I'm considering going back to school for a Master's in Finance, but I'm not sure I'm making the right decision. I graduated school in May 2009 from a big state school with a degree in Economics. Due to personal problems my undergrad experience didn't go the way it should have, so I graduated without relevant internships and a mediocre GPA (3.5).
I ended up getting a job a couple of months after graduation, but it's the epitome of a dead end job. I've been trying to network the past three or four months to try and land anything related to finance, but I'm not getting anywhere.
I've been thinking about an MBA or an MSF. I don't have the work experience to get into a top MBA program, and I don't want to waste the next 4 years in a dead end job only to still not have the work experience necessary for a top MBA. I'm thinking I could attend a good MSF program, get a good internship, and move on to a much better job (not banking but at least finance related).
Does this sound like a reasonable path? Does it make sense to go back to a MSF program 2 years out of undergrad? Also, fun fact, I'm 30k in debt from undergrad, but I think I'd be able to pay off a good portion of that by the time I enroll in a Masters program.
Paging Anthony to this thread
Bump to Anthony: Can I hit you w/ a PM about this?
Check out his blog too...i found it really helpful
www.msfhq.com
Someone (Anthony?) correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the key is to try to "look young" on paper if you'll have 2 years between UG and MSF, and thus internships>FT work, but take that with a grain of salt b/c I'm no expert.
Hahah
Thanks guys. I was actually at a recruiting event all day and met some great contacts at some more programs.
Do an MSF. You have some WE (close to 1 year by the time you apply). That will help your application and you will still be in the analyst range. Get a decent GMAT and you should be golden.
I worked for 3+ years and then went for an MSF. I had trouble with recruiting (capital markets stuff) because I was clearly out of the analyst pool. I received numerous job offers for MBA type roles, but I came to Villanova on a mission. I interned in the spring semester, but I know people in the program interning in the fall also. You will be able to try for banking jobs again or you can go into something more competitive outside of banking. On top of that you can save your MBA for later.
Check out my website (www.MSFHQ.com). Every MSF program out there is listed. This will give you a good idea of the universe of schools along with placements and stuff like that. Once you get a better idea I will be more than happy to work with you, provide you contacts and alumni at various schools, review your resume, etc.
I went to Villanova for my MSF, but I am pretty fair and balanced when it comes to giving advice. Not looking to be a shill for the school, but provide top quality advice and help.
Someone much better looking than yourself already plugged your site man
Hahah touche
lol since when is a 3.5 gpa "mediocre" what the fuck community college are you at that grade inflation is so rampant?
Yeah, that 3.5 comment stood out. I think you would be a solid MSF candidate for the core schools. Depending on your GMAT and math abilities you might be a decent shot at Princeton & MIT.
i was under the impression that the princeton msf is exceedingly difficult to get into - is that not so anthony? for some reason i thought of it as 'if you're super quanty, went to an ivy league school with a 4.0, and worked at a BB, you can apply'
could be entirely wrong...
that's what i thought...they seem to be on a whole different level. i think a link to some princeton msf resumes were posted in a thread not too long ago, fyi.
double post, my bad
I think the level of math Princeton requires is what sets it apart. Once in the program allows for a general MSF program vs. a MFE type program. The Princeton program in my mind really stands between an MSF and a MFE. They take a lot of industry people and a lot of European people, but I don't think someone with a 3.5 is automatically excluded. You just need really good math experience and a great GMAT.
A 3.5 from a large state school with 1 year or so WE and a decent GMAT will get you admitted to most core MSF programs.
Yeah, plus the MFin at Princeton is their only graduate level business degree. You are not in the shadow of an established MBA program. That really means a lot. Princeton is one of the only MSF's I have seen that places into Associate level positions. Really impressive. Gold Standard IMO.
