Howdy mates,
I have a question for you.
Which bank is the best to work for Goldman Sachs or Morgan Stanley in terms of learning, experience, skills, culture, and so on ?
I am asking this because I was told by lots of individuals that they are on par.
Opinions ?
| +89 | GF doesn’t care about her looks | 57 | 3h | |
| +59 | Affair with my Associate… In Desperate Need for Advice | 23 | 23h | |
| +49 | How to sound more eloquent? | 17 | 11h | |
| +38 | 400k/year in HVAC sales? | 26 | 1d | |
| +33 | WSO Ranking On Resume??? | 8 | 2h | |
| +33 | Would you rather live alone in an outer borough or with roommates in Manhattan? | 23 | 2d | |
| +28 | Why do people listen to Jim Cramer Investing Advice? | 11 | 1h | |
| +27 | Carnivore Diet | 12 | 2h | |
| +26 | Is my boss gaslighting me? | 3 | 1d | |
| +23 | Chaotic Insane investment banker who passed away in the 90s or 2000s | 12 | 1d |
Career Resources
Get instant access to lessons taught by experienced private equity pros and bulge bracket investment bankers including financial statement modeling, DCF, M&A, LBO, Comps and Excel Modeling.
Depends on which business line you mean/are interested in. GS and MS are pretty close in areas such as M&A and ECM I think, but GS is much stronger in fixed income. Also, GS has a better brand name overall which you might want to consider when evaluating exit opps.
If you're talking about IB, at that level I think it depends on which culture you mesh better with, and other things apart from just prestige - for example, MS has a global analyst program where in your 3rd year you can do a year in an office in another country, which is a big benefit if you're interested in spending some time overseas and getting that experience.
Although GS is traditionally the most prestigious, it's hard to imagine you will be hurt at all by going to MS in terms of exit ops.
GS vs MS (Originally Posted: 01/02/2016)
Thoughts?
I think you suck.
Apple vs. oranges, thoughts?
Goldman vs. Morgan Stanley - Difference in pay (Originally Posted: 12/07/2009)
I'm trying to get into banking, and want to know which is best.
I'm going to have to enter at the Analyst level as the small venture I created upon graduating is (basically) running on its on.
There's no difference in pay between the two @ the Analyst level... right?
Please explain your choice!
Piper Jaffray has both beat.
Piper Jaffray. It's an up and coming boutique bank. A lot of guys from Goldman and MS left for Piper jaffray, and they're getting mad deal flow. Pay about 1.5x any bulge bracket.
Great minds think alike, 1styearbanker.
For sure, check out megafunds like KRR and Carlyle. Almost all of them are from Piper Jaffray.
=*TYPO PATROL*=
Even Jeffrey Chiang passed up on his Bank of Ameria and MS offers to join Piper Jaffray..nuff said..
SirBankAlot & 1styear,
The Piper Jaffray jokes were hilarious months ago. Seriously, I challenge you to come up with something new. I picture you two nerds right now still laughing about it. And no, I definitely do not work at PJ.
Tyler Durden,
You have some reading to do on this website. Sounds like you have a lot to learn about this industry.
They were hilarious YEARS ago...
The Piper jokes are getting old. 1YB, you really confuse me -- sometimes I read your posts and you actually give reasonable advice. But generally, it's just crap like this. I don't understand how you are actually a first-year analyst and get off by making posts like this. It's amazing.
Thanks h.e.,
I know both are top notch. Conventional wisdom and popular culture would say Goldman Sachs, but the league tables this year say quite different. Which IBD is stronger today?
Jimbrowningu: Ok let me clear it up for you. I'm a black box. I spit out what I get.
If the question is reasonable and the person really needs help, then I give constructive advice.
However, if there are a bunch of idiots or a stupid question (which there usually is 65% of the time), then I respond alike. I mean look at this kid's post. Poor grammar, horrible diction, and a very nebulous understanding with absolutely no motivation to run a search. Plus this question is completely toolish and the kid obviously just created an account to screw around.
