Being socially conservative on the street

Anonymous Monkey's picture
Anonymous Monkey

I've read that Wall Street is fairly socially liberal. Being moderately socially conservative myself, how will that look to my boss/coworkers? Is it better I aim for a "Tier 2/3" city and if so which ones?

Comments (183)

Jun 24, 2020

No one is going to give a shit about your political views at work, especially if you keep them to yourself, which is what I would advise.

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  • Intern in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

no one talks about politics, show up and work that's it

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Jun 26, 2020

That couldn't be farther from true. People talk about politics all the time. Everything from the federal election, local elections, Brexit, to Trump. The latter is brought up at least once a day in both the offices I have worked.

You can choose to ignore what is said, but the rhetoric is often quite left-leaning, and if you share your conservative views, you are often looked down upon.

Just a fact of life in 2020.

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  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Jun 26, 2020

Thank you

Jun 24, 2020

define what you mean please, socially conservative could mean a lot of things in 2020. maybe it means you don't want all-gender bathrooms, or maybe it means you believe gay people are evil. context would be helpful.

also, never bring up politics at work. if you obey that rule, this should be a non-issue. if you have a religious thing preventing you from working on the sabbath or drinking alcohol, no big deal, just tell your boss the situation and then get back to work.

Jun 24, 2020

Replied to Leontree with some clarifications. I have socially conservative views that aren't political in nature, but I'm not as concerned about how I will be perceived with those.

Array

Jun 24, 2020

started writing a long reply and deleted the whole thing

  1. don't base your friends off of political beliefs
  2. don't judge others for having opposing viewpoints
  3. become better at navigating awkward conversations. it's perfectly fine to ask to change the subject or just keep quiet
  4. if it's not relevant to your job, keep your mouth shut about it in the office
  5. when you're outside of the office, you're still at work, so imagine everything you're saying being written down and read back to you by your boss

follow that, you'll be fine

Jun 25, 2020

I dunno... maybe I have a different view of things, but the only time discussing politics at work is okay is if it's relevant to what you're doing for a given company and done in a dispassionate manner that shows you understand the impact on both sides of the equation. Pick your industry here, but let's say you're dealing with a client like Google. Dispassionate politics would be discussing the impact of a potential Anti-Trust lawsuit and the impact that Democrat or Republican congress would have on it, or how changes to Section 230 under a Democrat or Republican would materially impact Google's ability to do business and affect a potential transaction.

I do have some great discussing politics at work stories though. I got called a communist by a former boss because I said I thought Jon Stewart was right in saying that Bridgegate was a 3rd Rate Scandal by New Jersey standards. I wasn't talking about was this good/bad, but that this was really a poorly executed if they were doing this intentionally and they should have been caught if that was the case.

Jun 25, 2020

I agree that you should be careful bringing up politics at work because at a lot of companies, it can come back to bite you in the ass, but I personally would prefer to work in an environment where I can speak my mind freely about personal subjects that are important to me, which at times might include political beliefs.

I'm not saying I think it's appropriate to run around screaming about which candidate I support all the time, but I think that having a healthy corporate culture necessitates allowing people to feel like they bring their whole selves to work and feel free to bring up potentially controversial opinions without feeling judged.

There's certainly a point at which the lines get crossed, and better to err on the side of caution, but I don't think that a blanket rule against all political discussion is either healthy or practical (because a lot of things fall under the category of "political discussion").

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Jun 26, 2020

Completely fair frieds. If it's relevant to the job, you can make commentary on that for sure. No argument bro, it's just a good rule of thumb

Jun 24, 2020

Are you saying you are socially conservative like you're adamantly against same-sex marriage and are pro-life, and like to talk about it?

Or are you socially conservative like you don't party?

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Jun 24, 2020

The first although I used the term moderate because I do believe everyone has constitutional rights an am pro life but do recognize that scenarios like rape exist.

Depends on what you mean by "like to talk about it." If a discussion is going one sided I do like to offer a counter and maybe this is one of my fatal flaws. That said I don't believe everyone needs to conform to my ways of thinking.

Array

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Jun 24, 2020

My "like to talk about it" sentiment is really - do you feel the need to start the conversation? If you show up in a MAGA hat, post fox news articles incessantly on your social media (if you follow your coworkers), or walk around saying all lives matter to people who didn't ask for it, you're not going to fit in.

But I've hardly ever seen people get into values based discussions at work. Sometimes politics comes up when it affects business (e.g. tariffs) or around election time. But thats typically more along the lines of "did you see what Trump said, what an idiot", or "Warren wants to ban mergers, what the hell has happened to this country".

If you get offended easily or try to engage the short quips said in passing with a soap box rant about constitutional interpretations, you will be disliked immensely, no matter if you root for red or blue.

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Jun 24, 2020

Please do not talk about this at work.

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Jun 24, 2020

It won't look like anything because you're not going to bring that up at work. Simple as that.