Hmmm, interesting. An MSF never really crossed my mind until now, but I'm in BB Corporate Finance (MO) and want to be in the FO. I'm planning to network my brains off, but don't know how likely I can make the switch. I do though have pretty maxed out grades (from a top 40 non-target) and GMAT (especially math). Maybe this is something to look into...
Are the only MSFs that place reliably well into IB the very quanty ones like Princeton? I would consider doing one if that's the best way, but my plans are more IB --> PE and/or Industry, so learning stochastic calculus (part of Princeton's program) seems a bit unnecessary...
Princeton places extremely well. They also place into associate roles which is a rarity among MSF programs. A lot of less quanty programs place well, but they are regional. MIT is a little less quanty than Princeton, but it costs 80K. Nova places well in MM banking, but we have had some success breaking out of that role. I will be updating our placement stats sometime this week or next.
Vanderbilt does very well. I really like the school and the program. Every student I have met is top notch. WUSTL is a little more math intensive, but does very well also. I know a few people there also if you want.
Check out my site, tons of placement info and stuff on there. Really need to decide where you are comfortable working. The MSF degree is great, but it is still relatively new. If you are in a good spot and dont mind your work you might want to just keep at it and get your MBA in a couple years.
Anthony I go to UT Austin now and will most likely be working in Dallas when I graduate and was wondering what you thought about getting an MSF in night school and any specifics about the UTD program.
Thanks
I don't know too much about the UTD program. Typically satellite campuses are not as respected as the main campus so you might have a stigma attached to the degree. Night time degrees usually mean no cohort and I think being with a core group of people adds something to the program. I would recommend the UTD program if the MSF will advance your current career. If you work in government it might make sense since you get a bump in pay for having a graduate degree. Other than that I don't think they are too serious about the degree.
It's a crazy world out there. Here's the resume of an indian student at Princeton MFin: http://www14.speedyshare.com/files/24906947/download/dhruv.PDF
Yeah, Princeton is an interesting program. You see a lot of people going to it instead of an MBA. A lot of people with MBA's go to Princeton also. Resumes are available online for people who do some searching.
...
"It's a crazy world out there. Here's the resume of an indian student at Princeton MFin:"
What the fuck. A VP trader at a BB? With a degree from MIT? Is that the norm at Princeton?
Anthony:
How would you compare Princeton (in terms of job placement) to the top MFE/MSQF programs like Berkely & CMU?
I think the job placements for Princeton will be much more varied and deep than a top MFE. Princeton has people going into S&T, Banking, PE, HF, etc. Basically banking,trading and quant positions. This stems from the fact that they are pretty quant while still maintaining the broad based finance education.
Top MFE programs are really training you to be quants. I suppose you could do something else, but the level of math and programming kind of pushes you into a quant type role.
I think salary and prestige wise, both are the same. Quant at Goldman vs associate at Goldman in banking are both bad ass. One will be more technical and the other will be more traditional. Different strokes for different folks.
What the MS in Financial Engineering DOES have over the MSF right now is the caliber of schools offering the degree. I love Villanova, but I am realistic and realize that people want brand names and people want Ivy league schools. Right now Princeton and MIT are the only "top tier" schools offering an MSF degree.
Wow, did not expect this to get that many comments, but thanks a lot for the feedback. Anthony I was hoping you'd find your way to this thread. Great site that you've got set up.
I've only taken Calc I, and that is really the extent of my math courses. I'm guessing that rules me out of most quant heavy programs like Princeton?
Also, does it matter that my work experience is pretty bad and not finance related? Do they just want to see full-time work?
[/quote]What the fuck. A VP trader at a BB? With a degree from MIT? Is that the norm at Princeton?[/quote]
no, that's just a cv someone emailed me because it was so accomplished for an MFin student. I had a friend interview for MIT Mfin last year and from the interview he asked about typical candates. Apparently MIT/Princeton and some top MFEs had a barage of older ex-Lehman (and other similar) guys applying which they obviously picked over the usual younger candidates.
MSFs are for quants. Oh no you are!
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