I mean read this: "I'm going to have to enter at the Analyst level as the small venture I created upon graduating is (basically) running on its on. "
I can either laugh or cry at stupid threads like these and I choose the former, thus the sarcastic response. However, if he were to do a basic search and wrote well-addressed questions + sentences, then I would be more than happy to offer a pleasant response such as "It depends.... MS M&A and GS TMT are the best groups.....blah blah blah".
Hope that helps buddy.
PS: Why doesn't this kid get into both firms and then ask? I wouldn't even be surprised if this guy's just a troll.
Fair enough. I actually enjoy your posts on occasion, and generally share similar feelings towards the poster. However, I do ask that you come up with some new/more offensive material. Every time I see "Piper Jaffray" spewed sarcastically, I can only think of PiperJaffrayChiang, and he is the worst.
I think what h.e. was trying to say is that if you want to be a banker, you're probably going to need to get up to speed on the industry. A good place to start would be to ensure you actually understand what we do in banking. I will say that the presumption that you know very little about banking stems from the fact that (1) you are presuming you can get into both GS and MS, and (2) you asked about salary differences at the analyst level. To have any shot at breaking into banking, you're going to need to do your homework.
NO!!!! PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!PIPER JAFFRAY!!!
Is anybody else curious what the small venture he created was?
Because I am.
Both are excellent, I'd pick MS if I had a choice. I get the feeling you're allowed to be more of an individual there from the guys I know at the bank.
I am....enlighten us please.
P.S. PJ jokes never get old
You can't admit PJ jokes are getting old unless you work there...and no one would ever admit they work at PJ...so PJ jokes will never get old
Forget Moron Stanley and Oldman Sachs
As I stressed before in previous posts, one of the best places to be in this economy is Piper Jaffray! They basically came out with no exposure to mortgage back securities and all those credit derivative securities that have lost significant value. Their excellent risk management and traditional conservatism has allowed them to stay on top of the game and have enough cash flow to reinvest significantly in their senior management and analysts. If you look at their pay structure, they are paying well above the street at around 80k and that's just base! I don't want to get into the details but I would say Piper Jaffray is certainly tops in terms of reputation and prestige. To be honest, even if it is a hair below GS in terms of exit opps, it's the up and coming place. Plus they didn't take TARP!
The problem with the PJ jokes is that every thread is now the same fuccin' thing. It's become such a cliche joke, it's as fresh as Frank Caliendo doing a Charles Barkley impression. As a result, nausea levels have never been higher here on WSO.
Not sure why you say you "have" to enter at the Analyst level...as opposed to what, the receptionist level? Maybe they'd let you jump on as a VP. After all, one of the pre-requisites for VP at GS and MS is that you start a small venture (bankers really care about this - also tell them about the portfolio that you have been managing). Honestly, you'd be lucky to get offers at either of those banks - if you indeed have received them, then congrats. The two institutions are basically equivalents so go with the one you got along with best, or which will be the easiest commute, or which has the coolest fitness center, or closest Starbucks, etc. Honest;y it doesn't matter which one you pick. Just so you know, if you press on and ask me to break it down exactly WHY this is and you REALLY need advice on WHICH one to go to, then I'll just tell you that you are an idiot and don't deserve to be associated with either.
Goldman vs Morgan Stanley (Scenario A or B) (Originally Posted: 04/19/2010)
As a new analyst, if you had your choice, would you rather work for Goldman Sachs (assuming they have 50/50% chance of guilt) or Morgan Stanley (not a fraudster)? SCENARIO A
What would your answer be assuming GS is found guilty and stays in the limelight on this for 5 years+? SCENARIO B
What is your rationale. There's been some strong debate on this the last day or two.
