Former Poker player looking for job in finance

Hi,

I took a break from college to play poker for almost 8 years. I went back to school last year and just finished in May, 2012 with a 3.25 GPA in Economics.

My school is a semi-target school where some, but not all, bulge bracket firms recruit on campus.

Given I have no work experience at all besides poker, I was wondering how I should sell myself and even get an interview for Investment Banking or S&T.

I'd appreciate any advice you guys have for me. Thank you.

Sincerely,
kiel

 

Poker will have more transferable skill sets to trading than ibd. Don't quote me, but i think prop shops like SIG, JSC, CTC, DRW, like poker players. Maybe try reaching out to them?

Disclaimer for the Kids: Any forward-looking statements are solely for informational purposes and cannot be taken as investment advice. Consult your moms before deciding where to invest.
 
captainkoolaid:
Poker will have more transferable skill sets to trading than ibd. Don't quote me, but i think prop shops like SIG, JSC, CTC, DRW, like poker players. Maybe try reaching out to them?

+1 on SIG! I have met and spoken with Jeff Yass several times, he and the other SIG founders all used to play poker professionally and poker culture is still huge there. You should have no prob getting an interview, just be able to back up your play with tax returns, etc.

 

Thank you for the response. I did apply to all of these firms except CTC (they don't have an opening listed so I'll have to cold call) and just scheduled a phone interview with Jane Street.

I was wondering if anyone got some tips for the interview?

I'm under the impression it will, for the most part, amount to an IQ test but I am still looking for tips anyway.

 
427kiel:
Thank you for the response. I did apply to all of these firms except CTC (they don't have an opening listed so I'll have to cold call) and just scheduled a phone interview with Jane Street.

I was wondering if anyone got some tips for the interview?

I'm under the impression it will, for the most part, amount to an IQ test but I am still looking for tips anyway.

damn. Jane Street gave you an interview with a 3.25 in econ? You must have really impressed someone. Congrats man.
 

Maybe for a little longer. But even before Black Friday I was already looking to leave.

BF just made it easier.

I do realize 3.25 GPA is low for IB under most circumstances but that is where I prefer to be. But yes, I'm definitely looking into the prop trading shops.

 

That could be a problem since I haven't reported any in a while.

Anything about the IBanking front?

I am not sure if it makes a difference but I was actually a 3.9GPA student in finance about to go into an IBanking internship before I discovered poker so it's not like I don't know what I am up against.

 
427kiel:
That could be a problem since I haven't reported any in a while.

Anything about the IBanking front?

I am not sure if it makes a difference but I was actually a 3.9GPA student in finance about to go into an IBanking internship before I discovered poker so it's not like I don't know what I am up against.

You really crashed and burned if you went from a 3.9 to a 3.25 over the course over 3 (maybe 4?) semesters of courses.

That and no evidence of winnings doesn't exactly paint the best picture.

 
Best Response
FreezePops:
427kiel:
That could be a problem since I haven't reported any in a while.

Anything about the IBanking front?

I am not sure if it makes a difference but I was actually a 3.9GPA student in finance about to go into an IBanking internship before I discovered poker so it's not like I don't know what I am up against.

You really crashed and burned if you went from a 3.9 to a 3.25 over the course over 3 (maybe 4?) semesters of courses.

That and no evidence of winnings doesn't exactly paint the best picture.

I had the same 'crash and burn' GPA scenario. Most places even during senior year recruiting didn't seem to really give a shit once I explained it to them. IBD cared a bit more though, and I got a lot of motivation questions after that. Definitely realized IBD wasn't for me at that point. Just from that experienced I'd say IBD is probably tougher to break into with that GPA and a big gap in employment unrelated to the job. S&T on the other hand I think you would be a great fit for, and I'd echo what everyone else is saying that prop shops will probably find you an interesting person to bring in for an interview, so if you can crush an interview you should be in a good spot.

I hate victims who respect their executioners
 
Sling Shot:
melvvvar:
you are all overestimating how much poker skills are valued at a trading desk.

not true. poker is a significant part of assistant trader training at SIG and other places

i am talking about the 99.99% of trading desks that aren't SIG.

 

I played poker extensively in college as well. I multi-tabled 12-20 tables on Stars, Party, Full-Tilt, etc., till about 2008 or so(5-6 years). I also used programs like PokerTracker and PokerAce that recorded hand histories of players that put out a digitial heads-up display of opposing players' tendencies to help. Multi-tasking these heads-up displays, the games themselves, and the moves I was making seemed like a viable skillset in the future.

I did get out of poker because I felt that I was not contributing to society in any capacity. I also felt that I was essentially hustling people because of the knowledge and skillset that I had acquired in this game. I saw players lose hundreds of thousands of dollars in some big games. They just didn't have the emotional control to handle the swings. Tables were 100/200 - 500/1000 on Full Tilt poker. Meaning the buyin was anywhere from 20,000 to 100,000 and you could put it all in any hand.

I am also trying to break into finance. I'm in retail banking now. I see many have posted that this is a valuable skillset to have as a trader. How should I broach this subject, or show this skillset to a potential employer??? On a resume? In an interview that would actually value playing poker?

When I was interviewing for my retail position, there's no way in hell I was going to say that I gambled online. I didn't want to show that I was risky or would gamble in any capacity. I wanted to show that I was stable and someone that could be trusted (Not that the two coincide.)

 

I'd recommend looking at shops where the big dogs are avid poker players...shouldn't be too hard. Also S&T will probably be a easier sell as it's much more quant. I'd also consider trying to reach out to HFs...they have basically unlimited flexibility in hiring, and if they think your smart they won't care about your GPa...

Don't worry too much about taxes, but have evidence from other sources if you don't, e.g. Sharpscope, articles, online casino results (may be hard if you mostly play live cash).

Wrt explaining poker on a resume, make sure to provide explicit results (e.g. Winnings, tourneys played, hours spent, any particularly notable scores) as well as anything which will show up on a google search. Also make sure you know exactly what the various reporting sites say your winnings are. If you say you made 5mm but p5's says you only made 50k, there will be some serious doubt as to your legitimacy (even tho obv those sites dont do a good job reporting).

You should sell your time playing poker as if it was time spent on a startup.... And make sure you can answer every single question about your time.

 

I'm in a similar situation to OP. I'm considering making a career shift from poker to a prop shop. Lately I've been playing as much poker and exercising as much as I can. However, in all my spare time I've been studying core finance and computer programming to try to get somewhat on pace, although I'm concerned that my memory of what I've been studying is a little hazy because of such little application of this knowledge.

I'm super motivated to put myself out there so I'm trying to be as active as I can for now by learning rather than standing idly by and speculating...

Also, out of curiosity to anyone that can help me out - if I have $200k to invest in the market, does this aid me in getting hired at some of these places?

 

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