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Jun 24, 2020

Leave your MAGA hat at home and don't talk politics with your coworkers. Simple.

Edit: I take it all back. Bring your MAGA hat to work and talk politics nonstop. Lol, this site, I swear.

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Controversial
Jun 24, 2020
CRE:

Leave your MAGA hat at home and don't talk politics with your coworkers. Simple.

Yes. Conservatives shouldn't talk. Meanwhile libs should force down your throat BLM, drag queens teaching gender fluidity to kids and the idea that trans-women are the exact same as biological women. Otherwise you lose your job.

SIMPLE

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Most Helpful
Jun 24, 2020
CRE:

don't talk politics with your coworkers

...applies to people of all persuasions. I specifically mentioned conservatives because OP self-identified as one. Stop being such a little snowflake, going out of your way to get offended.

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Jun 25, 2020

What I don't like about liberals (I'm neither a conservative nor a liberal) is their one-sided view of freedom of speech. If they don't like what you say they feel it's righteous to make you shut up.

Array

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  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

Lol I had no idea how much heat you've gotten in the past for simply being a liberal. I'm with you man and now I know what it's like to post from a liberal perspective on WSO

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Jun 24, 2020

I wasn't aware I was even expressing an opinion with that one. Flippant, maybe, but good lord - you shouldn't talk politics at work or bring political paraphernalia to the office. Not exactly controversial stuff, here

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Jun 24, 2020

So I want to clarify. I get that the office is professional and such discussion should be avoided. It's mostly after hours convos where I feel like such things will pop up and eventually co workers/boss will find out.

Array

Jun 24, 2020

Why? Talk about sports. Talk about home life. Talk about fishing. Talk about a good book you just read.

No one you work with needs to know your thoughts on controversial social issues.

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Jun 24, 2020

Ok, so the friends I talk to about social issues should basically not work in finance?

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Jun 24, 2020

Seriously, is this your first job? I have only worked at one place where politics was discussed but that was only because we were a little more than co-workers. We were more like friends. I was the lone "liberal" in the group, which was fine. The reason that you might perceive Wall Street as being socially liberal has nothing to do with finance. Wall Street might skew socially liberal because it is in NYC, which has a high percentage of democrats.

Jun 24, 2020

I'm actually still a prospect. That's why I asked in the OP whether is better to aim for a different city.

Array

Jun 24, 2020

I am also from a socially conservative background (Christian family). As long as your views don't interfere with work, I wouldn't bring it up.
Every time I even mentioned Christianity or Conservatism at work it backfired, even other Christians felt uncomfortable discussing these things at work.

One item that could be an issue is the Billy Graham rule, if you want to follow it. Discuss it with HR and go their route. Generally speaking, this should not be a problem either.

Jun 24, 2020
Jun 24, 2020

I can see why Billy Graham followed it but it seems a bit strict for Wall Street (this is probably where my "moderate" kicks in). Do you personally follow this? What is the chance of false accusations?

Array

Jun 24, 2020

If you look around modern office buildings, we kind of all follow it:
- open plan offices
- no locked doors
- social areas with no doors or walls, most likely open plan
- executive offices have glass walls/doors

All line managers in our team are encouraged to have 121s in open plan settings, no closed door meetings allowed for regular stuff.

I don't follow it but I also don't place myself in positions where I am alone with a female colleague - there would also be no chance of this happening anyway, most of our colleagues are male. small chance of ever occurring.

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Jun 24, 2020

That is outrageously weird

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Jun 24, 2020

Nice to agree with you for once

Jun 25, 2020

Lol I was trying to be subtle but I def agree with you here. I've already "broken" this many times in my PT job.

Array

  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

If I'm being completely honest, don't try to work in NYC finance if you are socially conservative. Every single person I know, including much older bankers who are openly republican, are socially liberal. This just comes from the fact that NYC is such a diverse city (nothing like it anywhere else in the world) and everyone is embedded into the culture that empowers diversity. Every bank and even most MDs openly have conversations about politics inadvertently when they push and praise diversity initiatives. I know of many Republican MDs, and they are definitely still socially liberal and love experiencing different types of culture.

I'm not sure why others are saying people don't talk about politics at work, but literally everyone in the office talks daily about how much of an idiot, racist, sexist, etc Trump is. Again, even Republican bankers hate Trump because they refuse to support someone that is so against their moral values (especially when it comes to racism). They've worked well with blacks/asians/latinos/women/LGBTQs their whole careers, so it's just naturally embedded that although they are fiscally conservative, they have to be socially liberal on most topics. It's just how it works when you've lived in NYC for that long. Lastly, you'd be surprised how small the banking world is and how much gossip people have, including with clients. The last thing people want is for a MD to say something stupid and the word gets around and clients refuse to work with you because 99% of clients BBs/EBs work with are socially liberal af.