When you look at the case Goldman is preparing, plus the reputation they have , the culture and the exit opps, as a trader I'd still opt for GS
I really think the mkts are overreacting to the sec case
J..P. Morgan all the way
Nah, GS all the way.
i still would go with goldman, since it looks like the case isn't that strong. the SEC's vote to sue goldman only passed 3-2, and most of this is political posturing. the rabid anti-business democrats want their pound of flesh, and goldman is the sacrificial lamb. but like jesus, it will resurrect itself.
i do have a friend who turned down goldman for JP Morgan's exotic derivatives trading group, and he made a killing this past year.
would this actually severely impact goldman's business/revenue if they are found guilty, or is the "damage" already done?
it could put them out of business
look at solomon brothers and drexel burnham and kidder peabody
convicted of fraud is not good
Scenario A: GS and MS both open a ton of doors. If you plan on running the Fed one day then go with Goldman. If not, go with the one that pays the most. Scenario B: If Goldman goes down for fraud, they will take Wall Street with them. I don't think it will happen anyway. Goldman is just too intertwined with our government.
LOL. Is that what happened when the previously mentioned banks went bust? Or is Goldman somehow different because it's the only name you recognize?
PS - the whole idea that Goldman is "intertwined" with our government is ludicrous.
And if this severely affects GS' business, could this potentially result in offers being revoked?...
THIS CALLS FOR
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
PIPER JAFFRAY
Stop busting on Piper, I love it here!
Neither... other top-tier global BB (not american although JPM is very strong) that has same type of prestige associated with the name in the eyes of employers like CS (especially over UBS) or some other specialized boutiques (Lazard, GH, etc...)
EDIT: Don't get me wrong GS/MS are great and will give you fantastic opportunities
I've mentioned this before; I have a lot of respect for MS guys but most of them look beaten down by life. I'd probably still go GS or one of the European banks.
now that everyone's getting investigated...question - anyone ever heard of someone suing a casino's sports book for losing a bet?
the answer is no. the banks are merely facilitators (i.e. bookies). how can we be held accountable for HF's betting against each other?? SEC has nothing but kudos to them for they know everyone will pay a fine and admit no guilt in the end to put this all behind.
Think before you speak
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/12/07/national/main5924641.shtml
uh...what? he's counter-suing cuz this is america and he's an idiot. unless the casino was forcing him to place bets and drink, what case does the dude have? on top of that, he owes the casino money.
if this case were to fly, then there should be millions of people lining up suing casinos because they got drunk and lost money. not even the same here.
What if the casino rigged the game you were playing making it almost impossible for you to win without you knowing it? Goldman did more than just offset risk.
GS vs. MS (Originally Posted: 01/12/2011)
Hi all,
I just want to hear what you guys think of the two companies-- if you had offers from both, where would you go and why?
Thanks so much!
Delete
They're both terrible companies with no exit opps
They're both great companies to work for. You'll find smart people at both. I think a lot of people would say there are a few more opportunities at Goldman, but you really need to take a look at who's hiring you and who your manager will be. If they can't give you any info, a good indication of that is going to be the people you interviewed with. Did either group of interviewers stand out to you as being a lot more intelligent or a lot more eager to share their knowledge?
When you get to this level- choosing between two top five firms- I think it really has to come down to which interviewers you'd like to work with or work for more than ever. Don't make the decision based on prestige. Prestige will come and go (just ask anyone who worked for a firm that disappeared in 2008) but long-term, it tends to stay within a certain range just based on the competence and reputation you've built up for yourself. So you want to find a manager that you can learn from and that wants to advance your career.
It's tough to go wrong with either one. Figure out who you like more, and if you still can't make a decision, maybe look a little more carefully at your Goldman interviewers and see if you'd be a good fit in their group.
I think MS interviewers were more laidback and more willing to share their stories, but I don't want to generalize a whole company's culture based on a few interviewers. I think you are right in the sense that it really comes down to who I'll be working with.
Anyone knows what are the best groups within GS and MS?
MS alllllllllllllllll the way baby.
BMW or MB? Ferrari or Lamborghini? If you could have either which one would you take the one that suited you best. Its the same thing between GS or MS it really depends on you and the people you will have around you..
Ferrari over Lambo any day of the week and BMV over MB.
Agree with the BMW over MB for the drive, but cmon man. Lambo's are way sexier than ferrari's.
Ferrari over lambo BMW over MB, new money over old money.
