Going From a Zero Pack to a Two Pack to a Six Pack

I have altered my exercise routine to include more ab work.  I am not a gym rat at all, so I am never going to ever be like or look like [Isaiah_53_5]  because I am not going to work out for three hours per day.  I can dedicate up to one hour on most days.   For my whole life, I have had a 0 pack and I was never motivated to improve it.  I am only doing this for myself.  Either I am becoming ill or the altered exercise regime is having an impact because I am started to see cuts/bones on the upper abs.  

Here is my question, how do you improve the middle or lower abs?  Is it more difficult to get to these areas?  For me, it is still a bunch of flab.  I am hoping the answer is to keep doing it but I am thinking there might be more efficient ways to target these areas.  I hope the answer is NOT to eat less.  

Region
 

Sumerian

Waiting for this one to get political. I hope I'm wrong lol

You have a point but the fitness topics are not usually political.  I did create a topic about the Bucs/Brady and received monkey shit from on a comment.  I thought sports would be one of the safe spaces, haha.  

 

Sumerian

Waiting for this one to get political. I hope I'm wrong lol

Apparently some people do think it is political.  I created a topic to get some insight on abs and a couple of people threw crap at me.  Like you, I have been branded with the Scarlet L.   With that said, I do appreciate the time people have taken to respond to this topic.  

 

90% of your body is made in the kitchen. Unless you're putting up @isaiah_53_5 numbers on cardio, you're not going to outwork your eating habits. Personally low carbs and high protein works best for my body (try to cut out sugars and most bread at least during the week). Everyone is different though and some excel with different macro percentages. The key is keeping your exercise the same and eating clean while experimenting ~every 6 weeks with different macro percentages until you find what works best for your body.

 

Eat whatever you want as long as it’s real food and meets your macro and calories requirements. Lean proteins, whole grains, vegetables, healthy fats, fruits (in moderation), etc. My most common daily food intake: Breakfast: oatmeal (1/2 cups of oats, green apple, berries, a splash of almond milk, cocoa powder) omelet (veggies and 3 egg whites and one whole jumbo egg) with a rice cake

Post workout/lunch: protein shake with berries and ice, chicken breast and some type of carb and veggie

Dinner: I normally have some more lean protein with vegetables and a mug cake/protein pancake with peanut butter and berries

I normally have a piece of fruit here and there as a snack and sometimes one yogurt

If I get hungry at night I have some lemonade with fake sugar (probably not the best) and sugar free gelatin.

This is my cutting diet that works for me as I aim to meet my daily 1800 calorie requirements to be in a 200 calorie deficit for a slow cut. I eat at least 1g of protein per body weight and the rest on carbs and fats. I don’t believe in all that keto/if bs. I tried it all and they are annoying to maintain without any real benefits (lots of bro science). What works best is whatever diet you can actually stick to. I’ll have a cheat meal once a week if necessary (if my girlfriend wants to eat out) but I tend to eat less during the day to accommodate the extra calories so the damage isn’t really bad.

 

Sumerian

Any recommendation on what to eat each meal? Would appreciate Isaiah_53_5's opinions as well.

I can document some of my meals on here, but I’m pretty random most of the time.

Next meal having Filet Mignon from Whole Foods with romaine lettuce, grape tomatoes, and feta cheese. 

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
 

90% of your body is made in the kitchen. Unless you're putting up @isaiah_53_5 numbers on cardio, you're not going to outwork your eating habits. Personally low carbs and high protein works best for my body (try to cut out sugars and most bread at least during the week). Everyone is different though and some excel with different macro percentages. The key is keeping your exercise the same and eating clean while experimenting ~every 6 weeks with different macro percentages until you find what works best for your body.

Yeah, I know that the kitchen is a big factor.  It is far easier for me to ramp up exercise than to reduce calories.  My biggest problem is that I eat a lot after dinner and sometimes in the middle of the night.  Lately, I have been trying to cut down the time that I spend near food.  If I am distracted, I will eat less.  

 

Patience. Lower stomach fat (abs that you mentioned) is very stubborn and normally the last place you will lose fat when leaning out. I would just keep hammering through and wait for results. I personally don’t see the need to add more cardio or eat less, you will most likely just get burnt out. Have you tried doing more core work that targets the lower abs and obliques? Might help toned those areas a bit more and will show more once you get a lower body fat. As you know, you can’t really target fat loss and losing your lower ab fat will just require reaching a lower body fat %.

