Difference between a MiM and Ms in Finance

Hi,

basically, by reading the title, some of you might wonder why I'm asking this question that can sound stupid or easy to answer.

I've googled this question and I couldn't find an answer here or on any other websites.

While browsing through a few career development pages on university websites, I found out that a lot of students attending a MiM program actually end up in investment banking, financial services, Asset Management, etc position.

Why do these people do not attend a finance degree? What's the point of taking a MiM if you're going to work in a finance related job?

I hope that what I'm asking makes sense and I am wondering if I'm the only one having questions about this topic

Comments (43)

 
5/23/12

A MiM is a one year, graduated degree in management and business sciences. The Masters in Finance is a one year, graduate degree entirely focus on finance.

If you have a liberal arts background, not a lot of math or business classes, etc, the MiM might be the optimal degree for you since it would provide that business education that you do not previously have. If you have a finance background you can really choose either degree.

Both the MiM and MSF will place you in banking if you work at it, but the MiM will provide more of an advantage for consulting or other types of non finance related careers. The MSF will provide you with an advantage if you are looking to work in finance and targeting places that might not have the resources to bring everyone up to speed all at once.

In the US the main MiM programs are Duke and Wake Forest. Duke places as well into banking because of the brand and quality of education coming out of Duke. Outside of these two schools most specialized business degrees with banking placements are MSF programs (UT-Austins MAcc being the exception, but most likely no longer with the advent of their MSF program).

Hope this helps. Let me know if you want further clarification.

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5/23/12

Thank you for your answer!

Considering that I am pursuing a bachelor's degree in business administration and that I know that I want to work in IB. A masters in finance would be a better choice (?) BUT what would be the positive and negative aspects of doing a MiM instead?

 
5/24/12
MEvolutionToday:

Thank you for your answer!

Considering that I am pursuing a bachelor's degree in business administration and that I know that I want to work in IB. A masters in finance would be a better choice (?) BUT what would be the positive and negative aspects of doing a MiM instead?

Brand is a big factor. A Duke MMS might be a general business education, but the Duke brand will go further than a specialized masters somewhere with no OCR or little alumni help.

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5/24/12

If you already have a BSBA and plan on working in Finance I personally don't understand why you would get a MiM over an MSF.

Search WSO and I'm sure you'll find many threads on this but TNA's comment is really good.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_of_Managementh...

 
5/25/12

The UVA MS Commerce degrees are also highly regarded from what I have read but I don't think you can apply if you are a BSBA.

 
5/25/12

Yeah, the UVA program is great. I put that more into the MSF category with the caveat that you can't have a business undergrad. Interesting enough though, you CAN have an econ undergrad (which I consider to be pretty interchangeable with finance/business).

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5/25/12
TNA:

Yeah, the UVA program is great. I put that more into the MSF category with the caveat that you can't have a business undergrad. Interesting enough though, you CAN have an econ undergrad (which I consider to be pretty interchangeable with finance/business).

yeah I found that interesting.

There are two different "tracks" to the UVA program.

The Financial Services track - more MSFish

And the Management and Marketing track- more MiMish.

 
5/26/12

Thanks for your input.

Basically, a guy like me could either do a MiM or MSF to end up in finance, but depending on the brand.

(From a european point of view) A LBS MiM would be much better than an unknown university MSF. Then again, a MSF would be better than a MiM, at, let's say LSE?

Again, the sloan MSF will be much better than the LBS MiM, if finance is my goal?

 
5/26/12

Yeah, I'd be interested in finding out whether a MiM from LBS is better than their Masters in Finance programme if the goal is HF/PE or asset management? I would naturally be more interested in the Finance programme, but it requires 2 years work experience.

Also finally, how would a MiM from LBS compare to a Finance programme from LSE/Cambridge/Imperial if the end goal is again HF/PE/Asset management?

Thanks.

 
5/27/12
Impossible_Living:

Yeah, I'd be interested in finding out whether a MiM from LBS is better than their Masters in Finance programme if the goal is HF/PE or asset management? I would naturally be more interested in the Finance programme, but it requires 2 years work experience.

Also finally, how would a MiM from LBS compare to a Finance programme from LSE/Cambridge/Imperial if the end goal is again HF/PE/Asset management?

Thanks.

For the first question, I'm pretty confident about saying that their MSF will give you MUCH more than their MiM if you want to work in finance.

