big 4 --> Controller --> VP/C Suite?
Hi!
A common big 4 route appears to be reaching manager then moving into a controller position at an F500. I also hear that VPs generally need experience across the finance department. Presumably having followed the big 4 to controller route, one would not have the broad experience required to move up to VP/CFO?
How much of a hinderance will the lack of finance experience (Treasury, FP&A) be when moving from the controller position towards VP/ C suite?
At the controller level, do you gain experience in FP&A/Treasury as a controller (hence getting the broad range of experience)?
How do controllers that have followed this route (big 4 to controller) normally move up?
Thank-you
Csulcy
Not necessarily. It really depends on the responsibilities as a controller. At MM companies, a controller may serve as a CFO in certain aspects that are more broad than standard accounting. You may be involved with hedging, FP&A, international finance strategies, etc.
However, for larger organizations, more breadth would be helpful. You gain minimal FP&A and Treasury experience at that level.
So if an ambition was to get to VP level (at a mid-large firm) as quickly as possible coming from big 4 audit, would the fastest route be going into controllership after reaching manager at big 4? Specifically would it be better going into a controller role at a mid cap company where one may gain a broader range of experience, or would it better going into a more narrow role at a bigger company?
"A common big 4 route appears to be reaching manager then moving into a controller position at an F500."
Sure, but "controller" is very vague, as a CFO is just a high level controller. So you have plant controllers, segment controllers, BU controllers, division controllers, sector controllers...all the way up.
"I also hear that VPs generally need experience across the finance department. "
Certainly useful, but not necessary in my experience. Vertical ascension in controller roles with increasing responsibility seems to be the norm, once again in my experience.
"At the controller level, do you gain experience in FP&A/Treasury as a controller (hence getting the broad range of experience)?"
FP&A certainly. Treasury...not so much. So you'll deal with cash flow management and capital investments...but you aren't working with the capital markets in any way.
This is from a F50 perspective. Smaller & MM firms will have very different ansers. Theres some good stuff in here //www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/best-way-to-executivejunior-exec-roles-a…-MBB-consulting-1-more-q from harvardgrad, once again aimed at a large corporate.
I think you need to do more research as to what a controller does. Essentially you would be head of accounting/finance at a plant, or head of accounting for a business unit or division. It is primarily accounting work.
I also don't see the big4 to controller as a given. you may have to come in as a SFA or manager for a couple years first. Controllers are often the high performers and yes those positions are often paths to upper management. also keep in mind that you don't go controller to VP. Director is inbetween the two and easy to get stuck there, although comp is good.
I've heard of people going straight from Big 4 -> Controller, but not at F500s. These were guys with 10+ years of experience.
Note that my data points on this are very limited, those are just the anecdotes I've heard.
Yeah I meant to say not directly from manager in Big4 to Controller
Any chance you can explain what different levels of big 4 can exit to (in terms of hierarchy) at a F500?
E.g Big 4 manager--> Finance Manager
I'm not positive on roles you can transition to from each respective Big4 role, however I do know the typical Corp fin hierarchy.
In general it's FA --> SFA --> Manager --> Sr Manager --> Director --> Sr Director --> VP -->SVP --> C-level
Now, controllers can fall in different areas of the hierarchy. Generally a divisional controller will be similar to a sr manager or director in the hierarchy. The Corporate Controller is usually the Chief Accounting Officer (C-level or SVP)
Controllers at plants are usually equivalents of manager or sr manager depending on the size of the operation and the company. Controllers at a plant that supplies a region, may have a title of CFO/Controller of said region. Ex: CFO/Controller of South America. This type of role is a director equivalent, and often people in such a role would transition out of said role to a Sr. Director or VP role.
One thing to keep in mind is that the longer you stay in Big4, the easier it is to get stuck on the accounting side of things once you transition to corporate finance. I've seen this happen to some, while others have broken out of said mode, but it has taken time. One example is a Director (He made sr mgr at Big4, then manager at a smaller F500, then came to my company as a Director) However, he was stuck in a accounting director role for the first 3.5 yrs at my company. He just got into a global operations finance director role.
So in general I'd say the following: Big 4 Sr --> FA/Accountant or SFA/Sr. Accountant, Big 4 manager/Sr. Manager --> Finance or accounting manager. After that, who knows.There isn't anyone I know at my current company who is a controller directly from Big 4.
@"D M" you are correct. Lots move from Big 4 to Controller or even CFO, but they are generally Partners or at least Sr. Managers from my experience. Possibly a manager if you are moving to a start-up or small business.
Looks like your questions have been answered, but wanted to add some of the common traits and experiences I've found to be most desired to progress to the senior F500 finance levels (CFO, VP, Director). In no particular order:
-Experience as a controller, preferably multiple progressive controllerships (plant, division, group) -Experience across multiple divisions and locations within the company -Experience in multiple areas within the finance function (traditional accounting, FP&A, commercial finance, treasury, etc) -MBA, CPA, CMA -International Experience -Public accounting experience
The level you come in at from big 4 is less important than ensuring you check as many boxes from the above list as possible.
Thanks for your post!
Just for some clarification, when you say experience in multiple areas within the finance function; will being at the plan/division controller level normally fulfil this requirement? OR by your statement did you mean you should have different jobs within each function? E.g job title: treasury manager, FP&A manager etc.
Also by international experience, does that mean you have to work in a different country (would being on a secondment meet this requirement?). Or does it mean you have to work in a department that interacts with different international operations.
By the way I am still learning about CF, consider me a complete novice, pardon my ignorance!
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