I would recommend you check out some of the less diverse finance scenes in the country like Houston, Atlanta, and maybe Chicago. In those places, 90%+ bankers are white males and especially in Houston, you can get away with being super socially conservative. You work with oil and gas companies whos executives are old white men who lived in the south/country their whole lives and couldnt give two shits about social justice. Work in NYC and SF, and you will definitely feel uncomfortable every day not just at work, but also outside of work when you see how diverse and liberal everyone is. I can't blame you for your views if you grew up in a non-diverse town and didn't have constant daily interaction with diversity in your life. Unfortunately for you in NYC, people are super unforgiving of anyone who is socially conservative and blame you for your upbringing which you have no control over.

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  • Analyst 2 in S&T - Equities
Jun 24, 2020

This post seems extremely opinionated with no real facts. Every single person you know is socially liberal? Perhaps, but every bank and most MD's having inadvertent conversations about socially liberally policies? Most likely not in public, and definitely not every bank nor most MD's. If they do, then that's unprofessional.

"I'm not sure why others are saying people don't talk about politics at work, but literally everyone in the office talks daily about how much of an idiot, racist, sexist, etc Trump is. Again, even Republican bankers hate Trump because they refuse to support someone that is so against their moral values (especially when it comes to racism)." Again, seems like you are basing reality off of your experiences. Literally everyone in the office talks about politics daily? Not true and if you do, it's based on economics or finance, not SJW bullshit. Unless you're working at a FAANG, then I understand.

"I would recommend you check out some of the less diverse finance scenes in the country like Houston, Atlanta, and maybe Chicago. In those places, 90%+ bankers are white males and especially in Houston, you can get away with being super socially conservative. You work with oil and gas companies whos executives are old white men who lived in the south/country their whole lives and couldnt give two shits about social justice. Work in NYC and SF, and you will definitely feel uncomfortable every day not just at work, but also outside of work when you see how diverse and liberal everyone is." This just comes off as super racist. "You can get away with being socially conservative" - what does that even mean? You can openly say you hate mexicans and lesbians?

"Unfortunately for you in NYC, people are super unforgiving of anyone who is socially conservative and blame you for your upbringing which you have no control over." Again, this seems like some anecdotal evidence you've experienced. Quit trying to tell this kid what he should do with his life based on your poor experience in the city. If you're upset you can't say "socially conservative" things at work or in public, whatever that may mean, then go make a thread for that. This isn't about your feelings for New York.

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  • Associate 1 in PE - LBOs
Jun 24, 2020

Maybe it's not about being too extreme with the comments (race, gay/straight etc), but more or less something like a locker room, if I understand Analyst 1 correctly. Being able to essentially speak freely.

My last job was basically a locker room and while we never said shit that was too far out or blatantly sexist, racist, homophobic, it definitely happened in the two-three man analyst lunches. And it's no ill will either, it just the type of culture some people prefer. But that's not to say you can't find that in NYC, because that's where my last job was lol. I think there should be more focus on firm culture than painting all of NYC with a broad stroke based on someones experiences.

Maybe Analyst 1 happens to work at a SJW firm, I can't blame him if that's his first job in NYC and that's what he sees for every other firm. But don't think all of NYC and its people are like that. You clearly can find like minded people anywhere, even in the largest blue cities in the US.

At the end of the day though, NYC doesn't give two shits if you like her, she's gonna keep it moving with ya ass or not.

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Jun 24, 2020

Mr. Anonymous Analyst, what you just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response, were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

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Jun 24, 2020
Analyst 1 in IB-M&A:

If I'm being completely honest, don't try to work in NYC finance if you are socially conservative. Every single person I know, including much older bankers who are openly republican, are socially liberal.

How can you possibly be serious about this. If you are going to imply something so ridiculous like every finance person in NYC is socially liberal, you should own the comment instead of posting it anonymously.

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Jun 24, 2020

Quite the sweeping generalization of NYC, no? I didn't bother reading past your first paragraph since it's all related to your experience. What makes you think OP is just like you and will hate it?

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  • VP in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

Comical coming from a first year analyst. Acting like you know the political ins and outs of Wall Street at 22.

Honestly, what has happened in your time here that you feel this way? If you ask anyone who knows me, they know I'm pretty right leaning. I'm from Texas, work in NYC, and I don't feel the need to be "socially liberal" at work or on the weekends or whatever. Just be professional with your team and clients. Painting that broad of a stroke does no one any good and people here reading your comment will think that's how it's like everywhere, when it's really your own experience.

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Jun 26, 2020

What made you decide to make the jump from Texas to NYC?

Array

Jun 24, 2020

This advice is insane. OP, do the exact opposite of everything in this post and you're good

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Jun 24, 2020

Lmao at this. I was in a client meeting where the client went off about not wanting to sell to a particular buyer right after meeting him because people of his race weren't trustworthy etc.. Kind of funny because I'm also of that race. The dude was so old I don't think he realized. He even spoke to me about my college days right after. Also he's a politician for the so called liberal party in a liberal state. Our entire team (major group/major bank/nyc) was there no one said a word during or after.