 
5/29/12
Impossible_Living:

Yeah, I'd be interested in finding out whether a MiM from LBS is better than their Masters in Finance programme if the goal is HF/PE or asset management? I would naturally be more interested in the Finance programme, but it requires 2 years work experience.

Also finally, how would a MiM from LBS compare to a Finance programme from LSE/Cambridge/Imperial if the end goal is again HF/PE/Asset management?

Thanks.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think the LBS MSF is post-experience.

You would have to ask more people about the second question, but from my limited research/experience/knowledge I'd guess an Oxbridge/LSE/Imperial MSF would be better.

 
 
5/29/12

dont think it damages nor does it replace unless you have work experience and go to something like princeton or sloans or etc that will give you an 'associate' placement

 
5/29/12

yeah agree, in my experience if you dont have the work experience you'll still only be considered for an Analyst position.

"I can calculate the motion of heavenly bodies but not the madness of people"

 
5/29/12

MSF/MiM are not viewed by the people hiring as a replacement for MBAs, because you cannot replicate real working experience. If I was going into IB I would consider going back to a target MBA program. However, being on the S&T side of the business the odds of me going back for an MBA are < 5%. I can only see myself getting an MBA to leverage a career switch. Odds are I'll do the CFA and be done with it.

I cant see how MSF/MiM would hurt someone as lon as they made good grades

 
5/29/12

Thanks! I guess the only problem with doubling up on the Master's degrees is student loans...

 
5/29/12

Well i have a MiM degree from ESCP which is a top MiM school in the EU, and i think it works really well as a replacement for an MBA degree, especially in the wee years of you career. You get excellent job opportunities at top companies in every sector, though granted the levels offered are entry or mid management positions. But then again the MiM students usually have less than 2 years of work ex, so it is a good start for them.

As for doing an MBA later on, well i think it will be counter productive as i already have most of the skills an MBA grad has and have almost the same education. After a few years of work ex, there hardly will be any difference between me( a MiM grad) and an MBA grad.
As for the last question on whether an MiM will harm your chances for an MBA. Well on the contrary it will greatly increase your chances of acceptance. An MiM will give you the brand of a great school plus loads of other skills which MBA schools greatly value. Add to that the work ex gained at an awesome company after graduation and you have a winning MiM application.
You can google "MiM Essay" to check out much more information about the MiM degree and the schools that offer it.

Hope the answer helped.

Abhyank Srinet
Founder at www.MiM-Essay.com

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5/29/12

The GRE is going to make or break your application. I'd focus on that right now. Imo, as a history major you'd probably do better gpa wise in a MiM.

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5/29/12

Add Ohio State, they are generous with schollys. As to which is better for careers it depends, Duke opens a lot of non-finance doors to you. Most people go into one of the following 3: Finance, Marketing and Consulting. So if you're not IB or bust it may be a better bet.

 
5/29/12

Thank you for the suggestions. Are there any other MiM programs that you would recommend me applying to?

 
5/29/12

Wake, it's a decent program and cheap, also generous with the schollys. Virginia is a great program.

 
5/29/12

Thanks, I'll definitely check out Wake Forest. Unfortunately I don't meet Virginia's requirements, but that program certainly sounds great too.

 
 
5/29/12

Do you have work experience?

 
5/29/12
 
5/29/12

Thanks for the answer. Well, I do have a bit of experience like 3 internships in non-finance position.

To be clear, some friends tell me that if I go for Bocconi, it will be harder for me to find a job in France or London than if I go to ESCP. They tell me that people recruit Italians only if they speak italian for their desks that are in charge of Souhern Europe! However, it still seems to me that Bocconi has a very powerful brand recognition in Finance??

 
5/29/12

Spain for Finance? Unless it's IE..

do you have schools' offers yet??

 
5/29/12

Yes, Master of corporate finance at Bocconi or Master European Business at ESCP! I only applied to those two masters. Any idea what to pick?

 
5/29/12

aim for the top brands and settle for the highest you can get.

excluding cost concerns of course... that you have to solve your own equations

 
 
5/29/12

Are you asking a Masters degree vs. Business Minor? If you are a senior and need extra time for recruitment, I'd say Masters.

 
 
5/29/12

Personally, I'd go MSF. @TNA has done a lot of work on this, just search the boards.

I'm talking about liquid. Rich enough to have your own jet. Rich enough not to waste time. Fifty, a hundred million dollars, buddy. A player. Or nothing.