 

AnonymousMonkey130

Patience. Lower stomach fat (abs that you mentioned) is very stubborn and normally the last place you will lose fat when leaning out. I would just keep hammering through and wait for results. I personally don't see the need to add more cardio or eat less, you will most likely just get burnt out. Have you tried doing more core work that targets the lower abs and obliques? Might help toned those areas a bit more and will show more once you get a lower body fat. As you know, you can't really target fat loss and losing your lower ab fat will just require reaching a lower body fat %.

Yeah, I figured that the lower stomach fat would take a while, as there is more fat in that area.  I plan to keep plugging away at it.  For abs, I do crunches, jump rope, and a pull up bar with sleeves. I also use a glider that might help a bit.   I think the pull up bar is probably the most effective because I can feel the tension in the abs when I do it.  

 

financeabc

For abs, I do crunches, jump rope, and a pull up bar with sleeves. I also use a glider that might help a bit.   I think the pull up bar is probably the most effective because I can feel the tension in the abs when I do it. 

Yeah these are all good. Also, flutter kicks, scissor kicks, leg raises, planking, elbow to fist planking, pushups. The lower abs will eventually show through if you're dedicated. But, also drinking lots of water, lots of green leafy vegetables, and lots of green tea as well. Getting chiseled abs is just a confirmation of all the hard work you have put in over time. But, its easy to lose them if you slip a little in eating or working out. Kicking the heavy bag will also get your torso ripped. Jump rope is great as well. 

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
 

Doing ab exercises helps build the muscle, but especially for abs eating at a caloric deficit and losing the body fat to reveal your abs is much more important to focus on. Eat enough protein and at a consistent 300-500 calorie deficit to lose weight. Stomach fat is typically some of the last to go and you can't spot reduce fat, so you might get lucky or probably not with how long it takes to get rid of that in particular.

 

IB analyst here that probably less time than you to stay fit but here is what I can do - bare in mind that I have not stepped into a gym since March 2020 (aka Covid start) and that I have limited equipment (aka none bar 2x5kg or ~10lbs weights) - currently considering buying a pullup bar

Food: - eat 2 meals a day, one at 1pm one at 7-8pm, protein heavy both, some carbs for the lunch, veggies only for dinner, drink a lot (water, green tea, lime juice into water)

Workouts:

- Weekdays: 20-30 mins max 1-3x per week, mostly pushups, HIIT stuff - ie shadow boxing with my 5kg weights, and once per week ab workouts. If you can would recommend (what I did when I was going to the gym) - add 20 mins of cycling - 10 mins warm up and 1 mins max watts, 1 min rest for 8 mins and 2 mins cool down. Burns a lot of calories. 

- Weekends: same each day 30min-1h run (I love running, pace is very much up to me don't care about it much as long as I move - I am able to run a 19mins 5km or sub 40mins 10km, not insane but quite good) + workout as per the above (typically doing biceps/triceps and one focusing on Shoulders/chest/back) + once abs

Abs workout is as follows: same set 4x, 1min-1.30 min rest in between each set. 4 exercises: 

1) just like rowing without a machine - there must be a name but idk

2) seated rotation with my weights

3) Crunches feet on the floor

4) Crunches feet in the air

Results: got complimented on my abs by some chicks last summer + one of my friend that is a girl. I am not massive but very lean and decent chest. For your reference I am 6'4; 90~kg = ~200lbs

Happy to discuss further what I do exactly in terms of actual movements if you are keen. 

 

Fuck ab workouts lol.

Be in a caloric deficit every day (doesn't matter if it's by eating less calories, doing more cardio, or ideally both), and you'll see your body fat % go down. Try to keep protein up and make sure your deficit isn't crazy (like 300-500 calories max) so you can hold onto muscle mass. I personally like intermittent fasting to keep calories low, but do whatever works.

Source: Had a 0 pack my entire life but have worked out regularly with bodybuilding and powerlifting training for the past 4 years. About 3 months ago I dropped my calories and started doing some sort of cardio like HIIT or short runs 3-4x per week, and now am starting to see a 6-pack come in. It started slowly, but comparing progress pics shows just how far I've come without sacrificing much strength. Oh, and I also haven't done a single ab isolation exercise in this entire time.