Yeah. The thing is that the manager is really driving the Ferrari, you're just along for the ride, and the real question is what kind of conversation there's going to be in the car. If it's Dracula and a bunch of vampires, maybe you want to run, not walk to the Ford Mustang of an F500 company if that's your only other option. If it's Angelina Jolie driving and two really gregarious Econ profs in back, maybe you want to try and ride shotgun.
It won't be an obvious decision at first- just try and take your mind back to your interactions with the folks working at that firm and how you'd feel if you turned into one of them in five, ten, or twenty years.
Maserati > Aston Marton Ferrari > Lambo Audi > BMW > MB Honda > Toyota
GM> Toyota
Ford > Honda.
But European > American.
Ferraris are definetly more sexy than a Lambo.
A or B? Which is better and why? What do you guys think?
^^ see above
It changes every couple of years, so you can't totally base it off of that. MS used to be really strong in trading but it's my understanding they've been struggling a little as of late. In IBD I think they are both very, very strong. GS is ever so slightly marginally stronger, but I don't think it's enough to override any other feelings you've got about this.
I would really give you a 50% chance of working somewhere under one of your interviewers and a 75% chance of working with at least one or two of them or their groups on a regular basis. If it's trading, just make sure you get out a copy of the firm's quarterly and annual reports and make sure those guys are making money.
Based on the information you're giving me, I'd really steer you towards MS. It sounds like there's a good fit here. Aggregated across all groups, you're giving up maybe 3-5% of GS's prestige and money over the long run, but you're dodging a firm that's still kinda in the crosshairs of the SEC, so you can almost call that a wash. And you seem to like the guys who interviewed you at MS, who you'll probably at least see (maybe not talk to) on a daily basis.
Do some research, get out some annual reports on the companies, and make your decision. It's a really tough choice- though you can't really choose badly here (unless you're getting hired into a group losing money), but my gut is telling me to suggest you take a long, hard look at Morgan Stanley. People rarely have regrets about making decisions based on opportunities to learn and work with people rather than prestige. I'd have a different take if it were some second tier BB vs. GS, but between MS and GS, the differences in opportunities are so marginal that any significant difference in the vibes you get from the folks who interviewed you really ought to trump that.
MS.
Trading - GS > MS marginally and most recently IBD - GS > MS where GS is by far the best brand Research - MS > GS Research teams within MS are far more superior than GS
But tbh, staff from MS and GS move around the two companies regularly, so they really are the same bunch.
MS
use your GS offer to leverage into MS M&A
GS
Depends on the group. Both are fantastic firms -- but overall, GS > MS.
Goldman vs. Morgan Stanley - Interning this summer (Originally Posted: 02/15/2007)
I'm interning this summer at Morgan Stanley IBD as a summer analyst..and I was just wondering--is Goldman really that much more prestigious than Morgan Stanley?
Yes, it is. I don't understand why anyone would even consider working for MS. You might as well go work as a retail broker because you will have about the same chances of getting into PE after 2 years.
Who cares if its more prestigious? You have your position, make the most of it.
thanks, i didn't really need the sarcasm.
then don't ask dumb questions
LOL
Morgan Stanley vs. Goldman (Originally Posted: 02/27/2008)
Which would you choose for a summer position: Morgan Stanley IBD generalist offer (maybe M&A, maybe not) vs. Goldman IBD offer (NOT TMT)
goldman
I'd say Goldman as well if all other factors are equal.
What if they can guarantee M&A at MS?
MS M&A over GS.
What about Lazard?
I love how people giving answers then turn around and ask questions...
I love how people asking questions give definitive answers to purely subjective questions.
You have to be more specific.
The best part of it all is these guys think that working at GS in TMT or at MS in M&A is going to make them feel good about themselves, like "Oh yeah! I rock! I kill it every day at work and I still have enough energy to rule the world whenever I leave the office!" When in reality if you've ever met anyone that works in these groups (yes, I have), it's more like "ugh, yeah, great experience, great setup for my next job, etc." but you can tell these kids are drained.
In the end if you work at GS or MS the only thing holding you back from major PE/HR offers is yourself - not the group you work in. So choose the best fit and you'll be happier when you log 100 hours for the first time.
