Trying to break into Investment Banking at a late stage in my undergrad.
Hi all,
I am a graduating senior at NYU and looking to break into Investment Banking Division.
For me, I realized my future lies in Investment banking really late. It was not until I got out of Korean army service and came back to continue my studies as a Junior. I had an interesting experience while in the army. I was working with officers and sergeants to re-create financial planning for the battalion. And this past summer, I was in one of the big 4 consulting firm conducting due diligence for the client's cross-border acquisition. I thought these were very relevant experience as far as the details of work went.
But since I am graduating real soon and do not have any experience in IB, it seems really hard for me to even be noticed! so I am asking for advice!
Thank you for reading my story, any advice will be so much helpful and greatly appreciated!
Best.
You're in NYC so your opportunities are endless. Try to network your way into a boutique/small firm that doesn't have a structured hiring process. There are so many Stern Alums on the street. After you do a bout a year or so at the small firm, net work your way to a BB. It worked for a guy I know and now he's in a good group at a top BB. It's doable, plus you're where the action is happening. Just start sending emails now.
+1 equiTee
Even though you didn't serve in the US military, start reaching out to as many military veterans you can drum up on LinkedIn as possible. It is hands down the most helpful and tight knit community on the street. I would imagine the shared military experience with an allied nation would mean most people would be willing to reach out. Even if the response rate is less, I would still imagine it is multiples higher than most school alumni networks.
Breaking in I-Banking - Too late in the game? (Originally Posted: 01/02/2014)
Hi WSO!,
I am currently a third year Finance student at McCombs (UT/Texas). Starting out at McCombs I thought I was set on doing F500 corporate finance. I really struggled my first year averaging a 3.0 GPA and then slowly improved to a 3.35 my second year. since and I should see further upward trend from here on out.
Coming into McCombs I came in with quite a few credits and so I decided to take a gap semester off my third year to do a 6 month internship at The Boeing Company (Boeing Commercial Airplanes division) in their corporate finance division doing Financial Planning and Analysis in Seattle (I will also be returning my junior year summer). Right off the bat I will tell you that the work/life balance was great. Honestly that was the only thing I really enjoyed about the corporate finance lifestyle. Other than that the work wasn't very intellectually challenging or "sexy"/"exciting" and the people I worked with were plain average joes and weren't very "intellectual" as well. These are the two main reasons why I hate the corporate finance lifestyle.
It was in the middle of my internship that I wanted to research more challenging finance career paths with great exit options (I would like to end up in Venture Capital eventually) and I came across investment banking. It was also then I was introduced to this wonderful website. I have come to realize that my odds at a bulge bracket are almost non-existent so I am tying to at least aim for Middle Market or Boutique banks if that's even possible. I took the advice I saw on trying to get a feel of the industry by cold calling/cold e-mailing people via my alumni network and through other contacts I knew. Guess what: NO DICE! Things took a turn mid November (right before Thanksigiving) when I had the chance to have a phone conversation with an alumni from McCombs working in RBC Capital Markets in Houston. I had an informational interview with him and things went well, but afterwards I tried following up with him quite a few times and no reply at all or contact at all
Now here I am on New Years trying to figure out a game plan and seek some wisdom to get into I-Banking. There are a few minor roadblocks though. This semester was spent at my CF internship at Boeing and my next semester will be spent studying abroad in Paris so I won't have an opportunity to at least resume drop for summer analyst positions which means I would HAVE to do Full Time Recruiting. This is where I need your guys' advice and help on whether I should bother continuing trying to break i given my GPA and my previous work experience (corporate finance seems to be on the bottom rungs if not THE bottom rung of the corporate finance ladder) as well as the fact that Full time recruiting seems exponentially harder than Summer Analyst recruiting. With this I wanted to ask you guys a few questions:
1) Previous work experience is a huge deal when it comes to getting an interview with a bank it seems. How will my work experience in corporate finance at a Fortune 50 company (The Boeing Company) will fare when it comes to interviews?
2) Has the switch from a F500 internship to Investment Banking full time ever been done? I have used the search engine on this and can't find any situation/question being asked? Is my only option now to wait for MBA and then transition into banking afterwards?
2) How much more difficult is recruiting Full Time during the school year vs internship recruiting for a Summer Analyst position? Are the expectations even higher?