Tl;dr - everyone is racist when they think outsiders aren't listening

  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

Speaking from my experience as well, we were in a huge conference call (30+ people) with a very large and well known client in tech, and their CFO literally said something very similar in the lines of "man I wish we had someone like Obama back in the office, what a shit show Trump has been". No one brought up anything related to politics. He just made a little comment after something came up in the news that he strongly disagreed with Trump

Jun 24, 2020

This post is a fuckin book

  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

Maybe my post was confusing (I didn't proofread it or anything so my bad), but I'm actually a pretty liberal person and posting about how I would feel if I was a conservative working at my bank, which is a BB that does a lot of what you would consider "liberal initiatives". Not sure where to start but I'll point to certain examples where it would be very uncomfortable if you were super socially conservative which I assume the OP is if he is asking these questions.

Diversity recruiting / affirmative action and "inclusive culture": Our CEO, group heads, etc often send out mass emails or say in conference calls how important it is to increase diversity within the firm/team whether thats race, gender, or sexual orientation. As far as I know, every BB in NYC publicly let it be known that they are very socially liberal. Just look at all the banks' logos being changed for Pride Month, speaking out against racism, police brutality, and Trump's ban on H1B for International immigrants following recent events. I'm not sure why I would be wrong to assume that if you're super conservative, you would feel uncomfortable when firms/teams send mass emails out about how they are supporting these causes. On top of this, you are working side by side with someone that is another race or a part of the LGBTQ society. If believing in their identities or their fighting for equality is something you don't agree with, I think it's fair to assume it is uncomfortable to work with them into the late hours every single day if you still have that mindset against them.

After-hours banking: I'll admit again that I do work for a very socially liberal bank (we have chief diversity officer type of roles and many internal organizations for people of diversity for example). My group especially is very diverse and I'd say about 30% are ethnically/racially diverse, 10% are LGBTQ, and 25% are women. When it's after 9pm and it's just the analysts and associates (sometimes VPs) left in the office, we have a lot of downtime when waiting for comments and talk about a lot of things, including political issues. You have to realize that most of us in our early/mid 20s heavily use Twitter, and when you see some fucked up video or news on Twitter, we talk about it right after we see it. I still stand by what I said in that there is no doubt politics will come up in conversations at work. OP said if he hears something he doesn't agree with, he tends to comment a lot on his side. I guarantee you if a bunch of us in the office are talking about BLM or LGBTQ rights or whatever topic there is that is liberal-leaning, and you say something like "All Lives Matter, White Lives Matter too, Black on Black Crime, I don't think LGBTQ is a real thing", etc, I can guarantee you most people will judge you and may be harsh on you.

Idk if this makes things any clearer for people but yes this is me talking as a liberal from my experiences at a very "liberal bank". To be honest, what bank is not openly socially liberal though??

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  • Analyst 1 in IB - DCM
Jun 24, 2020
Analyst 1 in IB-M&A:

On top of this, you are working side by side with someone that is another race or a part of the LGBTQ society. If believing in their identities or their fighting for equality is something you don't agree with, I think it's fair to assume it is uncomfortable to work with them into the late hours every single day if you still have that mindset against them.

Bro... this comes off as extremely bigoted. I don't really know how people can be against fighting for equality, does that bother you? This is a terrible example of being "socially conservative" and you're making it come off as we are all racist and homophobes. Not all conservatives are like that and frankly I don't know any that are. A better example would be if two random, gay men sat next to you on the train and you felt awkward, so you got up to stand. That would be socially conservative. Not wanting to work with or next to your black or lesbian coworker on a late night staff is bigotry and prejudice.

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  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

What? No it doesn't bother me I'm really liberal like I mentioned. If I learned anything from the past month, yes socially conservative people are usually racist/homophobic. If you weren't racist, you should be all for these protests happening right now, you should be happy that your bank is promoting diversity, happy that the LGBTQ society is getting attention to push for equal rights during pride month, etc. Just because you stay quiet doesn't mean you're not racist. Just because you work with coworkers who are different races doesn't mean you're not racist. Take for example that woman in central park that recently got fired who threatened to call the police on that black kid and explicitly say a black kid is trying to attack her or whatever. She works with black people everyday but she's still racist as fuck. I guarantee you when she works with people of color, she is super uncomfortable on the inside.

Getting rid of racism and sexism in society are two of the biggest topics in terms of social justice, so if you are for all these equality issues, then I would not consider you socially conservative. If you are so butthurt that you had to defend yourself and say socially conservative people are all about equal rights and isn't racist, then you're either 1) not really socially conservative like you think you are, or 2) you are racist and you just don't want to admit it

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Funniest
  • Intern in IB - Gen
Jun 24, 2020
Analyst 1 in IB-M&A:

2) you are racist and you just don't want to admit it

now we know youre a liberal lmao

I kid I kid

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Jun 24, 2020

You're making very sweeping statements.