Wow finally a sensible post on this board
Your choice? MS or GS (Originally Posted: 01/19/2010)
Where would you rather work? Why?
This is a stupid question.
GS. Blankfein doesn't take boxing lessons and hang up Muhammad Ali's photo all over his office.
gs-i wanna do gods work.
MS -more focused on IBD whereas GS has puts more focus on its rockstar traders
Depends on the group. All else equal, GS>MS.
I am complete noob and even I know that it depends on the group...I agree this is a stupid question--and one that has been posted time and time again.
If it is IBD, MS. Everything else, GS.
ok, heres one: GS Maintenance staff or Piper Jaffray IBD.
GS would probably have more exit ops, so i'd go for that
Morgan Stanley for sure for IBD -more options.
GS really only is a star in TMT the rest is just its brand name.
A little bitter that you didnt get a GS offer? How does MS provide "more options" than GS? Can you name a single headhunter that targets MS but not GS?
GS > MS for pretty much all groups besides M&A and sponsors (GS doesn't have an M&A group) and GS has a stronger brand name. GS has also done much better through the financial crisis.
Any inputs on the conversion from Summer Associate to Full Time at Morgan Stanley?
If you read carefully I conceded that GS has the brand name.
What I meant by more options is the groups you can choose from. MS has pretty much every group that GS does with a few additional (mainly being M&A) that are easier to get into than the top group(s) at GS (mainly TMT).
I'm strictly talking about IBD. You can't assume that because GS has such a rockstar trading platform, that every single group and division is #1 -like others have said, it all depends. GS puts more focus on S&T and MS puts more focus on IBD. With that being said, keep all of the above into consideration along with what culture appeals to you the most.
FYI: I received an offer from GS and NOT MS, and went with GS.
Morgan and Goldman are both great firms.
I would say that it only comes down to the people, because if you're a good analyst there aren't more opportunities at Goldman and vice versa.
I know many people who have been faced with this decision and met the people at both firms and based their decisions off of that. Some chose MS and some chose GS --it wasn't an obvious decision.
HELP! Should I choose GS or MS?? (Originally Posted: 02/22/2010)
I don't think I have a preference over the "people" as of yet since it's pretty hard to tell in interviews. Is this a no-brainer? I'm really not sure what to do, because I don't want to burn bridges for full-time recruiting. I am a little concerned that GS has taken such a beating lately in the media. Should I be concerned about this? I would really appreciate any input.
Ive heard MS has a better conversion rate
Ive heard MS has a better conversion rate
Depends on your risk tolerance.
GS is better, but has a lower conversion rate.
how do you know?
Things may have changed, it may vary from group to group, or my source may have misheard, but the evidence that I've seen seems to support this view at least a little.
Bear in mind that bank rankings change every few years, and GS might not always be on top. You find a lot of brilliant people at all of the top five firms and choosing MS despite the fact that it's not flavor of the year may not hurt your career all that much.
Have you spoken with existing MS and GS analysts?
I didn't get to interview with MS, but I really like the culture at Goldman. If I end of getting an offer I wouldn't think twice about taking it. I don't the culture is as intense as everyone makes it out to be, and from what I saw with the group I interviewed with it seemed like a place I could definitely devote un godly hours to. Also if you don't get a FT offer, it's still a rockstar internship that will set you up for any other firm.
+1 to the above. I definitely didn't feel like the GS culture was as "intense" as it is reputed to be. My GS interviewers seemed very down to earth and genuine. My MS interviews certainly aired more to the side of "grilling" than GS. One guy from MS didn't crack a smile or break eye contact for the first 10 minutes, no one at GS was even close to that. That said, op you really can't go wrong either way. If you read this sight you know the pro's and con's (retention rate, GS better all around but run by traders, MS strugguling but great IBD and focused on it, etc.). If you're still indifferent, just go with your gut.
I think this, by far, is one of the most accurate statements I have read on WSO in the past few months. I wish someone would make a timeline of investment banks (with rankings) starting 50 years ago progressing forward in 3 year increments. The investment banking industry is a dynamic landscape. If you look back 4 years ago at WSO comments, people were badmouthing JPMorgan, but everyone loved UBS. No one cared or knew about WF, BoA, and Barclays. Look at how firms have changed for better or for worse: Lazard, Evercore, Jefferies, RBC, RBS. Within this decade things will change again.
