they found out was order the girl to go live with her parents. She, and eventually the child, would be seen to (and financially assisted) while he would bust his ass in New York unfettered and save up money. They lived like this a good two years.

Dropped the idea of grad school, his BB gig, and setting a family home for an out-of-the-blue M&A gig at an oil giant in Cali because of "more money and prestige", which took him out of the house 95% of the time.

Yes, he wasn't a great father because the wife and child rarely saw him, but he made up for it by shaping his arrivals into that of Santa Claus on Christmas Eve. Buy/give the kid a lot of fun, happy and highly memorable experiences only his dad would provide for him.

I don't know you situation, but don't try taking it all completely on your shoulders. Work with your "partner" and your families. They should be able to help out in some way, they already have experience in child care and development, they should understand the importance of this time.

And lastly, please do not treat the baby as a disastrous burden. It is not his or her fault to be coming at an inconvenient time for you. It is a new life, and one that is your flesh and blood. Finances and career situations aren't permanent, they're constantly changing, but new life is special. So, take a deep breath. Smile... and congrats, Dad. This should be a proud and special time for you. Your first child.

 

Thanks for the words.

It is not easy to relax due to the level of uncertainty associated with this moment, but I am sure this journey as a father will bring a lot of joy and it definitely won’t be something that I’ll regret in the future.

Does your uncle kids have some resentment about your uncle workaholic tendencies?

 

I don't think the word "resentment" has ever crossed their vocabulary. He was more of a stranger than a parent up until the youngest was maybe 11, but when he stabilized he dropped everything he had on those kids. So much so that they are now in the very fortunate position of never having to work a day in their lives... the youngest currently lives in Switzerland on daddy's money.

Yeah, they're not complaining... It all evolved from him working for himself and his ego into him busting his brains so they would never have to.

 

Don't mean to be an ass, but not too sure about the motherly value of a chick who doesn't use birth control while fucking random drunk dudes.

To be fair, agree, child is a child. Not his/her fault. Bad form to abort just because your situation isn't going to be easy for the next few years. I'd put emphasis on the career. The girl may leave you and take the kid, but you'll always have your corp rank.

 

No matter how wealthy you are, your kids have to earn things. If you just buy your kids stuff without them earning or deserving it, then it won't mean as much to them, and they'll feel entitled to just get more stuff.

If they realize that hard work comes first and rewards come later, then they'll be better off than if they just expect to get the rewards (without earning them through hard work) since "Dad makes a lot of money."

When they're young, earning rewards can mean doing chores, doing well in school, being respectful of parents, taking care of their things, etc.

Anyway, that's the short version of my answer. I don't feel like typing much more.

 

Agreed with Model21. My family is relatively wealthy but I had to work my ass off to earn something when I was growing up... and I am VERY thankful my parents did that. It was very rare that I was given something without having to do something first. Obviously I didn't understand when I was growing up, but now that I look back and see a lot of those kids that were given things for no reason I see exactly why my parents did that.

If you give you pamper your really bad kids growing up, they are in for one hell of a surprise when they hit the real world because nobody is going to give a shit where they came from or what they THINK they should be doing.

 

My dad made me work at his business full time when I was 14 years old and he paid me $20 a week. It took me two months to buy a state of the art CD player...a week later Ipods came out.

You guys had it easy, pfft.

 

My parents made me pay my way through undergrad using money I made in the summers with the promise that they would pay it all back to me when I finished. Keep in mind that my tuition was only 8000 because it was in Canada. Me and my siblings all got the same deal.

In high school they gave me the option of being in an intensive sports program (20+hours) and getting an allowance or having a part-time job. If I did either of the options I would also get a cheap car, if I didn't, I would get fk all.

It worked for me, but my brother is a bum, so it's hard to tell what works.

 

I totally know the kind of person you've described.

I don't necessarily think how my parents raised me, is why I am the way I am. To be honest, I've had lots of things just given to me, but the fact that my parents don't expect much of me or don't think I'm capable of doing a lot has made me motivated to prove them wrong. Combine that with the fact that almost all of my relatives and cousins are all successful means that if I didn't work hard to get into something like banking, medicine, or law, I would be seen as a total failure. Also, I'm aware that the all the lifestyle I live is an expensive one and I need to make enough money to support it in the future. No one wants to downgrade their lifestyle and I don't like the idea of living in debt. I guess my competitive streak also makes me want to do banking.

 
 

being a father is a interesting experience. I am a workaholic myself but my wife and I planned our son. It will change a lot of things and it will require your presence more than what you are used to. With that said, as much as I wanted my son, I wasn't ready for the level of joy he put in mylife and how much I was willing to put aside in order to be in his life as much as I could.

 

Don't have kids until you're in your late 20's. Spend the majority of your 20's with your girlfriend / wife doing things you can't do once you have kids.

If you're 22 when you start out, you can do 2 years in banking + 2 years in a hedge fund + 2 years in an MBA program. When you're 28 and you have a more steady job like a PE senior associate role with a partner track, then you can consider having kids. If your girlfriend / wife is younger than you, you can probably wait longer if you want.

 

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