Didn't get the group you wanted
Incoming SA at a BB-
Found out last week that I didn't get the group I wanted, and now am looking for advice on how to approach the summer. What should I do to make sure I don't get screwed for FT?
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It's not like getting placed into your second choice group is the end of the world. What firm could you possibly be working for where there is only one good group and all others are just shit in comparison? They all do somewhat similar work.
Getting a FT offer is hardly getting 'screwed'.
I guess I should rephrase my topic- I realize I sound like a pretentious prick and didn't mean for it to come across that way.
I'm obviously very thankful to have a FO position at a leading BB. I guess my main question is- how do you go about trying to do a good job in your group, even if there's another group you'd rather be in? Granted you might end up falling in love w/ the group you ultimately got placed in, but what if your initial hunch is right and you hate it? I've always heard that switching after SA is very , very difficult - is this true?
Also, will members of the group you're in as an SA really vouch for you to move onto another group if you did a great job? It seems kind of like they'd want to keep you in their group
Just work your beotch ass off.
Dude, first get an offer than think about FT group placement...
I guess it depends more on the bank, but once you have an offer it shouldn't be too hard to switch groups. Assuming you have an offer, the bank has a vested interest in keeping you. Work hard...get the offer and worry about switching groups after the internship is over. From my experience, the main difficulty is explaining to the new group why you want to switch.
Dude, be an absolute bitch to your boss for the summer, get the offer - then think of switching. Signalling you're thinking of switching during the summer could be the impetus to you NOT getting a FT
HELP! Undesirable Group Placement (Originally Posted: 06/25/2010)
I start FT as an Analyst in a couple of weeks. I got placed into possibly my least desirable industry group. I would like to be in another group which I thought I had a strong shot at (eg. got along very well with the team, talked to MD of group regularly during recruiting). How do I approach this situation?
Should I just suck it up, or is there a polite way to go about requesting to be in another group?
Thanks, guys.
Suck it up for 11 months. Stay in contact with the group if you can. Then shoot the MD an email and say you'd like to do an internal transfer.
Might be tough to change without looking whiney, especially when they have you earmarked for that group. How undesireable are we talking about, metals and mining or what?
If you're in Canada, metals and mining (if PJC guessed correctly) is actually pretty good - good deal flow.
I'm going to guess Real Estate.
switching at 11 months sounds bad
real estate or fig? And no, switching after 1 year is standard.
why is fig bad? I know a guy at GS FIG who before the end of his 1st year is already getting calls from the likes of blackstone etc...
what's peoples' opinion on doing FIG in London?
I'm based In Canada, and it's in an industry where i currently have little to no interest in, and has low deal flow.
Is the consensus here to just stick with it?
Just stick with it. It's kind of tough to complain just before starting because, 'what do you know - you just started!' is going to be everyone's view, or that you're just whiny in an environment where there's a ton of people willing to take your spot without complaining. Stick it out for awhile, and keep in touch with the group you had a good rapport with - then make the switch later on, a yr later.
Alright, thanks folks.
to EnteringRealLife: kids in top groups get calls from hh in first 8-10mo. the calling starts from gs tmt/ms m&a and trickles down to gs fig/nat res, cs/baml/jpm sponsors/levfin, and such. don't have too much insight into when top boutiques get calls
to new1987: that's the worst mentality - you're just an unambitious fuck
to bobbylou: stick with it for first year, but make sure you're one of the top analysts. top bucket analysts are known even amongst other groups when groups collabo for deals, so it'll be easier for transfer. if you're looking to jump ship to pe after though, make sure you tell the story right/in a favorable light
so if your not in those tops groups, how do you get a piece of the top funds? would reaching out the recruiters 8 months in work instead of waiting for them to call you?
Some people are ambitious, some are unambitious; some people also have good or bad luck.
Exactly. In the quant groups, first year analysts could develop a really strong reputation for competence. Once you had that, everyone wanted you working with their group.Consistently do a good job and try to anticipate your coworkers needs/questions before they even come up. As an analyst, I spent my first 18 months not considering myself above anything. The admin needed help moving chairs and books around? I was there to offer her a hand. You see people working on something tough, and the first thing you ask is, "Is there anything I can do to make it easier for you on this project?" Unemployment back then was 6.5% and I was scared to death I'd lose my job- and I at least wanted to prove I was worth at least $15/hour. After 18 months, so many people are asking you for things that you get to choose what you want to work on and claim that certain things are higher priorities than others (until your immediate manager says otherwise.)
Believe me, you WILL get calls no matter where you are if you're good and at a marketable firm with enough people coming and going. People will leave, they will give recruiters/headhunters your name, and you'll get calls from people representing hedge funds.Try to stay in one spot for two years. But believe me, you'll get calls well before that happens.
Best to stick it out. Become a rock star analyst in your group and try to learn as much as you can if you ever plan to do a transfer. You'll need that skill set anyways to get to your next job. You can complain once you have skills people want, otherwise you're in the same bucket with everyone else.
Contact headhunters once you figure out what you want to do (PE, HFs, etc), have developed a good repoire with at least 2-3 people in your group to vouch for you for recs (all of the group is helpful as even non-recs will be called without your knowledge), studied enough to breeze through technical and fit type interviews, and have relevant experience within your group to back up everything else.
If you don't have those things..your best bet is to go do the same job at a different group or bank. Jumping to another group after 1 year is bad bad bad..typically people move to different firms for that.
If a manager consistently keeps taking people into his group that other groups overlook, but those people turn out to be really competent and get "promoted" to "better" groups, it might be annoying for him to have to keep replacing people all the time, but it also looks really good for him as a manager in general.
If I had someone working for me as a developer on the desk and he got moved into algorithmic trading after a year, I'd be thrilled. It would be nicer if I got 18 months out of him before he left, but if he really wanted to work in prop trading- and since everyone on the desk knows each other- I'd be a lot happier for him than I'd be irritated that he switched groups "early".
If you are doing banking, and you are trying to move to another industrial group...it's not going to be easy to do it within the same firm and bankers aren't going to understand your situation even if you are competent. I've seen it happen where people try moving around..and it happens after you've completed at least 2 years. If you're lucky maybe 3-6 months sooner...
In the end you need to be good and if you want to leave after a year, you need to go to another firm. Those are the only scenarios I've seen in the banking...it's political system and most bankers and even HR will try to prevent these type of things because you start to set a precedent for other disgruntled analysts.
Transferring mid-office to front-office after a year..I can't really comment on.
BTW I did have a friend jump ship from 1 firm to another after like 3 months but that was because he wanted to move closer to family (NY>SF)...good luck. Let us know how it goes
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