3) Assuming the worse of the GPA situation (where my GPA stays the same at a 3.35 going into Full time recruiting). Is this enough for FT recruiting for Middle Market/Boutique banks? What is the GPA range for such banks?
4) Finally what should I do here on out? I am going to continue to network my ass off but aside from that what else should I do?
I apologize for the meaty introduction/dilemma. I am hoping some of you will help me out!
Gad to be part of the WSO community!
Thanks
P.S: If any of you are wondering why I will be returning to Boeing for my summer internship its due to the fact I will be studying abroad next semester so I don't have access to On Campus Recruiting so I am trying to play it safe
You missed Super Week man; it's pretty much over. Your best bet now is to kill it over at Boeing for a couple of years and get accepted into a rockstar MBA program, then try again. Corp. Finance would've looked good on your resume had you dropped it for all the Super Week positions and had you had a decent GPA, but that ship has sailed. Even boutiques have a cutoff of 3.5-3.8. Just make sure you get into an MBA program that banks actually recruit at, preferably Ivy League (which is why you'll need to work a few years first so the focus will be on that and not your lackluster undergrad). The good news though is that you'll go in as an associate and be making more serious bank from the start. Good luck man.
I really appreciate your response user. Essentially I shouldn't even bother with dropping a resume for FT recruiting next fall, correct?
Don't give up hope man - keep cold-calling/networking. That's your best chance by far, but also cast your net wider by focusing on mm/boutiques; gpa cutoff is w/e considering you're coldcalling.
Disagree w/ above poster - you may hate IBD, why spend 4 years working in a CF position/attending MBA and then trying to break in as an associate? Test the waters first and see what it's like as an analyst and if it's what you really want to be doing.
realistically, you can also look into delaying a year. McCombs (particularly BHP) is enough of a target that it's worth it.
I know plenty if great boutique investment banks that have deadlines in late February so you are not "late". I would compile a list of them and start applying and networking with people at those firms. corporate finance is great (I had an internship as well F500). The important thing is to find a way to explain why IB over corp. finance (maybe how you would like a broader perspective and ability to work with multiple clients vs just a single company; maybe the work culture is boring and slow paced in the group you work in?)
As long as you network and have a solid story explaining your passions, mistakes, and future goals in IB, I think you still have a chance. Good luck!
Boeing is good. You should continue networking for MM/Boutiques and you should be ok.
Thanks for the feedback guys. Much appreciated.
@"ygi68592": Do you happen to know some of the MM's that have february deadlines specifically?
Message me and I'll get to it sometime this week
Having only just decided to pursue the IB route, what are my options? (Originally Posted: 01/04/2015)
I'm a graduating senior with a 3.7 gpa who is pursuing a degree in Management Sciences at a non-target school in the US. I have only had one wealth management internship. It wasn't until about a month ago that I decided that IB was the way I wanted to go and understand that I am way late in the game as a result. That being said it has been difficult figuring out how to orient myself toward landing summer internship opportunities. I realize that my best chance lies with boutique firms but at this stage in the game I don't know if networking is still an option given my situation or if i'm only left with cold-emailing.
Presently I am spending my days emailing as many local boutique firms as I can and studying all the M&A tech knowledge I can find. Are there any other ways to reach out to bankers if I live in a town with little to no investment banks? Any websites/books you guys can recommend for technical knowledge practice (already checked out M&I, Macabacus, and am currently working my way through Rosenbaum's IB)? When you guys cold email is there a reason you choose a particular MD? General advice/ guidance?
Cheers!
You should strongly consider doing an MSF. It's much more difficult to get an internship for after graduation.
A very common tip for students in your situation is to first focus on landing a full time job after college, while networking with alumni and boutique banks on the side. A gap in employment will look bad on your CV (I know this from personal experience) so if you can land a consulting or Big 4 accounting job in lieu of an IB offer, it is possible to transition to an MSF/MBA program.
"Redacted" Is my situation that dire? And what do you think about "Red3"'s idea of beginning in consulting?
"Redacted" Is my situation that dire? And what do you think about "Red3"'s idea of beginning in consulting?
"Redacted" Is my situation that dire? And what do you think about "Red3"'s idea of beginning in consulting?
"Redacted" Is my situation that dire? And what do you think about "Red3"'s idea of beginning in consulting?
"Redacted" Is my situation that dire? And what do you think about "Red3"'s idea of beginning in consulting?