See my Blog & AMA

 
5/29/12

MMS programs don't place as high in IB for a variety reasons (background, personal preference, class size - duke is like 100 kids with a ton of internationals which dilute placement stats).

Here is my opinion. Placement are a function of personal effort, school brand and performance in the program.

If you're a liberal arts grad you'll probably do better in a management program vs a finance program. All the schools you're looking at have a great brand name. It will be up to you to prep for interviews, use the schools network and execute when you get the super day.

Placement reports are good, but people too often think past placements mean they will automatically get a job. Not the case.

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5/29/12

None of these will get you a job and this comes from a Durham grad. Durham has strong and well respected undergrad programs, but business school is an embarrassment to the university. I personally knew people in msc finance and I can assure you that placement is not good.

Did you apply to the other programs in Europe? I have done some research on finance masters and I came to a conclusion that it's best to be at Oxbridge, LSE, Warvick, Imperial, HEC Paris, Bocconi, SSE, St. Gallen.

 
5/29/12

Hi,
I'm sorry but you wont land a job in IB and definitely not in a BB with any of these degrees.
You dont have any previous experience and those two schools are tier 3.
Please do not take this personally, but unless you're really extremely well connected, your profile sounds less then sub-par.

To compare: I go to a tier one school, had 6 previous internships in banking and it was really, i mean REALLY, hard to get a good IB job. I've finally done it but it was after a full year of hassle. Same for all my friends, some have CVs which would blow your mind and they have not found anything yet.

Just give it up. Go for the MSc in Management, because it's broader, and try to get into consulting, bottom tier banking (maybe) or (like most people) in a big MNC.
IB is dead anyway.

Best of Luck!

 
5/29/12

Can't really say anything about Durham, but have some idea about EM Lyon.

First, you absolutely have to speak French fluently if you want to work in IB in Paris (or France in general). If you did, you could manage to get an IB gig from EM Lyon since almost all major IBs (except GS) recruit there. Since you don't, the UK and Ireland are your only IB opportunities.

Breaking into IB in London from EM Lyon is a stretch. EM Lyon is one of the most well-known B-schools in France and Europe, but it is placed a notch below the three Parisian Schools (HEC, Essec, ESCP) for London recruiting. I was told this by IB Analysts from London and Paris that went to one of the Parisian schools. Also, I regularly see other IB Analysts from the three Parisian schools in the "People who visited this profile also visited..."-section on LinkedIn, but EM Lyon Alums hardly ever (if even...) show up. EM has a good reputation in Entrepreneurship though.

Pro EM:
+ The programme takes 2-3 yrs, leaving you more time

Con EM:
- Impossible to find a job in IB in France
- Not very well placed for London IB recruiting (vs. the three other schools from Paris)
- You'll have a hard time with everything in France if you don't speak the language

However, you should consider that Durham is also not a target for BB's in London. Hope this helps!

Disclaimer: went through FT recruiting in London last year, know many Frenchies that also did, and know the BSchool landscape in France and continental Europe quite well.

 
5/29/12

Thanks for the comments, just to clarify a few things:

  • I probably should have mentioned that I realize BB's will not give me a look and my goal is to find a relevant internship or two first, then try to break into IB at any level (Boutique, MM)
  • The two schools I'm waiting to hear back from are St.Gallen and SSE. I'm not holding my breath because my chances are slim to none. Obviously if I get into one of these, that's where I'll go.

-I know both schools (Durham,Lyon) are not a target and that it'll be an uphill battle. My thinking is, if atleast a couple people from each school broke into IB, then it's possible. I just need a shot at it, I can take care of the rest.

  • I appreciate the reality check, I'm well aware of my chances, but if I had a dollar for everytime someone told me to give up, I would be retired and sailing on my own yacht. I shouldn't even have gotten into any of the schools I received offers from based on their minimum requirements, but I did.

As far as France goes, is it possible to find an internship, whether in IB, CorpFin, or anything relevant really, without being proficient in French?
There is still Villanova, which has a great program and was originally my top choice, but I'm not sure about internship and FT opportunities for students who are not US citizens.

I'll try to reload my Silver Bananas today or tomorrow, I appreciate you guys taking the time to comment, especially anyone who has experience in these kinds of situations.

" A recession is when other people lose their job, a depression is when you lose your job. "