European degree, no experience, just a passion. HF?

Hey!

I've been reading this forum for a while and I've decided to ask you guys for advice.

Let me introduce myself in just a few lines:

  • I'm 27. Born and raised in Europe, now in NYC.
  • Software Engineering and Business Management degrees. Good grades, top of my class, a couple of awards. The schools are ok (some grads are working at Google, Amazon, McKinsey, HSBC...), but completely unknown in the US.
  • 2 years of consulting experience in Europe and Asia. Medium-sized company. Amazing graduate program and hard to get in, but not really known in the US either.

So..

I've been interested in the financial markets since I made my first trade when I was 16-17. I've been always amazed by how everything that happens around the world gets quantified in the markets and the history that's behind every chart.

My consulting job allowed me to travel around the world and it was a great experience, but I felt it wasn't the right job for me. So I saved some money and I went all-in: I quit my job and moved to NYC just in time to watch the ball drop in Times Square.

And here I am. What am I expecting? If I'm realistic, not much. I'd be happy to get an unpaid internship to clean the office floor just to be able to listen to the morning briefing of the traders, watch how professionals work and start learning everything I can about the industry.

I started cold e-mailing and cold calling some HFs for an unpaid internship and the question is... how can I differentiate myself? I've been targeting HFs that work with Latin American markets, thinking that maybe being able to speak Spanish and Portuguese would be useful; and HFs that work with quant strategies, where my coding skills would definitely come in handy. No luck so far. Any ideas? What would you do?

The odds of success are really low, I know that. But I wanted to try. Worst-case scenario, I'll be back home in 8-9 months (or when I run out of money) at the starting point, but at least I'll be able to sleep at night knowing that I did everything I could!

Thanks!

 
Best Response

Very interesting story.

I think first thing to consider is working in the US as a European. You said you just quit your job and moved to NYC. It's not that easy (I don't want to be negative but its the truth, I actually did the same and I am back in Europe). The problem is that it is extremely difficult for them to sponsor you if you do not have OPT first, BC they can test you this way.

Would you consider moving to London? There are lots of opportunities over there in HFs

 

Thanks for your answer! Sure, I've also considered London. But I think that the problem is not the Visa (at least for a short-term, unpaid internship), but finding a HF that would welcome the skills that I have. After some time in NY, in a few months or next year, no doubt the experience here would be valuable back in Europe.

But I came to NY because it's part of the big bet. After all, I can as well fail in London; it might be easier, but there are no guarantees I'd be able to make it there. And if I fail there, it would be the same outcome as not having tried in the first place: what if I had followed my gut and tried in NY... Now I'm jobless, the odds of success are low, but it feels so right.

 

Absolutely. U should go with whatever u feel like.

Keep in mind u r not allowed to work in the US, and u r not allowed to be there for a period of more than 3 months at a time.

The reason why I mentioned London, as it could also be Switzerland is BC u have a European passport and that's not a barrier for employment in Europe.

Anyway, I wish you best of luck!

 

What investment strategy are you interested in? You could apply to a few business schools to have a plan B. Despite what many people believe, getting into a top 25 business school programme is not that hard, provided that you have decent work experience and solid academics. As for the job search, you could prioritise recently launched funds and/or smaller shops over big names. I work in a European value-oriented long/short fund so I have limited knowledge of US funds, yet I can suggest a few names in my space.

 

Three funds with strategies similar to mine that are based in NY (or nearby) and are solely focussed on European companies are Permian Investment Partners, Lucerne Capital Management and Oriel Capital Management (launched a few months ago by Cara Goldenberg). Recently I came across a new fund called Gilead Capital. Pretty impressive, while it mostly invests in the US it has exposure to Europe too. Other (much bigger) names you may consider are Atlantic Investment Management and Blue Harbour Group.

Regarding business schools...just pick a school that is among the top 20 in the FT ranking.

 

Thank you so much! Those look interesting! I'll try to contact them.

Do you know any website where I could track recently created hedge funds? Perhaps something similar to AngelList for tech startups?

 

Please consider this.

Why the fuck are you blowing 2 years savings on living in NY, as a 27yo looking for an unpaid internship at a HF. I'm not saying you should follow your dreams, but you should be sensible about it. Without a US passport / permit it's going to be real tough to get a paid job in the US as the company will need to sponsor you (which is more likely at a large firm, and many HF are not). Most (respectable) companies have no issue of paying you a salary if you are worth bringing on, so you need to have a skill they seek other than being "free" labor (which doesn't really exist, because they would need to use their resources for you to be able to do anything).