1) "If you aren't racist you should all be for these protests."

Racism is not opposing violent protests and looting of stores (who in fact do comprise of minority owners). Racism is not pointing to objective facts about white people also being a victim of police brutality and in terms of violent crime ratios even more so. Racism is not being opposed to the witch hunt that is going on in social media and doxxing of any strong views that "offends" someone.

Edit: Maybe these could be considered sweeping statements also , but the point in trying to make is its not as simple as "If you don't think exactly like I do on issue X you're a racist."

And well I could go on and on with this. It looks like I've stayed true to me "liking to jump in" and now you get an idea of how I'd respond if someone made the exact claim you did and it was a back and forth discussion.

Array

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Jun 25, 2020

Ah yes the typical liberal who shouts from their ivory castle and believes that everyone is perfect and is just a victim. Do us all a favor and go live in a hood (i.e. Harlem, Brownsville, East New York, even Coney Island (which is where I grew up and was raised in) for a month and we'll see if you still hold your liberal views and you won't come out with "racist" views. Go work in a city pool for a summer in the projects and then tell me that won't change your views. Until then stop labeling everyone as just a racist.

If you're really from NYC and I mean REALLY born and raised here unlike 70% of the people that come from out of the city you wouldn't be holding these views and labeling everyone as a racist.

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Jun 24, 2020

I mean yeah if you told a black dude you didn't like working with him late at night because simply he's black or a lesbian MD you didn't respect her financial acumen, then yes I could also guarantee people will judge you for that. Why wouldn't they?

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Jun 25, 2020

For what it's worth I think it's a mistake to only promote "visible" diversity, for companies nowadays being diverse is being a woman/black/latino/gay, as if they weren't normal human beings and could bring something to the table just by having darker skin, or prefering penises or having a vagina.

Tbh my dream would be a company that wouldn't look at anything like that and to which what would matter would be both skills and character and only this.
It wouldn't matter if you're 75yo, if you went or not to college, if you're black, yellow, a dwarf, a cannibal, a voodoo sorcerer, a geek, a gay, a freak, poor or rich.

Despite all these "diversity" programs, banks fail to achieve true diversity because they are a temple of groupthink, this what they call "fit" and which is intensively used in the recruitment process.

That way whether they recruit blacks, gays or women they are sure to have their perfect army of clones thinking exactly the same way and never going out of line.

Array

  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

Reading comments on this thread, I must admit I was wrong. There are a bunch of closeted socially conservatives on Wall Street. They just don't say anything at work and ignore any social topics when they come up in an office setting. I will no longer talk about politics on this forum, seeing how the liberals always get shitted on.

Also just an observation and a huge generalization, but I also forgot that Real Estate is run by conservatives.

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Jun 24, 2020

You're assuming that everyone here works at the NYC office which is most likely not the case. Definitely a couple do, but not necessarily all.

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  • Analyst 3+ in AM - Other
Jun 25, 2020
Analyst 1 in IB-M&A:

There are a bunch of closeted socially conservatives on Wall Street. They just don't say anything at work and ignore any social topics when they come up in an office setting.

Probably because they're busy living their lives. Shut up about your politics kid and let me eat my Seamless in peace.

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Jun 25, 2020
Analyst 1 in IB-M&A:

Reading comments on this thread, I must admit I was wrong. There are a bunch of closeted socially conservatives on Wall Street. They just don't say anything at work and ignore any social topics when they come up in an office setting. I will no longer talk about politics on this forum, seeing how the liberals always get shitted on.

Also just an observation and a huge generalization, but I also forgot that Real Estate is run by conservatives.

If you view every thread on WSO through the lens of "85% of the users are college kids and of the remaining 15% only a fraction have ever worked for a major player in a major city and only a fraction of those have worked for longer than 6 months" you'll start to understand the dynamics a bit more. It especially makes sense when you break down that 85% because the college kids who go to schools with really good career resources (who tend to be the ones who send more kids to top finance jobs) are less likely to be on the site than those that don't.

Meaning, most of the stuff I read on WSO about what it's like to actually be on the job (not the recruiting stuff) is wrong or not representative and of the good posts they only come from a handful of people.

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Jun 24, 2020

x

Jun 24, 2020

You ever been around the middle market? It is solid Trump country. Especially the clients.

"Work ethic, work ethic" - Vince Vaughn
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Jun 24, 2020

Absolutely

Jun 24, 2020

You'd have to be the coward of the century to choose a different city over that.

Most IB groups won't care. I did work in one group where 2 MD's were aggressive liberals and especially Trump haters. Just kept my mouth shut in the office. Easy to do when you're running around all day anyways.

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Jun 25, 2020

That is definitely a factor, although it wouldn't be the sole factor. There are many different factors In thinking about when determining location. This is especially of relevance because many of the apps ask for location preference and those that don't have location picks later in the process.