Not to mention a lot of 1980s firms like the original Lehman Brothers, Drexel-Burnham, and Salomon. Maybe the most dramatic reversal of fortune was Drexel-Burnham. In 1986, the firm was bigger- at least in M&A- than GS is today. In 1990, it was bankrupt and a lot of innocent employees had trouble finding work elsewhere because it fell with a pretty tarnished reputation. At least the guys at Lehman and Bear could land other jobs.
Esse qui reiciendis velit velit. Voluptatum voluptate eos rerum expedita itaque suscipit. Similique odio sunt officiis assumenda quo vel molestias. Voluptas facilis sapiente culpa iusto corporis cum facere temporibus. Voluptas omnis nulla hic qui quam necessitatibus molestiae nulla.
Laborum et placeat voluptas. Pariatur qui non dolores delectus repellendus fugit. Harum iste sequi quia. Veritatis nisi corrupti quia itaque dolore sint in. Odio reprehenderit voluptates ut ut.
Nobis necessitatibus temporibus non alias illo. Voluptatem sed laborum quo corporis dolorem expedita iusto. Eaque neque sequi natus eligendi asperiores.
Quibusdam reprehenderit nam consequatur nobis ipsa vero. Quidem fugiat repellat dignissimos quia ut.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...
Repellat maxime assumenda aut veritatis. Dolorem sit molestias consequuntur omnis officiis soluta. Et sit eaque distinctio et harum dolores. Veritatis quisquam laboriosam dolore rem est.
Occaecati et excepturi labore tempore nobis. Assumenda repellendus nihil non necessitatibus dolor quo voluptatum. Iusto rerum et possimus est cupiditate earum. Dicta fuga et odit dolorem.
Error aperiam numquam ea autem beatae et eos. Voluptas natus ut tenetur sapiente fugit soluta rerum amet.
Repellendus id mollitia vero sint tenetur. Alias quos quis minima harum doloribus ea unde. Suscipit provident velit quia possimus necessitatibus in. Non tempore veniam vero commodi minus tenetur praesentium laudantium. Voluptas omnis dolores eum. Et quisquam voluptatem dolor alias quia. Ea esse amet dolores. Dicta est eius dolores nisi exercitationem porro ut suscipit.
Et placeat tempora voluptas ducimus. Occaecati odio saepe voluptatem delectus. Deserunt maiores laboriosam possimus sunt aut voluptas. Eveniet sed dicta consequuntur voluptatem qui voluptatem. Occaecati excepturi adipisci sit eum.
Laborum omnis neque voluptate omnis quis nostrum. Et nulla ut omnis perspiciatis veritatis deleniti reiciendis. Rerum saepe ut doloribus earum tempora illo at. Ad aspernatur expedita sint necessitatibus dolorem. Praesentium porro quae omnis sapiente.
Dicta quis quo rerum quia vitae hic voluptas consequatur. Occaecati sint sapiente veritatis et. Magnam nam molestiae nisi voluptatem et dolores et. Odio nihil doloremque voluptas id consectetur. Ea maxime distinctio ut dolor neque. Et iusto ducimus impedit voluptates ipsum enim. Inventore aut magnam rerum.
Quis praesentium consequatur deserunt iusto maiores. Atque aliquid ducimus aperiam ducimus est cupiditate aut amet. Neque eum rerum laudantium.
Corporis voluptatem vel sit. Aut aut quae excepturi at veritatis placeat. Iste est non quas suscipit nemo veniam. Dolorum in minus qui impedit ipsum voluptas. Tenetur consequuntur quidem ipsam quia libero cumque. Possimus ullam et ipsa suscipit. Et quaerat perferendis quaerat quaerat est autem.
Id dicta quas nobis voluptatem laudantium. Omnis dignissimos magni illo sequi. Asperiores tenetur atque provident in non tempore dolorem tempore.