Why didn't you move to London, Amsterdam or Zurich? You'd have the same number of opportunities in London as in NY and you'd have less of an issue with your working permit. You've taken a bet with worse odds by going to NY instead of LND.

I'm not saying it's not possible for you to succeed, I hope you do, but you need to make smart choices and take risks that makes sense. So you need to consider why a fund would want to hire you, and which funds you should target. You're not 21 anymore, you should know that moving to an expensive city where you cannot legally work, to find a job in an industry that you haven't worked in before and that is very competitive to enter, is a BAD idea.

I take you are not married and are not responsible for anyone else, but still Enzo, this is a very bad plan. Don't waste your hard earned cash and time on this. If you're dead-set on trading or investing, move to another financial hub in Europe where you can actually work and will be considered by companies. If you've worked in London for a few years you'll have it much easier to find a job at a NY-based fund.

 

A Friend: I do not think it is fair to let down one guy who made clear he "Would be happy to get an unpaid internship to clean the office floor just to be able to listen at the morning briefing of the traders ...". Coping with rejections is a rite of passage if one wants to work in the hedge fund industry, no matter the background.

enzo28: I am not aware of any database that tracks newly established hedge funds. Maybe you can find useful information in specialised publications like the Hedge Fund Journal though.

 

Debitis et quas libero nam reprehenderit animi architecto. Quia molestias consectetur aperiam voluptatibus et. Quas voluptas ut mollitia laborum temporibus eligendi et quia. Eos minima amet modi esse est in accusantium facere. Aut tenetur sit perferendis tempore ut beatae. Et cupiditate sapiente ipsa ut eligendi assumenda. Ut earum quos dolores eum. Maiores quia veritatis eum esse minima provident quis voluptatem.

Unde fuga ut qui eius qui velit aut. Sed ut aut ut reiciendis ipsam aut. Aut nisi numquam est dolores. Quibusdam blanditiis velit consequuntur hic quia. Architecto sunt nam beatae quaerat earum quia esse. Eum velit iure saepe et. Sint officiis eos sint rerum voluptates.

Consequatur voluptatibus assumenda quisquam est consequatur in rerum. Magnam voluptates minima voluptatum porro. Officia aperiam dolores sint qui veniam. Ut reiciendis adipisci id. Assumenda aspernatur voluptatum illum cupiditate quae saepe rerum. Quo voluptas deserunt voluptatem quo. Veritatis dicta id exercitationem.

Aperiam tempora est quae nesciunt distinctio expedita. Soluta dignissimos assumenda ut soluta. Voluptatem ad sint delectus facere sunt. Sint ab enim non inventore qui.

Career Advancement Opportunities

March 2024 Hedge Fund

  • Point72 98.9%
  • D.E. Shaw 97.9%
  • Magnetar Capital 96.8%
  • Citadel Investment Group 95.8%
  • AQR Capital Management 94.7%

Overall Employee Satisfaction

March 2024 Hedge Fund

  • Magnetar Capital 98.9%
  • D.E. Shaw 97.8%
  • Blackstone Group 96.8%
  • Two Sigma Investments 95.7%
  • Citadel Investment Group 94.6%

Professional Growth Opportunities

March 2024 Hedge Fund

  • AQR Capital Management 99.0%
  • Point72 97.9%
  • D.E. Shaw 96.9%
  • Citadel Investment Group 95.8%
  • Magnetar Capital 94.8%

Total Avg Compensation

March 2024 Hedge Fund

  • Portfolio Manager (9) $1,648
  • Vice President (23) $474
  • Director/MD (12) $423
  • NA (6) $322
  • 3rd+ Year Associate (24) $287
  • Manager (4) $282
  • Engineer/Quant (71) $274
  • 2nd Year Associate (30) $251
  • 1st Year Associate (73) $190
  • Analysts (225) $179
  • Intern/Summer Associate (22) $131
  • Junior Trader (5) $102
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (249) $85
notes
16 IB Interviews Notes

“... there’s no excuse to not take advantage of the resources out there available to you. Best value for your $ are the...”

Leaderboard

1
redever's picture
redever
99.2
2
BankonBanking's picture
BankonBanking
99.0
3
Betsy Massar's picture
Betsy Massar
99.0
4
Secyh62's picture
Secyh62
99.0
5
GameTheory's picture
GameTheory
98.9
6
dosk17's picture
dosk17
98.9
7
DrApeman's picture
DrApeman
98.9
8
CompBanker's picture
CompBanker
98.9
9
kanon's picture
kanon
98.9
10
numi's picture
numi
98.8
success
From 10 rejections to 1 dream investment banking internship

“... I believe it was the single biggest reason why I ended up with an offer...”