Array

  • Prospect in Other
Jun 24, 2020

I'm socially conservative as in I'm social and polite, but I won't bring up any topics I won't bring up in front of HR in a group work setting that would count as harassment, sexual harassment, or contempt against my employer. Don't say or do anything in front of several workplace witnesses.

This is how I'm socially conservative. I do talk about social issue with some of the coworkers who bring it up first but I never explicitly state my view in politics. I try to exam thing from both sides of the coin and explain which side I lean to.

Jun 24, 2020

Lots of conservatives in the street. Some are socially conservative. Lots of military veterans on street. Majority are conservative( and gasp
..voted for trump). No one cares. We all just wanna make money.

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  • Analyst 2 in IB-M&A
Jun 24, 2020

I'm socially conservative but don't work in NYC. I just don't talk about it, welcome to the silent majority.

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  • Intern in IB - Gen
Jun 25, 2020

Well, I'm assuming you live in a liberal city. You think social liberals don't feel the same in conservative areas?

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  • Analyst 2 in IB-M&A
Jun 25, 2020

I'm sure they do. especially in the south. but I would point out that most large cities are liberal in general

  • Analyst 1 in S&T - Other
Jun 25, 2020

My experience working in trading in nyc has been that people are reluctant to say anything pro trump To someone when they're unsure of their political views.

It's actually funny, people will drop hints to recognize if it's safe to discuss conservative viewpoints, like saying MAGA in a chat to a sales person after a big rally in Equities. Maybe it's just the circles i run in, but seems like the majority of my coworkers and friends in finance are Republicans

Jun 25, 2020

Lmao dropping a MAGA after stocks go up is incredibly cringey

Array

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Jun 25, 2020
Analyst 1 in S&T - Other:

Maybe it's just the circles i run in, but seems like the majority of my coworkers and friends in finance are Republicans

Finance is rife with white upper-middle class and above former frat bros... it's not just the circles you run in.

  • Analyst 2 in RE - Comm
Jun 25, 2020
Analyst 1 in S&T - Other:

My experience working in trading in nyc has been that people are reluctant to say anything pro trump To someone when they're unsure of their political views.

this is how it is at my RE firm. One of my first days, someone in investor relations said something about the current state of affairs, and mentioned "those red states" and left it at that. Being new, I just smiled and said yup, but that gave me an idea as to what environment I was working in. Really sucks when you can't truly be yourself for fear of your superiors judging you for something that they really shouldn't care about. But they still do, and who knows how it could affect my future (promos, raises, reviews, etc) at the firm.

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Jun 25, 2020

is "social conservative" still code for "against gay marriage?" cause you lost. there's nothing left to conserve.

heister:

Look at all these wannabe richies hating on an expensive salad.

https://arthuxtable.com/

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Jun 26, 2020

abortion is probably the most prominent social conservative issue

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  • Intern in IB-M&A
Jun 26, 2020

Abortion isn't a big deal I never got why theres a strong objection to it

  • Intern in IB-M&A
Jun 25, 2020

Ultimately, one would be hard-pressed to claim they don't support liberty and justice. But people's conceptions of what these terms entail are very different. And a lot of so-called "socially conservative" views are views are, in fact, in support of liberty, albeit liberty understood differently to how others understand that term.

Take, for example, the matter of abortion. Self-proclaimed "liberals" claim that giving women the choice of whether or not to abort their child promotes liberty. Yet, it seems to support some contrived form of liberty where the rights of the mother are put above those of the fetus -- and the fetus is deprived of his or her right to liberty, and more specifically, to life. There's a very compelling case against allowing women the right to have abortions as doing so enhances, and upholds, the liberty of the fetus.

Just like the upholding of liberty in the form of property requires government to create legal property rights and police to defend it, so too the upholding of liberty in the form of the right to life requires government to prevent some from killing others. And if you believe that everyone should have equal rights before the law, the fetus is entitled to his or her right to life equally as much as the mother is. It is perfectly compatible with liberty, then, to have regulation in place to ensure that mothers don't infringe upon fetus' liberty - and more specifically, their right to life - by making illegal abortion.

I leave you with some John Locke -- the 'Father of Liberalism':

"Freedom is constrained by laws in both the state of nature and political society... Freedom of people under government is to be under no restraint apart from standing rules to live by that are common to everyone in the society and made by the lawmaking power established in it. Persons have a right or liberty to (1) follow their own will in all things that the law has not prohibited and (2) not be subject to the inconstant, uncertain, unknown, and arbitrary wills of others"

"...though man in that state have an uncontroulable liberty to dispose of his person or possessions, yet he has not liberty to destroy himself, or so much as any creature in his possession, but where some nobler use than its bare preservation calls for it. The state of nature has a law of nature to govern it, which obliges every one: and reason, which is that law, teaches all mankind, who will but consult it, that being all equal and independent, no one ought to harm another in his life, health, liberty, or possessions: for men being all the workmanship of one omnipotent, and infinitely wise maker; all the servants of one sovereign master, sent into the world by his order, and about his business; they are his property, whose workmanship they are, made to last during his, not one another's pleasure: and being furnished with like faculties, sharing all in one community of nature, there cannot be supposed any such subordination among us, that may authorize us to destroy one another, as if we were made for one another's uses, as the inferior ranks of creatures are for our's. Every one, as he is bound to preserve himself, and not to quit his station wilfully, so by the like reason, when his own preservation comes not in competition, ought he, as much as he can, to preserve the rest of mankind, and may not, unless it be to do justice on an offender, take away, or impair the life, or what tends to the preservation of the life, the liberty, health, limb, or goods of another."

