To hell with all you people.

My wife:

30 710 GMAT (50 Quant = PhD candidates at Chicago) 3.55 GPA, non-target engineering school Accenture

Booth: Ding, no interview Kellogg: Ding Sloan: Ding, no interview UCLA: Ding, no interview Stern: Wait-list, then interview, then...Ding

@#$%^&*( ad comms...

 
Mike-M11:

To hell with all you people.

My wife:

30
710 GMAT (50 Quant = PhD candidates at Chicago)
3.55 GPA, non-target engineering school
Accenture

Booth: Ding, no interview
Kellogg: Ding
Sloan: Ding, no interview
UCLA: Ding, no interview
Stern: Wait-list, then interview, then...Ding

@#$%^&*( ad comms...

She has to have had a red flag, or an issue with her execution. Did she have unemployment? Did she have someone familiar with b-school applications look over her essays/resumes? On paper, UCLA at least interviews pretty much every female with that profile, so something must've thrown them off.

 

No, she didn't have her essays/resume professionally reviewed. With hindsight being 20/20, she certainly should have. In addition, I suspect she reached out to some folks to write recommendations that she perhaps oughtn't have. She didn't want to overwhelm her primary clients by asking for too many letters of recommendations, so she tried to "distribute" the effort. And, of course, the dings would just come in every few weeks, so as soon as her spirits would recover, there'd be another crushing ding. Damn shame.

 

I think "age discrimination" is a bit over-blown. While HBS and Stanford do skew young, with proper execution being 29 to 31 is no major impediment. Had plenty of friends in the 29-31 group (non-military) who got into top ten programs for this upcoming year...

 

Yes, the age issue was also a problem.

Had she been 27, we could have learned our lesson, prepared more thoroughly, and taken another swing at the ball. But since she's 30, she felt this was her one shot. Not sure it had any impact, but her applications were all Round 2 as well. It is what it is. Lessons learned.

 

Oooh oooh! Am I in the right place for the dick measuring contest? Hahaha

730 3.3 double major at a top 30ish undergrad. Military Extensive international experience Non-degree full time 10 month program for a Euro language used daily in current role

Tuck

 

I think execution had to be way off. 30 just isn't that old for b-schools, and is right on the back end of the middle 50% age for most (maybe not H/S, but everywhere else).

She has perfectly acceptable stats for all those schools, but nothing that would put her over the top without at least decent essays, recs, and general presentation. What's her work experience (e.g. IT/Strategy/Ops)? Career goals? Who wrote her recs? EC's?

I would also say that she can get into a top 15 school next year (at 31). She'll be at a slight age disadvantage then, but I definitely think if she does a solid analysis of her mistakes and fixes them, she still has a decent shot.

 

Accenture: IT - she was the product of an engineering school.

Career goals: Marketing specialty. I'm not sure this was adequately captured in her essays. And as a career switcher, she had to articulate how she was demonstrating this desire to switch in her engineering and BA roles, which was difficult for her to do.

Recs: There might have been a serious issue here. She had client product owners write some, but managers others. Some took their time and were very deliberate. Others submitted within 45 minutes of having received the request. My wife could be condemned for not having selected good candidates, but her motivation was to not overwhelm her best recommenders with a request for six essays.

ECs: These were limited.

Overall, her "profile" was collectively weak -- she was a career switcher (engineer -> marketing), had weak recommenders (and a few very strong ones), and weak ECs.

I assumed, and I think still assume, given her profile, despite her GMAT and GPA, there's simply no path to a top 15 school.

On the other hand, there might have been something obviously and seriously wrong that resulted in the stream of dings, but I can't imagine what that might be.

I simply thought that it was competitive, and that she was a relatively weak candidate.

 

Mike-M11,

It does sound like a combination of EC and Recs. Engineering -> Marketing is definitely doable. I personally come from a over represented background (read India) and Engineering and 30+. I faced similar issues in the past. One thing which I thought helped me was showcasing what steps I already took/plan to take to make a switch from Engineering/IT to entrepreneurship. I was also accepted to Booth. PM me if I can help.

 
Mike-M11:
Recs: There might have been a serious issue here. She had client product owners write some, but managers others. Some took their time and were very deliberate. Others submitted within 45 minutes of having received the request. My wife could be condemned for not having selected good candidates, but her motivation was to not overwhelm her best recommenders with a request for six essays.

To me it sounds like poor prep and her part, not poor selection.

There's no way a recommender should submit after 45 minutes if they've been properly briefed on what is expected (unless the two of you already had a typed out, edited essay ready to go).

It's a competitive process. Do it right. No loose ends.

 

Mike-M11,

I am not an expert by any means, but w/ a 50 quant score, that puts her at a 36 for verbal, which is not exactly balanced. Adcom might have looked at her desire to move to marketing (a more creative role) from engineering (more quant-ish based) and felt that she is not well rounded away from enineering type of skills. If she didn't address this disparity, and didn't strongly state how she has other qualities that lend to creative thinking skills, this might have put her at a disadvantage.

This plus weak Recs and ECs may have done her in. A solid and convincing narrative for what skills she has aquired through work and how they will contribute to her desired new field could go a long way towards getting her an admit.

 

Recs shouldn't be that difficult coming from a consulting firm like Accenture. Pick two or three managers level people she is good with. Have them write one standard recommendation each and use it for all applications. They all ask the same questions. Going to client is not necessary, neither is spreading among 18 people. If she started out of undergrad and had almost 8 years of experience, shouldn't she be an experienced manager anyway? That'd make profile much stronger than a 3rd year analysts.

 

going to Yale SOM.

age: 33, submitted GRE (170 quant / 167 verbal -- FWIW this supposedly converts to 790 GMAT w/ 740-800 range), 3.3 (tough major, good school). Strong LoRs, international experience, CFA charter. WE: boutique hedge funds in Europe (largest AuM was about 1.5Bn).

 
Best Response
TwoThrones:

Can anyone of you who got into HBS or GSB talk a little more about your profile and how you got in? Especially since we (read Brady4MVP) idolize all of you.

Oh, Brady...

I studied engineering at Top-5 school. I had weak grades but unusually strong ECs (at least I felt so) + strong summer work experience. After college, I worked at a prominent VC firm, and then worked for one of the VC's startups in a senior management role.

My argument to H/S was basically: - I put my heart and soul into college ECs, and I learned a lot about leadership from them. (This + engineering + tough school also put low grades into context, I hope). - I've had experience in both investing in tech as well as the operational side of tech in well-regarded firms / high-level roles (seemed somewhat uncommon). - I'm passionate not just about technology, but about a specific part of the tech ecosystem.

(I don't know what my recommenders said, but they know me well enough that I'd guess they made a similar case or elaborated on contributions to my VC and startup organizations.)

Got interviews at H/S (different rounds). Went into S interview w/o prep and bombed. Learned my lesson and practiced much harder for H and got in.

 

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