Meh, I don't know if dire is the right word. I assume you've already reached out to any and all alumni in IB that you can find? The majority of banks don't do internships following graduation. There will of course be exceptions but these are hard to come by.
Another option would be to extend an extra semester and graduate in December. This will give you the chance to do a traditional SA stint.
If your UG school does not have a presence in IB then the benefit of an MSF is that it gives you an additional alumni base and you can target a school that historically places well on the street.
I'm not thrilled about the idea of trying to lateral from consulting to IB unless you can go to a really solid firm (doesn't have to be MBB). Big 4 to IB is doable. In my experience though, you're are in such a unique spot with people wanted to help you when you are still a student.
Full disclosure: I went straight from UG to MSF and used it to get into IB.
"Redacted", Thanks. I have very little IB presence at my school but I'll keep knocking on alumni doors. I'll keep the idea of an MSF in my back pocket as well. Appreciate the advice!
"Redacted", Thanks. I have very little IB presence at my school but I'll keep knocking on alumni doors. I'll keep the idea of an MSF in my back pocket as well. Appreciate the advice!
Only just decided to pursue the IB route, what are my options? (Originally Posted: 01/04/2015)
I'm a graduating senior with a 3.7 gpa who is pursuing a degree in Management Sciences at a non-target school in the US. I have only had one wealth management internship. It wasn't until about a month ago that I decided that IB was the way I wanted to go and understand that I am way late in the game as a result. That being said it has been difficult figuring out how to orient myself toward landing summer internship opportunities. I realize that my best chance lies with boutique firms but at this stage in the game I don't know if networking is still an option given my situation or if i'm only left with cold-emailing.
Presently I am spending my days emailing as many local boutique firms as I can and studying all the M&A tech knowledge I can find. Are there any other ways to reach out to bankers if I live in a town with little to no investment banks? Any websites/books you guys can recommend for technical knowledge practice (already checked out M&I, Macabacus, and am currently working my way through Rosenbaum's IB)? When you guys cold email is there a reason you choose a particular MD? General advice/ guidance?
Cheers!
Start from reading other monkey's stories. There are many great stories from where you can learn much quicker in HOW TO.
Good luck!
The Wall Street Prep Accounting Crash Course and Excel Crash Course are good, check them out. It's going to be hard getting an Investment Banking summer internship as a graduate. You're competing with sophomores and juniors who already have the technical expertise, keep hustling though, persistence works, and building new relationships never hurts. In regards to networking, stick with junior Investment Bankers for now - Analysts & Associates. If you're still in exploration mode, and still learning about the industry, I wouldn't risk messing up a conversation with a senior Investment Banker. Junior Investment Bankers come and go, Analysts jump out to the buyside (PE & HF) in a couple/few years,senior Investment Bankers will be around longer. In regards to a summer program, check this out:
http://www.nyschooloffinance.com/ http://www.nyschooloffinance.com/semester_dates.html http://www.nyschooloffinance.com/advantage.html
You get the education you need, financial modeling & valuation/etc, and an internship. Once you complete the program, you'll have completed an IB internship on your resume and be much more qualified for an entry level IB job. Apply to FT IB jobs after this program.
Also, this is a post from someone else in WSO: this is a free accounting course from a professor in BYU, now he teaches at HBS. I'm sure this will help you a ton! Good luck and send me a message if you need help.
http://www.learnaccountingforfree.com/
This site also has some good and free resources on wall street training nyift dot com
Look into a MSF to get back into the game and further your knowledge. Go on weekend trips to NYC/large regional hubs. Keep up the good work--you have some nice resources to study from at this stage. Cold email should typically focus on analysts and maybe associates and then MDs/VPs if those guys refer you to them.
Changed mind -- too late for ibanking? (Originally Posted: 12/13/2006)
I'm a 4th year senior at a top 3 public (top 25).
I was planning on going to law school but I realized that I am more interested in investment banking.
I know most of the BB firms have filled their incoming analyst class. But what about MM or boutique banks? I'm looking for a analyst position in or near the Washington DC metro area.
Can anyone recommend some banks for me?
Thanks in advance.
http://www.fbr.com/ (energy- legit).
http://www.harriswilliams.com/ - Richmond, VA. Their analyst class is probably full.
know a partner at FBR, i'll ask them if there still hiring
lakerlax thanks a lot. I know it's a bit late in the game but I hope something turns up.
Why the hell do people prefer to tell what they think their school's ranking is rather than just simply stating what school you go to?
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