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  • Analyst 1 in IB-M&A
Jun 25, 2020

Bruh ain't know one fucking reading this shit

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Jun 25, 2020

Fair enough.

TLDR: a lot of 'socially conservative' policies promote liberty more so than those which self-proclaimed "liberals" advocate for, and therefore, you can say to your colleagues that you're a liberal, and make compelling arguments for these so-called 'socially conservative' policies in the name of upholding liberty.

E.g. There's a very compelling case against allowing women the right to have abortions as doing so enhances, and upholds, the liberty of the fetus. It ensures that the liberty of the fetus isn't interfered with by the "arbitrary will" of the mother. It ensures that there is equality amongst persons before the law -- that liberty and rights are "common to everyone in society".

Array

Jun 25, 2020

John Locke's "liberalism" has nothing to do with American political liberalism you fucking donkey

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Jun 26, 2020
Intern in IB-M&A:

Take, for example, the matter of abortion. Self-proclaimed "liberals" claim that giving women the choice of whether or not to abort their child promotes liberty. Yet, it seems to support some contrived form of liberty where the rights of the mother are put above those of the fetus -- and the fetus is deprived of his or her right to liberty, and more specifically, to life. There's a very compelling case against allowing women the right to have abortions as doing so enhances, and upholds, the liberty of the fetus.

oh the same old, done to death and frankly stupid talking point of 'but but what about the the fetus.' Yea but all it does is that shows your ignorance of the matter because majority of the pro-choice people don't support a blanket right to abortion. Most want to cap it at the first trimester anyways which is well before the time a fetus develops feelings, pain, a central nervous system etc.

Fetuses cannot live unsupported, even with a respirator before 21 weeks. Cannot feel pain before 24 weeks because they do not yet have the brain connections to do so. >90% abortions happen within the first 3 months.

so you can have these views. You have a right to them. But they are stupid.

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Jun 25, 2020

In my experience in finance, the MAGA people are the most vocal about politics not liberals. Honestly I'd rather not discuss any sort of politics at work but some of the MAGAs in the office just can't help it - they must have a conversation no matter the setting. I discuss politics with my friends (at least one of who is MAGA) and family, don't care to speak on it at work.

On that note, I am glad I am not at the office during this BLM resurgence. Almost positive one of the MAGAs would've said something that would be annoying af.

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Jun 25, 2020

In all honesty, if you're bothered by "liberal" political views at work on Wall Street you should consider another city. Not because of the industry or work, but because you probably won't be happy in your social life there.

I can't speak to Wall Street views, I work in conservative CRE Banking, but I've lived in NYC. But it's not like WS is Hollywood. In my experience, wealth and conservative views tend to have a lot in common.

NYC could potentially be fun and good for the career if you're not miserable. If you want to work with only like minded people, try Commercial Banking in Arkansas, or even Texas or Atlanta.

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Jun 25, 2020

Slightly sidestepping the question but I doubt T2 cities such as Chicago/Houston/Philly would be any less socially progressive unless you are living in some country club enclave (maybe Phoenix).

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  • Intern in IB - Gen
Jun 25, 2020

Financial industry as a whole lean socially left. Industries that lean socially right would include manufacturing, farming, coal mining, and religious institutions.

Jun 25, 2020

Why be so binary? I noticed people like to be put into boxes, left, right, big, small, black, white.
To me it's still a mystery why there are only two political parties in the US, democrats and republicans, all being limited to their own views.
Democrats have to be pro LGBT, pro social security, pro minorities.
Republicans have to be anti LGBT, anti social security, anti minorities.
I don't know at least that how I see it from the talks I read on Reddit and what little access I have to your culture, but I feel like some critical thinking may be profitable to both sides.

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Jun 26, 2020

Which of these cities have you worked in? Would you be willing to share your experience? Do you know anything about Atlanta/Charlotte/Dallas ?

Array

Jun 26, 2020

They're all cities where finance careers are largely made up of republicans.

Jun 25, 2020

If your definition of "moderately socially conservative" is "gay people shouldn't be allowed to get married" then yea fuck off out of NYC you ape

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Jun 25, 2020

Not only would you find it difficult to fit in with your coworkers, you would find it extraordinarily difficult to fit in at a large city such as New York City.

Sorry, but your socially conservative views won't be welcomed by New Yorkers.