 
Most Helpful

hey man, congrats on the journey! I had a 4 pack for most of my life, and even though I was always thin, tiny love handles were a pain point as I imagine they are for most men, even if in shape. full disclosure, I've been exercising since I was 15 years old (though only with REAL discipline for 10 years) and only within the past 5 years have gotten rid of lower ab fat. it's stubborn. it takes time.

from 2 to 4 pack - eating clean, doing lots of squats (even if not heavy, you'd be amazed at how building up hip muscles can melt away some of this fat)

from 4 to 6 pack - giving up dairy + cardio + kickboxing. for me it was easy, I've got family allergies and never really felt great after eating it. was suggested by a doctor and I noticed not only did my digestion improve, but that stubborn fat went away. probably wasn't just dairy, because around this same time I began doing 5 and 10K runs for fun, doing 20-30 minutes on the heavy bag before or after lifting weights, and so on. to get all of my abs to show, my body fat was in the 7-9% range (and before you ask, yes I've been tested, BIA and Jackson Pollack). I say that not to discourage, just to let you realize I was impatient as fuck waiting for my lower abs to show, and only looking back did I realize how long it took to get there. now, it's easy to maintain with my workout regimen, but hard af to get there.

I do very little direct ab work, I noticed my best gains from exercise in ab definition came from doing single side lifts (rack squats, SLRDLs, etc), overhead work, and shit like front squats, farmers walks, weighted bear crawls, etc.

on diet, I pretty much don't eat traditional American foods like wings, burgers, etc., most of my food is asian and middle eastern/Mediterranean. also, limit processed stuff (white flour, "enriched" anything, margarine, etc.), and added sugars. I'm not anti-sugar, I love fruit, and I treat myself to ben & jerry's often (I try to keep this to when I've done 2 workouts though, as a reward. hour run + hour workout is worth it if I get to eat ben & jerry's), but all sorts of foods have added sugars that you should pay attention to - salad dressings, sauces, dips, and especially drinks (I drink water or booze, that's it).

if you're not a gym rat I'll give you the same advice I gave my dad when he dropped a significant amount of weight - find an exercise regimen that's diversified (hits all the main groups) and a diet where the ingredients are simple and not full of added bullshit. more specifics? buy a kettlebell of at least 40lbs (ideally more), get good at kettlebell swings, squats, overhead presses, deadlifts, etc., start making stuff like you'd see on Halal trucks yourself - kebabbed meat spiced however you like, basmati rice (not too much!) veggies, and no sauce. make your meals look like some variation of that (meat, rice, veg) and as long as you're not eating too much, you're gucci.

 

One thing I will add that I don’t think anyone has mentioned above is that abs are like any other muscle! They need to be grown by doing a progressive overload (increasing weight over time). So don’t be afraid to add weight when doing any ab exercises. Some examples:

-Hold a 45lb bench plate while doing sit-ups or toe touches.

-Hold the heaviest medicine ball you can find while doing side twists.

-Put something heavy on your legs when doing leg raises.

-Etc etc

(Of course diet is still key and no matter how big your abs are you won’t see them if you’re fat, BUT you still need to treat your abs like any other muscle and try to grow them.)

There is more than one way to get there. I'd rather have 30 chapters than 3000 pages.
 

I thought this was going to be a thread about [Isaiah_53_5] showing us his progress pics from the times he got bullied in school to the times he tries to bully people from his bike while wearing spanx without underwear.

Just ba lazy bum and get lip and test like the celebrities.

 

Lot of ‘abs are made in the kitchen’ comments. Yes, if you’re fat, your abs will not show. However, if you build abdominal muscle, you will see them at a higher body fat %. You can train them like any other muscle too; adding weighted movements was key in my experience

 

Key part of your post was that the middle area is still just "flab". That leads me to believe it is more diet related. You don't necessarily need to eat less.. just try to eat more things where you can see the individual ingredients.. If it's processed, don't eat it. Another topic to address is drinking.. try to count all the calories you drink per day. For a lot of people.. it is several hundred per day. Rough BOE calculations, 3,500 cals in a pound of fat.. those excessive drinks add up. Try to stick to water.. and booze if that's your thing, but limit the others (fruit drinks, sodas, etc.)

One final point.. and a hot take. Keto might be worth a shot here and there. I do not recommend doing it 24/7, rather in week bursts 1x / month, gradually building if easy for you. It is impossible to do if alcohol plays a large roll in your life. However, when done correctly, the food tastes great, your body burns fat at rest and you lose the energy crashes that come throughout the normal day. Can totally help you on building a fulfilling diet here if you want.. just lmk. Really am a believer in keto, just when it is done right.. which isn't often. 