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  • Intern in IB - Gen
Jun 25, 2020

OP, it doesn't matter what you do, as long as you never listen to this user.

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Jun 25, 2020

Chill man. Why the grudge? Lmao

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  • Intern in IB-M&A
Jun 26, 2020

So when you say socially conservative, what groups of people do you think shouldn't have rights?

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Jun 26, 2020

I guess I'm a bigot for not thinking 6 years olds should get permanent sex-change operations

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Jun 26, 2020

I said I was moderately socially conservative.

Also why did you feel the need to post this anonymously? Is this question written in bad faith?

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Jun 29, 2020

There appears to be a high correlation between those who think all Republicans are racist and those who are too afraid to actually confront those 'racists'

  • Associate 1 in IB - Gen
Jun 26, 2020

Politics is a part of life. It cannot be avoided, no matter where you go - especially nowadays, with so many pressing issues in the fore of the national dialogue.

Don't be overly-sensitive and run from politics you disagree with. I don't agree with the assertion in this thread that most finance people are liberal, but even if they were, this shouldn't impact your choice of where to work.

I have spoken about politics with colleagues before, and with clients - it comes up from time to time. As long as everyone comports themselves with dignity and mutual respect, it's really not all that difficult. Generally speaking, the IB set are a rational and emotionally intelligent crowd who know how to navigate sensitive conversations with poise.

If, however, you're the type of person who can't have an adult conversation about issues with two sides without flinging verbal excrement, you need to reconsider whether you're cut out for a white collar job that involves serving various types of clients out of a cosmopolitan city. We're here to do a job, not to brandish our shiny opinions at one another. Anything you do which damages the pursuit of that objective just demonstrates that you're an amateur and not to be trusted.

More to the point, if you regularly find yourself saying or doing the following, you should be more worried about yourself than the political opinions of others:

  • Using the words/phrases "snowflakes", "libs", "cucks", "lock her up", "orange man bad", "trumpkins", "trumpsters", "deplorables", etc. - if you're an adult, you should be capable of espousing your support for political ideas without incorporating troglodyte dog whistles like the above into your conversation. Watching people use these phrases in any context is like watching a pig wallowing gleefully in its own shit, and it's about the clingiest thing I've ever seen when people do it in real life without the cover of anonymity. At that point, before I even question your political views, I question your maturity and polish on a fundamental level, because it makes you look unhinged.
  • Treating political topics like zero-sum verbal skirmishes where you have to win all the chips. Politics is the art of mediating different viewpoints in the context of human society, not the art of "pwning those [insert opposition here]". If you can't handle the fact that issues like abortion, minimum wage, immigration, etc. are nuanced without a capital-c "Correct" viewpoint, then you're not mature enough to be having these conversations. If you can't discuss these topics without forcing the conversation into an uncomfortable and conflict-prone stance, then you're not mature enough to be having these conversations. I absolutely cannot stand people who insist on wheedling and provoking others with their brash proclamations in these nuanced conversations. They sound like absolute morons and it's frankly embarrassing to watch their lack of self-restraint play out real time, face to face.
  • Not knowing when to shut the fuck up about it. You're not a genius. The odds are overwhelmingly that you have nothing novel to contribute to the conversation. You're not more enlightened than the others, so if you find a situation where expressing your views cannot be disentangled from looking like a sanctimonious asshole, then maybe just be quiet instead. This one particularly concerns me, as OP has expressed that he cannot stand by while others say things that are wrong. Why not? People do that shit all the time, in political conversations and otherwise. You're not the messiah, you need to learn to let it go and focus on the bigger picture, which is being the bigger person and keeping your eye on the ball at work/in your social life. If you truly believe that you have all the right answers to the hot button issues of today, it sounds like you have a major ego problem that you need to overcome.

Not an exhaustive list, but hope this helps.

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Jun 26, 2020
Associate 1 in IB - Gen:

* Using the words/phrases "snowflakes", "libs", "cucks", "lock her up", "orange man bad", "trumpkins", "trumpsters", "deplorables", etc. - if you're an adult, you should be capable of espousing your support for political ideas without incorporating troglodyte dog whistles like the above into your conversation. Watching people use these phrases in any context is like watching a pig wallowing gleefully in its own shit, and it's about the clingiest thing I've ever seen when people do it in real life without the cover of anonymity. At that point, before I even question your political views, I question your maturity and polish on a fundamental level, because it makes you look unhinged.

This - I see this so much on here and other social media sites. It's sad seeing people act like a child when they get their toy taken away. Calling someone a snowflake or a trumptard, really just makes me wonder what kind of a person you are and how you live your life at home, not your political stance. Goes both ways on the spectrum and it really seems like both parties are becoming parties of children.

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Jun 26, 2020
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Jun 26, 2020
  • Intern in IB - Gen
Jun 26, 2020
Jun 26, 2020
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  • Analyst 3+ in IB - Gen
Jun 27, 2020
Jun 30, 2020