Wish you the best, good luck.

 

There are certain exercises which target ab growth and development, but to be in a calorie deficit will greatly improve your chances at cutting the fat on your lower ab region. If you have to imagine this circumstance of a calorie deficit, just picture it as every possible moment you could be working out, you should be working out. So when you get up, during the day, and before you go to sleep. You don't want to be starving yourself because that sucks, so get in those pushups and flutter kicks every spare moment you have. You're most likely WFH, so stop being lazy...

A recommended exercise: fist to elbow planking. Do it to the beat - see if you can hold out for a few minutes. And jump rope + heavy bag will get you shredded. 

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
 

Isaiah_53_5

There are certain exercises which target ab growth and development, but to be in a calorie deficit will greatly improve your chances at cutting the fat on your lower ab region. If you have to imagine this circumstance of a calorie deficit, just picture it as every possible moment you could be working out, you should be working out. So when you get up, during the day, and before you go to sleep. You don't want to be starving yourself because that sucks, so get in those pushups and flutter kicks every spare moment you have. You're most likely WFH, so stop being lazy...

A recommended exercise: fist to elbow planking. Do it to the beat - see if you can hold out for a few minutes. And jump rope + heavy bag will get you shredded. 

All seems like good advice.  I have to be a little careful with some of the more aggressive exercises, as I do not want to hurt myself and be out of action.  I know you are one of the older guys here but I am even older than you, haha. 

 

Aut placeat qui nobis temporibus amet doloremque. Ratione sint id enim doloremque odio. Consequatur eum magnam aut consequatur mollitia quis. Cum laudantium debitis voluptas.

Qui tenetur repellat vel reprehenderit. Voluptas velit sunt ut. Atque eveniet laborum est excepturi nam ea.

Voluptatem aut harum ducimus eos harum eos. Sunt quis quasi adipisci repudiandae maxime qui.

Minus quisquam est et illum qui qui. Qui sit repudiandae inventore animi et dolore ratione. Provident provident cumque atque perferendis ullam. Est velit est fugit consequatur non. Dolores blanditiis omnis id.

 

Perferendis officia temporibus eligendi cumque. Itaque voluptas qui odit sunt veritatis. Id rerum et voluptatem illum voluptas voluptatem eligendi voluptates.

Aliquam molestiae sit ut provident nesciunt. Rerum dicta omnis qui ducimus nihil ut voluptates. Recusandae enim aut neque quia commodi laboriosam architecto. Velit est deserunt est maiores eveniet. Dolor ratione natus omnis quis consequatur ab ut.

Career Advancement Opportunities

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Jefferies & Company 02 99.4%
  • Goldman Sachs 19 98.8%
  • Harris Williams & Co. (++) 98.3%
  • Lazard Freres 02 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 03 97.1%

Overall Employee Satisfaction

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Harris Williams & Co. 18 99.4%
  • JPMorgan Chase 10 98.8%
  • Lazard Freres 05 98.3%
  • Morgan Stanley 07 97.7%
  • William Blair 03 97.1%

Professional Growth Opportunities

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Lazard Freres 01 99.4%
  • Jefferies & Company 02 98.8%
  • Goldman Sachs 17 98.3%
  • Moelis & Company 07 97.7%
  • JPMorgan Chase 05 97.1%

Total Avg Compensation

March 2024 Investment Banking

  • Director/MD (5) $648
  • Vice President (19) $385
  • Associates (86) $261
  • 3rd+ Year Analyst (13) $181
  • Intern/Summer Associate (33) $170
  • 2nd Year Analyst (66) $168
  • 1st Year Analyst (202) $159
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (144) $101
notes
16 IB Interviews Notes

“... there’s no excuse to not take advantage of the resources out there available to you. Best value for your $ are the...”

Leaderboard

1
redever's picture
redever
99.2
2
BankonBanking's picture
BankonBanking
99.0
3
Betsy Massar's picture
Betsy Massar
99.0
4
Secyh62's picture
Secyh62
99.0
5
kanon's picture
kanon
98.9
6
DrApeman's picture
DrApeman
98.9
7
dosk17's picture
dosk17
98.9
8
GameTheory's picture
GameTheory
98.9
9
CompBanker's picture
CompBanker
98.9
10
Jamoldo's picture
Jamoldo
98.8
success
From 10 rejections to 1 dream investment banking internship

“... I believe it was the single biggest reason why I ended up with an offer...”